Guest guest Posted February 23, 2001 Report Share Posted February 23, 2001 I've been popping in and out of this group for about a month now reading the posts but never posting myself. What seems very unique about this group is that they so often refrain from writing personal notes and more often than not just quote one of the great teachers. That to me shows great humility and also that real practice is happening. My name is David and I will break this tradition simply because the Maharaj's teachings are not the only reason I come to this group. I also come for social interaction around his teachings. Why don't we spend some time talking about the trials in our own lives of trying to live what Ramana Maharshi or Nisargadatta speak about? About a year ago I came upon these great sages: first Ramana then Nisargadatta. I instantly recognized their teachings as the vehicle I had been searching for to find the truth of myself. They were direct, they did not preach seperation from the world, they integrated their practice with life, and they stayed away from quoting holy books and becoming lost in traditions and rituals. I especially identified with Nisargadatta. When I read him it is as though every word is precious. I have tried to underline the key passages, but it seems that I could underline the entire book (I Am That). Much of what resonates with me about him is his cutting to the point and at the same time his gentle and loving urging of us. I'm sure the fact that he lived so recently also helps in his communication with me. I've become pretty good at coming back to the " I am " throughout the day. It has greatly helped my meditation periods too. They have a stillness that was never there before. Also, I actually hunger for my meditation sessions which is definitely new. Of course the spiritual life goes in cycles. Recently my mind has become very caught up in career plans. It is so interested in its thoughts that it doesn't want to rest in the " I am. " That is why the Maharaj's words about the fall: " accepting experiences as the truth, it gets more and more involved... " resonated with me so much. The pleasure in thinking and weaving a world of experiences is so great with me that I am sometimes reluctant to step beyond it. I think this is one of my greatest challenges. It has become very clear to me why Nisargadatta speaks so often of earnestness and of not taking on new ventures. The spiritual work is so easily thrown off by the mind's interests and preoccupations. But is also flourishes so easily when there is earnestness and focus. What are your (all) experiences with this and how do you resolve this issue? David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 24, 2001 Report Share Posted February 24, 2001 Nisargadatta, truthseeker@c... wrote: > I've been popping in and out of this group for about a month now > reading the posts but never posting myself. What seems very unique > about this group is that they so often refrain from writing personal > notes and more often than not just quote one of the great teachers. > That to me shows great humility and also that real practice is > happening. > > My name is David and I will break this tradition simply because the > Maharaj's teachings are not the only reason I come to this group. I > also come for social interaction around his teachings. Why don't we > spend some time talking about the trials in our own lives of trying > to live what Ramana Maharshi or Nisargadatta speak about? About a > year ago I came upon these great sages: first Ramana then > Nisargadatta. I instantly recognized their teachings as the vehicle I > had been searching for to find the truth of myself. They were direct, > they did not preach seperation from the world, they integrated their > practice with life, and they stayed away from quoting holy books and > becoming lost in traditions and rituals. I especially identified with > Nisargadatta. When I read him it is as though every word is precious. > I have tried to underline the key passages, but it seems that I could > underline the entire book (I Am That). Much of what resonates with me > about him is his cutting to the point and at the same time his gentle > and loving urging of us. I'm sure the fact that he lived so recently > also helps in his communication with me. > > I've become pretty good at coming back to the " I am " throughout the > day. It has greatly helped my meditation periods too. They have a > stillness that was never there before. Also, I actually hunger for my > meditation sessions which is definitely new. Of course the spiritual > life goes in cycles. Recently my mind has become very caught up in > career plans. It is so interested in its thoughts that it doesn't > want to rest in the " I am. " That is why the Maharaj's words about the > fall: " accepting experiences as the truth, it gets more and more > involved... " resonated with me so much. The pleasure in thinking and > weaving a world of experiences is so great with me that I am > sometimes reluctant to step beyond it. I think this is one of my > greatest challenges. It has become very clear to me why Nisargadatta > speaks so often of earnestness and of not taking on new ventures. The > spiritual work is so easily thrown off by the mind's interests and > preoccupations. But is also flourishes so easily when there is > earnestness and focus. > > What are your (all) experiences with this and how do you resolve this > issue? > > David Whatever experiences were happening in this field of knowingness, the Ultimate Principle got caught up in that. It accepted some experiences as itself. Accepting experiences as the truth, it gets more and more involved. Maharaj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 25, 2001 Report Share Posted February 25, 2001 On 23 February 2001 David wrote: Recently my mind has become very caught up in >career plans. It is so interested in its thoughts that it doesn't >want to rest in the " I am. " That is why the Maharaj's words about the >fall: " accepting experiences as the truth, it gets more and more >involved... " resonated with me so much. The pleasure in thinking and >weaving a world of experiences is so great with me that I am >sometimes reluctant to step beyond it. In relation to what David wrote about 'experience' I thought it may be helpful to collect together some of the words Nisargadatta offered on the subject of experience. John. Experience You talk about your spiritual experiences just to show people, “I am something!” You are interested in your experiential state. There are so many experiences. Be yourself and not the experiences. Experiences are a temporary phaze and you are giving it undue importance. It happens naturally. Everyone is concerned with these experiences from birth to death, but no one gives any thought to that state before experiencing began. One who has a clear understanding of this consciousness cannot attach any importance to any experience. In the state prior to beingness I alone prevail without even the message “I Am”. There are no experiences at all. It is the non-experiential eternal state. I alone prevail in that state, there is no otherness. For any experience otherness is necessary. I have no need of any experience. Whatever is seen, heard, experienced and acquired is totally useless and redundant, when it is realized that no one will remain but the nishkama Parabrahman, the desireless eternal Absolute state. Any experience you get is not real. The eternal ever is, a non-experiential state. In the realm of experience you cannot have the experience of truth. There can be no experience of truth because ultimately you are That. There cannot be experience of truth because it is prior to the beingness. No experiences are permanent. Experiences are in the realm of consciousness, which is bound by time. Beyond the mind there is no such thing as experience. Experience is a dual state. You cannot talk of reality as an experience. Once this is understood, you will no longer look for being and becoming as separate and opposite. In reality they are one and inseparable, like roots and branches of the same tree. Both can exist only in the light of consciousness, which again, arises in the wake of the sense “I Am”. This is the primary fact. If you miss it, you miss all. The world itself is contact.....the totality of all contacts actualized in consciousness. The spirit touches matter and consciousness results. Such consciousness, when tainted with memory and expectation, becomes bondage. Pure experience does not bind. Experience caught between desire and fear is impure and creates karma. This habit of experiencing will not go until you realize that all this domain of the five elements, and the experiences in the five elements, are unreal. This “I Amness” is itself unreal. You speak of my experience as different from your experience, because you believe we are separate. But we are not. On a deeper level my experience is your experience. Nisargadatta: extracts from various books recording his talks. >truthseeker >Nisargadatta >Nisargadatta > The Fall (Elizabeth) >Fri, 23 Feb 2001 23:14:13 -0000 > >I've been popping in and out of this group for about a month now >reading the posts but never posting myself. What seems very unique >about this group is that they so often refrain from writing personal >notes and more often than not just quote one of the great teachers. >That to me shows great humility and also that real practice is >happening. > >My name is David and I will break this tradition simply because the >Maharaj's teachings are not the only reason I come to this group. I >also come for social interaction around his teachings. Why don't we >spend some time talking about the trials in our own lives of trying >to live what Ramana Maharshi or Nisargadatta speak about? About a >year ago I came upon these great sages: first Ramana then >Nisargadatta. I instantly recognized their teachings as the vehicle I >had been searching for to find the truth of myself. They were direct, >they did not preach seperation from the world, they integrated their >practice with life, and they stayed away from quoting holy books and >becoming lost in traditions and rituals. I especially identified with >Nisargadatta. When I read him it is as though every word is precious. >I have tried to underline the key passages, but it seems that I could >underline the entire book (I Am That). Much of what resonates with me >about him is his cutting to the point and at the same time his gentle >and loving urging of us. I'm sure the fact that he lived so recently >also helps in his communication with me. > >I've become pretty good at coming back to the " I am " throughout the >day. It has greatly helped my meditation periods too. They have a >stillness that was never there before. Also, I actually hunger for my >meditation sessions which is definitely new. Of course the spiritual >life goes in cycles. Recently my mind has become very caught up in >career plans. It is so interested in its thoughts that it doesn't >want to rest in the " I am. " That is why the Maharaj's words about the >fall: " accepting experiences as the truth, it gets more and more >involved... " resonated with me so much. The pleasure in thinking and >weaving a world of experiences is so great with me that I am >sometimes reluctant to step beyond it. I think this is one of my >greatest challenges. It has become very clear to me why Nisargadatta >speaks so often of earnestness and of not taking on new ventures. The >spiritual work is so easily thrown off by the mind's interests and >preoccupations. But is also flourishes so easily when there is >earnestness and focus. > >What are your (all) experiences with this and how do you resolve this >issue? > >David > _______________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 25, 2001 Report Share Posted February 25, 2001 Hiya David, A somewhat old post, even though only 2 days old. You raise some interesting questions. My two bits......... - <truthseeker <Nisargadatta > Saturday, February 24, 2001 04:44 AM The Fall (Elizabeth) > I've been popping in and out of this group for about a month now > reading the posts but never posting myself. What seems very unique > about this group is that they so often refrain from writing personal > notes and more often than not just quote one of the great teachers. > That to me shows great humility and also that real practice is > happening. It could also be, that no movement has yet taken place in the individual concerned. You know, when you don't have it to flaunt, you can always fake it, by quoting.<g> > My name is David and I will break this tradition simply because the > Maharaj's teachings are not the only reason I come to this group. I > also come for social interaction around his teachings. Why don't we > spend some time talking about the trials in our own lives of trying > to live what Ramana Maharshi or Nisargadatta speak about? Indeed, that's where the real test of apperception or mere intellectual masturbation lies. > About a > year ago I came upon these great sages: first Ramana then > Nisargadatta. I instantly recognized their teachings as the vehicle I > had been searching for to find the truth of myself. They were direct, > they did not preach seperation from the world, they integrated their > practice with life, and they stayed away from quoting holy books and > becoming lost in traditions and rituals. I especially identified with > Nisargadatta. When I read him it is as though every word is precious. > I have tried to underline the key passages, but it seems that I could > underline the entire book (I Am That). Much of what resonates with me > about him is his cutting to the point and at the same time his gentle > and loving urging of us. I'm sure the fact that he lived so recently > also helps in his communication with me. Yeah that dude was a dude. > I've become pretty good at coming back to the " I am " throughout the > day. It has greatly helped my meditation periods too. They have a > stillness that was never there before. Also, I actually hunger for my > meditation sessions which is definitely new. Of course the spiritual > life goes in cycles. Recently my mind has become very caught up in > career plans. It is so interested in its thoughts that it doesn't > want to rest in the " I am. " The mind cannot rest in 'IAM " . That is not it's nature. It will use a new terminology it comes across viz " IAM " , play with it, experience maybe some esoteric stuff, and then will move on to something else, something new. That is it's nature. > That is why the Maharaj's words about the > fall: " accepting experiences as the truth, it gets more and more > involved... " resonated with me so much. The pleasure in thinking and > weaving a world of experiences is so great with me that I am > sometimes reluctant to step beyond it. Who is " pleasuring " in thinking and weaving around experiences? Who is experiencing these pleasurable stuff? Who is sometimes reluctant to step beyond it? > I think this is one of my > greatest challenges. It has become very clear to me why Nisargadatta > speaks so often of earnestness and of not taking on new ventures. The > spiritual work is so easily thrown off by the mind's interests and > preoccupations. That would be true, if there is a dichotomy between so called spiritual work and minds' interest and pre-occupations. Can there be spiritualism in the very mind's interest and pre-occupations? Can one make love next to the altar and meditate in a whore-house? > But is also flourishes so easily when there is > earnestness and focus. Who is to be earnest? Who is to be focussed? > What are your (all) experiences with this and how do you resolve this > issue? The apperception that there is nothing to resolve. When the mind lusts after that nude blonde, that is noted, when the mind lusts after the experience of " IAM " that is noted. Recalling a great sex therapist simple treatment to patients with the most esoteric and complex sexual problems. He used to tell his patients " It is simple. When you are hot you are hot, when you are not, you are not " Reminds me...... Ta Hui's fame as a enlightened Master grew to such proportions, that he was given the name of " Buddha Sun " as a sign of imperial honour in China. Ta Hui dies in 1163 AD and just before he dies, he is asked by his disciples to compose a verse. He does and dies immediately after uttering these words: Birth is thus Death is thus Verse or no verse What's the fuss? Yes, David, what's the fuss.<s> Cheers Sandeep Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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