Guest guest Posted February 22, 2001 Report Share Posted February 22, 2001 Namaskaragalu, Even though i am not able to answer th first qstn of yours,i will try to answer the rest. There is no doubt that Anjaneya,Bhimasena and SriMadhwacharya are all amshas of Vayu.There is no difference between the moola amsha and the avataras.This holds good only to Sarvotamma SriHari and Jeevotamma Vayu.Rest of them starting from Rudra devaru,have many differences between there mool amsha and avataras.As i have heard from Vidyavachaspathi Vyasanakere Prabhanjanacharya in his pravachana,he mentioned that as " Yuga " progresses from one to another,except for Hari and Vayu(including Laxmi) the moola amsha's power will deteriorate for all the devathas starting from Rudradevaru(i.e. from 5th kaxya).As everbody of us know,there is a instance in Mahabharatha where Bhimasena meets Hanumantha who was very old that time.Even though they are different avatharas,both possess the same power.It is not that Hanumantha had great power and Bhima had less.In another instance when Ashwathama is about to kill children of Pandavas,he actually meets his moola amsha " Lord Shiva " and there is a small war between them in which Ashwathama loses.That is Ashwathama who is an amsha of Rudra does not possess the same power as his mool amsha Rudra.This is to mention that Hari and Vayu possess the same power in all the avataras,so Hanumantha,Bhimasena and Madhwacharya all possess the same power.To conclude, Vayu has the same power in all Yugas,even though he may get old,his power remains the same. - GOPALAKRISHNA.B VARNA <bgkvarna Thursday, February 22, 2001 8:23 AM amsha, avesha > Dear Haribhakthas, > > Kindly enlighten me about > > 1) What is the mUlaswarUpa of Lord muKyapraaNa?. Everywhere we see only > icon of Lord Anjeneya in different postures, but not a diffenent icon > to represent shrI muKyapraaNa. > > 2) If I remember correctly shrI AnjanEya and shrI BImasEna are > sometimes referred as 'pavanasutha', 'vaayuputhra' etc. Is this > correct? Then what is the difference between shrI vAyu and shrI > AnjanEya / shrI BImasEna. > > 3)Is there any difference between these three avathaara? If I am > correct, we have icon of Lord mukhyapraaNa as well as shrI AchArya in > Udupi shrI Krishna maTha. But regular and detailed pooja is done only > to shrI muKyapraaNa and not to shrI AchArya. Is there any specific > reason? > > Pardon me for my ignorance > > shrI Hari prIyathAm > B.Gopalakrishna > > > > > --- Meera Tadipatri <mtadipatri wrote: > > On Wed, Feb 21, 2001 Murthy Navaratna <murthyn wrote: > > > > >In Dr. Sri Vyasanakere Prabhanjana's latest edition of " Sumadwa > > Vijaya " > > >(Kannada) while explaining the meaning for the shloka " nisacarreriva > > > > >lakshmanah.... " (4th sarga, 26th shloka) has a foot note > > explanation. This > > >footnote explains that Sri Vishnu Thirtha is the Amsha of Indra. He > > also > > >quotes Acharya's Sri Mahabharatha Tatparya Nirnaya's 129th shloka of > > 32nd > > >chapter (ArjunaadyaH KruthE Prajaatha HarithOshanAya..)to confirm > > this. > > >(This is not in his older editions though). > > > > > >Sri Narayana Panditacharya's " Amshaavathara " confirms this. (Sorry , > > I > > >don't have it with me at work to confirm whether it also says about > > the > > >Arjuna's Nara amsha). Amshavaathaara is nothing but a collection of > > Amsha, > > >Avathaara and Avesha of 100s of characters in Mahabhaaratha. > > > > Arjuna's mUlarUpa is Indra and he has the avesha of > > Hari, Vayu, and [amsha of]Nara > > > > I think you are referring to the second line of the second > > verse in " aMshAvatAraH " by shrI Narayana Panditacharya. > > > > " arjunaH pUrvamevendro harivAyunarAMshayuk.h " > > > > Also, note that Acharya's Mahabaratha Tatparya Nirnaya Chapter 12, > > verse # > > 99: > > > > " sa chArjuno nAma narAMshayukto vishhNvAveshI balavAnastravettA | > > ....|| 12\.99|| > > > > Indra [who takes the incarnation] named Arjuna is also bestowed > > with the amsha of Nara and Avesha of Vishnu. He will be strong, > > skilled in archery. > > > > Also, MBTN 2\.122 > > " rudrAtmakatvAchchheshhasya shuko drauNishcha tattanU | > > indre narAMshasampattyA pArtho.apIshhat.h tadAtmakaH " > > > > Since Sukha and Ashvathama have the amsha-s of Rudra in them, > > they can be said to belong to 3rd kaxya. Since Arjuna who > > is an 'incarnation' of Indra also has amsha of Nara, he also > > said to belong to 3rd kaxya > > > > Btw, an e-text of the mahAbhArata-tAtparya-nirNaya,[2708 KB, 625 > > pages] > > (Includes a Preface, a translation of the Bhava-Sangraha of Sri > > Raghavendra > > Tirtha, a list of authorities, is available at dvaita text > > resources i.e ., > > > > http://www.dvaita.net > > > > Regards, > > > > Meera Tadipatri > > > > _______________ > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices! http://auctions./ > > > nAham kartA hariH kartA tatpUjA karmachaakhilam.h| > taThaapi matkR^itaa pUja tatprasaadhEna naanyaThaa| > tadbhakti tadphalam.h mahyam.h tatprasaadaat.h punaH punaH | > karmanyaasO harAvevam.h vishNOsthR^iptikaraH sadhA || > > " I am not the doer, shri Hari is the doer, all the actions that I do are His worship. Even then, the worship I do is through His grace and not otherwise. That devotion and the fruits of the actions that come to me are due to His recurring grace " > If one always practices to do actions with a dedicated spirit to Hari, in this way, it pleases Vishnu. > --- Quoted by Sri madhvAchArya in GitA tAtparya > > To send an empty E-mail (without subject and body info.) > to - or go the web page > /community/ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 23, 2001 Report Share Posted February 23, 2001 Dear Sri Gopalakrishna, I have an idea of the answer to the first question, though not the sources. The mUla rUpa of mukhyaprANa devaru is panchamukha Anjaneya -- this is different from the ones that we usually see with the faces of horse et al. Here all the five faces are that of Sri Hanumantha itself, though with different colors. One interesting feature of this rUpa is that out of the 10 hands, one has a tree shown with roots and upside down -- basically to depict that praNadevaru is capable of uprooting the miseries right from the root (linga-sharIra). I'd seen this photo in somebody's house and they told me that Rayaru's mutt in Mantralayam had released this photo sometime back (that is more than 2 years back). Add to this, some other scholar in Andhra, somewhat controversial in his research, went through some purANAs and came up with the conclusion that the mUla rUpa is indeed of the above form. Sorry, I don't know what his sources were, too. The answer to the second question is that there is absolutely no difference. It is quite common to use such language (that's how the story depicts the birth of three avataaras), but that is not sufficient reason to assume that they are different from the mUla rupa in essence. If somebody has any other info, please share over here. Regards, Krishna GOPALAKRISHNA.B VARNA [bgkvarna] Thursday, February 22, 2001 8:23 AM amsha, avesha Dear Haribhakthas, Kindly enlighten me about 1) What is the mUlaswarUpa of Lord muKyapraaNa?. Everywhere we see only icon of Lord Anjeneya in different postures, but not a diffenent icon to represent shrI muKyapraaNa. 2) If I remember correctly shrI AnjanEya and shrI BImasEna are sometimes referred as 'pavanasutha', 'vaayuputhra' etc. Is this correct? Then what is the difference between shrI vAyu and shrI AnjanEya / shrI BImasEna. 3)Is there any difference between these three avathaara? If I am correct, we have icon of Lord mukhyapraaNa as well as shrI AchArya in Udupi shrI Krishna maTha. But regular and detailed pooja is done only to shrI muKyapraaNa and not to shrI AchArya. Is there any specific reason? Pardon me for my ignorance shrI Hari prIyathAm B.Gopalakrishna --- Meera Tadipatri <mtadipatri wrote: > On Wed, Feb 21, 2001 Murthy Navaratna <murthyn wrote: > > >In Dr. Sri Vyasanakere Prabhanjana's latest edition of " Sumadwa > Vijaya " > >(Kannada) while explaining the meaning for the shloka " nisacarreriva > > >lakshmanah.... " (4th sarga, 26th shloka) has a foot note > explanation. This > >footnote explains that Sri Vishnu Thirtha is the Amsha of Indra. He > also > >quotes Acharya's Sri Mahabharatha Tatparya Nirnaya's 129th shloka of > 32nd > >chapter (ArjunaadyaH KruthE Prajaatha HarithOshanAya..)to confirm > this. > >(This is not in his older editions though). > > > >Sri Narayana Panditacharya's " Amshaavathara " confirms this. (Sorry , > I > >don't have it with me at work to confirm whether it also says about > the > >Arjuna's Nara amsha). Amshavaathaara is nothing but a collection of > Amsha, > >Avathaara and Avesha of 100s of characters in Mahabhaaratha. > > Arjuna's mUlarUpa is Indra and he has the avesha of > Hari, Vayu, and [amsha of]Nara > > I think you are referring to the second line of the second > verse in " aMshAvatAraH " by shrI Narayana Panditacharya. > > " arjunaH pUrvamevendro harivAyunarAMshayuk.h " > > Also, note that Acharya's Mahabaratha Tatparya Nirnaya Chapter 12, > verse # > 99: > > " sa chArjuno nAma narAMshayukto vishhNvAveshI balavAnastravettA | > ....|| 12\.99|| > > Indra [who takes the incarnation] named Arjuna is also bestowed > with the amsha of Nara and Avesha of Vishnu. He will be strong, > skilled in archery. > > Also, MBTN 2\.122 > " rudrAtmakatvAchchheshhasya shuko drauNishcha tattanU | > indre narAMshasampattyA pArtho.apIshhat.h tadAtmakaH " > > Since Sukha and Ashvathama have the amsha-s of Rudra in them, > they can be said to belong to 3rd kaxya. Since Arjuna who > is an 'incarnation' of Indra also has amsha of Nara, he also > said to belong to 3rd kaxya > > Btw, an e-text of the mahAbhArata-tAtparya-nirNaya,[2708 KB, 625 > pages] > (Includes a Preface, a translation of the Bhava-Sangraha of Sri > Raghavendra > Tirtha, a list of authorities, is available at dvaita text > resources i.e ., > > http://www.dvaita.net > > Regards, > > Meera Tadipatri > > _______________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices! http://auctions./ nAham kartA hariH kartA tatpUjA karmachaakhilam.h| taThaapi matkR^itaa pUja tatprasaadhEna naanyaThaa| tadbhakti tadphalam.h mahyam.h tatprasaadaat.h punaH punaH | karmanyaasO harAvevam.h vishNOsthR^iptikaraH sadhA || " I am not the doer, shri Hari is the doer, all the actions that I do are His worship. Even then, the worship I do is through His grace and not otherwise. That devotion and the fruits of the actions that come to me are due to His recurring grace " If one always practices to do actions with a dedicated spirit to Hari, in this way, it pleases Vishnu. --- Quoted by Sri madhvAchArya in GitA tAtparya To send an empty E-mail (without subject and body info.) to - or go the web page /community/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 23, 2001 Report Share Posted February 23, 2001 Dear Haribhakthas, > It is quite common to use such language (that's how the story >depicts the birth of three avataaras), but that is not sufficient >reason to assume that they are different from the mUla rupa in >essence. But is it OK to use such adjectives ?. There is a saying that " athma vai putra nama " meaning father is himself son by amsha ( Hope this is correct interpretation). But I think that is not applicable here. Calling someone as 'son' seems to be making some difference between father and son. I am not sure how this is not applicable here. We don't use such terminology in case of Shri Hari or any other Gods. It is found only in case of Shri Vayu. I am sure there is some explanation for this. I request scholars to enlighten me. shrI Hari priyatham B.Gopalakrishna Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices! http://auctions./ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 26, 2001 Report Share Posted February 26, 2001 > 1) What is the mUlaswarUpa of Lord muKyapraaNa?. Everywhere we see only > icon of Lord Anjeneya in different postures, but not a diffenent icon > to represent shrI muKyapraaNa. > See, SrimadAcharya himself narated the mUla rUpa of Sri mukhyaprANa in tantrasaara like this... " udyad-ravi-prakarasnnibhamachyutaanke svaasiinamasya shrutinityavachaH-pravrittim dhyaayed gadaabhayakaram sukritaanjalim tam praaNam yatheshhta-tanumunnatakarmashaktim. " Sri mukhyaprANa is sitting on the lap of Lord Sri nArAyaNa. He has four arms. In one among them he has worn gadaa and the abhaya-mmudra in another. And with left two hands he is doing praNama to the LORD.He is looking like rising sun. etc.... ( this is not direct translation). > 2) If I remember correctly shrI AnjanEya and shrI BImasEna are > sometimes referred as 'pavanasutha', 'vaayuputhra' etc. Is this > correct? Then what is the difference between shrI vAyu and shrI > AnjanEya / shrI BImasEna. > There is no deference at all in any rUpas of Sri vaayudeva. All avataara rUpas are equal in all respect. There is no sin in calling by these names. In laghu vaayustuti these all names are listed. > 3)Is there any difference between these three avathaara? If I am > correct, we have icon of Lord mukhyapraaNa as well as shrI AchArya in > Udupi shrI Krishna maTha. But regular and detailed pooja is done only > to shrI muKyapraaNa and not to shrI AchArya. Is there any specific > reason? > NO! no deference at in avataara-rUpas and mUla-rUpa. You can worship both as equal. regards, srivara. for PPSMB. > Pardon me for my ignorance > > shrI Hari prIyathAm > B.Gopalakrishna > > > > > --- Meera Tadipatri <mtadipatri wrote: > > On Wed, Feb 21, 2001 Murthy Navaratna <murthyn wrote: > > > > >In Dr. Sri Vyasanakere Prabhanjana's latest edition of " Sumadwa > > Vijaya " > > >(Kannada) while explaining the meaning for the shloka " nisacarreriva > > > > >lakshmanah.... " (4th sarga, 26th shloka) has a foot note > > explanation. This > > >footnote explains that Sri Vishnu Thirtha is the Amsha of Indra. He > > also > > >quotes Acharya's Sri Mahabharatha Tatparya Nirnaya's 129th shloka of > > 32nd > > >chapter (ArjunaadyaH KruthE Prajaatha HarithOshanAya..)to confirm > > this. > > >(This is not in his older editions though). > > > > > >Sri Narayana Panditacharya's " Amshaavathara " confirms this. (Sorry , > > I > > >don't have it with me at work to confirm whether it also says about > > the > > >Arjuna's Nara amsha). Amshavaathaara is nothing but a collection of > > Amsha, > > >Avathaara and Avesha of 100s of characters in Mahabhaaratha. > > > > Arjuna's mUlarUpa is Indra and he has the avesha of > > Hari, Vayu, and [amsha of]Nara > > > > I think you are referring to the second line of the second > > verse in " aMshAvatAraH " by shrI Narayana Panditacharya. > > > > " arjunaH pUrvamevendro harivAyunarAMshayuk.h " > > > > Also, note that Acharya's Mahabaratha Tatparya Nirnaya Chapter 12, > > verse # > > 99: > > > > " sa chArjuno nAma narAMshayukto vishhNvAveshI balavAnastravettA | > > ....|| 12\.99|| > > > > Indra [who takes the incarnation] named Arjuna is also bestowed > > with the amsha of Nara and Avesha of Vishnu. He will be strong, > > skilled in archery. > > > > Also, MBTN 2\.122 > > " rudrAtmakatvAchchheshhasya shuko drauNishcha tattanU | > > indre narAMshasampattyA pArtho.apIshhat.h tadAtmakaH " > > > > Since Sukha and Ashvathama have the amsha-s of Rudra in them, > > they can be said to belong to 3rd kaxya. Since Arjuna who > > is an 'incarnation' of Indra also has amsha of Nara, he also > > said to belong to 3rd kaxya > > > > Btw, an e-text of the mahAbhArata-tAtparya-nirNaya,[2708 KB, 625 > > pages] > > (Includes a Preface, a translation of the Bhava-Sangraha of Sri > > Raghavendra > > Tirtha, a list of authorities, is available at dvaita text > > resources i.e ., > > > > http://www.dvaita.net > > > > Regards, > > > > Meera Tadipatri > > > > _______________ > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > > > > > > > > Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices! http://auctions./ > > > nAham kartA hariH kartA tatpUjA karmachaakhilam.h| > taThaapi matkR^itaa pUja tatprasaadhEna naanyaThaa| > tadbhakti tadphalam.h mahyam.h tatprasaadaat.h punaH punaH | > karmanyaasO harAvevam.h vishNOsthR^iptikaraH sadhA || > > " I am not the doer, shri Hari is the doer, all the actions that I do are His worship. Even then, the worship I do is through His grace and not otherwise. That devotion and the fruits of the actions that come to me are due to His recurring grace " > If one always practices to do actions with a dedicated spirit to Hari, in this way, it pleases Vishnu. > --- Quoted by Sri madhvAchArya in GitA tAtparya > > To send an empty E-mail (without subject and body info.) > to - or go the web page > /community/ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 27, 2001 Report Share Posted February 27, 2001 --- ppsmb <ppsmb wrote: > Sri mukhyaprANa is sitting on the lap of Lord Sri nArAyaNa. > He has four arms. In one among them he has worn gadaa and .He is > looking like rising sun. etc.... > ( this is not direct translation). I request scholars to provide detailed meaning of this shloka, to explain the mUla rUpa of shrI Vayu. Then Is it panchamukhI prana devaru or not??. > There is no sin in calling by these names. > In laghu vaayustuti these all names are listed. I am not clear here. How we can call shrI Hanuman as 'son of shrI vAyu'? When shrI hanuman is shrI vAyu himself, why we are using the word " pavanaputhra " , " vAyuputhra " etc.??? Kindly enlighten me. shrI Hari priyatham B.Gopalakrishna Get email at your own domain with Mail. http://personal.mail./ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 27, 2001 Report Share Posted February 27, 2001 > I request scholars to provide detailed meaning of this shloka, to > explain the mUla rUpa of shrI Vayu. > I will mail you soon. > Then Is it panchamukhI prana devaru or not??. > This is not panchamukhi praaNadevaru. > I am not clear here. How we can call shrI Hanuman as 'son of shrI > vAyu'? When shrI hanuman is shrI vAyu himself, why we are using the > word " pavanaputhra " , " vAyuputhra " etc.??? > I will try my best to answer this question. There is some deference in `avataras' of LORD and those of Sri Vaayu. Srimadaachaarya says in MBTN that Sri naaraayaNa has nityavyaktatva in avataara-rUpas too. `nityavyaktaguNo hariH'. But, Sri mukhyapraaNa can have his qualities in avataara-rUpas when he desires. " ichChAvyaktiH praayasho maarutasya.. " (MBTN). No other deity has this capacity. Therefore we can consider avataara-rUpas of VAyudeva are identical with mUla-rUpa ; so is the statement in balitthA-sUkta " itthaa.... This means that all rUpas are equal in knowledge, capacity etc. However keeping the statement made by Acharya in veiw, we can also infer that there is some sort of deference than Sri NaaraayaNa, since avataara-rUpas of Lord have abhivyakti for ever, where as this contrasts in the case of vaayu. So, is the name as `vAyuputra' and etc. regards, srivara. > Kindly enlighten me. > > shrI Hari priyatham > B.Gopalakrishna > > > > > Get email at your own domain with Mail. > http://personal.mail./ > > nAham kartA hariH kartA tatpUjA karmachaakhilam.h| > taThaapi matkR^itaa pUja tatprasaadhEna naanyaThaa| > tadbhakti tadphalam.h mahyam.h tatprasaadaat.h punaH punaH | > karmanyaasO harAvevam.h vishNOsthR^iptikaraH sadhA || > > " I am not the doer, shri Hari is the doer, all the actions that I do are His worship. Even then, the worship I do is through His grace and not otherwise. That devotion and the fruits of the actions that come to me are due to His recurring grace " > If one always practices to do actions with a dedicated spirit to Hari, in this way, it pleases Vishnu. > --- Quoted by Sri madhvAchArya in GitA tAtparya > > To send an empty E-mail (without subject and body info.) > to - or go the web page > /community/ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 2, 2001 Report Share Posted March 2, 2001 Dear Haribhakthas, > I have an idea of the answer to the first question, though not the > sources. The mUla rUpa of mukhyaprANa devaru is panchamukha >Anjaneya - this is different from the ones that we usually see with >the faces of horse et al. Here all the five faces are that of Sri >Hanumantha itself, though with different colors. I am still not sure about this. There was another mail by " ppsmb " <ppsmb as follows: > I request scholars to provide detailed meaning of this shloka, to > explain the mUla rUpa of shrI Vayu. ----I will mail you soon. > Then Is it panchamukhI prana devaru or not??. > ----This is not panchamukhi praaNadevaru. So I am more confused now. My humble request with the scholars to clarify this. ShrI Hari Priyatham B.Gopalakrishna Get email at your own domain with Mail. http://personal.mail./ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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