Guest guest Posted March 13, 2003 Report Share Posted March 13, 2003 Larry, " The true 'acid test' of SR is in deep sleep - because in sleep the ego is not-experiencing/evaluating and there is therefore no opportunity for delusion. " Please go on and expand on this... Toby Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 14, 2003 Report Share Posted March 14, 2003 Firstly, take a dozen folks who have realized the Self, that is, they no longer identify with their body and mind, and these 30 could generate 30 different descriptions of their experience - mostly due to differenent understandings of their experience, and different phrases they might use to describe it (to themselves and to others). Secondly, we may have realized the Self, or are ripe and ready to do so, but because we accept a subset of the 30 or so explainations above, and therefore have a preconceived notion of what self- realization is - we don't accept our own self-realization because it doesn't conform to the subset we accept - even when the Self is most apparent. That is why Nisargata says " I Am " is as close as our next breath. Ironic isn't it - to think our own preconceived ideas of Self- Realization are the very 'thing' keeping us from it!!! Take witnessing of sleep. One would think that one would know what that is - how could I miss that!!! BUT THINK FOR A MOMENT - WHO IS THERE TO RECOGNIZE THAT WITNESSING. Are you expecting thoughts like " WOW, I Am Witnessing Sleep " Witnessing is not thought-based, so if you are have the thought " I am witnessing sleep " - you are not witnessing sleep - because in sleep the ego is out like a light. So what is witnessing sleep? Remember - 30 people could give 30 different answers but it could be described as a 'continuous awareness' or a sense of 'not going away' or you may notice the process of ego falling asleep (or ego waking up) as in thoughts get farther apart, more random - feeling inertia or heaviness of mind/body, then awareness only . . . Larry Nisargadatta , " toby20042004 " <toby.wilson@t...> wrote: > Larry, > > " The true 'acid test' of SR is in deep sleep - because in sleep the > ego is not-experiencing/evaluating and there is therefore no > opportunity for delusion. " > > Please go on and expand on this... > > Toby Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 14, 2003 Report Share Posted March 14, 2003 Nisargadatta , " trem23 " <inmadison@h...> wrote: > Firstly, take a dozen folks who have realized the Self, that is, > they no longer identify with their body and mind, and these 30 could +++++++++++++++++++++ Woah---there partner! How many ? A dozen or thirty? .....Because 9 ouf ten agree that there has never been any agreement! That was almost a good koan! @ ;-) ))))Shawn ********************************** > generate 30 different descriptions of their experience - mostly due > to differenent understandings of their experience, and different > phrases they might use to describe it (to themselves and to others). > > Secondly, we may have realized the Self, or are ripe and ready to do > so, but because we accept a subset of the 30 or so explainations > above, and therefore have a preconceived notion of what self- > realization is - we don't accept our own self-realization because it > doesn't conform to the subset we accept - even when the Self is most > apparent. > > That is why Nisargata says " I Am " is as close as our next breath. > Ironic isn't it - to think our own preconceived ideas of Self- > Realization are the very 'thing' keeping us from it!!! > > Take witnessing of sleep. One would think that one would know what > that is - how could I miss that!!! BUT THINK FOR A MOMENT - WHO IS > THERE TO RECOGNIZE THAT WITNESSING. Are you expecting thoughts > like " WOW, I Am Witnessing Sleep " Witnessing is not thought-based, > so if you are have the thought " I am witnessing sleep " - you are not > witnessing sleep - because in sleep the ego is out like a light. > > So what is witnessing sleep? Remember - 30 people could give 30 > different answers but it could be described as a 'continuous > awareness' or a sense of 'not going away' or you may notice the > process of ego falling asleep (or ego waking up) as in thoughts get > farther apart, more random - feeling inertia or heaviness of > mind/body, then awareness only . . . > > Larry > > > Nisargadatta , " toby20042004 " > <toby.wilson@t...> wrote: > > Larry, > > > > " The true 'acid test' of SR is in deep sleep - because in sleep > the > > ego is not-experiencing/evaluating and there is therefore no > > opportunity for delusion. " > > > > Please go on and expand on this... > > > > Toby Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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