Please Elaborate on GUNAATEET (Beyond the Gunas)

[Guest guest]

In Gitaji God says, regarding mode of purity (sattva), activity / passion

(rajas) and inertia (tamas) that on having an inclination for these three modes

of nature, there is no desire to be released from rebirth and on being released

from rebirth there is no desire to be inclined to the three gunas (modes of

nature). Kindly elaborate?

Raja Gurdasani

 

---------------

IN HINDI

IN GITAJI GOD SAYS STVA, RAJ AUR TAM IN TEENO GUNO KE PRAVRAT HONE PAR NIVTRATI

KI AKANSHA NAHI AUR NIVRAT HONE PAR PRAVRATI KI AKANSHA NAHI,

KINDLY ELABORATE?

RAJA GURDASANI

 

===========================================

 

 

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[Guest guest]

In Gitaji God says, regarding mode of purity (sattva), activity / passion(rajas) and inertia (tamas) that on having an inclination for these three modesof nature, there is no desire to be released from rebirth and on being releasedfrom rebirth there is no desire to be inclined to the three gunas (modes ofnature). Kindly elaborate?Raja Gurdasani---------------IN HINDIIN GITAJI GOD SAYS STVA, RAJ AUR TAM IN TEENO GUNO KE PRAVRAT HONE PAR NIVTRATIKI AKANSHA NAHI AUR NIVRAT HONE PAR PRAVRATI KI AKANSHA NAHI,KINDLY ELABORATE?RAJA GURDASANI===========================================

NEW POSTING

Dear Sadhakas,Hare Krishna.

This is in response to a question from a Sadhaka. Lord Krishna says in Bhagavad Gita,

"Sattvam rajas tama iti,Gunah prakrti sambhavahNibadhnanti maha baho,Dehe dehinam avyayam" (Gitaji 14,5)

Which means,'Material nature consists of mode of goodness(sattvika),passion(rajo),ignorance(tamasa). When the living entity comes in contact with nature, he gets conditioned by these three modes.'Of these three modes, sattva is the preferred one but even this binds us.

Lord Krishna described the qualities of the one who transcended the modes of nature'Who does not hate attachment, delusion,illumination when they are present or wish for them when they are absent, who is unperturbed by the reactions of material qualities, remains neutral and transcendental, who regards happiness and sorrow alike,who looks upon a lump of earth, a stone, and a piece of gold equally,who is equal in desirable and undesirable situations,who is steady, deals equally in praise and blame, honor and dishonor,who treats friends and foes alike and who has renounced all the material activities, such a person is believed to have transcended the modes of nature. '(Gitaji 14, 22 to 25)"Gunatitah sa ucyate. " (Gitaji 14,25)

means who have transcended the modes of nature, ( sattva, rajo, and tamo gunas). The way to transcend the modes of nature is through devotional service and total surrender to the Lord Krishna. Thank You,Hare Krishna. Prasad.A.Iragavarapu, M.D

-----------------------------

Dear Ones, Namaste!Rajaji, as usual, initiates good dialogues among us, the seekers/lovers of truth, in his short but sweet style!I would share the way I understand it. It is not going to be much different than what we have been sharing lately in current topics. It seems as if we have handed over the Chariot of our Life over to Nature - Prakriti - Gunas to drive us around! We take ourselves to be body-mind, part of prakriti endowed with three Gunas. Naturally, then, when new body-mind organisms appear in it, we call it Births/rebirths and when they perish away back into Nature, we call it Deaths! Thus these Gunas, intrinsic to nature, keep recycling themselves which we call the cycle of Birth and Death. As we all know, pleasures and pains are inherent in such organisms. This is because in ignorance of not knowing their true nature being SELF, the IS-NESS that is Consciousness, they think and act as if whatever happens to body, happens to them. Thus, desires for pleasures keep them in the cycle of rebirths!I don't see that "being released from rebirth there is no desire to be inclined to Gunas". What I see is that when Realization happens, Self just gives up all identifications/inclinations with individual body-mind, and takes it true stand as Witnessing Presence, or In-dweller, Sakshi Chaitanyam, and obtains equanimity in all situations, meaning rising above the Gunas! At some point, Witnessing Presence and "witnessed" world merge, by realization that witnessed prakriti, too, is of the same substance as Presence, Consciousness Universal! Thus, there is nothing to witness, because Vasudevah Sarvam!It is important to know that even after Realization, Prakriti Gunas, as before, keep on recycling through new bodies, but Self knows body-mind is not its true nature! So, whatever happens to body-mind organism happens to prakriti and not to Him/Her, because there is no Him/Her anymore! Equanimity reins there or rather here and now! Prakriti keeps on unfolding as it does!!!Namaskar..........Pratap Bhatt

--

There are three basic types of Gunas: sattva, rajas and tamas. Eac human

being is imparted these three Gunas: person to person the strength or

weakness or quality of these Gunas vary. It is because of the variation in

the Guna quality combination, different people act differently under

different circumstances. All these Gunas instill desire and ego of varying

types in each human being. Atma however does not have these Gunas and is

unaffected by them. When the ego, desires and perception of differences

among entities in the Universe disappear, Atma is realized. When Atma is

realized, the life of the guna-driven sensual desire-oriented senses, mind

and intellect ends. This situation is of no birth and no death.

Thus with Gunas gone, there is no birth and no death as one in always in the

Atma-realized state. So long as Gunas continue to exert influence on body,

mind and intellect, the pangs of worldy life has to be endured.

Basudeb Sen">

--

Shree Hari Ram Ram

How can one elaborate on Gunaateet? In fact Swamiji says so in Gita 14:25. Such a person has risen about the three gunas (modes of nature), rather transcended, therefore there cannot be any marks, qualities, descriptions, or any such thing. Marks, qualities, elaboration vest in modes of nature (prakriti). How can one who has marks, qualities etc.... transcend these gunas (qualities)?

Even though when Arjuna inquired of the qualities of such a person, and Lord responded, in fact these are only qualities related to the inner faculites and body, giving only a hint of such a person. But this cannot be described / elaborated. This mind / intellect cannot even fully describe the modes which are their cause. How can they describe nature (prakriti) the cause of the modes ? Then how is it possible for these to describe / elaborate on one who has transcended the modes ?

Meera Das, Ram Ram

Please elaborate which sloka of Gita says this statement.

Gaurav Mittal -----------

GITA TALK GROUP GUIDELINES: PLEASE - FOR QUESTIONER1. The questions as far as possible must be relevant to Gita, relevant toDharma, relavant to other scriptures and relevant to motivate Sadhaks to take upspiritual path2. The Questioner must commit to feedback at end of dicussion to bring closureand commit to daily Gita study3. Only one question at a time.4. Question must be brief, to the point and relevant to the group's primary aimof deeper understanding of Gita.GITA TALK GROUP GUIDELINES for RESPONDER: PLEASE -1. Only responses that further clarify Gita message will be posted.2. Quote Gitaji/scriptures wherever possible.3. RESPECT all Sadhaks. Limit personal feelings, opinions, beliefs etc. to theextent that they further help in understanding the Gita shlokas4. Be BRIEF, RELEVANT (stay with the subject being discussed only)5. Do not include links to the other sites; personal information (Ph #, addressetc) or personalize message to particular person6. All responses may not be posted.7. Please keep in mind novices, youth, westerners, non-sectarian audience. Limitthe use to Sanskrit words and provide English word bracketed.GITA TALK MODERATORSRam Ram------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- ---------Post message: Subscribe: - Unsubscribe: -

[Guest guest]

In Gitaji God says, regarding mode of purity (sattva), activity / passion

(rajas) and inertia (tamas) that on having an inclination for these three modes

of nature, there is no desire to be released from rebirth and on being released

from rebirth there is no desire to be inclined to the three gunas (modes of

nature). Kindly elaborate?

Raja Gurdasani

 

---------------

IN HINDI

IN GITAJI GOD SAYS STVA, RAJ AUR TAM IN TEENO GUNO KE PRAVRAT HONE PAR NIVTRATI

KI AKANSHA NAHI AUR NIVRAT HONE PAR PRAVRATI KI AKANSHA NAHI,

KINDLY ELABORATE?

RAJA GURDASANI

 

===========================================

 

NEW POSTING

 

 

 

-----------

 

I don't understand which sloka is being referred here.

 

 

 

Gunateet is a person who is not affected or beyond by gunas.

 

 

When you see yourself as atma beyond matter, then you won't be affected by inert

matter or gunas.

 

 

Swamiji says it again and again -

Accept that you are not this inert world but you are part of Paramatma. Your

body and this world belongs to Bhagavan. - Bhakti yog

Accept that you are not this inert world but you are part of Paramatma. Your

body and this world belongs to Samsara. - Karma yog

Accept that you are not this inert world but you are part of Paramatma. Your

body and this world belongs to Prakriti. - Jnana yog

 

 

That is gunateet person.

Gaurav Mittal

--\

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Tamas, Rajas, Sattwa and beyond (TriguNaateeta)

 

Polarities in our perception are generated due to the conflicts of interest we

harbor within. The conflicts of interest arise from the bias we nurture within.

The bias is rooted in the desire cluster we covet at the core of our existence.

 

As soon as a biased perception is conceived in the cognition, its nemesis takes

birth automatically at the very same instant. We name the two polarities as

Rajas and Tamas - one inciting us into actions and the other inhibiting us from

our activities. As a result, the two spur the individual into oscillatory

existence between the two corresponding poles - the opposite pulling the

individual away from wherever he/she tries to settle with. As a result, the

individual remains unsettled, rather restless.

 

An ignorant being could rip oneself apart from the mutually opposed forces

generated in the restless conflict of existence. The nature has developed a

third quality, which we call Sattwa, within that tries to balance between the

opposed forces to safegaurd the sytematic integrity.

 

We can imagine an individual as a magnet where the postivie and negative poles

(Rajas and Tamas) are bonded by the stem (Sattwa).

 

The magnet - our existential identity - becomes bigger and bigger as we get

farther and farther from what we ARE ... as we collect newer and newer

identities borrowing from our interaction with the world. As the magnet becomes

bigger, the polarity becomes stronger and so is the need to balance the same.

When the magnet grows beyond one's fathom, one looses to correlate the poles and

hence looses the capacity to generate a balancing force between the two opposing

poles and starts gravitating toward one of the poles helplessly. Though " a pole "

is chosen as an existential identity, the other pole remains dormant in one's

subconscious presence with pretty much equal potency.

 

To complicate our existence further, we generate multiple magnets in multiple

directions as the dimensions of our existence grow in our urge to propogate our

identity in the existential world. As a result, we start drifting amongst the

poles we have consciously gravitated in our apparent memory; and retain the set

of their opposites intact at our inherent memory.

 

As the poles are seggragated into relatively distinct compartments of our

cognition - conscious and subconscious - we further loose our ability to relate

the opposite poles. The only way that remains to discharge the opposites - one

hovering in the conscious mind and the other hidden in the subconscious mind -

into a balance, is to depend on the nature to mingle the two apparently distinct

domains ... either in sleep ... or in death ...

 

The magnet - our existential identity - becomes smaller and smaller as we get

closer and closer to what we ARE. As the magnet becomes smaller, the polarity

becomes weaker and so is the need to balance the same. In the limit of being

just ourselves, the polarities as well as the balancing bond between the same

become completely irrelevant and non-existent. This state is often referred to

as the " TriguNaateeta Tattva " or " PoorNa Tattva " in an all-inclusive sense or

" NirguNa Tattva " or " Shoonya Tattva " in an all-exclusive sense by our seers and

their revelations.

 

Respects

 

Naga Narayana

 

------

 

 

Dear Sadaks,

One who clearly understood and sticks to the understood matter of 24 Thatuvas is

Gunaateeth.

 

It is 24 Tattuvas. They are :-

1) Panch Pranas 5, Pancha Gosas 5, Karmendriyam 5, budthi, Manas, Chitta,

sensory 5, athuman. These are in Geetha.

 

How these are influenced, are told by Swamy Datatreya sitting under a tree as

Avadoot to King Edthu Maharaj. 24 Gurus

 

2) Prithivi- Earth. 2)Vaayu- Breeze. 3) Akaash- Sky. 4) Aapaha- water.

5)Agni- Fir. 6)Chandra- Moon. 7) Surya –Sun. 8)Tapotaha- Dove. 9)Ajagaraha-

Mountain Snake. 10)Sagaram- Sea. 11) Salabam- Flying ant. 12)Madhukrith- Bee.

13)Gajaha- Elephant. 14) Madhuhan- Hunter who collects honey. 15) Grahavena-

Deer. 16) Meenaha- Fish. 17) Pingala- Prostitute. 18)Kuraram- A type of Bird.

19) Kuntha Pakchi- A type of Bird. 20)Arthaha- Child. 21)Kumar- Teen age girl.

22)Sarakrith- Diyanam (Meditation). 23)Sarpaha- Snake. 24) Uornanaabhi- Spider.

 

How the first 24 correlates and shows one as 24 Gurus, can be posted with clear

explanations and example, it is voluminous. These are off my mind. there may

be mistakes, if so please excuse me. B.Sathyanarayan

 

 

 

 

 

Contd ...

 

How to attain TriguNaateeta?

 

Spirituality is to acknowledge the facts as they are … we have created the

magnets of identities with multi-polar contradictions knowingly (to start with)

and unknowingly (as we expand and multiply our dominions of identities) … we are

solely responsible for every seggregation of the polarities into conscious and

subconscious domains of our existence ... and finally, since we have authored

every polarity as such, we can potentially mitigate the same ... and, also, we

being the sole authors of all these junk, nothing else can access these

polarities ...

 

Therefore, the way to get out of the clutches of the desires and fears is to

appreciate their very root cause that is the source for their perpetual

nourishment - the bias apparent in one's wakeful state as well as its conjugate

lost in the oblivion of one's sleepful state, the Vaasanaas - the behaviors and

the conjugate instincts. Their very existence also indicates their whereabouts,

whatabouts as well as whyabouts if we truthfully seek to know.

 

The electable (Shreya) is verily different from the delectable (Preya) in life.

The former educates us how not to develop polar attitude in our day-to-day

activities. The later instigates us to collect more garbage in terms of

contradictory behaviors and attitudes. Therefore, a wise seeker would obviously

choose the electable while an ignorant man running behind his craves would fall

a prey to the delectable for procreating the identities further.

 

Anyacchreyo'nyadutaiva preyah te ubhe naanaarthe purusham sineetah |

Tayosshreya aadadaanasya sadhu bhavati heeyate'rthaadya u preyo vrineete ||

 

Every occasion with this world as well as with ourselves always proposes the two

choices to us - electable and delectable. A truthful seeker would differentiate

the two choices with utter clarity while a mundane living would probably fail to

distinguish them.

 

Shreyashcha preyashcha manushyametat tou sampareetya vivinakti dheerah |

 

The ignorants who crave to acquire and safegaurd their identities would go

behind the delectable choice in life that strengthens and promotes the bias and

polarities within. We have been vested with the Saattwic power (we call it

wisdom, Viveka) which always acts in the crisis to alleviate us from the

miserable positions we subject ourselves into. If we have the authority over the

polarities we nurture, we should be able to excercize our authority over them to

identify and mitigate the polarities by applying the Saattwic power vested in us

proactively. That is the electable choice that reduces the polarities and hence

our affinity to and dependence on the three GuNas ... to attain the state that

transcends all the GuNas altogether.

 

Shreyohi dheero'bhipreyaso vriNeete preyo mando yogakshemaadvriNeete ||

 

One who is awake sleepfully as well as sleeping wakefully verily transcends both

the sleep (Tamas) as well as the wakefulness (Rajas) and hence transcends the

balancing virtue of Sattva as well. The Shreyas is in appreciating the bliss of

sleep while awake and the awareness of wakeful state while sleeping

simultaneously.

 

Respects.

 

Naga Narayana.

 

-------

 

My friends,Atma and Prakriti are two creations of the Lord/Eesvara/Parama Atma.

Of these,Prakriti is inferior and apart from the matter Rayi and Prana (see 1.4

ofPrasnopanishat). Atma is gifeted with chetas and Prakriti is Jada.

Originalstate of Atma is to be ever in service of Parama Atma and

contemplateperennially on IT. Prakriti made of material has three lieutenants

called Gunas.They are satva, Rajas and tamas. These Gunas press on any object

that is incontact with them. Due to the presence of Prakriti and its proximity

to Atma,the three gunas try to impress on Atma also. An Atma which is aware of

its truenature and job refuses to be influenced by the triad. But mostly Atmas

allowthemselves to be impressed a litttle to begin with. The contact creates

subtleimpressions on the knowledge or chetana of Atma. These subtle impressions

arecalled Vaasana.These Vaasanas, force the Atma to enter a suitable body. Once

in a Prakriti madeBody, the Atma faces a more dangerous situation because

Indriyas of the bod areenemy (Prakrit) agents and they feed Mana with false

input and pushes Atma intothe ignorance that it is body and the three Gunas are

its friends and lovers.These three Gunas are difficult to be rid off. Once Atma

gains knowledge ofitself and realizes that it is subordinating to an inferior

entity, it tries tobe independent of the three Gunas. The success is not easy.

When the Atma winsthe battle against the 3 gunas, it is Gunaateeta. Once, this

is achieved, Atmadissociates from the mundane body and hence is not bothered by

its desires,aspirations, successes and failures. It looks at materially precious

Gold andordinary mud alike.A triguna ateeta Atma has only one desire that is to

be back in its originalstate of perennial contemplation on Parama Atma.Krishnam

Vande Jagad Gurumkrishna samudrala

------------------

 

 

Dear Sadhakas,

Hare Krishna.

 

This is in response to a question from a Sadhaka.

Lord Krishna says in Bhagavad Gita,

 

" Sattvam rajas tama iti,

Gunah prakrti sambhavah

Nibadhnanti maha baho,

Dehe dehinam avyayam " (Gitaji 14,5)

 

 

Which means,

'Material nature consists of mode of

goodness(sattvika),passion(rajo),ignorance(tamasa). When the living entity comes

in contact with nature, he gets conditioned by these three modes.'

Of these three modes, sattva is the preferred one but even this binds us.

 

Lord Krishna described the qualities of the one who transcended the modes of

nature

'Who does not hate attachment, delusion,illumination when they are present or

wish for them when they are absent, who is unperturbed by the reactions of

material qualities, remains neutral and transcendental, who regards happiness

and sorrow alike,who looks upon a lump of earth, a stone, and a piece of gold

equally,who is equal in desirable and undesirable situations,who is steady,

deals equally in praise and blame, honor and dishonor,who treats friends and

foes alike and who has renounced all the material activities, such a person is

believed to have transcended the modes of nature. '

(Gitaji 14, 22 to 25)

 

" Gunatitah sa ucyate. " (Gitaji 14,25)

 

means who have transcended the modes of nature, ( sattva, rajo, and tamo gunas).

 

The way to transcend the modes of nature is through devotional service and total

surrender to the Lord Krishna.

Thank You,

Hare Krishna.

Prasad.A.Iragavarapu, M.D

 

-----------------------------

 

Dear Ones, Namaste!

Rajaji, as usual, initiates good dialogues among us, the seekers/lovers of

truth, in his short but sweet style!

I would share the way I understand it. It is not going to be much different than

what we have been sharing lately in current topics.

 

It seems as if we have handed over the Chariot of our Life over to Nature -

Prakriti - Gunas to drive us around! We take ourselves to be body-mind, part

of prakriti endowed with three Gunas. Naturally, then, when new body-mind

organisms appear in it, we call it Births/rebirths and when they perish away

back into Nature, we call it Deaths! Thus these Gunas, intrinsic to nature, keep

recycling themselves which we call the cycle of Birth and Death.

As we all know, pleasures and pains are inherent in such organisms. This is

because in ignorance of not knowing their true nature being SELF, the IS-NESS

that is Consciousness, they think and act as if whatever happens to body,

happens to them. Thus, desires for pleasures keep them in the cycle of rebirths!

I don't see that " being released from rebirth there is no desire to be inclined

to Gunas " .

What I see is that when Realization happens, Self just gives up all

identifications/inclinations with individual body-mind, and takes it true stand

as Witnessing Presence, or In-dweller, Sakshi Chaitanyam, and obtains equanimity

in all situations, meaning rising above the Gunas! At some point, Witnessing

Presence and " witnessed " world merge, by realization that witnessed prakriti,

too, is of the same substance as Presence, Consciousness Universal! Thus, there

is nothing to witness, because Vasudevah Sarvam!

It is important to know that even after Realization, Prakriti Gunas, as before,

keep on recycling through new bodies, but Self knows body-mind is not its true

nature! So, whatever happens to body-mind organism happens to prakriti and not

to Him/Her, because there is no Him/Her anymore!

Equanimity reins there or rather here and now! Prakriti keeps on unfolding as it

does!!!

Namaskar..........Pratap Bhatt

 

--

 

There are three basic types of Gunas: sattva, rajas and tamas. Eac human being

is imparted these three Gunas: person to person the strength or weakness or

quality of these Gunas vary. It is because of the variation in the Guna quality

combination, different people act differently under different circumstances. All

these Gunas instill desire and ego of varying types in each human being. Atma

however does not have these Gunas and is unaffected by them. When the ego,

desires and perception of differences among entities in the Universe disappear,

Atma is realized. When Atma is realized, the life of the guna-driven sensual

desire-oriented senses, mind and intellect ends. This situation is of no birth

and no death. Thus with Gunas gone, there is no birth and no death as one in

always in the Atma-realized state. So long as Gunas continue to exert influence

on body, mind and intellect, the pangs of worldy life has to be endured.

 

Basudeb Sen

 

 

" >

--

 

Shree Hari Ram Ram

 

How can one elaborate on Gunaateet? In fact Swamiji says so in Gita 14:25.

Such a person has risen about the three gunas (modes of nature), rather

transcended, therefore there cannot be any marks, qualities, descriptions, or

any such thing. Marks, qualities, elaboration vest in modes of nature

(prakriti). How can one who has marks, qualities etc.... transcend these gunas

(qualities)?

 

Even though when Arjuna inquired of the qualities of such a person, and Lord

responded, in fact these are only qualities related to the inner faculites and

body, giving only a hint of such a person. But this cannot be described /

elaborated. This mind / intellect cannot even fully describe the modes which

are their cause. How can they describe nature (prakriti) the cause of the modes

? Then how is it possible for these to describe / elaborate on one who has

transcended the modes ?

 

Meera Das, Ram Ram

 

 

 

 

 

Please elaborate which sloka of Gita says this statement.

 

Gaurav Mittal

 

-----------

 

 

GITA TALK GROUP GUIDELINES: PLEASE - FOR QUESTIONER

1. The questions as far as possible must be relevant to Gita, relevant to

Dharma, relavant to other scriptures and relevant to motivate Sadhaks to take up

spiritual path

2. The Questioner must commit to feedback at end of dicussion to bring closure

and commit to daily Gita study

3. Only one question at a time.

4. Question must be brief, to the point and relevant to the group's primary aim

of deeper understanding of Gita.

 

 

GITA TALK GROUP GUIDELINES for RESPONDER: PLEASE -

1. Only responses that further clarify Gita message will be posted.

2. Quote Gitaji/scriptures wherever possible.

3. RESPECT all Sadhaks. Limit personal feelings, opinions, beliefs etc. to the

extent that they further help in understanding the Gita shlokas

4. Be BRIEF, RELEVANT (stay with the subject being discussed only)

5. Do not include links to the other sites; personal information (Ph #, address

etc) or personalize message to particular person

6. All responses may not be posted.

7. Please keep in mind novices, youth, westerners, non-sectarian audience. Limit

the use to Sanskrit words and provide English word bracketed.

 

GITA TALK MODERATORS

Ram Ram

 

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