death and dying

[Guest guest]

Danielitosan,

 

 

a very nice read. Thank you.

 

> Such teachings are of no use.

 

sk: Yes, but are not completely absurd.

 

 

> Trying to bring a teaching with you into the unknown,

> is merely the activity called " anxiety about the

> unknown. "

 

sk: Incredible if we consider that, infact, the thing we know best is

the unknown. This anxiety has its function and it's burned in in our

most rudimental software. It begins nearly at the same time when an

infant recognize itself in the mirror and smiles toward the

reflection. This young life becomes a thing to be protected against

every possible jeopardy. Later even against the evidency of the

unshirkable. Strange that we celebrate with such a joy birth and have

to look, at least, serious at funerals. Rituals. The anxiety about

loneliness, a feeling of void, to be at the mercy of definite and

conclusive circumstances, anxiety about separation, and so on ar

interblended, too.

 

 

> That there is, in truth, no such thing as bringing

> a teaching with you, into " this, " might lead to

> laughter, or a sigh, who knows?

 

 

sk: Yes, the " absolute " teaches nothing but we try endlessly to teach

the " absolute " something we consider particulary smart. Expecting an

commendation or an acknowledgement. Since we don't get it from " the

other side " , a definite confirmation, we try to convince our

neighbours about the importance of our discoveries, despite the fact

that there is a prevailing doubt. The doubt diminishes all the more

adherents are captured and convinced. The rituals do the rest. At the

end only the ritual counts and has to be conserved. Reminds me of

Sandeeps 8 monkeys .

 

> That you have never separated, to be going through

> an experience of dying, for which you could require

> a teaching,...

 

sk: Yes. You have never been separeted form something and less than

ever from what you really constitute, the absolute.

 

 

 

skogelito

[Guest guest]

Hi Skogelito,

 

> a very nice read. Thank you.

 

Great, nice talking to you!

 

> > Such teachings are of no use.

>

> sk: Yes, but are not completely absurd.

 

True. They may be of some use, as long as there

is a mind to hold teachings.

 

> > Trying to bring a teaching with you into the unknown,

> > is merely the activity called " anxiety about the

> > unknown. "

>

> sk: Incredible if we consider that, infact, the thing we know best

is

> the unknown.

 

Yes, that's all we know. That's what constitutes the known:

this which we've never really known. But, of course, we kill

each other to prove we really do know something!

 

> This anxiety has its function and it's burned in in our

> most rudimental software.

 

Indeed, it is the function of the software -- to maintain

and continue a form.

 

> It begins nearly at the same time when an

> infant recognize itself in the mirror and smiles toward the

> reflection.

 

True. Which is a function of the software. It also includes,

even earlier, the differentiation of the difference when

the right hand touches the right leg, compared with someone

else touching the right leg.

 

Me and not-me is wired in, apparently.

 

> This young life becomes a thing to be protected against

> every possible jeopardy. Later even against the evidency of the

> unshirkable. Strange that we celebrate with such a joy birth and

have

> to look, at least, serious at funerals. Rituals.

 

Quite so. Also known as " life in time, " the duration of the

known, the entities that form and lose their relationships.

 

> The anxiety about

> loneliness, a feeling of void, to be at the mercy of definite and

> conclusive circumstances, anxiety about separation, and so on ar

> interblended, too.

 

Yes, anxiety about abandonment, about falling,

about being unsafe and unprotected.

The conmitent urge to care, to form community, to

have security.

 

> > That there is, in truth, no such thing as bringing

> > a teaching with you, into " this, " might lead to

> > laughter, or a sigh, who knows?

>

>

> sk: Yes, the " absolute " teaches nothing but we try endlessly to

teach

> the " absolute " something we consider particulary smart.

 

We are this attempt, to have ourself, as one who knows and

experiences.

 

In this " absolute " there is no absolute, no relative, just

" as is " -- and therefore, no way to have a hold.

 

The holding onto self isn't a real holding. It never was.

 

The attempt was only an avoidance of the inability to ever

have a position in the first place, from which to gain a hold.

 

" Wired in " perhaps -- only when there never was a thing or being

there in the first place, to have the wiring, what kind of

wiring is that?

 

The wiring is only understood retrospectively, looking back

and analyzing what is going on and why.

 

But that looking back and analyzing always requires an

illusion, a way to place a looker, and something to look at.

 

So, the rituals evolve, which help cement the illusion as

a reality, to confirm that real beings have their positions,

which they get to keep for awhile. :-)

 

Expecting an

> commendation or an acknowledgement. Since we don't get it from " the

> other side " , a definite confirmation,

 

Indeed -- all we get is disconfirmation. Not easy to take.

Only one who really wants the truth above all else will find this --

otherwise, there is nothing in it for " me. "

Just disconfirmation of every aspect of the attempt to have

me and keep ahold.

 

So, many will opt for " spirituality " instead -- a nice way to

keep " me " going, while I experience all kinds of wonderful

things, confirming me as a spiritual being! :-)

 

we try to convince our

> neighbours about the importance of our discoveries, despite the

fact

> that there is a prevailing doubt. The doubt diminishes all the more

> adherents are captured and convinced. The rituals do the rest. At

the

> end only the ritual counts and has to be conserved. Reminds me of

> Sandeeps 8 monkeys .

 

There would have to really be a monkey there in the first place,

with an ability to observe really existing other monkeys

and what they know and do. But, if there were no other,

this would be very, very difficult!

 

> > That you have never separated, to be going through

> > an experience of dying, for which you could require

> > a teaching,...

 

> sk: Yes. You have never been separeted form something and less than

> ever from what you really constitute, the absolute.

 

Unfortunately, " I " will never be able to know this!

 

So, in the meantime, " I " will continue to live out my

life as imagining it to be taking place, experientially.

 

" I " have no choice, because this is all that I can ever

be -- and this apparent life can never be held, isn't

taking place somewhere other than in a self-confirming loop,

call it " wiring " if you wish -- wiring to confirm an

ongoing existence " as if " --

and the loop necessarily dissolves, as there isn't the

personal infinite energy resources needed to keep it going

indefinitely! Thank God. :-)

 

-- Danielitosan

[Guest guest]

> yes danielito, this, probably what i'm saying, " the anxiety of the

> unknown " or " what is burdening the pristine " right now, it has a

> color, a shape, a weight, that could be seen just at the hinge

> between two " moments " ...falling asleep

> i mean, of course this inbetween is it.

> some mass of me is in charge for three seconds, then another mass

> takes over, a silly feeling of persistant burdening can be felt

> bridging the two moments,...?

> very strange

> and this burdening would not even require attention, and have a

life

> of its own?

> weird

 

Hi Eric --

 

The 'life of its own' depends on avoidance.

 

Ignoring that nothing is actually being continued

of itself.

 

Now, that's really weird.

 

To be incarnated as a being, among a tribe of beings,

that have lives only by inheriting a conditioned

avoidance of " what is. "

 

Weirdly,

Dan