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Upadesa and Jignasa

What is Upadesa? the declention may be as: upa=

samipE desa:h= disati iti, that is one guides being

close by. Teaching by a guru to a sishya being close

by is upadesa. That is, teaching a subject in which

the guru is proficient to a student is upadesa.

Obviously this involves giving the right knowledge( as

the guru has understood it).It does not prohibit the

student to think on his own or in case he feels

differently about it (like E= Mc3), discussing it with

the guru. That is VAdakatha. The discussion shall be

free and fair. The decision of the guru shall be taken

as final in such discussion.

In case of Jignasa, it may be a single individual

making the Jignasa( we may call it as 'vichara

mathana') or two or more persons discussing or

studying a topic toether to get to the truth of the

subject , or with a guru leading; example Brahma

jignasa. It may not be a formal debate like a Jalpa.

It could be between a guru and a sishya as well as in

Upadesa.

Thus Upadesa and Jignasa may be complimentary to

each other. In both the cases the purpose is the

desire to know the truth or 'yatarthajnana', that is

'Tattva'.

 

Bannur.R

 

 

 

 

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kesava.padipatri wrote:

 

>answered, it may lead to some new questions. Then comes the need

>for more " upadesha " and the process goes on until the individual is

>satisfied or has reached the limit of his capacity. But as we all

>know, there is no end to that process as no one including " Laxmi "

>knows " brahman " completely.

 

Clarification: there is no end until mukti, but after that there is no

increase in knowledge, as indicated in the pramANa-laxaNa's `krameNa

vardhamAnam.h; A mukteH; tato.avyayam.h'.

 

Regards,

 

Shrisha Rao

 

>Keshava Rao

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" jij~nAsa " is defined as " j~nAtum ichchhA " which can be translated as

desire to know. It is an ardent desire to know. It can be about

anything. But the ultimate subject is " brahman " only. Then it is

called " brahmajij~nAsa " . It is like a constant flame burning inside.

It is there at all stages. It is there as a prerequisite for

" upadesha " , it is there all during " upadesha " and it continues to be

there even after it. It is never diminishing and ever increasing,

ardent desire. " upadesha " without " jij~nAsa " is futile and " jij~nAsa "

without " upadesha " is like a rudderless boat. " jij~nAsa " is further

kindled not only during " upadesha " by a teacher but also during

discusion with " sahAdhyAyis " (co-learners). A right kind of teacher

knows not only the position of his disciple, but also the direction,

he has to show to his student. The teacher also knows that even

though the same " upadesha " is given to all his students, based on

individual capacities, they benefit differently and reach different

levels. Also this " jij~nAsa " which includes the inquiry process in

the form of many questions finds some answers in " upadesha " . But

that starts a cyclic process because even though some questions get

answered, it may lead to some new questions. Then comes the need

for more " upadesha " and the process goes on until the individual is

satisfied or has reached the limit of his capacity. But as we all

know, there is no end to that process as no one including " Laxmi "

knows " brahman " completely.

 

Regards

Keshava Rao

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Namaskara Keshava Rao,

 

Thanks for posting. You have said it very well.

But I see lots of other emails, where the upadesha they are talking about

is really the Shravana

which is the first step in Brahma-Jignaasaa. But in the example I gave of

E=Mc2) the

4th grader is not really a Jignaasu. If he was, like the Upanishadic

Satyakama, he would ask the

person who told him about the prameya ( E=Mc2), to teach him the necessary

things for getting that

Jnana. So, in my example, what he received as upadesha is not really the

" Shravana " that we talk

about in shastra as sitting at the feet of a guru and learning shastra, but it

is simply a prameya that

is given to him as spoon-feeding, and this kind of " upadesha " will not lead to

any kind of Shastra-Janya

Jnana. This is what I had said in my email.

 

But in the emails I see, people are talking about various kinds of upadeshas

etc, which are really

the shravana of the Sharava-Manana-Nidhidhyaasana process.

 

I hope this clarifies.

 

Jayakrishna.

 

 

----------

----------

RJAY Consultants Inc.,

Tel: (703)430-8090 Fax: (703)904-8496

Email: jay

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kesava.padipatri <kesava.padipatri

< >

Thursday, September 02, 1999 2:50 PM

Re: upadesa and jignasa

 

 

>kesava.padipatri

>

>

>

> " jij~nAsa " is defined as " j~nAtum ichchhA " which can be translated as

>desire to know. It is an ardent desire to know. It can be about

>anything. But the ultimate subject is " brahman " only. Then it is

>called " brahmajij~nAsa " . It is like a constant flame burning inside.

>It is there at all stages. It is there as a prerequisite for

> " upadesha " , it is there all during " upadesha " and it continues to be

>there even after it. It is never diminishing and ever increasing,

>ardent desire. " upadesha " without " jij~nAsa " is futile and " jij~nAsa "

>without " upadesha " is like a rudderless boat. " jij~nAsa " is further

>kindled not only during " upadesha " by a teacher but also during

>discusion with " sahAdhyAyis " (co-learners). A right kind of teacher

>knows not only the position of his disciple, but also the direction,

>he has to show to his student. The teacher also knows that even

>though the same " upadesha " is given to all his students, based on

>individual capacities, they benefit differently and reach different

>levels. Also this " jij~nAsa " which includes the inquiry process in

>the form of many questions finds some answers in " upadesha " . But

>that starts a cyclic process because even though some questions get

>answered, it may lead to some new questions. Then comes the need

>for more " upadesha " and the process goes on until the individual is

>satisfied or has reached the limit of his capacity. But as we all

>know, there is no end to that process as no one including " Laxmi "

>knows " brahman " completely.

>

>Regards

>Keshava Rao

>

>

>

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>nAham kartA hariH kartA tatpUjA karmachaakhilam.h|

>taThaapi matkR^itaa pUja tatprasaadhEna naanyaThaa|

>tadbhakti tadphalam.h mahyam.h tatprasaadaat.h punaH punaH |

>karmanyaasO harAvevam.h vishNOsthR^iptikaraH sadhA ||

>

> " I am not the doer, shri Hari is the doer, all the actions that I do are

His worship. Even then, the worship I do is through His grace and not

otherwise. That devotion and the fruits of the actions that come to me are

due to His recurring grace "

>If one always practices to do actions with a dedicated spirit to Hari, in

this way, it pleases Vishnu.

> --- Quoted by Sri madhvAchArya in GitA tAtparya

 

--\

------

RJAY Consultants Inc.,

Tel: (703)430-8090 Fax: (703)904-8496

Email: jay

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