Guest guest Posted July 29, 2004 Report Share Posted July 29, 2004 You have heard the rallying cry often enough all over these lists, " stay in the now. " " Be pure awareness. " I seriously doubt that a thing such as a NOW, a human could stay in even exists. A now vanishes so fast. Could the NOW be defined as a single act of awareness? And how long does that take, 350 milliseconds? Could that mean anything without memory? What could you do with that, or with pure awareness without memory? Without memory you are nothing, just a breathing celery stalk. People who have lost their short memory function due to injury, stroke, or senility can't even brush their teeth or feed themselves. They take a bite and forget about the food. They wander away from the table attracted by the thought of doing something somewhere else and forget what that was before they get there. You are the memory of yourself, and the only now memory can hold, is a remembered now. Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 29, 2004 Report Share Posted July 29, 2004 Nisargadatta , " cerosoul " <Pedsie2@a...> wrote: > You have heard the rallying cry often enough all over these > lists, " stay in the now. " " Be pure awareness. " I seriously doubt that > a thing such as a NOW, a human could stay in even exists. A now > vanishes so fast. Could the NOW be defined as a single act of > awareness? And how long does that take, 350 milliseconds? > Could that mean anything without memory? What could you do > with that, or with pure awareness without memory? Without > memory you are nothing, just a breathing celery stalk. > > People who have lost their short memory function due to injury, > stroke, or senility can't even brush their teeth or feed themselves. > They take a bite and forget about the food. They wander away > from the table attracted by the thought of doing something > somewhere else and forget what that was before they get there. > > You are the memory of yourself, and the only now memory can > hold, is a remembered now. > > Pete The real shock comes when we begin to realize that our memories are not the real thing, that our memories are dead and shallow, and only seem to have a life because the ego plays them like a movie: " look, " the ego says, " look how nice memories you have, I can make them come alive for you, I really can, I can paint your memories in your mind so that they may seem to be like real life happening now " . Then you see the trick of the ego, and you begin to see that your memories are not real life at all. Then you feel empty (this is also an ego trick: to feel empty), and the ego says: " look, I can create a future for you, I can use your memories and predict a future for you, I can give you something to dream about, real hopes " . Now you really are beginning to become depressed. Shallow past, shallow future, and an empty now. At this point the Deep Now may begin to dawn upon you. Then the days of your ego are counted. /AL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 29, 2004 Report Share Posted July 29, 2004 Hi Pete, Let me add to that bullshit: Ramana Maharshi once stated that this idea that saints or realized ones have no ego is nonsense. His ego too sometimes appears but he just doesn't care if that happens. Werner Nisargadatta , " cerosoul " <Pedsie2@a...> wrote: > You have heard the rallying cry often enough all over these > lists, " stay in the now. " " Be pure awareness. " I seriously doubt that > a thing such as a NOW, a human could stay in even exists. A now > vanishes so fast. Could the NOW be defined as a single act of > awareness? And how long does that take, 350 milliseconds? > Could that mean anything without memory? What could you do > with that, or with pure awareness without memory? Without > memory you are nothing, just a breathing celery stalk. > > People who have lost their short memory function due to injury, > stroke, or senility can't even brush their teeth or feed themselves. > They take a bite and forget about the food. They wander away > from the table attracted by the thought of doing something > somewhere else and forget what that was before they get there. > > You are the memory of yourself, and the only now memory can > hold, is a remembered now. > > Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 29, 2004 Report Share Posted July 29, 2004 Hi again, > Ramana Maharshi once stated that this idea that saints or realized > ones have no ego is nonsense> Yes, every '''''realized person''''' *still* has an ego. His ego too sometimes appears but he > just doesn't care if that happens> His *ego* or what we call ME Ramana Maharshi is the thing that doesn't care so it really is a contradiction in terms to say that HE doesn't care. This is the problem of language. Neither is it accurate to say 'Ramana Maharshi' is not his ego! Even saying Ramana Maharshi realized he is not what we call ME is not correct and contradictory. Kind Regards, Scott. > > Werner > > Nisargadatta , " cerosoul " <Pedsie2@a...> wrote: > > You have heard the rallying cry often enough all over these > > lists, " stay in the now. " " Be pure awareness. " I seriously doubt > that > > a thing such as a NOW, a human could stay in even exists. A now > > vanishes so fast. Could the NOW be defined as a single act of > > awareness? And how long does that take, 350 milliseconds? > > Could that mean anything without memory? What could you do > > with that, or with pure awareness without memory? Without > > memory you are nothing, just a breathing celery stalk. > > > > People who have lost their short memory function due to injury, > > stroke, or senility can't even brush their teeth or feed themselves. > > They take a bite and forget about the food. They wander away > > from the table attracted by the thought of doing something > > somewhere else and forget what that was before they get there. > > > > You are the memory of yourself, and the only now memory can > > hold, is a remembered now. > > > > Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 29, 2004 Report Share Posted July 29, 2004 A millisecond takes place *in* time, Now does not. Now is not a memory. Consider *aliveness*. A " thing " can be alive, but no thing can have *aliveness*. Aliveness is, it simply is. The mind cannot *grasp* aliveness. And yet the twinkling vitality of the moment is evident. And Now is simply aliveness. From the vantagepoint of time aliveness cannot be known. In the meanderings of the mind aliveness cannot be known. It is like *really hearing* a bird song. You have to sssuhh! You must become utterly still, suspended... to *really* hear a bird song. So it is with aliveness/Now... only when all is suspended, given up, is aliveness/Now realized. Bill - cerosoul Nisargadatta Thursday, July 29, 2004 9:52 AM Bullshit Now You have heard the rallying cry often enough all over these lists, " stay in the now. " " Be pure awareness. " I seriously doubt that a thing such as a NOW, a human could stay in even exists. A now vanishes so fast. Could the NOW be defined as a single act of awareness? And how long does that take, 350 milliseconds? Could that mean anything without memory? What could you do with that, or with pure awareness without memory? Without memory you are nothing, just a breathing celery stalk. People who have lost their short memory function due to injury, stroke, or senility can't even brush their teeth or feed themselves. They take a bite and forget about the food. They wander away from the table attracted by the thought of doing something somewhere else and forget what that was before they get there. You are the memory of yourself, and the only now memory can hold, is a remembered now. Pete ** If you do not wish to receive individual emails, to change your subscription, sign in with your ID and go to Edit My Groups: /mygroups?edit=1 Under the Message Delivery option, choose " No Email " for the Nisargadatta group and click on Save Changes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 29, 2004 Report Share Posted July 29, 2004 Hi, > A millisecond takes place *in* time, Now does not. Yes. >Now is not a memory. Yes. > Consider *aliveness*. Consider *alive no-thingness* > A " thing " can be alive, but no thing can have *aliveness*. Yes, that is one way of putting this down, another is that objects have no self nature as the Buddhists state or that no object is conscious / aware. Phenomenon are DE-void of self. > Aliveness is, it simply is. Is *NOT* ( a thing ), cannot be spoken of as a thing, except as concept. > The mind cannot *grasp* aliveness. Yes, the mind is an object, a phenomenon as are all concepts and beliefs, no matter how subtle or gross. > From the vantagepoint of time aliveness cannot be known. Cannot be *known* through time bound perception. > In the meanderings of the mind aliveness cannot be known> You cannot intellectualize about the nature of 'God' yes. > So it is with aliveness/Now... only when all is > suspended, given up, is aliveness/Now realized. Surrendered,.. *accepted*... So long as there is a knower and an object to be known or 'figured out' '*you*' have not seen God. Kind Regards, Scott. > > Bill > > > > - > cerosoul > Nisargadatta > Thursday, July 29, 2004 9:52 AM > Bullshit Now > > > You have heard the rallying cry often enough all over these > lists, " stay in the now. " " Be pure awareness. " I seriously doubt that > a thing such as a NOW, a human could stay in even exists. A now > vanishes so fast. Could the NOW be defined as a single act of > awareness? And how long does that take, 350 milliseconds? > Could that mean anything without memory? What could you do > with that, or with pure awareness without memory? Without > memory you are nothing, just a breathing celery stalk. > > People who have lost their short memory function due to injury, > stroke, or senility can't even brush their teeth or feed themselves. > They take a bite and forget about the food. They wander away > from the table attracted by the thought of doing something > somewhere else and forget what that was before they get there. > > You are the memory of yourself, and the only now memory can > hold, is a remembered now. > > Pete > > > > ** > > If you do not wish to receive individual emails, to change your subscription, sign in with your ID and go to Edit My Groups: > > /mygroups?edit=1 > > Under the Message Delivery option, choose " No Email " for the Nisargadatta group and click on Save Changes. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 30, 2004 Report Share Posted July 30, 2004 Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr@p...> wrote: > Hi Pete, > > Let me add to that bullshit: > > Ramana Maharshi once stated that this idea that saints or realized > ones have no ego is nonsense. His ego too sometimes appears but he > just doesn't care if that happens. > > Werner Hi Werner, Good to hear from you. As you know, one of the main steps in liberation is not to let words fool you. Words like 'now' and ego are treacherous because we tend to objectify them. An ego is a pattern of acquisition, rejection, defense, offence all aimed at protecting an illusory identity. When that illusion is seen thru, the pattern dissolves. Yes, a realized being will acquire, reject, get angry on occassion, but an enduring pattern aimed at protecting an identity is no longer there. Pete > > Nisargadatta , " cerosoul " <Pedsie2@a...> wrote: > > You have heard the rallying cry often enough all over these > > lists, " stay in the now. " " Be pure awareness. " I seriously doubt > that > > a thing such as a NOW, a human could stay in even exists. A now > > vanishes so fast. Could the NOW be defined as a single act of > > awareness? And how long does that take, 350 milliseconds? > > Could that mean anything without memory? What could you do > > with that, or with pure awareness without memory? Without > > memory you are nothing, just a breathing celery stalk. > > > > People who have lost their short memory function due to injury, > > stroke, or senility can't even brush their teeth or feed themselves. > > They take a bite and forget about the food. They wander away > > from the table attracted by the thought of doing something > > somewhere else and forget what that was before they get there. > > > > You are the memory of yourself, and the only now memory can > > hold, is a remembered now. > > > > Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 30, 2004 Report Share Posted July 30, 2004 Nisargadatta , " Bill Rishel " <plexus@a...> wrote: > A millisecond takes place *in* time, Now does not. > > Now is not a memory. > > Consider *aliveness*. > A " thing " can be alive, but no thing can have *aliveness*. > Aliveness is, it simply is. > > The mind cannot *grasp* aliveness. > And yet the twinkling vitality of the moment is evident. > > And Now is simply aliveness. > > From the vantagepoint of time aliveness cannot be known. > In the meanderings of the mind aliveness cannot be known. > It is like *really hearing* a bird song. > You have to sssuhh! > You must become utterly still, suspended... > to *really* hear a bird song. > > So it is with aliveness/Now... only when all is > suspended, given up, is aliveness/Now realized. > > Bill > > Bill, glad my bullshit flushed you out. It's been a few weeks since you regale us with your poetic insights. Welcome back! Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 30, 2004 Report Share Posted July 30, 2004 Thanks Pete. I've been pretty busy. Actually, I've started painting again, first time in 5 years. The images you have seen are scans of or composed from scans of paintings I did over 5 yrs ago. I'll still be pretty scarce on the lists as the painting continues. Bill - cerosoul Nisargadatta Friday, July 30, 2004 9:53 AM Re: Bullshit Now Nisargadatta , " Bill Rishel " <plexus@a...> wrote: > A millisecond takes place *in* time, Now does not. > > Now is not a memory. > > Consider *aliveness*. > A " thing " can be alive, but no thing can have *aliveness*. > Aliveness is, it simply is. > > The mind cannot *grasp* aliveness. > And yet the twinkling vitality of the moment is evident. > > And Now is simply aliveness. > > From the vantagepoint of time aliveness cannot be known. > In the meanderings of the mind aliveness cannot be known. > It is like *really hearing* a bird song. > You have to sssuhh! > You must become utterly still, suspended... > to *really* hear a bird song. > > So it is with aliveness/Now... only when all is > suspended, given up, is aliveness/Now realized. > > Bill > > Bill, glad my bullshit flushed you out. It's been a few weeks since you regale us with your poetic insights. Welcome back! Pete ** If you do not wish to receive individual emails, to change your subscription, sign in with your ID and go to Edit My Groups: /mygroups?edit=1 Under the Message Delivery option, choose " No Email " for the Nisargadatta group and click on Save Changes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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