Suggestions on being Free of Modes of Nature (Gunatit) per Gitaji

June 16, 2009

Kindly suggest briefly on Gunatit (being free of modes of Nature) state as per

Gitaji.

Raja Gurdasani

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GITA TALK GROUP GUIDELINES: PLEASE -

FOR QUESTIONER

1. The questions as far as possible must be relevant to Gita, relevant to

Dharma, relavant to other scriptures and relevant to motivate Sadhaks to take up

spiritual path

2. The Questioner must commit to daily Gita study

3. Only one question at a time.

4. Question must be brief, to the point and relevant to the group's primary aim

of deeper understanding of Gita.

GITA TALK GROUP GUIDELINES for RESPONDER: PLEASE -

1. Only responses that further clarify Gita message will be posted.

2. Quote Gitaji/scriptures wherever possible..

3. Limit personal feelings, opinions, beliefs etc. to the extent that they

further help in understanding the Gita shlokas

4. Be as concise, to the point, respecting sadhaka's time.

5. Focus on subject at hand only.

6. Do not include links to the other sites; personal information (Ph #, address

etc) or personalize message to particular person

7. All responses may not be posted and moderator at his discretion, may modify

the posting.

8. Please keep in mind novices, youth, westerners, non-sectarian audience. Limit

the use to Sanskrit words and provide English word bracketed.

MODERATOR

Ram Ram

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June 17, 2009

Kindly suggest briefly on Gunatit (being free of modes of Nature) state as perGitaji.

Raja Gurdasani---------

NEW POSTING

First requirement is to study Chapter13 and to clearly understand how toseparate Kshetra and Kshetrgna. Once this is done,whatever changes take place inKshetra by way of Sattva,Rajas and Tamas have to be just observed without anyintention of changing them. Soon the Sadhaka will experience that Tamas andRajas are changing to Sattva.Hereagain,we have to grasp the Truth that it is Prakriti which has becomeSattvic and I am just observing and keeping watch over it. I am Sat-Chit-AnandSwarup Atma and I am neither Sattvic,Rajasic or Tamasic.This is an awakenedstate.To test that we are in awakened state,Verses 22,23,24 and 25 are given as checklist and to either take this Direction or to maintain that condition, this checklist is very important.Characteristics mentioned there are similar toSthit-Pragna Laxan of Chapter2 Verses 54 to 72 or Characteristic of Bhakta asmentioned in Chapter 12 Verses 13 to 19. This Swadhyay individually or in agroup will protect the Sadhaka from falling or make the experience progressivelymore Distinct (Spasta Anubhuti).Jayantilal Shah

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In Chapter-14, Bhagwan Shri Krishna has mentioned the the attributes of the man who has risen above the three properties (Gunatit) from verses 22 to 25.

Chapter-14

Verse-22 " The man, O Pandav, who neither abhors radiance, inclination to action and attachment that are generated respectively by the operations of Sattwa, Rajas and Tamas when he is involved in them, nor aspires for them when he is liberated."

Verse-23 "And who, like a dispassionate onlooker, is unmoved by the properties and is steady and unshaken by dint of his realization that these properties of nature but abide in themselves..."

Verse-24"And who, ever dwelling in his self , views joy, sorrow, earth, stone, and gold as equal is patient and evenly regards the pleasant and the unpleasant, slander and praise...."

Verse-25 "And who puts up with honour and dishonour, as (also) with friend and foe, with equanimity, and who gives up the undertaking of action is said to have transcended all the properties"

Om

Ashwin

-------NamastePatanjali defines Yoga as the cessation of the mind's modifications which are due to five factors - Prmana, Viparyaya, Vikalpa, Budra, and Smrti, translated as Logical Thinking, Impulsive Thinking, Imagination, Sleep, and Memory, respectively. Since the mind's modifications arise because of the conditioning factors upon ones consciousness, then the process of de-conditioning the mind must address the attributes of the mind - sattva, rajas, and tamas. The term used by the GITA for a de-conditioned state is gunatit or Trigunatit - the state in which the three gunas are transcended. Chapter 14 gives a lucid explanation of the three gunas and their effects on the mind. Sattva, Rajas, and Tamas,â€"these Gunas, O mighty-armed, born of Prakriti, bind fast in the body the indestructible embodied one. GITA 14-5Later in Chapter 14, Bhagavan describes the transcending of the three gunas:

When the seer beholds no agent other than the Gunas and knows That which is higher than the Gunas, he attains to My being.

The embodied one having gone beyond these three Gunas out of which the body is evolved, is freed from birth, death, decay and pain, and attains to immortality. GITA 14-19,20

Arjuna then asks Bhagavan how will one know one has transcended the gunas:

By what marks, O Lord, is he (known) who has gone beyond these three Gunas? What is his conduct, and how does he pass beyond these three Gunas? GITA 14-21

The Blessed Lord replies:

He who hates not the appearance of light, (the effect of Sattva), activity (the effect of Rajas), and delusion (the effect of Tamas), (in his own mind), O PÃ¢ndava, nor longs for them when absent;

He who, sitting like one unconcerned, is moved not by the Gunas, who, knowing that the Gunas operate, is Self-centred and swerves not;

Alike in pleasure and pain, Self-abiding, regarding a clod of earth, a stone and gold alike; the same to agreeable and disagreeable, firm, the same in censure and, praise;

The same in honour and disgrace, the same to friend and foe, relinquishing all undertakingsâ€"he is said to have gone beyond the Gunas. GITA 14-22 to 25

And what does one achieve?

And he who serves Me with an unswerving devotion, he, going beyond the Gunas, is fitted for becoming Brahman.

For I am the abode of Brahman, the Immortal and Immutable, of everlasting Dharma and of Absolute Bliss GITA 14-26,27

GITA asks the aspirant to transcend all the 3 gunas if he is to arrive at a pure, unconditioned state of spiritual illumination. The difficulty with most of us is that we get entangled in the working of the gunas. We indentify ourselves with the inertia, the activity, and the balance which constitute the 3 states of expressional behavior.If one could observe oneself in the habits, in the conflicts, and in the conclusions to which one clings then would one see the modes functioning among the modes. And in this observation one would also perceive the true nature of oneself as above and beyond the modes. One who has transcended the three gunas is forever unconcened and unpeturbed,. Such a man (denoting mankind) is Udasin - uncommitted and therefore unswerving. To stand apart and look at the modes functioning within oneself is indeed a supremely spiritual state. To be aware of the functioning of the Tamas, the Rajas, and the Sattva, and yet not interfere wih them - this indeed is freedom from all conditioning. In such a state the mind of man is rendered pure and innocent, capable of responding to the gentlest touch of the Supreme and the Transcendental.GITA Chapter 18 provides further information on how one can transcend the 3 gunas. Ram Ram Deosaran Bisnath

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Verses 22 to 26 of the 14th chapter give the answer to the question asked ................

But,the answer given in Sh 22 is valid for you only if your Conduct is in accordance with Sh 23 to 26.( do read the doubt expressed by Arjuna in shaloka 21.)

and it is you,who shall be the judge ........you, who will have to pass the test in your own eyes ;the other is only an excuse to show you the reflection of your being in your mind, the mirror ................. do stop relying on other persons praise of you ,or their censure ............their tongues are often as untrue as their non-realisation

If meditation blossoms in you and contemplation becomes your Way

these words shall suffice ............. one upadesh suffices,

if not ............ questions will arise on the answers given and read ...........

there will be no dearth of them!

In the hushed Silence of the Mind,also called the death of Mind,

all questions drop ............ the wave disappears in the Ocean ,to rise again as ' not the wave 'but as Ocean waving in the wave ...............

the 700 shalokas of the Lord's song show you but how to die to the self ( ego).............. and be the Self ( atma)

ah,nari,........................ ah,narinder ....................ah !

Meditation is the Way ......contemplation is the way

BUT

your journey begins with a single step from where you presently are .............

the first step is the knowing and acceptance of what( type) you are, and where you presently stand.............. karma,bhakti and gyana, are the three main Paths ............ even the bhaktas have to walk the way

then keep walking the Way Bhagvada Geetha indicates for the Type you are

till the mind ,in Samadhi,dies and Silence itself becomes your Guru

to lead you into contemplation on the words heard and read ...........and realise their Truth !!!

the conduct in accordance with the Bhagvada Geetha's shalokas referred above will then flower in you..............................

Aum

narinder bhandari ---------

GITA TALK GROUP GUIDELINES: PLEASE -

FOR QUESTIONER1. The questions as far as possible must be relevant to Gita, relevant toDharma, relavant to other scriptures and relevant to motivate Sadhaks to take upspiritual path2. The Questioner must commit to daily Gita study3. Only one question at a time.4. Question must be brief, to the point and relevant to the group's primary aimof deeper understanding of Gita.

GITA TALK GROUP GUIDELINES for RESPONDER: PLEASE -1. Only responses that further clarify Gita message will be posted.2. Quote Gitaji/scriptures wherever possible..3. Limit personal feelings, opinions, beliefs etc. to the extent that theyfurther help in understanding the Gita shlokas4. Be as concise, to the point, respecting sadhaka's time.5. Focus on subject at hand only.6. Do not include links to the other sites; personal information (Ph #, addressetc) or personalize message to particular person7. All responses may not be posted and moderator at his discretion, may modifythe posting.8. Please keep in mind novices, youth, westerners, non-sectarian audience. Limitthe use to Sanskrit words and provide English word bracketed.

MODERATORRam Ram------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------Post message: Subscribe: - Unsubscribe: -

June 18, 2009

Kindly suggest briefly on Gunatit (being free of modes of Nature) state as perGitaji.

Raja Gurdasani---------

NEW POSTING

Dear sadhakas,Hare krishna. This is in response to a question from a sadhaka. Lord krishna clearly defined the qualities of a person who transcended the modes of nature, in bhagavad gita. . lord krishna said. " O son of pandu, he who does not hate attachment, comforts, and delusion when they are present or wish for them when they are absent, who is not disturbed in any of the reactions of materialism, remains transcendental, who regards happiness and distress alike, who treats a piece of earth, stone and gold the same way, who is equal in desirable and undesirable conditions, who treats praise and blame, honor and dishonor, friend and foe alike , and who has renounced all material activities, that person transcended the modes of nature. " ( Gitaji, 14, 22 to 25). Such person does everything for the lord, in the name of the lord. He or she does not do anything for himself or for herself, loves every one. . Hence that person is free. This is the right path to attain the lord. Thank you,Hare krishna. Prasad. Iragavarapu. M. D

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Hari OmQs like this help sadhaks propel towards their goal faster. Thanks Rajaji.My Pranaams !Sir, non acceptance of. Gunas in you- be it Sattwik, Rajasic or Tamasic is the best, easiest and the most practical way of getting rid of them. SIMPLY IGNORE THEM ! That's all is needed. "Tayorna vashmagachhet" ( Don't get swayed by them) - Says Holy Gita. You can't eliminate them so long as you are embodied. You can only ignore them, you can only disregard them, you can only not accept them in you ! You are FULLY INDEPENDENT and capable of non acceptance of Gunas in you ! They are visitors. You are permanent. They are temporary!!As simple as that ! That is Param Shraddheya Swamiji Ramsukhdasji Maharaj, for you Dear Sadhaks !Jai Shree KrishnaVyas N B

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Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!Rajaji, I am glad to share what I have learned from Gita about being free of Modes of Nature (sattva, Rajas, Tamas). Cosmic Nature/Maya constantly engages in actions with gunas kept in equilibrium, which go in disequilibrium in individuals. This is reflected in working of our sense organs, body, mind, Intellect and organs of action, and is the reason why individuals seem to be predominant in one guna versus others. At individual-Jeeva levels it is ignorance-Avidya to identify with Gunas-modes of nature working through body-mind.To rise above this ignorance is to first balance gunas by bringing Sattva(tranquility, equanimity etc) through discrimination, dispassion or devotion and surrender to Ishwara, or self-less actions(Gita). As the sadhana matures, Sadhaka feels freedom from the overpowering modes of nature.In the direct path, Sadhaka at the very outset inquires into this ignorance and realizes that he/she was never in ignorance, the ignorance was perpetuating due to wrong notions and beliefs of being "an Individual" due to identification with Nature and its modes. One finds no evidence of being an individual upon inquiry with honesty. This opens up sadhaka to feel, think and act from "not being a person" but as "Existence Itself". Then, by the intensity of sadhana and Grace, he crosses over the ocean of Sansara and goes beyond Gunas!Beyond, Gunas, he is Sat-Chit-Ananda, permeating timelessly and spacelessly!Namaskar....Pratap Bhatt

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Jai HanumanNarinderji Maharaj ! On one hand you say :"and it is you,who shall be the judge ........you, who will have to pass the test in your own eyes ;the other is only an excuse to show you the reflection of your being in your mind, the mirror ............ do stop relying on other persons"Then, Narinderji Maharaj you utter the following:"the first step is the knowing and acceptance of what( type) you are, and where you presently stand....... ....... karma,bhakti and gyana, are the three main Paths ............ even the bhaktas have to walk the way then keep walking the Way Bhagvada Geetha indicates for the Type you are"Then your kindself opines: "till the mind ,in Samadhi,dies and Silence itself becomes your Guru to lead you into contemplation on the words heard and read ...........and realise their Truth !!! "Maharaj !! Which statement do we believe, Jee ? We sense some contradictions ! If this is not true then please come back ! If yes, correct yourself !Which words "heard and read" Jee ? From whom "heard and read" Jee?

On the Q of Raja Bhaiyya ! Where are Gunas, Brother ? For us, Bhaiyyaji? Oh... Do not they change? ... Some times sattwik, sometimes rajasic, sometimes tamasic... What have they got to do with us ? Come on ! Ah ... Where are they? In us ? How can they be? No ! No!! Brother ! They can't be in us, Jee ! How can temporary be in permanent ? Inert be in sentient ? Perishable be in imperishable? Can darkness prevail in light, Brother?Accept what Narinderji Maharaj? Present state? Come on... What if it is full of Gunas, Jee ?? Can't present state be like that ? Will you accept that? Where will you reach unless you reject that? Bolo Jee !!

Namaste JeeJee JeeShashikala

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PRIOR POSTING

First requirement is to study Chapter13 and to clearly understand how toseparate Kshetra and Kshetrgna. Once this is done,whatever changes take place inKshetra by way of Sattva,Rajas and Tamas have to be just observed without anyintention of changing them. Soon the Sadhaka will experience that Tamas andRajas are changing to Sattva.Hereagain,we have to grasp the Truth that it is Prakriti which has becomeSattvic and I am just observing and keeping watch over it. I am Sat-Chit-AnandSwarup Atma and I am neither Sattvic,Rajasic or Tamasic.This is an awakenedstate.To test that we are in awakened state,Verses 22,23,24 and 25 are given as checklist and to either take this Direction or to maintain that condition, this checklist is very important.Characteristics mentioned there are similar toSthit-Pragna Laxan of Chapter2 Verses 54 to 72 or Characteristic of Bhakta asmentioned in Chapter 12 Verses 13 to 19. This Swadhyay individually or in agroup will protect the Sadhaka from falling or make the experience progressivelymore Distinct (Spasta Anubhuti).Jayantilal Shah

-------------------------------

In Chapter-14, Bhagwan Shri Krishna has mentioned the the attributes of the man who has risen above the three properties (Gunatit) from verses 22 to 25. Chapter-14Verse-22 " The man, O Pandav, who neither abhors radiance, inclination to action and attachment that are generated respectively by the operations of Sattwa, Rajas and Tamas when he is involved in them, nor aspires for them when he is liberated." Verse-23 "And who, like a dispassionate onlooker, is unmoved by the properties and is steady and unshaken by dint of his realization that these properties of nature but abide in themselves..." Verse-24"And who, ever dwelling in his self , views joy, sorrow, earth, stone, and gold as equal is patient and evenly regards the pleasant and the unpleasant, slander and praise...." Verse-25 "And who puts up with honour and dishonour, as (also) with friend and foe, with equanimity, and who gives up the undertaking of action is said to have transcended all the properties" OmAshwin-------Namaste

Patanjali defines Yoga as the cessation of the mind's modifications which are due to five factors - Prmana, Viparyaya, Vikalpa, Budra, and Smrti, translated as Logical Thinking, Impulsive Thinking, Imagination, Sleep, and Memory, respectively. Since the mind's modifications arise because of the conditioning factors upon ones consciousness, then the process of de-conditioning the mind must address the attributes of the mind - sattva, rajas, and tamas. The term used by the GITA for a de-conditioned state is gunatit or Trigunatit - the state in which the three gunas are transcended. Chapter 14 gives a lucid explanation of the three gunas and their effects on the mind. Sattva, Rajas, and Tamas,â€"these Gunas, O mighty-armed, born of Prakriti, bind fast in the body the indestructible embodied one. GITA 14-5

Later in Chapter 14, Bhagavan describes the transcending of the three gunas:

When the seer beholds no agent other than the Gunas and knows That which is higher than the Gunas, he attains to My being.

The embodied one having gone beyond these three Gunas out of which the body is evolved, is freed from birth, death, decay and pain, and attains to immortality. GITA 14-19,20

Arjuna then asks Bhagavan how will one know one has transcended the gunas:

By what marks, O Lord, is he (known) who has gone beyond these three Gunas? What is his conduct, and how does he pass beyond these three Gunas? GITA 14-21

The Blessed Lord replies:

He who hates not the appearance of light, (the effect of Sattva), activity (the effect of Rajas), and delusion (the effect of Tamas), (in his own mind), O PÃ¢ndava, nor longs for them when absent;

He who, sitting like one unconcerned, is moved not by the Gunas, who, knowing that the Gunas operate, is Self-centred and swerves not;

Alike in pleasure and pain, Self-abiding, regarding a clod of earth, a stone and gold alike; the same to agreeable and disagreeable, firm, the same in censure and, praise;

The same in honour and disgrace, the same to friend and foe, relinquishing all undertakingsâ€"he is said to have gone beyond the Gunas. GITA 14-22 to 25

And what does one achieve?

And he who serves Me with an unswerving devotion, he, going beyond the Gunas, is fitted for becoming Brahman.

For I am the abode of Brahman, the Immortal and Immutable, of everlasting Dharma and of Absolute Bliss GITA 14-26,27

GITA asks the aspirant to transcend all the 3 gunas if he is to arrive at a pure, unconditioned state of spiritual illumination. The difficulty with most of us is that we get entangled in the working of the gunas. We indentify ourselves with the inertia, the activity, and the balance which constitute the 3 states of expressional behavior.If one could observe oneself in the habits, in the conflicts, and in the conclusions to which one clings then would one see the modes functioning among the modes. And in this observation one would also perceive the true nature of oneself as above and beyond the modes.

One who has transcended the three gunas is forever unconcened and unpeturbed,. Such a man (denoting mankind) is Udasin - uncommitted and therefore unswerving. To stand apart and look at the modes functioning within oneself is indeed a supremely spiritual state. To be aware of the functioning of the Tamas, the Rajas, and the Sattva, and yet not interfere wih them - this indeed is freedom from all conditioning. In such a state the mind of man is rendered pure and innocent, capable of responding to the gentlest touch of the Supreme and the Transcendental.

GITA Chapter 18 provides further information on how one can transcend the 3 gunas.

Ram Ram Deosaran Bisnath--------Verses 22 to 26 of the 14th chapter give the answer to the question asked ................ But,the answer given in Sh 22 is valid for you only if your Conduct is in accordance with Sh 23 to 26.( do read the doubt expressed by Arjuna in shaloka 21.) and it is you,who shall be the judge ........you, who will have to pass the test in your own eyes ;the other is only an excuse to show you the reflection of your being in your mind, the mirror ................. do stop relying on other persons praise of you ,or their censure ............their tongues are often as untrue as their non-realisation If meditation blossoms in you and contemplation becomes your Way these words shall suffice ............. one upadesh suffices, if not ............ questions will arise on the answers given and read ........... there will be no dearth of them! In the hushed Silence of the Mind,also called the death of Mind, all questions drop ............ the wave disappears in the Ocean ,to rise again as ' not the wave 'but as Ocean waving in the wave ............... the 700 shalokas of the Lord's song show you but how to die to the self ( ego).............. and be the Self ( atma) ah,nari,........................ ah,narinder ....................ah ! Meditation is the Way ......contemplation is the way BUT your journey begins with a single step from where you presently are ............. the first step is the knowing and acceptance of what( type) you are, and where you presently stand.............. karma,bhakti and gyana, are the three main Paths ............ even the bhaktas have to walk the way then keep walking the Way Bhagvada Geetha indicates for the Type you are till the mind ,in Samadhi,dies and Silence itself becomes your Guru to lead you into contemplation on the words heard and read ...........and realise their Truth !!! the conduct in accordance with the Bhagvada Geetha's shalokas referred above will then flower in you.............................. Aum narinder bhandari

---------GITA TALK GROUP GUIDELINES: PLEASE -

FOR QUESTIONER1. The questions as far as possible must be relevant to Gita, relevant toDharma, relavant to other scriptures and relevant to motivate Sadhaks to take upspiritual path2. The Questioner must commit to daily Gita study3. Only one question at a time.4. Question must be brief, to the point and relevant to the group's primary aimof deeper understanding of Gita.

GITA TALK GROUP GUIDELINES for RESPONDER: PLEASE -1. Only responses that further clarify Gita message will be posted.2. Quote Gitaji/scriptures wherever possible..3. Limit personal feelings, opinions, beliefs etc. to the extent that theyfurther help in understanding the Gita shlokas4. Be as concise, to the point, respecting sadhaka's time.5. Focus on subject at hand only.6. Do not include links to the other sites; personal information (Ph #, addressetc) or personalize message to particular person7. All responses may not be posted and moderator at his discretion, may modifythe posting.8. Please keep in mind novices, youth, westerners, non-sectarian audience. Limitthe use to Sanskrit words and provide English word bracketed.

MODERATORRam Ram------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------Post message: Subscribe: - Unsubscribe: -

June 21, 2009

Kindly suggest briefly on Gunatit (being free of modes of Nature) state as perGitaji.

Raja Gurdasani---------

NEW POSTING

Jai Shree Hari !Being free of the 3 modes of nature is nothing but wining over the nature. Note that Bhagavaan ji has said "DAIVI HI ESHA GUNAMAYI MAM MAAYAA DURATYAYAA . MAAM EVA PRAPADYANTE MAAYAAM ETAAM TARANTI TE - Gitaji-7/14". It means the nature is God's divine power and you can be free from his gunamyi maya ONLY (which is the meaning of EVA here) when you surrender to him (i.e. when God is with you).Bhagavaan ji has tried to impart the knowledge of "Purush-Prakriti" and "Nature of Prakriti and how to be free from them" in chapter 13 and 14 respectively mainly for the NIRGUN BRAHM UPAASAK (i.,e. who is on the path of knowledge) as he has already mentioned that this path is very difficult (KLESHO ADHIKATAR TESHHAM... Gitaji 12/5). While describing the qualities of a saadhak on the path of knowledge he has mentioned "AVYABHICHARINI BHAKTI in GOD" (Gitaji 13/10) as one of the qualities (or requirement). In other words, the saadhak who is on the path of knowledge can be free from 3 modes of nature by having 1)the qualities including AVYABHICHARINI BHAKTI described in chap13/7-11 and 2) his effort described in chap14/22-25. Note that the shloka 14/26 also talks about the requirement of "AVYABHICHARINI BHAKTI". The saadhak who is on the path of devotion does not worry about the nature as he thinks GOD as "SAT + ASAT" (SAT ASAT CHA AHAM ARJUN.. Gitaji 9/19). Ofcourse God does take care of him to make him free from the ASAT (i.e nature and its 3 modes).May God bless us all!Niteesh Dubey

Priy Sadhaks,

From what lord says in BG, and heard from saints, I have a gist that all contradictions lies equally in god.

Like god is Justfull and loving (Contra)

Like god is Nirgun and sagun

Like god is omnipresent and yet nirlep from all.

2. As we learn experience that mamevansho jeevloke jeevbhoot sanatan and Iswar ans jeev abinasi sat chetan ghan anand rasi and others say you are son of god.whatever be the notion, as being ansh of god we definately have all the qualities of god.

Now it is the matter of accepting this, coz accepting is fastest path of attaining.

Hope it helps,

Always at thy lotus feet,

Raja.

Priy Sadhaks,

From what lord says in BG, and heard from saints, I have a gist that all contradictions lies equally in god.

Like god is Justfull and loving (Contra)

Like god is Nirgun and sagun

Like god is omnipresent and yet nirlep from all.

2. As we learn experience that mamevansho jeevloke jeevbhoot sanatan and Iswar ans jeev abinasi sat chetan ghan anand rasi and others say you are son of god.whatever be the notion, as being ansh of god we definately have all the qualities of god.

Now it is the matter of accepting this, coz accepting is fastest path of attaining.

Hope it helps,

Always at thy lotus feet,

Raja.

Priy Sadhaks,

From what lord says in BG, and heard from saints, I have a gist that all contradictions lies equally in god.

Like god is Justfull and loving (Contra)

Like god is Nirgun and sagun

Like god is omnipresent and yet nirlep from all.

2. As we learn experience that mamevansho jeevloke jeevbhoot sanatan and Iswar ans jeev abinasi sat chetan ghan anand rasi and others say you are son of god.whatever be the notion, as being ansh of god we definately have all the qualities of god.

Now it is the matter of accepting this, coz accepting is fastest path of attaining.

Hope it helps,

Always at thy lotus feet,

Raja.------------------

Dear sadaks,Gunateet is the mind set in a person who attains total clarity of Chethan (living) and Achethan (non living) things. He understands that everything around him is created to suit life on earth. Say a plant requires sun light, water, air, space and soil. Human need food, air, water. But needs of human is more than that and sometimes needs and comfort is multifold. Human mind is attracted towards desires, passions etc based on his chemical constitution which we call 3 Gunas. No body born as Gunateet generally. Normally gains divine knowledge from Guru or GOVIND. Then he perfectly understood the whole world is 8 dimensional picturised digital cosmic Maya. When such this HAPPENS in a man, he becomes Gunateet. Ex: When Adi Sankar age of 6, his father expired. His mother and relatives all around were crying. But he remained as if nothing happened. That is Gunateet. Another man called (Pattinathar very wealthy person) of very recent times clarity HAPPENED through his son. He just abandoned his whole family & wealth and proved he was Gunateet. Gunateet is a great gift from GOD.Jai Sri KrishnaB.Sathyanarayan

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Jai Shree Hari !Being free of the 3 modes of nature is nothing but wining over the nature. Note that Bhagavaan ji has said "DAIVI HI ESHA GUNAMAYI MAM MAAYAA DURATYAYAA . MAAM EVA PRAPADYANTE MAAYAAM ETAAM TARANTI TE - Gitaji-7/14". It means the nature is God's divine power and you can be free from his gunamyi maya ONLY (which is the meaning of EVA here) when you surrender to him (i.e. when God is with you).Bhagavaan ji has tried to impart the knowledge of "Purush-Prakriti" and "Nature of Prakriti and how to be free from them" in chapter 13 and 14 respectively mainly for the NIRGUN BRAHM UPAASAK (i.,e. who is on the path of knowledge) as he has already mentioned that this path is very difficult (KLESHO ADHIKATAR TESHHAM... Gitaji 12/5). While describing the qualities of a saadhak on the path of knowledge he has mentioned "AVYABHICHARINI BHAKTI in GOD" (Gitaji 13/10) as one of the qualities (or requirement). In other words, the saadhak who is on the path of knowledge can be free from 3 modes of nature by having 1)the qualities including AVYABHICHARINI BHAKTI described in chap13/7-11 and 2) his effort described in chap14/22-25. Note that the shloka 14/26 also talks about the requirement of "AVYABHICHARINI BHAKTI". The saadhak who is on the path of devotion does not worry about the nature as he thinks GOD as "SAT + ASAT" (SAT ASAT CHA AHAM ARJUN.. Gitaji 9/19). Ofcourse God does take care of him to make him free from the ASAT (i.e nature and its 3 modes).May God bless us all!Niteesh Dubey

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It took Krishna 700 shalokas in 18 chapters to make Arjuna understand the essence of the self that clarifies in Arjuna as to what his conduct should be at that particular time .................

for the arjuna in us,there are commentaries and commentaries,and commentaries explaining how to reach that state.....

Swami Ramsukh das jee's Sadhak Sanjivini does that beautifully.............BUT now,each upadesh of the Swami needs discussion /explanation to be understood ......

............ and, does the Truth become clear even then ...................... !!!!!

all these discussions become redundent only for the sadhaka ,who understands the Truth of the Vedic Injunction " When the Self is known ................ all is known " Then,all doubts disappear . All discussions about the Paths cease because the Path is no more ; the destination has been reached .......................

and if the self has not yet been realised ............. one must accept the word of the scriptures, the Seers and the Sages with Faith, till that happens ............. and walk the Path most suited for one diligently

BUT herein lies the Rub.Till self realisation, the Mind keeps imparting its own colour to every understanding ............... and arguments/discussions continue ...............continue till SILENCE dawns..................

the silence that removes all doubts is nirbeej samadhi ..... it is in that Samadhi that the Self gets realised .................

All your beliefs/ concepts shall die ,when you go beyond words ............ all quibbling shall stop...... all paradoxes reconciled ............ discussions dead forever ! ( is this not what the Bhagvada Geetha promises to the sincere sadhak,who walks the Path ???)

If you have not yet reached the state of Mind , which is the promise of all the words of the scriptures , walk the Path and see, dear sadhaka( if you so choose ) .....................

you too will be your own Proof ................ your own conduct will go unto that righteousness ( Dharma),which is beyond ' right' and 'wrong', which embraces both lovingly , which just IS the essence of the Self .......................

in other words , you will live life spontaneously, always in the NOW, the Past and Future no more a disturbance of the Mind .................. no more doubts ....

in Bliss will you live.......the Bliss that embraces all dualities like pain and pleasure,heat and cold,praise and censure , wealth and poverty,

but you cannot skip your sadhna ................

IT IS VERY VERY SIMPLE............................

AUM

narinder bhandari

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Dear sadhakas,

Hare krishna.

This is in response to a question from a sadhaka.

Lord krishna clearly defined the qualities of a person who transcended the modes of nature, in bhagavad gita. .

lord krishna said.

" O son of pandu, he who does not hate attachment, comforts, and delusion when they are present or wish for them when they are absent, who is not disturbed in any of the reactions of materialism, remains transcendental, who regards happiness and distress alike, who treats a piece of earth, stone and gold the same way, who is equal in desirable and undesirable conditions, who treats praise and blame, honor and dishonor, friend and foe alike , and who has renounced all material activities, that person transcended the modes of nature. " ( Gitaji, 14, 22 to 25).

Such person does everything for the lord, in the name of the lord. He or she does not do anything for himself or for herself, loves every one. . Hence that person is free.

This is the right path to attain the lord.

Thank you,

Hare krishna.

Prasad. Iragavarapu. M. D

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Hari Om

Qs like this help sadhaks propel towards their goal faster. Thanks Rajaji.My Pranaams !

Sir, non acceptance of. Gunas in you- be it Sattwik, Rajasic or Tamasic is the best, easiest and the most practical way of getting rid of them. SIMPLY IGNORE THEM ! That's all is needed. "Tayorna vashmagachhet" ( Don't get swayed by them) - Says Holy Gita. You can't eliminate them so long as you are embodied. You can only ignore them, you can only disregard them, you can only not accept them in you ! You are FULLY INDEPENDENT and capable of non acceptance of Gunas in you ! They are visitors. You are permanent. They are temporary!!

As simple as that ! That is Param Shraddheya Swamiji Ramsukhdasji Maharaj, for you Dear Sadhaks !

Jai Shree Krishna

Vyas N B

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Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!Rajaji, I am glad to share what I have learned from Gita about being free of Modes of Nature (sattva, Rajas, Tamas). Cosmic Nature/Maya constantly engages in actions with gunas kept in equilibrium, which go in disequilibrium in individuals. This is reflected in working of our sense organs, body, mind, Intellect and organs of action, and is the reason why individuals seem to be predominant in one guna versus others. At individual-Jeeva levels it is ignorance-Avidya to identify with Gunas-modes of nature working through body-mind.To rise above this ignorance is to first balance gunas by bringing Sattva(tranquility, equanimity etc) through discrimination, dispassion or devotion and surrender to Ishwara, or self-less actions(Gita). As the sadhana matures, Sadhaka feels freedom from the overpowering modes of nature.In the direct path, Sadhaka at the very outset inquires into this ignorance and realizes that he/she was never in ignorance, the ignorance was perpetuating due to wrong notions and beliefs of being "an Individual" due to identification with Nature and its modes. One finds no evidence of being an individual upon inquiry with honesty. This opens up sadhaka to feel, think and act from "not being a person" but as "Existence Itself". Then, by the intensity of sadhana and Grace, he crosses over the ocean of Sansara and goes beyond Gunas!Beyond, Gunas, he is Sat-Chit-Ananda, permeating timelessly and spacelessly!Namaskar....Pratap Bhatt

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Jai Hanuman

Narinderji Maharaj ! On one hand you say :

"and it is you,who shall be the judge ........you, who will have to pass the test in your own eyes ;the other is only an excuse to show you the reflection of your being in your mind, the mirror ............ do stop relying on other persons"

Then, Narinderji Maharaj you utter the following:

"the first step is the knowing and acceptance of what( type) you are, and where you presently stand....... ....... karma,bhakti and gyana, are the three main Paths ............ even the bhaktas have to walk the way then keep walking the Way Bhagvada Geetha indicates for the Type you are"

Then your kindself opines:

"till the mind ,in Samadhi,dies and Silence itself becomes your Guru to lead you into contemplation on the words heard and read ...........and realise their Truth !!! "

Maharaj !! Which statement do we believe, Jee ? We sense some contradictions ! If this is not true then please come back ! If yes, correct yourself !Which words "heard and read" Jee ? From whom "heard and read" Jee?

On the Q of Raja Bhaiyya ! Where are Gunas, Brother ? For us, Bhaiyyaji? Oh... Do not they change? ... Some times sattwik, sometimes rajasic, sometimes tamasic... What have they got to do with us ? Come on ! Ah ... Where are they? In us ? How can they be? No ! No!! Brother ! They can't be in us, Jee ! How can temporary be in permanent ? Inert be in sentient ? Perishable be in imperishable? Can darkness prevail in light, Brother?

Accept what Narinderji Maharaj? Present state? Come on... What if it is full of Gunas, Jee ?? Can't present state be like that ? Will you accept that? Where will you reach unless you reject that? Bolo Jee !!

Namaste Jee

Jee JeeShashikala

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PRIOR POSTING

First requirement is to study Chapter13 and to clearly understand how toseparate Kshetra and Kshetrgna. Once this is done,whatever changes take place inKshetra by way of Sattva,Rajas and Tamas have to be just observed without anyintention of changing them. Soon the Sadhaka will experience that Tamas andRajas are changing to Sattva.Hereagain,we have to grasp the Truth that it is Prakriti which has becomeSattvic and I am just observing and keeping watch over it. I am Sat-Chit-AnandSwarup Atma and I am neither Sattvic,Rajasic or Tamasic.This is an awakenedstate.To test that we are in awakened state,Verses 22,23,24 and 25 are given as checklist and to either take this Direction or to maintain that condition, this checklist is very important.Characteristics mentioned there are similar toSthit-Pragna Laxan of Chapter2 Verses 54 to 72 or Characteristic of Bhakta asmentioned in Chapter 12 Verses 13 to 19. This Swadhyay individually or in agroup will protect the Sadhaka from falling or make the experience progressivelymore Distinct (Spasta Anubhuti).Jayantilal Shah

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In Chapter-14, Bhagwan Shri Krishna has mentioned the the attributes of the man who has risen above the three properties (Gunatit) from verses 22 to 25. Chapter-14Verse-22 " The man, O Pandav, who neither abhors radiance, inclination to action and attachment that are generated respectively by the operations of Sattwa, Rajas and Tamas when he is involved in them, nor aspires for them when he is liberated." Verse-23 "And who, like a dispassionate onlooker, is unmoved by the properties and is steady and unshaken by dint of his realization that these properties of nature but abide in themselves..." Verse-24"And who, ever dwelling in his self , views joy, sorrow, earth, stone, and gold as equal is patient and evenly regards the pleasant and the unpleasant, slander and praise...." Verse-25 "And who puts up with honour and dishonour, as (also) with friend and foe, with equanimity, and who gives up the undertaking of action is said to have transcended all the properties" OmAshwin-------Namaste

Patanjali defines Yoga as the cessation of the mind's modifications which are due to five factors - Prmana, Viparyaya, Vikalpa, Budra, and Smrti, translated as Logical Thinking, Impulsive Thinking, Imagination, Sleep, and Memory, respectively. Since the mind's modifications arise because of the conditioning factors upon ones consciousness, then the process of de-conditioning the mind must address the attributes of the mind - sattva, rajas, and tamas. The term used by the GITA for a de-conditioned state is gunatit or Trigunatit - the state in which the three gunas are transcended. Chapter 14 gives a lucid explanation of the three gunas and their effects on the mind. Sattva, Rajas, and Tamas,â€"these Gunas, O mighty-armed, born of Prakriti, bind fast in the body the indestructible embodied one. GITA 14-5

Later in Chapter 14, Bhagavan describes the transcending of the three gunas:

When the seer beholds no agent other than the Gunas and knows That which is higher than the Gunas, he attains to My being.

The embodied one having gone beyond these three Gunas out of which the body is evolved, is freed from birth, death, decay and pain, and attains to immortality. GITA 14-19,20

Arjuna then asks Bhagavan how will one know one has transcended the gunas:

By what marks, O Lord, is he (known) who has gone beyond these three Gunas? What is his conduct, and how does he pass beyond these three Gunas? GITA 14-21

The Blessed Lord replies:

He who hates not the appearance of light, (the effect of Sattva), activity (the effect of Rajas), and delusion (the effect of Tamas), (in his own mind), O PÃ¢ndava, nor longs for them when absent;

He who, sitting like one unconcerned, is moved not by the Gunas, who, knowing that the Gunas operate, is Self-centred and swerves not;

Alike in pleasure and pain, Self-abiding, regarding a clod of earth, a stone and gold alike; the same to agreeable and disagreeable, firm, the same in censure and, praise;

The same in honour and disgrace, the same to friend and foe, relinquishing all undertakingsâ€"he is said to have gone beyond the Gunas. GITA 14-22 to 25

And what does one achieve?

And he who serves Me with an unswerving devotion, he, going beyond the Gunas, is fitted for becoming Brahman.

For I am the abode of Brahman, the Immortal and Immutable, of everlasting Dharma and of Absolute Bliss GITA 14-26,27

GITA asks the aspirant to transcend all the 3 gunas if he is to arrive at a pure, unconditioned state of spiritual illumination. The difficulty with most of us is that we get entangled in the working of the gunas. We indentify ourselves with the inertia, the activity, and the balance which constitute the 3 states of expressional behavior.If one could observe oneself in the habits, in the conflicts, and in the conclusions to which one clings then would one see the modes functioning among the modes. And in this observation one would also perceive the true nature of oneself as above and beyond the modes.

One who has transcended the three gunas is forever unconcened and unpeturbed,. Such a man (denoting mankind) is Udasin - uncommitted and therefore unswerving. To stand apart and look at the modes functioning within oneself is indeed a supremely spiritual state. To be aware of the functioning of the Tamas, the Rajas, and the Sattva, and yet not interfere wih them - this indeed is freedom from all conditioning. In such a state the mind of man is rendered pure and innocent, capable of responding to the gentlest touch of the Supreme and the Transcendental.

GITA Chapter 18 provides further information on how one can transcend the 3 gunas.

Ram Ram Deosaran Bisnath--------Verses 22 to 26 of the 14th chapter give the answer to the question asked ................ But,the answer given in Sh 22 is valid for you only if your Conduct is in accordance with Sh 23 to 26.( do read the doubt expressed by Arjuna in shaloka 21.) and it is you,who shall be the judge ........you, who will have to pass the test in your own eyes ;the other is only an excuse to show you the reflection of your being in your mind, the mirror ................. do stop relying on other persons praise of you ,or their censure ............their tongues are often as untrue as their non-realisation If meditation blossoms in you and contemplation becomes your Way these words shall suffice ............. one upadesh suffices, if not ............ questions will arise on the answers given and read ........... there will be no dearth of them! In the hushed Silence of the Mind,also called the death of Mind, all questions drop ............ the wave disappears in the Ocean ,to rise again as ' not the wave 'but as Ocean waving in the wave ............... the 700 shalokas of the Lord's song show you but how to die to the self ( ego).............. and be the Self ( atma) ah,nari,........................ ah,narinder ....................ah ! Meditation is the Way ......contemplation is the way BUT your journey begins with a single step from where you presently are ............. the first step is the knowing and acceptance of what( type) you are, and where you presently stand.............. karma,bhakti and gyana, are the three main Paths ............ even the bhaktas have to walk the way then keep walking the Way Bhagvada Geetha indicates for the Type you are till the mind ,in Samadhi,dies and Silence itself becomes your Guru to lead you into contemplation on the words heard and read ...........and realise their Truth !!! the conduct in accordance with the Bhagvada Geetha's shalokas referred above will then flower in you.............................. Aum narinder bhandari

---------GITA TALK GROUP GUIDELINES: PLEASE -

FOR QUESTIONER1. The questions as far as possible must be relevant to Gita, relevant toDharma, relavant to other scriptures and relevant to motivate Sadhaks to take upspiritual path2. The Questioner must commit to daily Gita study3. Only one question at a time.4. Question must be brief, to the point and relevant to the group's primary aimof deeper understanding of Gita.

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MODERATORRam Ram------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------Post message: Subscribe: - Unsubscribe: -

June 22, 2009

Kindly suggest briefly on Gunatit (being free of modes of Nature) state as perGitaji.

Raja Gurdasani---------

NEW POSTING

Jai Shree Krishna

SEEDLESS samadhi ! Is it simple ? Kaliyuga's Gurus and their chellas are really bigger than Lord Krishna and Holy Gita ! Scriptures predicted that eons ago and how truly ! Almost every one is calling himself to be BHAGWAAN ! Self ( mind) Proclamations.

But Gita calls Dhyaan Yoga to be the most difficult. There are eligibility criterion both in Gita and in Patanjali Yoga Darshan. Why do we go opposite of what is clearly established? Reliance on inert mind ! Ego !! Gurus !!! But can there be a better Guru than Krishna ? One should at least read as to what Krishna says in Gita ! Minimum !! Or Read Sadhak Sanjeevani ! Who told that these discussions which take place are indicators of failure ? This is SATSANGA ! Swamiji used to do that ! It has been glorified in Scriptures not because it indicates some yardstick but because it sticks to the truth. What does "api chetsu duracharo" means in Gita. Is "durachari" there has to silence or annihilate inert mind? Where is the limit to such insistences ? When "I" is gone, along with that "YOU" also goes !!!

Swami Rupesh Kumar

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Jai HanumanWhen whichever way you take for Self/God Realisation, the renunciation of the shelter of inert is compulsory then why one should take the path of first taking the shelter of inert(say mind) and then renouncing the same? When "sugam" / "simple" methods like karma yoga, jnana yoga and bhakti yoga are available why one should go for "dhyaan yoga" ? In Gitaji alone there are more than 25 independent ways of realisation. One should think why Lord stated them to be 2 only (laukik) plus bhakti (alaukik) ?Says Rajjab Dasji Maharaj:CHARON VED DHANDHOR KE, ANT KAHOGE RAAM !TO RAJJAB PAHLE KAHO, ITNE HI MAIN KAAM !!After studying all Vedas etc, in the end you will have to say Raam... Raam .... (Establish mineness with Him and be a devotee)Then, O Rajjab , why don't you say that ("Raam.... Raam...") in the beginning itself and be done with it ?Same applies to the mindless insistences of minds , wherein mind advocates/suggests everything about itself but never advocates the ignorance of itself , nor suggests very throwing of itself by the "self" into a dustbin- the shelter of it ! That is the job of intellect , wherein "Conscience" (Viveka) manifests when it stablises. In a human body it is intellect which controls the mind. Both Science and Gita confirm that.If you control the owner, the subordinate must fall in line. Stilling or silencing of mind is death, the end of human birth ! Namaste JeeJee JeeShashikala ---------------

Radhey ! Radhey !!

Isnt it a great example of BG 18:33 that when even Lord Krishna calls a process to be very difficult in Holy Gita not once but CATEGORICALLY twice, and when other processes are told by Lord Krishna Himself to be comparatively simple.... we are arguing, and arguing .... and arguing about what type of cream we ought to make of mind.... and reg the former being simple, and not only simple but the ONLY course available ? Sheer misguidance ! Where is the scope of ifs and buts in Sadhak Sanjeevani ? Sadhaks should read Sadhak Sanjeevani and then put any ifs or buts. Why do you often get "occult powers" in Samadhi/meditation? Because SEEDS of desires are allowed to continue there for long ! Now a days Gurus in order to fill in their bellies drive innocent people into these realms which are nothing but outputs of a seconds' intense conentration of mind. On top of that MIND never loosens its hold on the SELF. It is therefore not surprising that we find many souls loosing their mental equilibrium in the old age and getting dubbed as "religious cracks". Go to Himalaya region, you will find them in dozens. Many start "tantrik" practices. Many even get some funny powers out of concentration ( walking on burning coals, thorns etc) ! These are dangerous courses. Consider the kind of eating, sleeping, living patterns envisaged in samadhi ! First there is rigorous discipline, then there is isolation, then there is shedding of all extra curriculam, then there is concentration , eightfold disciplines, then "seedful" state, then conquering the temptation for occult poers, then seedless state...and then too the disconnection with inert is outstanding to be done as it was at the beginning of process. Why ? I ask WHY ?

Control your intellect. Mind shall start wagging the tail ! Read Sadhak Sanjeevani first ! Seedless Samadhi ! At least my forefathers can not do that ! Still I am told by Holy Gita and confirmed by Miraji Dass that I am eligible (yogya) , and capable (samarth) of Self/God Realisation... and I am happy by that.

Radhey ! Radhey !!

Nisha Chatterji

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the truth is very simple ..................

IT IS VERY VERY SIMPLE............................

the scriptures say "one in a million realises the Self"

"Amongst thousands of men , one perchance strives for perfection; even amongst these successful strivers,only one perchance knows ME in essence . " ( the SELF ... KRISHNA ??)

........................................ Bh. Geetha,Ch. 7,Sh.3 .

dear sadhaka, would you agree that ..............'striving'.........indicates walking ?

ah,when you call yourself a sadhak,are you not saying that you are that 'striving' one ... that you are walking the Path.....and,that you have yet to reach your Goal ,the Bliss that the Self IS ....................

"For,I am the Abode of BRAHAMAN,the Immortaland the Immutable,of everlasting DHARMAand of Absolute Bliss ."

.......... Ch. 14/ Sh. 27

ah, dear sadhaka true ,

Be Yourself .............Accept yourself...Love yourself

Walk the Path ..........................

till laughter blossoms in you, as it did in the Laughing Buddha,who cried as he laughed

................." Ah,I was always Gunateet ..................... there never was a Path ................! "

AUM

narinder

---------------------Hari OmNeither Swamiji , nor Holy Gita nor majority of Saints and Sages nor most of the Scriptures have ever stated or advocated that "seedless samadhi" is the final way of Self Realisation. Sadhak Sanjeevani teaches "khule netro ka dhyaan" ( a sahaj/natural state of self , meditation with eyes open! ) where there is no nose to be pressed, no ears to be closed, no eyes to be positioned on the tip of nose, no caves are to be chosen... Only shelter of mind/ego/intellect/body is to be rejected (before you are rejected by them) !!What kind of stilling of mind is needed in believing: O God I am yours ? What kind of Samadhi is required in "accepting" - Mere to Girdhar Gopal, Doosaro na koi? If any efforts or actions are needed, then where remains the truth in "yogakshema vahamyham" ? Of what essence then remain the divine words of BG 18:66 or 9:30/31 or 12:6/7 ? In any case it is established beyond doubt that you can't realise "self" with the aid or modification in body or in sense organs (inert) - COME WHAT MAY ! You can only realise "self" by renouncing the shelter of inert. This is the primary and basic thing taught by Swamiji, Holy Gita, Goswami Tulsidasji Maharaj and all respected Scriptures of Sanatan Dharma.Real "Silencing of mind" is not "seedless samadhi" but "desirelessness" !! That "seed" is in desires. You can't forcibly "silence" the desires. You have to change/purify/eliminate the very ego in which "desires" reside. You have to change/purify/ eliminate- the very "me" and "mine" ! What meditation is going to do there? These are all tricks of mind and nothing else. The peace emanating out of "concentration" of mind is temporary. Gita does not advocate "stilling/stablisation of mind" ! Gita wants "intellect" to be stablised.If one reads even "Preface" and "Foreword" of Sadhak Sanjeevani , one gets clear about it !! O Divine Sadhaks ! Read, Read and Read ! If you surrender to Gitaji and Sadhak Sanjivani and then read it.... Nothing more would need to be done. There is grace of Swamiji there with you. But you will have to throw insistent and stubborn mind into a dust bin ! Any takers ?Jai Shree KrishnaVyas N B

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PRIOR POSTING

Jai Shree Hari !Being free of the 3 modes of nature is nothing but wining over the nature. Note that Bhagavaan ji has said "DAIVI HI ESHA GUNAMAYI MAM MAAYAA DURATYAYAA . MAAM EVA PRAPADYANTE MAAYAAM ETAAM TARANTI TE - Gitaji-7/14". It means the nature is God's divine power and you can be free from his gunamyi maya ONLY (which is the meaning of EVA here) when you surrender to him (i.e. when God is with you).

Bhagavaan ji has tried to impart the knowledge of "Purush-Prakriti" and "Nature of Prakriti and how to be free from them" in chapter 13 and 14 respectively mainly for the NIRGUN BRAHM UPAASAK (i.,e. who is on the path of knowledge) as he has already mentioned that this path is very difficult (KLESHO ADHIKATAR TESHHAM... Gitaji 12/5). While describing the qualities of a saadhak on the path of knowledge he has mentioned "AVYABHICHARINI BHAKTI in GOD" (Gitaji 13/10) as one of the qualities (or requirement). In other words, the saadhak who is on the path of knowledge can be free from 3 modes of nature by having 1)the qualities including AVYABHICHARINI BHAKTI described in chap13/7-11 and 2) his effort described in chap14/22-25. Note that the shloka 14/26 also talks about the requirement of "AVYABHICHARINI BHAKTI". The saadhak who is on the path of devotion does not worry about the nature as he thinks GOD as "SAT + ASAT" (SAT ASAT CHA AHAM ARJUN.. Gitaji 9/19). Ofcourse God does take care of him to make him free from the ASAT (i.e nature and its 3 modes).

May God bless us all!Niteesh Dubey

Priy Sadhaks,From what lord says in BG, and heard from saints, I have a gist that all contradictions lies equally in god.Like god is Justfull and loving (Contra)Like god is Nirgun and sagunLike god is omnipresent and yet nirlep from all.2. As we learn experience that mamevansho jeevloke jeevbhoot sanatan and Iswar ans jeev abinasi sat chetan ghan anand rasi and others say you are son of god.whatever be the notion, as being ansh of god we definately have all the qualities of god.Now it is the matter of accepting this, coz accepting is fastest path of attaining.Hope it helps,Always at thy lotus feet,Raja.

Priy Sadhaks,From what lord says in BG, and heard from saints, I have a gist that all contradictions lies equally in god.Like god is Justfull and loving (Contra)Like god is Nirgun and sagunLike god is omnipresent and yet nirlep from all.2. As we learn experience that mamevansho jeevloke jeevbhoot sanatan and Iswar ans jeev abinasi sat chetan ghan anand rasi and others say you are son of god.whatever be the notion, as being ansh of god we definately have all the qualities of god.Now it is the matter of accepting this, coz accepting is fastest path of attaining.Hope it helps,Always at thy lotus feet,Raja.Priy Sadhaks,From what lord says in BG, and heard from saints, I have a gist that all contradictions lies equally in god.Like god is Justfull and loving (Contra)Like god is Nirgun and sagunLike god is omnipresent and yet nirlep from all.2. As we learn experience that mamevansho jeevloke jeevbhoot sanatan and Iswar ans jeev abinasi sat chetan ghan anand rasi and others say you are son of god.whatever be the notion, as being ansh of god we definately have all the qualities of god.Now it is the matter of accepting this, coz accepting is fastest path of attaining.Hope it helps,Always at thy lotus feet,Raja. ------------------

Dear sadaks,Gunateet is the mind set in a person who attains total clarity of Chethan (living) and Achethan (non living) things. He understands that everything around him is created to suit life on earth. Say a plant requires sun light, water, air, space and soil. Human need food, air, water. But needs of human is more than that and sometimes needs and comfort is multifold. Human mind is attracted towards desires, passions etc based on his chemical constitution which we call 3 Gunas. No body born as Gunateet generally. Normally gains divine knowledge from Guru or GOVIND. Then he perfectly understood the whole world is 8 dimensional picturised digital cosmic Maya. When such this HAPPENS in a man, he becomes Gunateet. Ex: When Adi Sankar age of 6, his father expired. His mother and relatives all around were crying. But he remained as if nothing happened. That is Gunateet. Another man called (Pattinathar very wealthy person) of very recent times clarity HAPPENED through his son. He just abandoned his whole family & wealth and proved he was Gunateet. Gunateet is a great gift from GOD.Jai Sri KrishnaB.Sathyanarayan

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Jai Shree Hari !Being free of the 3 modes of nature is nothing but wining over the nature. Note that Bhagavaan ji has said "DAIVI HI ESHA GUNAMAYI MAM MAAYAA DURATYAYAA . MAAM EVA PRAPADYANTE MAAYAAM ETAAM TARANTI TE - Gitaji-7/14". It means the nature is God's divine power and you can be free from his gunamyi maya ONLY (which is the meaning of EVA here) when you surrender to him (i.e. when God is with you).

Bhagavaan ji has tried to impart the knowledge of "Purush-Prakriti" and "Nature of Prakriti and how to be free from them" in chapter 13 and 14 respectively mainly for the NIRGUN BRAHM UPAASAK (i.,e. who is on the path of knowledge) as he has already mentioned that this path is very difficult (KLESHO ADHIKATAR TESHHAM... Gitaji 12/5). While describing the qualities of a saadhak on the path of knowledge he has mentioned "AVYABHICHARINI BHAKTI in GOD" (Gitaji 13/10) as one of the qualities (or requirement). In other words, the saadhak who is on the path of knowledge can be free from 3 modes of nature by having 1)the qualities including AVYABHICHARINI BHAKTI described in chap13/7-11 and 2) his effort described in chap14/22-25. Note that the shloka 14/26 also talks about the requirement of "AVYABHICHARINI BHAKTI". The saadhak who is on the path of devotion does not worry about the nature as he thinks GOD as "SAT + ASAT" (SAT ASAT CHA AHAM ARJUN.. Gitaji 9/19). Ofcourse God does take care of him to make him free from the ASAT (i.e nature and its 3 modes).

May God bless us all!Niteesh Dubey

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It took Krishna 700 shalokas in 18 chapters to make Arjuna understand the essence of the self that clarifies in Arjuna as to what his conduct should be at that particular time .................

for the arjuna in us,there are commentaries and commentaries,and commentaries explaining how to reach that state..... Swami Ramsukh das jee's Sadhak Sanjivini does that beautifully.............BUT now,each upadesh of the Swami needs discussion /explanation to be understood ......

............ and, does the Truth become clear even then ...................... !!!!! all these discussions become redundent only for the sadhaka ,who understands the Truth of the Vedic Injunction " When the Self is known ................ all is known " Then,all doubts disappear . All discussions about the Paths cease because the Path is no more ; the destination has been reached ....................... and if the self has not yet been realised ............. one must accept the word of the scriptures, the Seers and the Sages with Faith, till that happens ............. and walk the Path most suited for one diligently BUT herein lies the Rub.Till self realisation, the Mind keeps imparting its own colour to every understanding ............... and arguments/discussions continue ...............continue till SILENCE dawns.................. the silence that removes all doubts is nirbeej samadhi ..... it is in that Samadhi that the Self gets realised ................. All your beliefs/ concepts shall die ,when you go beyond words ............ all quibbling shall stop...... all paradoxes reconciled ............ discussions dead forever ! ( is this not what the Bhagvada Geetha promises to the sincere sadhak,who walks the Path ???) If you have not yet reached the state of Mind , which is the promise of all the words of the scriptures , walk the Path and see, dear sadhaka( if you so choose ) ..................... you too will be your own Proof ................ your own conduct will go unto that righteousness ( Dharma),which is beyond ' right' and 'wrong', which embraces both lovingly , which just IS the essence of the Self ....................... in other words , you will live life spontaneously, always in the NOW, the Past and Future no more a disturbance of the Mind .................. no more doubts .... in Bliss will you live.......the Bliss that embraces all dualities like pain and pleasure,heat and cold,praise and censure , wealth and poverty, but you cannot skip your sadhna ................ IT IS VERY VERY SIMPLE............................AUM narinder bhandari

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Dear sadhakas,

Hare krishna.

This is in response to a question from a sadhaka.

Lord krishna clearly defined the qualities of a person who transcended the modes of nature, in bhagavad gita. .

lord krishna said.

" O son of pandu, he who does not hate attachment, comforts, and delusion when they are present or wish for them when they are absent, who is not disturbed in any of the reactions of materialism, remains transcendental, who regards happiness and distress alike, who treats a piece of earth, stone and gold the same way, who is equal in desirable and undesirable conditions, who treats praise and blame, honor and dishonor, friend and foe alike , and who has renounced all material activities, that person transcended the modes of nature. " ( Gitaji, 14, 22 to 25).

Such person does everything for the lord, in the name of the lord. He or she does not do anything for himself or for herself, loves every one. . Hence that person is free.

This is the right path to attain the lord.

Thank you,

Hare krishna.

Prasad. Iragavarapu. M. D

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Hari Om

Qs like this help sadhaks propel towards their goal faster. Thanks Rajaji.My Pranaams !

Sir, non acceptance of. Gunas in you- be it Sattwik, Rajasic or Tamasic is the best, easiest and the most practical way of getting rid of them. SIMPLY IGNORE THEM ! That's all is needed. "Tayorna vashmagachhet" ( Don't get swayed by them) - Says Holy Gita. You can't eliminate them so long as you are embodied. You can only ignore them, you can only disregard them, you can only not accept them in you ! You are FULLY INDEPENDENT and capable of non acceptance of Gunas in you ! They are visitors. You are permanent. They are temporary!!

As simple as that ! That is Param Shraddheya Swamiji Ramsukhdasji Maharaj, for you Dear Sadhaks !

Jai Shree Krishna

Vyas N B

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Dear Sadhakas, Namaste!Rajaji, I am glad to share what I have learned from Gita about being free of Modes of Nature (sattva, Rajas, Tamas). Cosmic Nature/Maya constantly engages in actions with gunas kept in equilibrium, which go in disequilibrium in individuals. This is reflected in working of our sense organs, body, mind, Intellect and organs of action, and is the reason why individuals seem to be predominant in one guna versus others. At individual-Jeeva levels it is ignorance-Avidya to identify with Gunas-modes of nature working through body-mind.To rise above this ignorance is to first balance gunas by bringing Sattva(tranquility, equanimity etc) through discrimination, dispassion or devotion and surrender to Ishwara, or self-less actions(Gita). As the sadhana matures, Sadhaka feels freedom from the overpowering modes of nature.In the direct path, Sadhaka at the very outset inquires into this ignorance and realizes that he/she was never in ignorance, the ignorance was perpetuating due to wrong notions and beliefs of being "an Individual" due to identification with Nature and its modes. One finds no evidence of being an individual upon inquiry with honesty. This opens up sadhaka to feel, think and act from "not being a person" but as "Existence Itself". Then, by the intensity of sadhana and Grace, he crosses over the ocean of Sansara and goes beyond Gunas!Beyond, Gunas, he is Sat-Chit-Ananda, permeating timelessly and spacelessly!Namaskar....Pratap Bhatt

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Jai Hanuman

Narinderji Maharaj ! On one hand you say :

"and it is you,who shall be the judge ........you, who will have to pass the test in your own eyes ;the other is only an excuse to show you the reflection of your being in your mind, the mirror ............ do stop relying on other persons"

Then, Narinderji Maharaj you utter the following:

"the first step is the knowing and acceptance of what( type) you are, and where you presently stand....... ....... karma,bhakti and gyana, are the three main Paths ............ even the bhaktas have to walk the way then keep walking the Way Bhagvada Geetha indicates for the Type you are"

Then your kindself opines:

"till the mind ,in Samadhi,dies and Silence itself becomes your Guru to lead you into contemplation on the words heard and read ...........and realise their Truth !!! "

Maharaj !! Which statement do we believe, Jee ? We sense some contradictions ! If this is not true then please come back ! If yes, correct yourself !Which words "heard and read" Jee ? From whom "heard and read" Jee?

On the Q of Raja Bhaiyya ! Where are Gunas, Brother ? For us, Bhaiyyaji? Oh... Do not they change? ... Some times sattwik, sometimes rajasic, sometimes tamasic... What have they got to do with us ? Come on ! Ah ... Where are they? In us ? How can they be? No ! No!! Brother ! They can't be in us, Jee ! How can temporary be in permanent ? Inert be in sentient ? Perishable be in imperishable? Can darkness prevail in light, Brother?

Accept what Narinderji Maharaj? Present state? Come on... What if it is full of Gunas, Jee ?? Can't present state be like that ? Will you accept that? Where will you reach unless you reject that? Bolo Jee !!

Namaste Jee

Jee JeeShashikala

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PRIOR POSTING

First requirement is to study Chapter13 and to clearly understand how toseparate Kshetra and Kshetrgna. Once this is done,whatever changes take place inKshetra by way of Sattva,Rajas and Tamas have to be just observed without anyintention of changing them. Soon the Sadhaka will experience that Tamas andRajas are changing to Sattva.Hereagain,we have to grasp the Truth that it is Prakriti which has becomeSattvic and I am just observing and keeping watch over it. I am Sat-Chit-AnandSwarup Atma and I am neither Sattvic,Rajasic or Tamasic.This is an awakenedstate.To test that we are in awakened state,Verses 22,23,24 and 25 are given as checklist and to either take this Direction or to maintain that condition, this checklist is very important.Characteristics mentioned there are similar toSthit-Pragna Laxan of Chapter2 Verses 54 to 72 or Characteristic of Bhakta asmentioned in Chapter 12 Verses 13 to 19. This Swadhyay individually or in agroup will protect the Sadhaka from falling or make the experience progressivelymore Distinct (Spasta Anubhuti).Jayantilal Shah

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In Chapter-14, Bhagwan Shri Krishna has mentioned the the attributes of the man who has risen above the three properties (Gunatit) from verses 22 to 25. Chapter-14Verse-22 " The man, O Pandav, who neither abhors radiance, inclination to action and attachment that are generated respectively by the operations of Sattwa, Rajas and Tamas when he is involved in them, nor aspires for them when he is liberated." Verse-23 "And who, like a dispassionate onlooker, is unmoved by the properties and is steady and unshaken by dint of his realization that these properties of nature but abide in themselves..." Verse-24"And who, ever dwelling in his self , views joy, sorrow, earth, stone, and gold as equal is patient and evenly regards the pleasant and the unpleasant, slander and praise...." Verse-25 "And who puts up with honour and dishonour, as (also) with friend and foe, with equanimity, and who gives up the undertaking of action is said to have transcended all the properties" OmAshwin-------Namaste

Patanjali defines Yoga as the cessation of the mind's modifications which are due to five factors - Prmana, Viparyaya, Vikalpa, Budra, and Smrti, translated as Logical Thinking, Impulsive Thinking, Imagination, Sleep, and Memory, respectively. Since the mind's modifications arise because of the conditioning factors upon ones consciousness, then the process of de-conditioning the mind must address the attributes of the mind - sattva, rajas, and tamas. The term used by the GITA for a de-conditioned state is gunatit or Trigunatit - the state in which the three gunas are transcended. Chapter 14 gives a lucid explanation of the three gunas and their effects on the mind. Sattva, Rajas, and Tamas,â€"these Gunas, O mighty-armed, born of Prakriti, bind fast in the body the indestructible embodied one. GITA 14-5

Later in Chapter 14, Bhagavan describes the transcending of the three gunas:

When the seer beholds no agent other than the Gunas and knows That which is higher than the Gunas, he attains to My being.

The embodied one having gone beyond these three Gunas out of which the body is evolved, is freed from birth, death, decay and pain, and attains to immortality. GITA 14-19,20

Arjuna then asks Bhagavan how will one know one has transcended the gunas:

By what marks, O Lord, is he (known) who has gone beyond these three Gunas? What is his conduct, and how does he pass beyond these three Gunas? GITA 14-21

The Blessed Lord replies:

He who hates not the appearance of light, (the effect of Sattva), activity (the effect of Rajas), and delusion (the effect of Tamas), (in his own mind), O PÃ¢ndava, nor longs for them when absent;

He who, sitting like one unconcerned, is moved not by the Gunas, who, knowing that the Gunas operate, is Self-centred and swerves not;

Alike in pleasure and pain, Self-abiding, regarding a clod of earth, a stone and gold alike; the same to agreeable and disagreeable, firm, the same in censure and, praise;

The same in honour and disgrace, the same to friend and foe, relinquishing all undertakingsâ€"he is said to have gone beyond the Gunas. GITA 14-22 to 25

And what does one achieve?

And he who serves Me with an unswerving devotion, he, going beyond the Gunas, is fitted for becoming Brahman.

For I am the abode of Brahman, the Immortal and Immutable, of everlasting Dharma and of Absolute Bliss GITA 14-26,27

GITA asks the aspirant to transcend all the 3 gunas if he is to arrive at a pure, unconditioned state of spiritual illumination. The difficulty with most of us is that we get entangled in the working of the gunas. We indentify ourselves with the inertia, the activity, and the balance which constitute the 3 states of expressional behavior.If one could observe oneself in the habits, in the conflicts, and in the conclusions to which one clings then would one see the modes functioning among the modes. And in this observation one would also perceive the true nature of oneself as above and beyond the modes.

One who has transcended the three gunas is forever unconcened and unpeturbed,. Such a man (denoting mankind) is Udasin - uncommitted and therefore unswerving. To stand apart and look at the modes functioning within oneself is indeed a supremely spiritual state. To be aware of the functioning of the Tamas, the Rajas, and the Sattva, and yet not interfere wih them - this indeed is freedom from all conditioning. In such a state the mind of man is rendered pure and innocent, capable of responding to the gentlest touch of the Supreme and the Transcendental.

GITA Chapter 18 provides further information on how one can transcend the 3 gunas.

Ram Ram Deosaran Bisnath--------Verses 22 to 26 of the 14th chapter give the answer to the question asked ................ But,the answer given in Sh 22 is valid for you only if your Conduct is in accordance with Sh 23 to 26.( do read the doubt expressed by Arjuna in shaloka 21.) and it is you,who shall be the judge ........you, who will have to pass the test in your own eyes ;the other is only an excuse to show you the reflection of your being in your mind, the mirror ................. do stop relying on other persons praise of you ,or their censure ............their tongues are often as untrue as their non-realisation If meditation blossoms in you and contemplation becomes your Way these words shall suffice ............. one upadesh suffices, if not ............ questions will arise on the answers given and read ........... there will be no dearth of them! In the hushed Silence of the Mind,also called the death of Mind, all questions drop ............ the wave disappears in the Ocean ,to rise again as ' not the wave 'but as Ocean waving in the wave ............... the 700 shalokas of the Lord's song show you but how to die to the self ( ego).............. and be the Self ( atma) ah,nari,........................ ah,narinder ....................ah ! Meditation is the Way ......contemplation is the way BUT your journey begins with a single step from where you presently are ............. the first step is the knowing and acceptance of what( type) you are, and where you presently stand.............. karma,bhakti and gyana, are the three main Paths ............ even the bhaktas have to walk the way then keep walking the Way Bhagvada Geetha indicates for the Type you are till the mind ,in Samadhi,dies and Silence itself becomes your Guru to lead you into contemplation on the words heard and read ...........and realise their Truth !!! the conduct in accordance with the Bhagvada Geetha's shalokas referred above will then flower in you.............................. Aum narinder bhandari

---------GITA TALK GROUP GUIDELINES: PLEASE -

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