Guest guest Posted July 16, 2002 Report Share Posted July 16, 2002 Dear Kirsten I feel there is a misconception here about advaita. Advaita is the state of one's Real Self. It cannot be practised because it is our Self and it is eternal. But, our ego or body-consciousness is the covering. This covering is temproal. In fact, time is the product of ego. When Sri Bhagawan was speaking, He spoke as the Self. He had no body-consciousness. So was Maharaj. What they speak is known as 'Ajata Siddhanta'. It is the speech of the unborn. Karma and reincarnation do not exist for such jnanis. But, ordinary people overpowered by body-consciousness can not realise this easily. Because, the ego interferes and obscures the perception of the ever-present Self. Yet, even the ignorant abide happily in deep sleep without body-consciousness. And, they remain unawares in the deep dreamless sleep state. Even in the dream state, they are only partly aware and partly in control. So, once the waking state overtakes and the identification with the waking physical body comes about in the waking state, one must begin the Self-Enquiry. Gradually this self-inquiry will become subconscious and will lead one into the Self. Gradually, the difference between the waking, dream and sleep states will subside. And, the ever-present Self will be revealed with the subsidence and dissolution of the ego. When Sri Bhagawan was speaking to some people about performing the sadhana of Self-Enquiry or Japa etc. he was speaking from their point of view. And, such speech is called 'Vivarta Siddhanta'. Karma and reincarnation do exist for these ordinary people. Only the one whom the waking body-consciousness overtakes must do the sadhana of Self-Enquiry. And, not the other who sees Himself as the One undivided Supreme Self. I hope this clarifies. Thanks and kind regards RK Shankar > I have read numerous books yet still this question about the necessity of sadhana remains. > why Sri Ramana Maharshi recommended that a person practice sadhana > many people who practiced sadhana are still identified with being a body-mind entity > If sadhana doesn't lead to disidentification in this life > Any insights! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2002 Report Share Posted July 16, 2002 > I feel there is a misconception here about advaita. > Advaita is the state of one's Real Self. This is all there is. > It cannot be practised because it is our Self and it is eternal. > But, our ego or body-consciousness is the covering. Now you have put a covering on all there is. How did you manage to do that? Did you step outside of all there is and then cover it? What kind of magic did you employ? > This covering is temproal. In fact, time is the product of ego. How can ego produce something, unless it exists as an independent entity? If it exists as an independent entity, how did something separate from all that is? > When Sri Bhagawan was speaking, He spoke as the Self. > He had no body-consciousness. So was Maharaj. > What they speak is known as 'Ajata Siddhanta'. > It is the speech of the unborn. Karma and reincarnation do not exist for > such jnanis. > > But, ordinary people overpowered by body-consciousness can not realise this > easily. You start with Self. But now you have split it in so many ways. Now it has been covered, it has been divided into ordinary and nonordinary, and it can have one kind of consciousness or another kind. This splitting of the unsplittable is quite a feat! > Because, the ego interferes and obscures the perception of the ever- present > Self. If it is everpresent, nothing interferes. If something interferes with its presence, it is not everpresent. > Yet, even the ignorant abide happily in deep sleep without > body-consciousness. > And, they remain unawares in the deep dreamless sleep state. > Even in the dream state, they are only partly aware and partly in control. > So, once the waking state overtakes and the identification with the waking > physical body > comes about in the waking state, one must begin the Self-Enquiry. > Gradually this self-inquiry will become subconscious and will lead one into > the Self. > Gradually, the difference between the waking, dream and sleep states will > subside. > And, the ever-present Self will be revealed with the subsidence and > dissolution of the ego. > > When Sri Bhagawan was speaking to some people about performing the sadhana > of > Self-Enquiry or Japa etc. he was speaking from their point of view. > And, such speech is called 'Vivarta Siddhanta'. > Karma and reincarnation do exist for these ordinary people. > > Only the one whom the waking body-consciousness overtakes must do the > sadhana of Self-Enquiry. > And, not the other who sees Himself as the One undivided Supreme Self. > I hope this clarifies. Clarity alone is. Disruptions of clarity are only possible if there is something apart, which can disrupt what is clear. You have made One, into one and another. That simply allows concepts about divisionless being, being divided. > Thanks and kind regards > RK Shankar And kind regards to you, too, as you are all that is. Blessed be, All that is Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2002 Report Share Posted July 16, 2002 Dear Dan, Shankar, By tussling , fencing and slinging , you do nothing but reveal your biases, conditioning and prejudices. based on your respective accumulated experiences. So its only entertainment, no utility to it! It's wonderful entertainment though, so no contradictions in regard to the Jedi battle-discussions we've fought ,Dan!:-). Happy slinging and namastes garnished with hot Indian spices, ---- Anand. > I feel there is a misconception here about advaita. > Advaita is the state of one's Real Self. This is all there is. > It cannot be practised because it is our Self and it is eternal. > But, our ego or body-consciousness is the covering. Now you have put a covering on all there is. How did you manage to do that? Did you step outside of all there is and then cover it? What kind of magic did you employ? > This covering is temproal. In fact, time is the product of ego. How can ego produce something, unless it exists as an independent entity? If it exists as an independent entity, how did something separate from all that is? > When Sri Bhagawan was speaking, He spoke as the Self. > He had no body-consciousness. So was Maharaj. > What they speak is known as 'Ajata Siddhanta'. > It is the speech of the unborn. Karma and reincarnation do not exist for > such jnanis. > > But, ordinary people overpowered by body-consciousness can not realise this > easily. You start with Self. But now you have split it in so many ways. Now it has been covered, it has been divided into ordinary and nonordinary, and it can have one kind of consciousness or another kind. This splitting of the unsplittable is quite a feat! > Because, the ego interferes and obscures the perception of the ever- present > Self. If it is everpresent, nothing interferes. If something interferes with its presence, it is not everpresent. > Yet, even the ignorant abide happily in deep sleep without > body-consciousness. > And, they remain unawares in the deep dreamless sleep state. > Even in the dream state, they are only partly aware and partly in control. > So, once the waking state overtakes and the identification with the waking > physical body > comes about in the waking state, one must begin the Self-Enquiry. > Gradually this self-inquiry will become subconscious and will lead one into > the Self. > Gradually, the difference between the waking, dream and sleep states will > subside. > And, the ever-present Self will be revealed with the subsidence and > dissolution of the ego. > > When Sri Bhagawan was speaking to some people about performing the sadhana > of > Self-Enquiry or Japa etc. he was speaking from their point of view. > And, such speech is called 'Vivarta Siddhanta'. > Karma and reincarnation do exist for these ordinary people. > > Only the one whom the waking body-consciousness overtakes must do the > sadhana of Self-Enquiry. > And, not the other who sees Himself as the One undivided Supreme Self. > I hope this clarifies. Clarity alone is. Disruptions of clarity are only possible if there is something apart, which can disrupt what is clear. You have made One, into one and another. That simply allows concepts about divisionless being, being divided. > Thanks and kind regards > RK Shankar And kind regards to you, too, as you are all that is. Blessed be, All that is ______________________ Want to sell your car? advertise on Autos Classifieds. It's Free!! visit http://in.autos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2002 Report Share Posted July 16, 2002 Hi Anand, > Dear Dan, Shankar, > > By tussling , fencing and slinging , you do nothing > but reveal your biases, conditioning and prejudices. > based on your respective accumulated experiences. So why are you bothering to get yourself so muddy? > > So its only entertainment, no utility to it! It's the joke of the century! In fact, it is the century! > > It's wonderful entertainment though, so no > contradictions in regard to the Jedi > battle-discussions we've fought ,Dan!:-). It's like a see-through nightgown. It's fun seeing through it, it's fun seeing it, and it's fun not seeing it! > Happy slinging and namastes garnished with hot Indian > spices, Hot pastrami namastes, garnished with rocket fuel, Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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