Bhaghavat Gita lectures by Sri Sathyadhyana Thirtha, Q & A last part

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hari saRvOthtthamma, vAyu jIvOththamma

 

shrI gurubhyO namaha

 

QUESTIONS & ANSWERS:

 

Sri Sethu Rao: Swamiji, Sathyam, jnanam, anantham Brahma etc...... How

do the advaitees explain the Sruthies? Is not the meaning Brahma is

Sathya svarupa, jnana Svarupa & Anantha?

 

Srigalavaru: Because he is not ajnani, he is called jnaani. Since he

does not meet an end in space or time according to well known

" Anyapohavada " both in Vijnanavada & adwaitha, the words Sathya, Jnana,

Anantha are applied to Brahma not because he has any of these positive

qualities, but because of the absence of their opposite in him. These

applications are only vyavaharika not paramarthika.

 

Sri Sethu Rao: We should not say that because he has sathyathwa &

jnanathva, Brahma is sathya & jnana.

 

Since Brahma has no dharma, according to advaitha, he cannot be

represented by any dhravya (thing) Guna (quality), Kriya (action or

work) as none of these can apply to him. Sankaracharya himself has

said, Brahma is opposed to falsehood, he is Sathya (not because he has

sathya as his dharma) as he is opposed to the end in space, time

quality, he is anantha not because he has been constant as his dharma)

etc.. Further, they say according to lakshana, Upanishads just give the

expression of Brahma, Lakshna means for example, if we say that Kashi is

on Ganga we actually mean Kashi is on the bank of Ganga not on the water

in the river bed. Here, by lakshna Ganga river is represented by the

Bank.

 

Sri Sethu Rao: What is the objection for saying so?

 

Srigalavaru: There are two important objections without ascribing any

quality to Brahma how can you say that he is not false. If one has to

say that you do not speak falsehood, he has to show that because you

speak truth, you do not speak falsehood. This is the method in practice

in the world. Therefore, we have to say that Brahma has qualities like

Sathya, he is not asathya. If we say, Brahma is nirguna (nirdharma)

will be lost & when you agree the Brahma is (unknowable)Sarvatha Ajneya

to say that Sruthi Sathyam Jnanam Anantham Brahma in indicates by

lakshana vriththi Brahma is untenable for one who is completely

unknowable, lakshna vriththi also cannot indicate anything. The

statement of unknowability rules out any relationship.

 

Sri Sethu Rao: Everyday, we find that students ask questions like what

is the use of Brahma jignasa? What is the proof is Brahma Sadhbhava?

The teachers reply using the word Brahma. In this circumstances, how to

say that Brahma is completely unknowable, if he cannot be known from

shastras? & if we do not get brahma jnana from sasthras why should we

read cart loads of books?

 

Srigalavaru: To avoid all these difficulties- some advaitees have

accepted anthahakarana (just as dharma) in Brahma i.e. they have agreed

that Brahma has consicousness. But since he is nirdharma, that also

does not hold good. Actually, our sastrakaras have raised the same

questions. But in advaitha system convincing answers for these

questions are not available. If you persist in asking these questions,

some advaitees say that our brahma need not be established by vedas. By

experience, we establish.

 

Sri Sethu Rao: Swamiji, is that in anyway inferior? It is known by

experience, that there is Brahma where is the harm, even if he is not

established by Vedas? Is there any condition that Brahma must be

established only by Vedha?

 

Srigalavaru: Yes, there is such condition. Let it be there for

present. If everyone has to understand either Brahma or brahmaikya by

experience, then everyone must have Brahmajnana. There should not be

any doubt about Brahma " I am " feeling is common feeling of everybody.

Nobody gets doubt wherther I am or not. About Brahma, many people do

not know anything, doubts & difficulties are innumerable. Therefore,

our Brahma (or sentence) can be realized by experience is not

practicable & hence to be given up. If by experience, Brahma can be

realized why should there be any argument between dvaithees &

advaithees.

 

Sri Sethu Rao: Swamiji, can we say that there is Brahma but the

experience that jeeva & Brahma are one & the same comes in future though

that experience is not at present?

 

Srigalavaru: In that case, since one has the experience of Brahma the

fact that Brahma is there at present is not established. If it is said

that the experience that there is Brahma will come in future & then it

will be possible to experience Brahma, there should be some authorities

or proof for accepting a future occurance. The normal pramanas adopted

in philosophy are Prathyaksha, Anumana, Agama. In the field beyond the

purview of sense experience, prathyaksha & anumana do not enter.

Therefore, if we have to believe that we can realize Brahma in future

evidence from Agama is absolutely necessary. That is why the restiction

that Brahma must be established by Vedhas only. Then if you say that

Brahma is nirdharama, since you accept his existence which itself is a

quality.

 

Sri Sethu Rao: Swamiji, Anthahakarana (conscious) is one or many? What

do advaithees say in this respect?

 

Srigalavaru: There are many anthahakaranas. Some say that non

different from upadhi in the form of anthahakarana chethana itself is

jeeva.

 

Sri Sethu Rao: Swamiji, This anthahakarana is Sathya (real or kalpitha

false or vyavaharika)?

 

Note: The definition of real in advaitha is that which was without

beginning which is & which will continue for all time without any

change. Such a thing is only Brahma & nothing else.

 

Srigalavaru: Anthahakarana is Kalpitha (false) it is said in advaitha

system, that Brahma gets jeeva bhava from the relation of this Kapitha

(False. Anthahakaranarupa upadhi)

 

Sri Sethu Rao: What is the defect in this?

 

Sri galavaru: There are innumerable defects in this statement. You

see, if this anthahakarana (conscious) is to be Kalpitha (false) it

should be illusion (Branthi) for somebody. It is not possible to say

that conscience has become false due to the illusion of jeeva, because

due to the relation of false anthahakarana (conscious) jeeva bhava

comes. This means the illusion has taken place before the birth of

formation of jeeva. Therefore, we have to say the illusion is for

Brahma. How to say illusion for Brahma who is Nithyajnana svarupa. If

we say by relation of avidhya Brahma get the Branthi or anthahakarana

Asangohyoyam purushaha " . The Sruthi which means Brahma is always devoid

of avidhya relationship contradicts & in advaitha also it is not real.

Only Brahma is Sathya. If it is accepted that avidhya is Kalpitha, it

is shown above that illusion is not for the jeeva. If it said Brahma

gets illusion due to avidhya, we will have to suppose never ending

series of avidhya which Anavastha postion results. Therefore, there is

no possibility of Brahma getting jeeva bhava. Moreover, if Brahma has

to get illusion of jeeva bhava, he should have ordinary knowledge,

absence of clear knowledge, similarity of the object which is the cause

of illusion. Since Advaitha Brahma is niravayaya, he has no such things

within him according to the advaitha commentator Bhamathi. This has

been shown previously. Therefore, illusion which is the cause for

Brahma to get jeeva bhava cannot happen to him.

 

Moreover, there is not a single sruthi which can establish (avidhya

Brahma) for Brahma, from such false avidhya Anthahkarana Brahma from

such false anthakarnopadhitha jeevabhava. Hence how to accept this

thesis which has no proof from any Sruthi since all statements in

Vedantha are proved on the strength of Sruthies. After considering all

these facts, Srimadhanandha Theertha Bhagvathpadhcharya has said :

 

Meaning: Since advaitha system of philosophy is full of numerous

contradictions & defects, it is not fit for acceptance by those who seek

salvation.

 

 

Sri Vyasarajaru has collected everything of our Madhwamatha in one

shloka

 

shrIman-madhva-mate hariH parataraH satyaM jagat.h

tattvato |

bhedo jIvagaNAH hareranucharAH nIchochcha

bhAvaN^gatAH |

muktirnaijasukhAnubhUtiramalAbhaktishcha

tatsAdhanam.h |

hyaxAditrayaM pramANamakhilAmnAyaikavedyo hariH ||

 

This may be split as:

 

shrIman.h madhva-mate In Sriman

Madhva's doctrine

 

1> hariH parataraH Hari (Vishnu) is

Supreme

2> satyaM jagat.h The world is

true (real)

3> tattvataH bhedaH The differences

are real

4> jIvagaNAH hareH anucharAH The classes of

souls are

 

cohorts

of Hari

5> nIchochcha bhAvaN^gatAH And reach

different ultimate

 

states

6> muktiH naija-sukha-anubhUtiH mukti

(liberation) is the

 

experience of the joy of one's

 

own

nature

7> amalA-bhaktiH-cha tat.h sAdhanaM That is achieved

by flawless

 

devotion and [correct

 

understanding]

8> axAditrayaM hi pramANaM pratyaksha

(observation), etc.,

 

are

indeed the sources of

 

knowledge

9> akhila-AmnAya-eka-vedyo hariH Hari alone is

praised in all

the Vedas.

 

Details on this premeya stothra can be seen in

http://www.dvaita.org/shaastra/prameya.html

 

Coming back to Srimad Bhaghavat Gita chapters, HH Sri Sathyadhyana

Theertha has proved in the first chapter of His lectures on Vishnu

Sarvoththammathva, HARI PARATARAH just quoting Sri Krishna's words from

Srimad Bhaghavath Geetha.. Sri Sathyadhyana Theertha, in His lectures

on the Second Chapter, He is going to prove SATHYAM JAGATH

(Jagathsathyathva) Establishment of Reality of the world just by quoting

Sri Krishna's words in Srimad Bhaghavat Gita..

 

TO BE

CONTINUED...............................................................

 

Lectures on Bhaghavath Geetha (Dhwaitha Siddhantha Vaijayanthi)

by H. H. Sri Sathya Dhyana Thirtha Sri Padhangalavaru, Uttradhi Mutt

Translated into English by Sri Krishnamurthy

 

Published by Sri M. R. Krishnamurthy & Sri M. N. Gururaja Rao of Mumbai

 

Printed at:

Parishree Printers

100/3 Nagappa Street

Palace Guttahalli

Bangalore 5600 04

Telephone # (80)368286

 

All rights remain with Uttradhi Mutt, Basavangudi, Bangalore 560004

Permission was given to post it in this list by the Uttradhi Mutt

authorities & by Sri SathyAthma Thirtha Swamiji of Uttradhi Mutt.

 

Sri kRuShNARpanamasthu