Guest guest Posted September 9, 2001 Report Share Posted September 9, 2001 HiSome fun and games from the world of Science.Sandeep-----------------------Excerpts FromSCIENCE AND U.G.AN EXPOSITION OF THE SCIENTIFIC BASIS OF U.G.'S PHILOSOPHYByDr. O. S. ReddyIn nature things are as they are.Correlation is a concept which we use to describe the connections weperceive. The word and concept of `correlation' have no significance apartfrom people. This is because only people use words and concepts. Correlationis a concept. Subatomic particles are correlations.If we are not here to make them, there would not be any concepts, includingthe concept of correlation.The same is true of particles: if we were not here to make them, there wouldnot be any particles.From a pragmatic point of view nothing can be said about the world `outthere' except via our concepts. Even in the world of our concepts particlesdo not have a separate and independent existence. They are represented bywave functions (Schr"dinger's wave equation); and the meaning of the wavefunction lies only in the correlation of other macroscopic things. Since thewave function is thought to be a complete description of physical reality,and since that which the wave function describes is an idea as well asmatter, the world cannot be as it appears.A macroscopic object like a table or a chair has an experienced meaning.That is, we organize our sensory perceptions directly in terms of it. Theseexperiences are such that we can believe that the object has an existenceand a well-defined location in space-time that is logically independent ofother things.But the concept of independent existence evaporates at the subatomic level.If it has an idea-like aspect, the physical world cannot be substantive inthe usual sense of the word.One hundred percent matter is one hundred percent idea.The Copenhagen interpretation of Quantum mechanics states that the physicalworld is not what it appears to be.It states that what we perceive to be physical reality is actually ourcognitive construction of it.This cognitive construction may appear to be substantive, but the Copenhageninterpretation of quantum mechanics leads directly to the conclusion thatthe physical world itself does not exist.------------The mind is such that it can only deal with ideas.It is not possible for the mind to relate to anything other than ideas.Therefore, it is not correct to think that the mind can actually ponderreality.All that the mind can ponder are its own ideas about reality.Therefore, whether or not an idea is true is not a matter of how closely itcorresponds to the absolute reality, but how consistent it is with ourexperience.Even the Copenhagen interpreters of quantum mechanics were forced by theirown findings to acknowledge that a complete understanding of reality liesbeyond the capabilities of rational thought.--------------------------The Copenhagen Interpretation and the Nature of Space and Time." AmericanJournal of Physics. 1977. pp.108-9. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 9, 2001 Report Share Posted September 9, 2001 Thanks, Sandeep! Quite intriguing this point at which the point I see, and the seeing of the point, and the one seeing that the point is being seen, is the same thing. This seems to relate even more to Gautama's teachings then U.G.'s, and certainly to J.K.'s as well, but of course, that's simply a correlation made by this one who is looking at the ideas, which ideas constitute he who is looking at the ideas. When the one looking is known to be the looking, the looked at, and simultaneously merely the concept of looking ... What is this life, this death, this seeing ... But a bucket of water splashing around all over, with no bottom or top -- dancing in endless space ... Love, Dan --- Sandeep Chatterjee <sandeepc wrote: > Hi > > Some fun and games from the world of Science. > > Sandeep > ----------------------- > > Excerpts From > > > SCIENCE AND U.G. > > > AN EXPOSITION OF THE SCIENTIFIC BASIS OF U.G.'S > PHILOSOPHY > > By > > Dr. O. S. Reddy > > > In nature things are as they are. > Correlation is a concept which we use to describe > the connections we > perceive. The word and concept of `correlation' have > no significance apart > from people. This is because only people use words > and concepts. Correlation > is a concept. Subatomic particles are correlations. > If we are not here to make them, there would not be > any concepts, including > the concept of correlation. > The same is true of particles: if we were not here > to make them, there would > not be any particles. > > From a pragmatic point of view nothing can be said > about the world `out > there' except via our concepts. Even in the world of > our concepts particles > do not have a separate and independent existence. > They are represented by > wave functions (Schr " dinger's wave equation); and > the meaning of the wave > function lies only in the correlation of other > macroscopic things. Since the > wave function is thought to be a complete > description of physical reality, > and since that which the wave function describes is > an idea as well as > matter, the world cannot be as it appears. > > A macroscopic object like a table or a chair has an > experienced meaning. > That is, we organize our sensory perceptions > directly in terms of it. These > experiences are such that we can believe that the > object has an existence > and a well-defined location in space-time that is > logically independent of > other things. > > But the concept of independent existence evaporates > at the subatomic level. > If it has an idea-like aspect, the physical world > cannot be substantive in > the usual sense of the word. > > One hundred percent matter is one hundred percent > idea. > > The Copenhagen interpretation of Quantum mechanics > states that the physical > world is not what it appears to be. > It states that what we perceive to be physical > reality is actually our > cognitive construction of it. > This cognitive construction may appear to be > substantive, but the Copenhagen > interpretation of quantum mechanics leads directly > to the conclusion that > the physical world itself does not exist. > > ------------ > > > The mind is such that it can only deal with ideas. > It is not possible for the mind to relate to > anything other than ideas. > Therefore, it is not correct to think that the mind > can actually ponder > reality. > All that the mind can ponder are its own ideas about > reality. > Therefore, whether or not an idea is true is not a > matter of how closely it > corresponds to the absolute reality, but how > consistent it is with our > experience. > > Even the Copenhagen interpreters of quantum > mechanics were forced by their > own findings to acknowledge that a complete > understanding of reality lies > beyond the capabilities of rational thought. > > -------------------------- > > The Copenhagen Interpretation and the Nature of > Space and Time. " American > Journal of Physics. 1977. pp.108-9. > > Get email alerts & NEW webcam video instant messaging with Messenger http://im. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 9, 2001 Report Share Posted September 9, 2001 Hi Dan, - d b Realization Monday, September 10, 2001 12:04 AM Re: Some fun and games from the world of Science Thanks, Sandeep!Quite intriguing this point at which the point I see, and the seeing of the point, and the one seeing that the point is being seen, is the same thing. San: Indeed. And that is why, phenomenality, made up of the "seer", the "seen" and the functioning in the form of "seeing", is a concept. A Lila, a grand play on the scale of infinity. It is fairly easy to see, that the "seen" is nothing but a projection of the conditioning of the "seer", and hence an illusion, but what is often missed is that this conditioned "seer' is itself part of the that same illusion. Sometime back, there was a prattling on "Mirrors" which brings the point to light. ----------- This seems to relate even more to Gautama's teachings then U.G.'s, and certainly to J.K.'s as well, but of course, that's simply a correlation made by this one who is looking at the ideas, which ideas constitute he who is looking at the ideas.When the one looking is known to be the looking, the looked at, and simultaneously merely the concept of looking ...What is this life, this death, this seeing ...But a bucket of water splashing around all over, with no bottom or top -- dancing in endless space ... San: A bow. The bamboo shadows are sweeping the stairs,but no dust is stirred.The moonlight penetrates the depth of the pool,but no trace is left in the water Or, Water without losing it's nature, enjoying the beauty of the illusory waves thereon Cheers Sandeep Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 10, 2001 Report Share Posted September 10, 2001 Hi Sandeep, Beautiful discussing this with you! > S: It is fairly easy to see, that the " seen " is > nothing but a projection of the conditioning of the > " seer " , and hence an illusion, but what is often > missed is that this conditioned " seer' is itself > part of the that same illusion. Well-said! <bow> and >smile< This indeed is the point at which the tooth can't bite itself! Namaste and love, Dan Get email alerts & NEW webcam video instant messaging with Messenger http://im. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 10, 2001 Report Share Posted September 10, 2001 Hiya Dan, - d b Realization Tuesday, September 11, 2001 03:55 AM Re: Re: Some fun and games from the world of Science Hi Sandeep,Beautiful discussing this with you!> S: It is fairly easy to see, that the "seen" is> nothing but a projection of the conditioning of the> "seer", and hence an illusion, but what is often> missed is that this conditioned "seer' is itself> part of the that same illusion.Well-said!<bow> and >smile<This indeed is the point atwhich the tooth can't bite itself! ------ Or the eye see itself Cheers Sandeep Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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