What did Bhagavan say to Arjuna ? What is Holding Us Back from Realization?

[Guest guest]

Dear Sadaks,

Most of us know that body and soul is separate, human is gift to

attain GOD, total surrender to GOD is easy way for liberation, to

speak lies is sin, to love one and all is virtue. Salvation is

Parama Anandham (Eternal Bliss), pain and suffering is from our own

account, death is certain and time of death is uncertain, we know

saints reached Bagavan (God). Their ways are shown to us Etc. But

some thing is holding us from not observing these qualities and

separating us from realization.

 

CAN WE DISCUSS WHAT IS IT---WHAT BAGAVAN SAID TO ARJUNA?

Jai Sri Krishna

B.Sathyanarayan

------------------------------

 

GITA TALK GROUP GUIDELINES: PLEASE -

1. Only responses that further clarify Gita message will be posted.

2. Quote Gitaji/scriptures wherever possible..

3. Limit personal feelings, opinions, beliefs etc. to the

extent that they further help in understanding the Gita shlokas

4. Be as concise, to the point, respecting sadhaka's time.

5. Focus on subject at hand only.

6. Do not include links to the other sites.

7. Do not include your personal information (Ph #, address etc).

8. Do not personalize message

9. All responses may not be posted.

10. Moderator at his discretion, may modify the posting.

11. Take into consideration the novices, youth, westerners, non-

sectarian audience. i.e. limit the use to Sanskrit words only.

Provide English word bracketed.

 

MODERATOR

Ram Ram

------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------

 

Post message:

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[Guest guest]

Dear Sadaks,

Most of us know that body and soul is separate, human is gift to

attain GOD, total surrender to GOD is easy way for liberation, to

speak lies is sin, to love one and all is virtue. Salvation is

Parama Anandham (Eternal Bliss), pain and suffering is from our own

account, death is certain and time of death is uncertain, we know

saints reached Bagavan (God). Their ways are shown to us Etc. But

some thing is holding us from not observing these qualities and

separating us from realization.

 

CAN WE DISCUSS WHAT IS IT---WHAT BAGAVAN SAID TO ARJUNA?

Jai Sri Krishna

B.Sathyanarayan

 

----------------------------

NEW POSTING

 

Shree Hari

Ram Ram

Kindly also provide Gita Shlokas wherever possible, so sadhaks can

read them as well. From Gita Talk Moderators, Ram Ram

----------------------------

 

EGO- EDGING GOD OUT- from our life is the main impediment.

With pranams,

G.Vaidyanathan.

----------------------------

What is holding us back?

 

I, I, I and ME, ME, ME

FALSE EGO

RELIGIOUS ARROGANCE

 

Bhagavan tells that the bewildered spirit soul, under the influence

of the three modes of material nature, thinks himself to be the doer

of activities, which are in actuality carried out by nature. B.G.

chapter 3 verse 27

 

The most unsatisfied and unhappiest people are those who are

selfish, self-centred, and insecure, with low self-esteem. One

should not be anxious to have the satisfaction of being honored by

others. The material conception of life makes us very eager to

receive honor from others, but from the point of view of a man in

perfect knowledge--who knows that he is not this body--anything,

honor or dishonor, pertaining to this body is useless. One should

not be hankering after this material deception. People are very

anxious to be famous for their religion.

 

False ego means accepting this body as oneself. When one understands

that he is not his body and is spirit soul, that is real ego. Ego is

there. False ego is condemned, but not real ego. In the Vedic

literature it is said: aham brahmasmi. I am Brahman, I am spirit.

This " I am, " the sense of self, also exists in the liberated stage

of self-realization. This sense of " I am " is ego, but when the sense

of " I am " is applied to this false body, it is false ego. When the

sense of self is applied to reality, that is real ego.

 

Be humble, cast away the False Ego, Serve others without looking for

rewards or praise, and you shall attain God.

 

Krishna S

---------------------

Good question......

Ego/attachment is what separates us from God......

Spirituality is the process of understanding and experiencing this

in depth and shedding the ego....being empty.... and Emptiness is

God....

Sushil Jain

----------------------

 

Dear Sadhak

By reading Bhagvat Gita ,a time comes when we understand the message

of Bhagvat Gita.We must have devotion and faith.Every human being

ought to read one chapter every day.Otherwise at leasat recite some

short slokas every day.Read the commentary of Bhagvat Gita published

by authorative saints like Sivananda or his disciple Swami

Jyotiramayananda or Swami Chinmayananda.Some have misintepreated the

meaning of Gita.In case of doubt we should refer to the publication

of Gita Press.By starting this Gita talk they have done a good

service to the humanity.

In short Bhagvat Gita is the sum and substance of all scriptures.

God always supports the righteous people.

The number of people is irrrelevant God always help the righteous

people.The main theme is that every human being ought to perform

one's duty first

Truly yours

 

S S Bhatt

 

------------------------------

 

GITA TALK GROUP GUIDELINES: PLEASE -

1. Only responses that further clarify Gita message will be posted.

2. Quote Gitaji/scriptures wherever possible..

3. Limit personal feelings, opinions, beliefs etc. to the

extent that they further help in understanding the Gita shlokas

4. Be as concise, to the point, respecting sadhaka's time.

5. Focus on subject at hand only.

6. Do not include links to the other sites.

7. Do not include your personal information (Ph #, address etc).

8. Do not personalize message

9. All responses may not be posted.

10. Moderator at his discretion, may modify the posting.

11. Take into consideration the novices, youth, westerners, non-

sectarian audience. i.e. limit the use to Sanskrit words only.

Provide English word bracketed.

 

MODERATOR

Ram Ram

------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------

 

Post message:

Subscribe: -

Un: -

[Guest guest]

Dear Sadaks,

Most of us know that body and soul is separate, human is gift to

attain GOD, total surrender to GOD is easy way for liberation, to

speak lies is sin, to love one and all is virtue. Salvation is

Parama Anandham (Eternal Bliss), pain and suffering is from our own

account, death is certain and time of death is uncertain, we know

saints reached Bagavan (God). Their ways are shown to us Etc. But

some thing is holding us from not observing these qualities and

separating us from realization.

 

CAN WE DISCUSS WHAT IS IT---WHAT BAGAVAN SAID TO ARJUNA?

Jai Sri Krishna

B.Sathyanarayan

------------------------------

Shree Hari

Ram Ram

Kindly also provide Gita Shlokas wherever possible, so sadhaks can

read them as well. From Gita Talk Moderators, Ram Ram

----------------------------

 

NEW POSTING

 

Dear Sadhak,

 

The only thing which is holding some one back is his/her own mind,

which says-God realization is not easy, everything can be achieved

through sincere efforts, you must do this or that to reach Him. As

Swamiji says-God can be realized HERE and NOW. and God realization

is easy and effortless.

Those who dared to drop the mind have seen HIM.

 

with Love,

A sadhika

 

Sadhna Karigar

------------------------------

 

Hari Om

 

Sadhak Sathyanarainji is indeed providing much needed direction to

the deliberations !

 

Certainly while EGO is the core obstacle but in the " practical "

terms is Bhog (consumption) and Sangrah (accumulation) of worldly

things/pleasures which is holding us back. Reason: Inability to

perceive temporaryness of worldly objects/pleasures. If we firmly

understand we are 'permanent' and this body, worldly

objects/things/pleasures are temporary- instantly we shall realise

the futility and stupidity behind 'desiring' for the same and the

same 'desire' will then get directed towards Paramatma.

 

Our tendency to get 'pleasure' out of world in my view is single

most important obstacle.

 

Jai Shree Krishna

 

Vyas N B

--------------------------------

 

In Swami Sharanandji Maharaj's words

" The agony of not being perfect in spiritual path has the power to

make a sadhak perfect. "

 

Hare Krishna

Varun P. Paprunia

 

------------------------------

 

 

Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!

Very timely and important issue raised by Sathyanarayanji, indeed!

" what is holding us back from Realizing? "

Nothing is really holding us back except our own unquestioned

beliefs, ideas, opinions, about us, World, and God. We may not have

even explored the true meaning of surrender!

We may not have even explored the deep meaning of " I " or " me " !

We may have taken for granted we have understood Gita's message just

by reading!

We may not be hungry enough, thirsty enough as we may have stuffed

ourselves with so much unhealthy foods, and drinks in terms of these

unquestioned ideas, beliefs, do's and don'ts, dogmas etc in the name

of religions!

 

Suggestions:

Let us emphasize freeing " ourselves " from Doership of Karmas, rather

than to overemphasize justification of individual karmas and past

lives. That happened and nothing we can do about the past or even

future if we don't change now.

Let us question, " am I the doer of my deeds? " . What makes me think

the deeds performed by this body is mine? Is " I " the doer or

the " doer " is separate from " I " ?

Even to formulate such questions, we need to resume " I " , " me " , " my " .

So they must refer to some ideas of them in our mind, and hence

conceptual only, and may not be reality.

Why do the deeds performed through the use of this body are

mine? " Is the body " I " and the label Pratap, " me " ? Please wait,

don't answer from the mind yet!

You are provisionally opening up here, you experience a glimpse of

freedom!

Such line of questioning with open mind and honesty in answering

them or saying " I don't know " will bring so much clarity to mind

that the entire structure of " I " , " me " and my or mine " will collapse

now that the thieves(imposters) are all spotted out by the Real

Master of House, Atman, the True I or SELF, the Conscious Existence

Itself. Such line of questioning is higher reasoning and takes one

to Experiential level(Anubhuti), unreachable by the lower reasoning

of mind. Useful as it is, the mind can conceptualize such Aparaoksha

Anubhuti, the objectless experience, nicely as sages and saints are

doing it and Bhagwaan has done thorugh Gita teaching.

At this stage nothing is holding us, nothing can hold us, as there

is nothing to hold onto!

Namaskar............Pratap Bhatt

 

-------------------------------

 

Who is holding us back from Salvation?

Gita says they are the forces of Gunas and Desire. Gita says those

who are not held back are rare. That is an eternal empirical Truth.

Those who are held back are doing their Karma as per their Guna

properties. If most people are not held back, there is no fun of the

Creator and Creation. This is the ultimate Dialectics.

Basudeb Sen

----------------------------

 

PRIOR POSTING

EGO- EDGING GOD OUT- from our life is the main impediment.

With pranams,

G.Vaidyanathan.

----------------------------

What is holding us back?

 

I, I, I and ME, ME, ME

FALSE EGO

RELIGIOUS ARROGANCE

 

Bhagavan tells that the bewildered spirit soul, under the influence

of the three modes of material nature, thinks himself to be the doer

of activities, which are in actuality carried out by nature. B.G.

chapter 3 verse 27

 

The most unsatisfied and unhappiest people are those who are

selfish, self-centred, and insecure, with low self-esteem. One

should not be anxious to have the satisfaction of being honored by

others. The material conception of life makes us very eager to

receive honor from others, but from the point of view of a man in

perfect knowledge--who knows that he is not this body--anything,

honor or dishonor, pertaining to this body is useless. One should

not be hankering after this material deception. People are very

anxious to be famous for their religion.

 

False ego means accepting this body as oneself. When one understands

that he is not his body and is spirit soul, that is real ego. Ego is

there. False ego is condemned, but not real ego. In the Vedic

literature it is said: aham brahmasmi. I am Brahman, I am spirit.

This " I am, " the sense of self, also exists in the liberated stage

of self-realization. This sense of " I am " is ego, but when the sense

of " I am " is applied to this false body, it is false ego. When the

sense of self is applied to reality, that is real ego.

 

Be humble, cast away the False Ego, Serve others without looking for

rewards or praise, and you shall attain God.

 

Krishna S

---------------------

Good question......

Ego/attachment is what separates us from God......

Spirituality is the process of understanding and experiencing this

in depth and shedding the ego....being empty.... and Emptiness is

God....

Sushil Jain

----------------------

 

Dear Sadhak

By reading Bhagvat Gita ,a time comes when we understand the message

of Bhagvat Gita.We must have devotion and faith.Every human being

ought to read one chapter every day.Otherwise at leasat recite some

short slokas every day.Read the commentary of Bhagvat Gita published

by authorative saints like Sivananda or his disciple Swami

Jyotiramayananda or Swami Chinmayananda.Some have misintepreated the

meaning of Gita.In case of doubt we should refer to the publication

of Gita Press.By starting this Gita talk they have done a good

service to the humanity.

In short Bhagvat Gita is the sum and substance of all scriptures.

God always supports the righteous people.

The number of people is irrrelevant God always help the righteous

people.The main theme is that every human being ought to perform

one's duty first

Truly yours

 

S S Bhatt

 

------------------------------

 

GITA TALK GROUP GUIDELINES: PLEASE -

1. Only responses that further clarify Gita message will be posted.

2. Quote Gitaji/scriptures wherever possible..

3. Limit personal feelings, opinions, beliefs etc. to the

extent that they further help in understanding the Gita shlokas

4. Be as concise, to the point, respecting sadhaka's time.

5. Focus on subject at hand only.

6. Do not include links to the other sites.

7. Do not include your personal information (Ph #, address etc).

8. Do not personalize message

9. All responses may not be posted.

10. Moderator at his discretion, may modify the posting.

11. Take into consideration the novices, youth, westerners, non-

sectarian audience. i.e. limit the use to Sanskrit words only.

Provide English word bracketed.

 

MODERATOR

Ram Ram

------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------

 

Post message:

Subscribe: -

Un: -

[Guest guest]

Dear Sadaks,

Most of us know that body and soul is separate, human is gift to

attain GOD, total surrender to GOD is easy way for liberation, to

speak lies is sin, to love one and all is virtue. Salvation is

Parama Anandham (Eternal Bliss), pain and suffering is from our own

account, death is certain and time of death is uncertain, we know

saints reached Bagavan (God). Their ways are shown to us Etc. But

some thing is holding us from not observing these qualities and

separating us from realization.

 

CAN WE DISCUSS WHAT IS IT---WHAT BAGAVAN SAID TO ARJUNA?

Jai Sri Krishna

B.Sathyanarayan

------------------------------

Shree Hari

Ram Ram

Kindly also provide Gita Shlokas wherever possible, so sadhaks can

read them as well. From Gita Talk Moderators, Ram Ram

----------------------------

 

NEW POSTING

 

Dear Sadaks,

 

Ref: Bagavath Geetha. Bagavan said†" “Kamayesu, Krodhayesu---“

 

So Kama is topmost. Sadaks can take time and contemplate that

anything or any action is due to desire. Besides this birth is

itself due to only desire from which came all other things such as

Krodha, Mada etc. Few Examples: Desire to reach GOD makes to do

Pooja, Sat Sangh, Meditation etc. But the actions done without

desire certainly takes one faster to Athuma Bothana. Like Sri Rama

asked Sri Hanuman on the day of Patabisek, that HE (Sri Rama) wants

to present something for all the good deeds he did. Hanuman totally

refused and Sri Rama could only give HIMSELF in the arms of Hanuman.

Again this in Geetha Bagavan said in Karma Yog to surrender all

actions to HIM. If One wants to abuse, praise, work, marry,

children, education, obeying parents, friendship, pilgrimage etc are

due to some desire to attain something on this earth. Even Droupathi

called Sri Krishna because of being disrobed. But Gajendra the

elephant called Bagavan when caught by Crocodile. Bagavan is said HE

even pushed aside Sri Mahalakshme when HE ran to rescue elephant.

But after rescue the elephant said ,â€Oh Bagavan I called YOU not

for saving my life or from death, but to present you this lotus

flower before deathâ€. It is said that Bagavan took HIS anga Vastra

blew Hot air from his mouth on vastra and pampered on the wound of

elephant, as a mother does to her child on eyes when dust falls

into. Hanuman or Gajendra had NO desire for anything to survive but

only desire of action less on Bagavan. Still better when Markandeya

Maha Rishi sitting in Badrinath, Sri Vishnu appeared and said that

HE came to praise his Tapas. The Rishi said, “Oh Bagavan it is not

my Tapas, YOU made me do it, YOU decided to come here and nothing is

my effortâ€. Bagavan said, “ Markandeya you won MY maya and you

will know what MY Vishnu Maya isâ€.

 

One Alwar Vaisnavite sang, “ Oh bagavan when YOU could save that

elephant from one crocodile, then I am sure that YOU can save me

from many crocodile (Desires) that are catching me.†To That faith

Sri Vishnu appeared to him.

 

DESIRE

 

Detaches SAT from reaching.

 

CONCEQUENCES

 

Desires, Enjoyment, Sufferings, Involvement worldly Etc

 

UNTIL Athuma Botha

 

Desire--- Dies

 

Enjoyment--- Ends

 

Suffering--Stops

 

Involvement ---Invalid

 

Rejoycement--- ruined

 

Emotions ---Escaped

 

THIS RESULTS IN

 

Divinity setting in

 

Sins evaporating

 

Rebirth never comes

 

TATVA Masi. This is A little of Sabdhajala Maha

Araniyam

 

 

 

This is also said in Vivekachudamani as,

 

VADANTHU SASTRANI,

 

YAJANTHU DEVANI

 

KURVANTHU KARMANI

 

BAJANTHU DEVATHA

 

ATHUMA AYIKIYA BHODANI

 

NAH SHIDYHATHE

 

BRAMA SATHANTRA REPINI

 

Bagavan also said same about this in Geetha, as Sri Krishna to

Vasudev not to do pooja to mountain govardhan,

 

To Arjuna saying when HE is in front why sastras. Because they were

ignorant of Athuma bodha.

 

Jai sri Krishna

 

B.Sathyanarayan

---------------------------

 

 

---------------------------

Dear Sadaks,

I, Me, Mine Ego all are coming into action only due to desire. " I "

want. It is ME that " I " did. This is mine. EGO --I am better than

him. is desire to be super. All that we discuss, interrogate, learn,

Do and act, read and understand is all Bagavans, since HE blessed us

with time to think on HIM, trying to know of HIM, eyes to read

Geetha, legs to walk to temple, ears to listen divine speeches,

mouth to sing of HIM, Etc. We are Yoga Brastas ref Geetha. There

are millions totally disconnected from this Sat Sangh, may be

millionaire, or begger, householder, professional, artist, actors,

sportsmen, TV addict, Etc all with NO time to even think of Bagavan

but a big RAT race for what? Eventually fame, money, comfort, etc

which ALL collapses on closing eyes and all that saved by RAT race

is enjoyed or fought over by someone. This in Bible there is a

parable know as " Prodicle Son " and a " Miser " . The miser when died,

reach heaven and he was asked why he lived Rat Race. The punishment

was to send the soul back to earth to wittness how his wealth was

spent recoklessly, which this soul will undergo totcher and repent.

Though this in Bible, in Srimat Bagavat it is similar to Gokarna

story. We have to grab values from anywhere with faith without

doubt. But all faith does lead to Geetha or Srimat Bagavath in which

Sri Krishna said HE lives in.

Jai Sri Krishna

B.Sathyanarayan

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

----------------------------

PRIOR POSTING

Dear Sadhak,

 

The only thing which is holding some one back is his/her own mind,

which says-God realization is not easy, everything can be achieved

through sincere efforts, you must do this or that to reach Him. As

Swamiji says-God can be realized HERE and NOW. and God realization

is easy and effortless.

Those who dared to drop the mind have seen HIM.

 

with Love,

A sadhika

 

Sadhna Karigar

------------------------------

 

Hari Om

 

Sadhak Sathyanarainji is indeed providing much needed direction to

the deliberations !

 

Certainly while EGO is the core obstacle but in the " practical "

terms is Bhog (consumption) and Sangrah (accumulation) of worldly

things/pleasures which is holding us back. Reason: Inability to

perceive temporaryness of worldly objects/pleasures. If we firmly

understand we are 'permanent' and this body, worldly

objects/things/pleasures are temporary- instantly we shall realise

the futility and stupidity behind 'desiring' for the same and the

same 'desire' will then get directed towards Paramatma.

 

Our tendency to get 'pleasure' out of world in my view is single

most important obstacle.

 

Jai Shree Krishna

 

Vyas N B

--------------------------------

 

In Swami Sharanandji Maharaj's words

" The agony of not being perfect in spiritual path has the power to

make a sadhak perfect. "

 

Hare Krishna

Varun P. Paprunia

 

------------------------------

 

 

Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!

Very timely and important issue raised by Sathyanarayanji, indeed!

" what is holding us back from Realizing? "

Nothing is really holding us back except our own unquestioned

beliefs, ideas, opinions, about us, World, and God. We may not have

even explored the true meaning of surrender!

We may not have even explored the deep meaning of " I " or " me " !

We may have taken for granted we have understood Gita's message just

by reading!

We may not be hungry enough, thirsty enough as we may have stuffed

ourselves with so much unhealthy foods, and drinks in terms of these

unquestioned ideas, beliefs, do's and don'ts, dogmas etc in the name

of religions!

 

Suggestions:

Let us emphasize freeing " ourselves " from Doership of Karmas, rather

than to overemphasize justification of individual karmas and past

lives. That happened and nothing we can do about the past or even

future if we don't change now.

Let us question, " am I the doer of my deeds? " . What makes me think

the deeds performed by this body is mine? Is " I " the doer or

the " doer " is separate from " I " ?

Even to formulate such questions, we need to resume " I " , " me " , " my " .

So they must refer to some ideas of them in our mind, and hence

conceptual only, and may not be reality.

Why do the deeds performed through the use of this body are

mine? " Is the body " I " and the label Pratap, " me " ? Please wait,

don't answer from the mind yet!

You are provisionally opening up here, you experience a glimpse of

freedom!

Such line of questioning with open mind and honesty in answering

them or saying " I don't know " will bring so much clarity to mind

that the entire structure of " I " , " me " and my or mine " will collapse

now that the thieves(imposters) are all spotted out by the Real

Master of House, Atman, the True I or SELF, the Conscious Existence

Itself. Such line of questioning is higher reasoning and takes one

to Experiential level(Anubhuti), unreachable by the lower reasoning

of mind. Useful as it is, the mind can conceptualize such Aparaoksha

Anubhuti, the objectless experience, nicely as sages and saints are

doing it and Bhagwaan has done thorugh Gita teaching.

At this stage nothing is holding us, nothing can hold us, as there

is nothing to hold onto!

Namaskar............Pratap Bhatt

 

-------------------------------

 

Who is holding us back from Salvation?

Gita says they are the forces of Gunas and Desire. Gita says those

who are not held back are rare. That is an eternal empirical Truth.

Those who are held back are doing their Karma as per their Guna

properties. If most people are not held back, there is no fun of the

Creator and Creation. This is the ultimate Dialectics.

Basudeb Sen

----------------------------

 

PRIOR POSTING

EGO- EDGING GOD OUT- from our life is the main impediment.

With pranams,

G.Vaidyanathan.

----------------------------

What is holding us back?

 

I, I, I and ME, ME, ME

FALSE EGO

RELIGIOUS ARROGANCE

 

Bhagavan tells that the bewildered spirit soul, under the influence

of the three modes of material nature, thinks himself to be the doer

of activities, which are in actuality carried out by nature. B.G.

chapter 3 verse 27

 

The most unsatisfied and unhappiest people are those who are

selfish, self-centred, and insecure, with low self-esteem. One

should not be anxious to have the satisfaction of being honored by

others. The material conception of life makes us very eager to

receive honor from others, but from the point of view of a man in

perfect knowledge--who knows that he is not this body--anything,

honor or dishonor, pertaining to this body is useless. One should

not be hankering after this material deception. People are very

anxious to be famous for their religion.

 

False ego means accepting this body as oneself. When one understands

that he is not his body and is spirit soul, that is real ego. Ego is

there. False ego is condemned, but not real ego. In the Vedic

literature it is said: aham brahmasmi. I am Brahman, I am spirit.

This " I am, " the sense of self, also exists in the liberated stage

of self-realization. This sense of " I am " is ego, but when the sense

of " I am " is applied to this false body, it is false ego. When the

sense of self is applied to reality, that is real ego.

 

Be humble, cast away the False Ego, Serve others without looking for

rewards or praise, and you shall attain God.

 

Krishna S

---------------------

Good question......

Ego/attachment is what separates us from God......

Spirituality is the process of understanding and experiencing this

in depth and shedding the ego....being empty.... and Emptiness is

God....

Sushil Jain

----------------------

 

Dear Sadhak

By reading Bhagvat Gita ,a time comes when we understand the message

of Bhagvat Gita.We must have devotion and faith.Every human being

ought to read one chapter every day.Otherwise at leasat recite some

short slokas every day.Read the commentary of Bhagvat Gita published

by authorative saints like Sivananda or his disciple Swami

Jyotiramayananda or Swami Chinmayananda.Some have misintepreated the

meaning of Gita.In case of doubt we should refer to the publication

of Gita Press.By starting this Gita talk they have done a good

service to the humanity.

In short Bhagvat Gita is the sum and substance of all scriptures.

God always supports the righteous people.

The number of people is irrrelevant God always help the righteous

people.The main theme is that every human being ought to perform

one's duty first

Truly yours

 

S S Bhatt

 

------------------------------

 

GITA TALK GROUP GUIDELINES: PLEASE -

1. Only responses that further clarify Gita message will be posted.

2. Quote Gitaji/scriptures wherever possible..

3. Limit personal feelings, opinions, beliefs etc. to the

extent that they further help in understanding the Gita shlokas

4. Be as concise, to the point, respecting sadhaka's time.

5. Focus on subject at hand only.

6. Do not include links to the other sites.

7. Do not include your personal information (Ph #, address etc).

8. Do not personalize message

9. All responses may not be posted.

10. Moderator at his discretion, may modify the posting.

11. Take into consideration the novices, youth, westerners, non-

sectarian audience. i.e. limit the use to Sanskrit words only.

Provide English word bracketed.

 

MODERATOR

Ram Ram

------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------

 

Post message:

Subscribe: -

Un: -

[Guest guest]

Dear Sadaks,

Most of us know that body and soul is separate, human is gift to

attain GOD, total surrender to GOD is easy way for liberation, to

speak lies is sin, to love one and all is virtue. Salvation is

Parama Anandham (Eternal Bliss), pain and suffering is from our own

account, death is certain and time of death is uncertain, we know

saints reached Bagavan (God). Their ways are shown to us Etc. But

some thing is holding us from not observing these qualities and

separating us from realization.

 

CAN WE DISCUSS WHAT IS IT---WHAT BAGAVAN SAID TO ARJUNA?

Jai Sri Krishna

B.Sathyanarayan

------------------------------

NEW POSTING

 

Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!

Most of us have spoken on " what is holding us back " . Sathyanarayanji

has outlined in details with references from scriptures too. The

culprit, in general, is desire for objects, in some forms, or idea

in the mind that realization is not easy as Sadhanaji pointed it out

rightly.

If we go a level below to dig deep, all desires can be linked to

just single desire of wanting to be complete, full, happy, peaceful.

This is " the Desire " which goes unnoticed as it is covered up by

many desires for objects, gross and subtle!

The true desire is from our innate nature to rest in Wholeness, the

true nature of what we are is already full in itself, within itself,

by itself, for itself.

However, we feel, and think we are limited by the body, by the

knowledge we have, in our relationship, in our possessions of

objects of the world etc. Limitations make us pursue objects! All

such worldly pursuits do bring limited happiness, and temporarily

wipe out desires when fulfilled, making us desire-less. How short-

lived the desire-less state lasts, it makes us happy and fulfilled,

nevertheless. There is an absence of " me " , the one who is desire

itself, is gone now for a while. This fools us making us keep

chasing objects to fulfill " me " which cannot be fulfilled by such

external pursuits of objects. The key is to realize that it is not

objects that fulfill us(neither do they cause pain), but temporary

absence of " me " and therefore, desirelessness that makes us happy!

Limited objects can only give limited happiness is the LAW.

The single biggest limitation we have imposed on us is due to

identification with body-mind-senses-intellect, the mother of all

subsequent limitations out of which we are compelled to keep on

desiring as we feel lack in ourselves, inadequate, and insignificant

all through the life!

So it is essential to cast off " me " , the separating agency to become

full now and here!

Ii is a matter of realizing, discovering first handed by looking our

experiences, that we were, we are and we will be ever Full,

Adedquate, and Significant!

Namaskar...........Pratap Bhatt

----------------------------

 

 

-Shree Hari-

 

Dear Sadhak Sathyanarainji,

When I saw your post, I said to myself, " Mike, me tell

Sathyanarainji, about Gitaji, Shree Krisna , Arjuna, what am I the

court jester before the Emperor, best be quiet and just be the

student " .

Thus I am.

I think I picked up on the point of desire. Look, if one takes up

certain practices, as a means of obtaining, 'Liberation', I can't

help feeling there is a possible danger of Ego becoming entwined in

the desire for God realization. Juxtaposed to this, is one who turns

to God, for no other reason than he sees 'The Beloved' as his only

hope and his only way, may take to meditation, naam jap, or

whatever, in the manner a young man may sing a song to his beloved,

or write a poem.

 

I also noticed that Arjuna's so called logical thinking got a real

drubbing by Bhagwan in the early part of Gitaji.

I read how Mrs Tweedie had her 'Spiritual Knowledge' turned up side

down and sideways by her 'Sat Guru', smashed as it were, before she

finally found 'Divine Bliss'.

 

I have noted Sathyanarainji, that you have knowledge of the Bible,

there's something that reflects my thoughts, on worldly

knowledge,(false knowledge). 1 Cor 3 :18-19 [....If any one among you

think that he is wise in this age, let him become a fool that he may

become wise. For the wisdom of this world is folly with God.

I really cannot see Lord Krishna taking umbrage with that.

 

One other point; I have read a lot about Ego, and how to get rid of

it, I am sure one cannot defeat Ego with Ego, turning to,

surrendering to Bhagwan will lead to death of Ego, that is how I see

it, also the Ego can take hammering by the blessing of unfavorable

circumstances.

 

These are just my thoughts as a student.

 

With Respect and Divine Love,

 

Mike (Keenor)

-------------------------------

 

 

PRIOR POSTING

Dear Sadaks,

 

Ref: Bagavath Geetha. Bagavan said " Kamayesu, Krodhayesu--- "

So Kama is topmost. Sadaks can take time and contemplate that

anything or any action is due to desire. Besides this birth is

itself due to only desire from which came all other things such as

Krodha, Mada etc. Few Examples: Desire to reach GOD makes to do

Pooja, Sat Sangh, Meditation etc. But the actions done without

desire certainly takes one faster to Athuma Bothana. Like Sri Rama

asked Sri Hanuman on the day of Patabisek, that HE (Sri Rama) wants

to present something for all the good deeds he did. Hanuman totally

refused and Sri Rama could only give HIMSELF in the arms of Hanuman.

Again this in Geetha Bagavan said in Karma Yog to surrender all

actions to HIM. If One wants to abuse, praise, work, marry,

children, education, obeying parents, friendship, pilgrimage etc are

due to some desire to attain something on this earth. Even Droupathi

called Sri Krishna because of being disrobed. But Gajendra the

elephant called Bagavan when caught by Crocodile. Bagavan is said HE

even pushed aside Sri Mahalakshme when HE ran to rescue elephant.

But after rescue the elephant said , " Oh Bagavan I called YOU not

for saving my life or from death, but to present you this lotus

flower before death " . It is said that Bagavan took HIS anga Vastra

blew Hot air from his mouth on vastra and pampered on the wound of

elephant, as a mother does to her child on eyes when dust falls

into. Hanuman or Gajendra had NO desire for anything to survive but

only desire of action less on Bagavan. Still better when Markandeya

Maha Rishi sitting in Badrinath, Sri Vishnu appeared and said that

HE came to praise his Tapas. The Rishi said, " Oh Bagavan it is not

my Tapas, YOU made me do it, YOU decided to come here and nothing is

my effort " . Bagavan said, " Markandeya you won MY maya and you

will know what MY Vishnu Maya is " .

 

One Alwar Vaisnavite sang, " Oh bagavan when YOU could save that

elephant from one crocodile, then I am sure that YOU can save me

from many crocodile (Desires) that are catching me. " To That faith

Sri Vishnu appeared to him.

 

DESIRE

 

Detaches SAT from reaching.

 

CONCEQUENCES

 

Desires, Enjoyment, Sufferings, Involvement worldly Etc

 

UNTIL Athuma Botha

 

Desire--- Dies

 

Enjoyment--- Ends

 

Suffering--Stops

 

Involvement ---Invalid

 

Rejoycement--- ruined

 

Emotions ---Escaped

 

THIS RESULTS IN

 

Divinity setting in

 

Sins evaporating

 

Rebirth never comes

 

TATVA Masi. This is A little of Sabdhajala Maha

Araniyam

 

 

 

This is also said in Vivekachudamani as,

 

VADANTHU SASTRANI,

 

YAJANTHU DEVANI

 

KURVANTHU KARMANI

 

BAJANTHU DEVATHA

 

ATHUMA AYIKIYA BHODANI

 

NAH SHIDYHATHE

 

BRAMA SATHANTRA REPINI

 

Bagavan also said same about this in Geetha, as Sri Krishna to

Vasudev not to do pooja to mountain govardhan,

 

To Arjuna saying when HE is in front why sastras. Because they were

ignorant of Athuma bodha.

 

Jai sri Krishna

 

B.Sathyanarayan

---------------------------

 

Dear Sadaks,

I, Me, Mine Ego all are coming into action only due to desire. " I "

want. It is ME that " I " did. This is mine. EGO --I am better than

him. is desire to be super. All that we discuss, interrogate, learn,

Do and act, read and understand is all Bagavans, since HE blessed us

with time to think on HIM, trying to know of HIM, eyes to read

Geetha, legs to walk to temple, ears to listen divine speeches,

mouth to sing of HIM, Etc. We are Yoga Brastas ref Geetha. There

are millions totally disconnected from this Sat Sangh, may be

millionaire, or begger, householder, professional, artist, actors,

sportsmen, TV addict, Etc all with NO time to even think of Bagavan

but a big RAT race for what? Eventually fame, money, comfort, etc

which ALL collapses on closing eyes and all that saved by RAT race

is enjoyed or fought over by someone. This in Bible there is a

parable know as " Prodicle Son " and a " Miser " . The miser when died,

reach heaven and he was asked why he lived Rat Race. The punishment

was to send the soul back to earth to wittness how his wealth was

spent recoklessly, which this soul will undergo totcher and repent.

Though this in Bible, in Srimat Bagavat it is similar to Gokarna

story. We have to grab values from anywhere with faith without

doubt. But all faith does lead to Geetha or Srimat Bagavath in which

Sri Krishna said HE lives in.

Jai Sri Krishna

B.Sathyanarayan

 

----------------------------

PRIOR POSTING

Dear Sadhak,

 

The only thing which is holding some one back is his/her own mind,

which says-God realization is not easy, everything can be achieved

through sincere efforts, you must do this or that to reach Him. As

Swamiji says-God can be realized HERE and NOW. and God realization

is easy and effortless.

Those who dared to drop the mind have seen HIM.

 

with Love,

A sadhika

 

Sadhna Karigar

------------------------------

 

Hari Om

 

Sadhak Sathyanarainji is indeed providing much needed direction to

the deliberations !

 

Certainly while EGO is the core obstacle but in the " practical "

terms is Bhog (consumption) and Sangrah (accumulation) of worldly

things/pleasures which is holding us back. Reason: Inability to

perceive temporaryness of worldly objects/pleasures. If we firmly

understand we are 'permanent' and this body, worldly

objects/things/pleasures are temporary- instantly we shall realise

the futility and stupidity behind 'desiring' for the same and the

same 'desire' will then get directed towards Paramatma.

 

Our tendency to get 'pleasure' out of world in my view is single

most important obstacle.

 

Jai Shree Krishna

Vyas N B

--------------------------------

 

In Swami Sharanandji Maharaj's words

" The agony of not being perfect in spiritual path has the power to

make a sadhak perfect. "

 

Hare Krishna

Varun P. Paprunia

 

------------------------------

 

 

Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!

Very timely and important issue raised by Sathyanarayanji, indeed!

" what is holding us back from Realizing? "

Nothing is really holding us back except our own unquestioned

beliefs, ideas, opinions, about us, World, and God. We may not have

even explored the true meaning of surrender!

We may not have even explored the deep meaning of " I " or " me " !

We may have taken for granted we have understood Gita's message just

by reading!

We may not be hungry enough, thirsty enough as we may have stuffed

ourselves with so much unhealthy foods, and drinks in terms of these

unquestioned ideas, beliefs, do's and don'ts, dogmas etc in the name

of religions!

 

Suggestions:

Let us emphasize freeing " ourselves " from Doership of Karmas, rather

than to overemphasize justification of individual karmas and past

lives. That happened and nothing we can do about the past or even

future if we don't change now.

Let us question, " am I the doer of my deeds? " . What makes me think

the deeds performed by this body is mine? Is " I " the doer or

the " doer " is separate from " I " ?

Even to formulate such questions, we need to resume " I " , " me " , " my " .

So they must refer to some ideas of them in our mind, and hence

conceptual only, and may not be reality.

Why do the deeds performed through the use of this body are

mine? " Is the body " I " and the label Pratap, " me " ? Please wait,

don't answer from the mind yet!

You are provisionally opening up here, you experience a glimpse of

freedom!

Such line of questioning with open mind and honesty in answering

them or saying " I don't know " will bring so much clarity to mind

that the entire structure of " I " , " me " and my or mine " will collapse

now that the thieves(imposters) are all spotted out by the Real

Master of House, Atman, the True I or SELF, the Conscious Existence

Itself. Such line of questioning is higher reasoning and takes one

to Experiential level(Anubhuti), unreachable by the lower reasoning

of mind. Useful as it is, the mind can conceptualize such Aparaoksha

Anubhuti, the objectless experience, nicely as sages and saints are

doing it and Bhagwaan has done thorugh Gita teaching.

At this stage nothing is holding us, nothing can hold us, as there

is nothing to hold onto!

Namaskar............Pratap Bhatt

 

-------------------------------

 

Who is holding us back from Salvation?

Gita says they are the forces of Gunas and Desire. Gita says those

who are not held back are rare. That is an eternal empirical Truth.

Those who are held back are doing their Karma as per their Guna

properties. If most people are not held back, there is no fun of the

Creator and Creation. This is the ultimate Dialectics.

Basudeb Sen

----------------------------

 

PRIOR POSTING

EGO- EDGING GOD OUT- from our life is the main impediment.

With pranams,

G.Vaidyanathan.

----------------------------

What is holding us back?

 

I, I, I and ME, ME, ME

FALSE EGO

RELIGIOUS ARROGANCE

 

Bhagavan tells that the bewildered spirit soul, under the influence

of the three modes of material nature, thinks himself to be the doer

of activities, which are in actuality carried out by nature. B.G.

chapter 3 verse 27

 

The most unsatisfied and unhappiest people are those who are

selfish, self-centred, and insecure, with low self-esteem. One

should not be anxious to have the satisfaction of being honored by

others. The material conception of life makes us very eager to

receive honor from others, but from the point of view of a man in

perfect knowledge--who knows that he is not this body--anything,

honor or dishonor, pertaining to this body is useless. One should

not be hankering after this material deception. People are very

anxious to be famous for their religion.

 

False ego means accepting this body as oneself. When one understands

that he is not his body and is spirit soul, that is real ego. Ego is

there. False ego is condemned, but not real ego. In the Vedic

literature it is said: aham brahmasmi. I am Brahman, I am spirit.

This " I am, " the sense of self, also exists in the liberated stage

of self-realization. This sense of " I am " is ego, but when the sense

of " I am " is applied to this false body, it is false ego. When the

sense of self is applied to reality, that is real ego.

 

Be humble, cast away the False Ego, Serve others without looking for

rewards or praise, and you shall attain God.

 

Krishna S

---------------------

Good question......

Ego/attachment is what separates us from God......

Spirituality is the process of understanding and experiencing this

in depth and shedding the ego....being empty.... and Emptiness is

God....

Sushil Jain

----------------------

 

Dear Sadhak

By reading Bhagvat Gita ,a time comes when we understand the message

of Bhagvat Gita.We must have devotion and faith.Every human being

ought to read one chapter every day.Otherwise at leasat recite some

short slokas every day.Read the commentary of Bhagvat Gita published

by authorative saints like Sivananda or his disciple Swami

Jyotiramayananda or Swami Chinmayananda.Some have misintepreated the

meaning of Gita.In case of doubt we should refer to the publication

of Gita Press.By starting this Gita talk they have done a good

service to the humanity.

In short Bhagvat Gita is the sum and substance of all scriptures.

God always supports the righteous people.

The number of people is irrrelevant God always help the righteous

people.The main theme is that every human being ought to perform

one's duty first

Truly yours

 

S S Bhatt

 

------------------------------

 

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3. Limit personal feelings, opinions, beliefs etc. to the

extent that they further help in understanding the Gita shlokas

4. Be as concise, to the point, respecting sadhaka's time.

5. Focus on subject at hand only.

6. Do not include links to the other sites.

7. Do not include your personal information (Ph #, address etc).

8. Do not personalize message

9. All responses may not be posted.

10. Moderator at his discretion, may modify the posting.

11. Take into consideration the novices, youth, westerners, non-

sectarian audience. i.e. limit the use to Sanskrit words only.

Provide English word bracketed.

 

MODERATOR

Ram Ram

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[Guest guest]

Dear Sadaks,

Most of us know that body and soul is separate, human is gift to

attain GOD, total surrender to GOD is easy way for liberation, to

speak lies is sin, to love one and all is virtue. Salvation is

Parama Anandham (Eternal Bliss), pain and suffering is from our own

account, death is certain and time of death is uncertain, we know

saints reached Bagavan (God). Their ways are shown to us Etc. But

some thing is holding us from not observing these qualities and

separating us from realization.

 

CAN WE DISCUSS WHAT IS IT---WHAT BAGAVAN SAID TO ARJUNA?

Jai Sri Krishna

B.Sathyanarayan

------------------------------

NEW POSTING

 

Dear Sadak Mikeji,

Said by Mikeji-- " .If any one among you think that he is wise in this

age, let him become a fool that he may become wise. For the wisdom

of this world is folly with God " .

 

For me Mike and myself are NOT two spirits only one but 2 bodies.

Wise or fool are also not 2 separate entities. As Mikeji says, " let

him become a fool that he may become wise. " is first instance a

desire to be fool to become wise. Second instance fool only becomes

wise later OR wise also can become fool. The change in behavior

(Fool or wise) does not affect Atma. Changes in age pattern, changes

in behavioral pattern (In childhood play, adulthood pleasure, middle

age workholic, old age feeling worried (Chintta Sakthaha) Reference

Bajagovindam, finally Asthi does not affect Athuman. Again birth and

cycle of life until NO desires happens. With this body is Mike later

with another body Mr.White. Mr.Mike or Mr. White are names given to

bodies (Prameyams) not to Apprameyams (Divinity). Nobody was born

with knowledge. All learnt here by God`s grace. We share knowledge.

But Ego peeps unknowingly somewhere, that which only ones own

conscience can illuminate.

 

Thus says, Mikeji, " I said to myself, " Mike, me tell Sathyanarainji,

about Gitaji, Shree Krisna , Arjuna, what am I the court jester

before the Emperor, best be quiet and just be the

student " . Respected Sir Mike, we all are THAT -- " SAT " . No emperor or

student. Please refer in Geetha, " Bagavan HIMSELF said that about

Gunatheethan & Stitapragnan that they are not different than

HIMSELF " . Besides, why have desire to be quiet or to be student?

Quietness happens it cannot be made to happen. We all are trying

best to quieten mind, does it (Mind) obey? To quieten the mind GURU

or GOVINDA (GOD) has to come say Sant Tukaram. just like a

prostitute been stoned by people, there came Guru the Christ to

quieten the mind. Refrence Bible. Buddha could not quieten his mind

for years. When his mind quietened he became dumb for days. It

happened. Everybody thought he is Mad, like Pagal Baba. Thank you

Mikeji for sharing valuable knowledge.

Jai Sri Krishna

B.Sathyanarayan

 

-------------------

 

===============================================================

PRIOR POSTING

 

Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!

Most of us have spoken on " what is holding us back " . Sathyanarayanji

has outlined in details with references from scriptures too. The

culprit, in general, is desire for objects, in some forms, or idea

in the mind that realization is not easy as Sadhanaji pointed it out

rightly.

If we go a level below to dig deep, all desires can be linked to

just single desire of wanting to be complete, full, happy, peaceful.

This is " the Desire " which goes unnoticed as it is covered up by

many desires for objects, gross and subtle!

The true desire is from our innate nature to rest in Wholeness, the

true nature of what we are is already full in itself, within itself,

by itself, for itself.

However, we feel, and think we are limited by the body, by the

knowledge we have, in our relationship, in our possessions of

objects of the world etc. Limitations make us pursue objects! All

such worldly pursuits do bring limited happiness, and temporarily

wipe out desires when fulfilled, making us desire-less. How short-

lived the desire-less state lasts, it makes us happy and fulfilled,

nevertheless. There is an absence of " me " , the one who is desire

itself, is gone now for a while. This fools us making us keep

chasing objects to fulfill " me " which cannot be fulfilled by such

external pursuits of objects. The key is to realize that it is not

objects that fulfill us(neither do they cause pain), but temporary

absence of " me " and therefore, desirelessness that makes us happy!

Limited objects can only give limited happiness is the LAW.

The single biggest limitation we have imposed on us is due to

identification with body-mind-senses-intellect, the mother of all

subsequent limitations out of which we are compelled to keep on

desiring as we feel lack in ourselves, inadequate, and insignificant

all through the life!

So it is essential to cast off " me " , the separating agency to become

full now and here!

Ii is a matter of realizing, discovering first handed by looking our

experiences, that we were, we are and we will be ever Full,

Adedquate, and Significant!

Namaskar...........Pratap Bhatt

----------------------------

 

 

-Shree Hari-

 

Dear Sadhak Sathyanarainji,

When I saw your post, I said to myself, " Mike, me tell

Sathyanarainji, about Gitaji, Shree Krisna , Arjuna, what am I the

court jester before the Emperor, best be quiet and just be the

student " .

Thus I am.

I think I picked up on the point of desire. Look, if one takes up

certain practices, as a means of obtaining, 'Liberation', I can't

help feeling there is a possible danger of Ego becoming entwined in

the desire for God realization. Juxtaposed to this, is one who turns

to God, for no other reason than he sees 'The Beloved' as his only

hope and his only way, may take to meditation, naam jap, or

whatever, in the manner a young man may sing a song to his beloved,

or write a poem.

 

I also noticed that Arjuna's so called logical thinking got a real

drubbing by Bhagwan in the early part of Gitaji.

I read how Mrs Tweedie had her 'Spiritual Knowledge' turned up side

down and sideways by her 'Sat Guru', smashed as it were, before she

finally found 'Divine Bliss'.

 

I have noted Sathyanarainji, that you have knowledge of the Bible,

there's something that reflects my thoughts, on worldly

knowledge,(false knowledge). 1 Cor 3 :18-19 [....If any one among you

think that he is wise in this age, let him become a fool that he may

become wise. For the wisdom of this world is folly with God.

I really cannot see Lord Krishna taking umbrage with that.

 

One other point; I have read a lot about Ego, and how to get rid of

it, I am sure one cannot defeat Ego with Ego, turning to,

surrendering to Bhagwan will lead to death of Ego, that is how I see

it, also the Ego can take hammering by the blessing of unfavorable

circumstances.

 

These are just my thoughts as a student.

 

With Respect and Divine Love,

 

Mike (Keenor)

-------------------------------

 

 

PRIOR POSTING

Dear Sadaks,

 

Ref: Bagavath Geetha. Bagavan said " Kamayesu, Krodhayesu--- "

So Kama is topmost. Sadaks can take time and contemplate that

anything or any action is due to desire. Besides this birth is

itself due to only desire from which came all other things such as

Krodha, Mada etc. Few Examples: Desire to reach GOD makes to do

Pooja, Sat Sangh, Meditation etc. But the actions done without

desire certainly takes one faster to Athuma Bothana. Like Sri Rama

asked Sri Hanuman on the day of Patabisek, that HE (Sri Rama) wants

to present something for all the good deeds he did. Hanuman totally

refused and Sri Rama could only give HIMSELF in the arms of Hanuman.

Again this in Geetha Bagavan said in Karma Yog to surrender all

actions to HIM. If One wants to abuse, praise, work, marry,

children, education, obeying parents, friendship, pilgrimage etc are

due to some desire to attain something on this earth. Even Droupathi

called Sri Krishna because of being disrobed. But Gajendra the

elephant called Bagavan when caught by Crocodile. Bagavan is said HE

even pushed aside Sri Mahalakshme when HE ran to rescue elephant.

But after rescue the elephant said , " Oh Bagavan I called YOU not

for saving my life or from death, but to present you this lotus

flower before death " . It is said that Bagavan took HIS anga Vastra

blew Hot air from his mouth on vastra and pampered on the wound of

elephant, as a mother does to her child on eyes when dust falls

into. Hanuman or Gajendra had NO desire for anything to survive but

only desire of action less on Bagavan. Still better when Markandeya

Maha Rishi sitting in Badrinath, Sri Vishnu appeared and said that

HE came to praise his Tapas. The Rishi said, " Oh Bagavan it is not

my Tapas, YOU made me do it, YOU decided to come here and nothing is

my effort " . Bagavan said, " Markandeya you won MY maya and you

will know what MY Vishnu Maya is " .

 

One Alwar Vaisnavite sang, " Oh bagavan when YOU could save that

elephant from one crocodile, then I am sure that YOU can save me

from many crocodile (Desires) that are catching me. " To That faith

Sri Vishnu appeared to him.

 

DESIRE

 

Detaches SAT from reaching.

 

CONCEQUENCES

 

Desires, Enjoyment, Sufferings, Involvement worldly Etc

 

UNTIL Athuma Botha

 

Desire--- Dies

 

Enjoyment--- Ends

 

Suffering--Stops

 

Involvement ---Invalid

 

Rejoycement--- ruined

 

Emotions ---Escaped

 

THIS RESULTS IN

 

Divinity setting in

 

Sins evaporating

 

Rebirth never comes

 

TATVA Masi. This is A little of Sabdhajala Maha

Araniyam

 

 

 

This is also said in Vivekachudamani as,

 

VADANTHU SASTRANI,

 

YAJANTHU DEVANI

 

KURVANTHU KARMANI

 

BAJANTHU DEVATHA

 

ATHUMA AYIKIYA BHODANI

 

NAH SHIDYHATHE

 

BRAMA SATHANTRA REPINI

 

Bagavan also said same about this in Geetha, as Sri Krishna to

Vasudev not to do pooja to mountain govardhan,

 

To Arjuna saying when HE is in front why sastras. Because they were

ignorant of Athuma bodha.

 

Jai sri Krishna

 

B.Sathyanarayan

---------------------------

 

Dear Sadaks,

I, Me, Mine Ego all are coming into action only due to desire. " I "

want. It is ME that " I " did. This is mine. EGO --I am better than

him. is desire to be super. All that we discuss, interrogate, learn,

Do and act, read and understand is all Bagavans, since HE blessed us

with time to think on HIM, trying to know of HIM, eyes to read

Geetha, legs to walk to temple, ears to listen divine speeches,

mouth to sing of HIM, Etc. We are Yoga Brastas ref Geetha. There

are millions totally disconnected from this Sat Sangh, may be

millionaire, or begger, householder, professional, artist, actors,

sportsmen, TV addict, Etc all with NO time to even think of Bagavan

but a big RAT race for what? Eventually fame, money, comfort, etc

which ALL collapses on closing eyes and all that saved by RAT race

is enjoyed or fought over by someone. This in Bible there is a

parable know as " Prodicle Son " and a " Miser " . The miser when died,

reach heaven and he was asked why he lived Rat Race. The punishment

was to send the soul back to earth to wittness how his wealth was

spent recoklessly, which this soul will undergo totcher and repent.

Though this in Bible, in Srimat Bagavat it is similar to Gokarna

story. We have to grab values from anywhere with faith without

doubt. But all faith does lead to Geetha or Srimat Bagavath in which

Sri Krishna said HE lives in.

Jai Sri Krishna

B.Sathyanarayan

 

----------------------------

PRIOR POSTING

Dear Sadhak,

 

The only thing which is holding some one back is his/her own mind,

which says-God realization is not easy, everything can be achieved

through sincere efforts, you must do this or that to reach Him. As

Swamiji says-God can be realized HERE and NOW. and God realization

is easy and effortless.

Those who dared to drop the mind have seen HIM.

 

with Love,

A sadhika

 

Sadhna Karigar

------------------------------

 

Hari Om

 

Sadhak Sathyanarainji is indeed providing much needed direction to

the deliberations !

 

Certainly while EGO is the core obstacle but in the " practical "

terms is Bhog (consumption) and Sangrah (accumulation) of worldly

things/pleasures which is holding us back. Reason: Inability to

perceive temporaryness of worldly objects/pleasures. If we firmly

understand we are 'permanent' and this body, worldly

objects/things/pleasures are temporary- instantly we shall realise

the futility and stupidity behind 'desiring' for the same and the

same 'desire' will then get directed towards Paramatma.

 

Our tendency to get 'pleasure' out of world in my view is single

most important obstacle.

 

Jai Shree Krishna

Vyas N B

--------------------------------

 

In Swami Sharanandji Maharaj's words

" The agony of not being perfect in spiritual path has the power to

make a sadhak perfect. "

 

Hare Krishna

Varun P. Paprunia

 

------------------------------

 

 

Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!

Very timely and important issue raised by Sathyanarayanji, indeed!

" what is holding us back from Realizing? "

Nothing is really holding us back except our own unquestioned

beliefs, ideas, opinions, about us, World, and God. We may not have

even explored the true meaning of surrender!

We may not have even explored the deep meaning of " I " or " me " !

We may have taken for granted we have understood Gita's message just

by reading!

We may not be hungry enough, thirsty enough as we may have stuffed

ourselves with so much unhealthy foods, and drinks in terms of these

unquestioned ideas, beliefs, do's and don'ts, dogmas etc in the name

of religions!

 

Suggestions:

Let us emphasize freeing " ourselves " from Doership of Karmas, rather

than to overemphasize justification of individual karmas and past

lives. That happened and nothing we can do about the past or even

future if we don't change now.

Let us question, " am I the doer of my deeds? " . What makes me think

the deeds performed by this body is mine? Is " I " the doer or

the " doer " is separate from " I " ?

Even to formulate such questions, we need to resume " I " , " me " , " my " .

So they must refer to some ideas of them in our mind, and hence

conceptual only, and may not be reality.

Why do the deeds performed through the use of this body are

mine? " Is the body " I " and the label Pratap, " me " ? Please wait,

don't answer from the mind yet!

You are provisionally opening up here, you experience a glimpse of

freedom!

Such line of questioning with open mind and honesty in answering

them or saying " I don't know " will bring so much clarity to mind

that the entire structure of " I " , " me " and my or mine " will collapse

now that the thieves(imposters) are all spotted out by the Real

Master of House, Atman, the True I or SELF, the Conscious Existence

Itself. Such line of questioning is higher reasoning and takes one

to Experiential level(Anubhuti), unreachable by the lower reasoning

of mind. Useful as it is, the mind can conceptualize such Aparaoksha

Anubhuti, the objectless experience, nicely as sages and saints are

doing it and Bhagwaan has done thorugh Gita teaching.

At this stage nothing is holding us, nothing can hold us, as there

is nothing to hold onto!

Namaskar............Pratap Bhatt

 

-------------------------------

 

Who is holding us back from Salvation?

Gita says they are the forces of Gunas and Desire. Gita says those

who are not held back are rare. That is an eternal empirical Truth.

Those who are held back are doing their Karma as per their Guna

properties. If most people are not held back, there is no fun of the

Creator and Creation. This is the ultimate Dialectics.

Basudeb Sen

----------------------------

 

PRIOR POSTING

EGO- EDGING GOD OUT- from our life is the main impediment.

With pranams,

G.Vaidyanathan.

----------------------------

What is holding us back?

 

I, I, I and ME, ME, ME

FALSE EGO

RELIGIOUS ARROGANCE

 

Bhagavan tells that the bewildered spirit soul, under the influence

of the three modes of material nature, thinks himself to be the doer

of activities, which are in actuality carried out by nature. B.G.

chapter 3 verse 27

 

The most unsatisfied and unhappiest people are those who are

selfish, self-centred, and insecure, with low self-esteem. One

should not be anxious to have the satisfaction of being honored by

others. The material conception of life makes us very eager to

receive honor from others, but from the point of view of a man in

perfect knowledge--who knows that he is not this body--anything,

honor or dishonor, pertaining to this body is useless. One should

not be hankering after this material deception. People are very

anxious to be famous for their religion.

 

False ego means accepting this body as oneself. When one understands

that he is not his body and is spirit soul, that is real ego. Ego is

there. False ego is condemned, but not real ego. In the Vedic

literature it is said: aham brahmasmi. I am Brahman, I am spirit.

This " I am, " the sense of self, also exists in the liberated stage

of self-realization. This sense of " I am " is ego, but when the sense

of " I am " is applied to this false body, it is false ego. When the

sense of self is applied to reality, that is real ego.

 

Be humble, cast away the False Ego, Serve others without looking for

rewards or praise, and you shall attain God.

 

Krishna S

---------------------

Good question......

Ego/attachment is what separates us from God......

Spirituality is the process of understanding and experiencing this

in depth and shedding the ego....being empty.... and Emptiness is

God....

Sushil Jain

----------------------

 

Dear Sadhak

By reading Bhagvat Gita ,a time comes when we understand the message

of Bhagvat Gita.We must have devotion and faith.Every human being

ought to read one chapter every day.Otherwise at leasat recite some

short slokas every day.Read the commentary of Bhagvat Gita published

by authorative saints like Sivananda or his disciple Swami

Jyotiramayananda or Swami Chinmayananda.Some have misintepreated the

meaning of Gita.In case of doubt we should refer to the publication

of Gita Press.By starting this Gita talk they have done a good

service to the humanity.

In short Bhagvat Gita is the sum and substance of all scriptures.

God always supports the righteous people.

The number of people is irrrelevant God always help the righteous

people.The main theme is that every human being ought to perform

one's duty first

Truly yours

 

S S Bhatt

 

------------------------------

 

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Ram Ram

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