Guest guest Posted February 8, 2005 Report Share Posted February 8, 2005 I found this description of nonduality on the web: http://www.francislucille.com/excerpt.html An excerpt from that page: " To learn not to expect. Not expecting is a great art. When you no longer live in expectation, you live in a new dimension. You are free. Your mind is free. Your body is free. To understand intellectually that we are not a psycho-physical entity in the process of becoming is a necessary first step, but this understanding is not sufficient. The fact that we are not the body must become an actual experience that penetrates and liberates our muscles, our internal organs and even our cells. An intellectual understanding that corresponds to a sudden, fleeting recognition of our true nature brings us a flash of pure joy, but when we have full knowledge that we are not the body, we are that joy. " -- Francis Lucille Can we tell if Francis Lucille is a real sage or not? /AL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2005 Report Share Posted February 8, 2005 Nisargadatta , " anders_lindman " <anders_lindman> wrote: > > I found this description of nonduality on the web: > > http://www.francislucille.com/excerpt.html > > An excerpt from that page: > > " To learn not to expect. so, nonduality can be learned? > Not expecting is a great art. so, nonduality is an art? When you no > longer live in expectation, you live in a new dimension. so, nonduality is a dimension? You are free. > Your mind is free. Your body is free. you, you, you... To understand intellectually > that we are not a psycho-physical entity in the process of becoming is > a necessary first step, but this understanding is not sufficient. so, there are steps to nonduality? The > fact that we are not the body must become an actual experience that > penetrates and liberates our muscles, our internal organs and even our > cells. An intellectual understanding that corresponds to a sudden, > fleeting recognition of our true nature so, a recognition of our true nature can come and go? brings us a flash of pure joy, > but when we have full knowledge that we are not the body, we are that > joy. " -- Francis Lucille joy is good, gimme joy... you got joy? it's so obvious Francis got joy. > Can we tell if Francis Lucille is a real sage or not? > > /AL let's say he is, how does that help me? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2005 Report Share Posted February 8, 2005 Nisargadatta , " dabo_now " <dscasta> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " anders_lindman " > <anders_lindman> wrote: > > > > I found this description of nonduality on the web: > > > > http://www.francislucille.com/excerpt.html > > > > An excerpt from that page: > > > > " To learn not to expect. > > > so, nonduality can be learned? If there is such thing as a state of the sage then there must be a transition from ego to sage, and that can be called learning. > > > > Not expecting is a great art. > > > so, nonduality is an art? He is perhaps describing the state of not expecting, not prescribing it. > > > When you no > > longer live in expectation, you live in a new dimension. > > > so, nonduality is a dimension? The word is not the thing. All that can be said is only in the form of pointers, poetic or not. > > > You are free. > > Your mind is free. Your body is free. > > > you, you, you... Who else is there? > > > To understand intellectually > > that we are not a psycho-physical entity in the process of becoming > is > > a necessary first step, but this understanding is not sufficient. > > > so, there are steps to nonduality? A transition is a kind of step (or steps). > > > The > > fact that we are not the body must become an actual experience that > > penetrates and liberates our muscles, our internal organs and even > our > > cells. An intellectual understanding that corresponds to a sudden, > > fleeting recognition of our true nature > > > so, a recognition of our true nature can come and go? He doesn't say that this recognition will go. > > > brings us a flash of pure joy, > > but when we have full knowledge that we are not the body, we are > that > > joy. " -- Francis Lucille > > > joy is good, gimme joy... you got joy? > > it's so obvious Francis got joy. > > > > Can we tell if Francis Lucille is a real sage or not? > > > > /AL > > > let's say he is, how does that help me? Maybe people who have found enlightenment can point in directions so that we can find it too more quickly. /AL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2005 Report Share Posted February 8, 2005 Nisargadatta , " dabo_now " <dscasta> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " anders_lindman " > <anders_lindman> wrote: > > > > I found this description of nonduality on the web: > > > > http://www.francislucille.com/excerpt.html > > > > An excerpt from that page: > > > > " To learn not to expect. > > > so, nonduality can be learned? > > > > Not expecting is a great art. > > > so, nonduality is an art? > > > When you no > > longer live in expectation, you live in a new dimension. > > > so, nonduality is a dimension? > > > You are free. > > Your mind is free. Your body is free. > > > you, you, you... > > > To understand intellectually > > that we are not a psycho-physical entity in the process of becoming > is > > a necessary first step, but this understanding is not sufficient. > > > so, there are steps to nonduality? > > > The > > fact that we are not the body must become an actual experience that > > penetrates and liberates our muscles, our internal organs and even > our > > cells. An intellectual understanding that corresponds to a sudden, > > fleeting recognition of our true nature > > > so, a recognition of our true nature can come and go? > > > brings us a flash of pure joy, > > but when we have full knowledge that we are not the body, we are > that > > joy. " -- Francis Lucille > > > joy is good, gimme joy... you got joy? > > it's so obvious Francis got joy. > > > > Can we tell if Francis Lucille is a real sage or not? > > > > /AL > > > let's say he is, how does that help me? Every one ......including every guru is in prison......... Every character in the dream.....received a life sentence.....with no possibility of parole.... toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2005 Report Share Posted February 8, 2005 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " dabo_now " <dscasta> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " anders_lindman " > > <anders_lindman> wrote: > > > > > > I found this description of nonduality on the web: > > > > > > http://www.francislucille.com/excerpt.html > > > > > > An excerpt from that page: > > > > > > " To learn not to expect. > > > > > > so, nonduality can be learned? > > > > > > > Not expecting is a great art. > > > > > > so, nonduality is an art? > > > > > > When you no > > > longer live in expectation, you live in a new dimension. > > > > > > so, nonduality is a dimension? > > > > > > You are free. > > > Your mind is free. Your body is free. > > > > > > you, you, you... > > > > > > To understand intellectually > > > that we are not a psycho-physical entity in the process of becoming > > is > > > a necessary first step, but this understanding is not sufficient. > > > > > > so, there are steps to nonduality? > > > > > > The > > > fact that we are not the body must become an actual experience that > > > penetrates and liberates our muscles, our internal organs and even > > our > > > cells. An intellectual understanding that corresponds to a sudden, > > > fleeting recognition of our true nature > > > > > > so, a recognition of our true nature can come and go? > > > > > > brings us a flash of pure joy, > > > but when we have full knowledge that we are not the body, we are > > that > > > joy. " -- Francis Lucille > > > > > > joy is good, gimme joy... you got joy? > > > > it's so obvious Francis got joy. > > > > > > > Can we tell if Francis Lucille is a real sage or not? > > > > > > /AL > > > > > > let's say he is, how does that help me? > > > > Every one ......including every guru is in prison......... > > Every character in the dream.....received a life sentence.....with no possibility of parole.... > > > toombaru " Non-duality is an experience in which there is no separation between subject and object; a " me " and the rest of the universe; a " me " and God. It is the experience of *consciousness*, our true nature, which reveals itself as absolute happiness, love and beauty. Consciousness is defined as that, whatever that is, which is aware of these very words right here, right now. " -- From Francis Lucille's web site. That sounds more like being free from the prison than still being in it. Maybe you are still in the prison and cannot see anything but the prison, and you dare not have a belief that there can be liberation, because what if there is no such thing as liberation. So you play it safe, while remaining trapped in the mental prison. /AL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2005 Report Share Posted February 8, 2005 Nisargadatta , " anders_lindman " <anders_lindman> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " dabo_now " <dscasta> wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " anders_lindman " > > > <anders_lindman> wrote: > > > > > > > > I found this description of nonduality on the web: > > > > > > > > http://www.francislucille.com/excerpt.html > > > > > > > > An excerpt from that page: > > > > > > > > " To learn not to expect. > > > > > > > > > so, nonduality can be learned? > > > > > > > > > > Not expecting is a great art. > > > > > > > > > so, nonduality is an art? > > > > > > > > > When you no > > > > longer live in expectation, you live in a new dimension. > > > > > > > > > so, nonduality is a dimension? > > > > > > > > > You are free. > > > > Your mind is free. Your body is free. > > > > > > > > > you, you, you... > > > > > > > > > To understand intellectually > > > > that we are not a psycho-physical entity in the process of becoming > > > is > > > > a necessary first step, but this understanding is not sufficient. > > > > > > > > > so, there are steps to nonduality? > > > > > > > > > The > > > > fact that we are not the body must become an actual experience that > > > > penetrates and liberates our muscles, our internal organs and even > > > our > > > > cells. An intellectual understanding that corresponds to a sudden, > > > > fleeting recognition of our true nature > > > > > > > > > so, a recognition of our true nature can come and go? > > > > > > > > > brings us a flash of pure joy, > > > > but when we have full knowledge that we are not the body, we are > > > that > > > > joy. " -- Francis Lucille > > > > > > > > > joy is good, gimme joy... you got joy? > > > > > > it's so obvious Francis got joy. > > > > > > > > > > Can we tell if Francis Lucille is a real sage or not? > > > > > > > > /AL > > > > > > > > > let's say he is, how does that help me? > > > > > > > > Every one ......including every guru is in prison......... > > > > Every character in the dream.....received a life sentence.....with > no possibility of parole.... > > > > > > toombaru > > " Non-duality is an experience in which there is no separation between > subject and object; a " me " and the rest of the universe; a " me " and > God. It is the experience of *consciousness*, our true nature, which > reveals itself as absolute happiness, love and beauty. Consciousness > is defined as that, whatever that is, which is aware of these very > words right here, right now. " -- From Francis Lucille's web site. To hell with Francis Lucille. He's just another delusional prisoner...trying to sell books. He shakes his bag of bones......throws them on the floor.......and a few prisoners gather around to be anointed with his interpretation of their pattern. You are not going to find This in the bone-bags of another............... toombaru > > That sounds more like being free from the prison than still being in > it. Maybe you are still in the prison and cannot see anything but the > prison, and you dare not have a belief that there can be liberation, > because what if there is no such thing as liberation. So you play it > safe, while remaining trapped in the mental prison. > > /AL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2005 Report Share Posted February 8, 2005 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " anders_lindman " <anders_lindman> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " dabo_now " <dscasta> wrote: > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " anders_lindman " > > > > <anders_lindman> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > I found this description of nonduality on the web: > > > > > > > > > > http://www.francislucille.com/excerpt.html > > > > > > > > > > An excerpt from that page: > > > > > > > > > > " To learn not to expect. > > > > > > > > > > > > so, nonduality can be learned? > > > > > > > > > > > > > Not expecting is a great art. > > > > > > > > > > > > so, nonduality is an art? > > > > > > > > > > > > When you no > > > > > longer live in expectation, you live in a new dimension. > > > > > > > > > > > > so, nonduality is a dimension? > > > > > > > > > > > > You are free. > > > > > Your mind is free. Your body is free. > > > > > > > > > > > > you, you, you... > > > > > > > > > > > > To understand intellectually > > > > > that we are not a psycho-physical entity in the process of becoming > > > > is > > > > > a necessary first step, but this understanding is not sufficient. > > > > > > > > > > > > so, there are steps to nonduality? > > > > > > > > > > > > The > > > > > fact that we are not the body must become an actual experience that > > > > > penetrates and liberates our muscles, our internal organs and even > > > > our > > > > > cells. An intellectual understanding that corresponds to a sudden, > > > > > fleeting recognition of our true nature > > > > > > > > > > > > so, a recognition of our true nature can come and go? > > > > > > > > > > > > brings us a flash of pure joy, > > > > > but when we have full knowledge that we are not the body, we are > > > > that > > > > > joy. " -- Francis Lucille > > > > > > > > > > > > joy is good, gimme joy... you got joy? > > > > > > > > it's so obvious Francis got joy. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Can we tell if Francis Lucille is a real sage or not? > > > > > > > > > > /AL > > > > > > > > > > > > let's say he is, how does that help me? > > > > > > > > > > > > Every one ......including every guru is in prison......... > > > > > > Every character in the dream.....received a life sentence.....with > > no possibility of parole.... > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > " Non-duality is an experience in which there is no separation between > > subject and object; a " me " and the rest of the universe; a " me " and > > God. It is the experience of *consciousness*, our true nature, which > > reveals itself as absolute happiness, love and beauty. Consciousness > > is defined as that, whatever that is, which is aware of these very > > words right here, right now. " -- From Francis Lucille's web site. > > > To hell with Francis Lucille. > > He's just another delusional prisoner...trying to sell books. > > He shakes his bag of bones......throws them on the floor.......and a few prisoners gather > around to be anointed with his interpretation of their pattern. > > > > You are not going to find This in the bone-bags of another............... > > > > toombaru > Hehe. Sorry for trying to push this sage onto you. I was just taking my own feelings and projected them onto you. I feel like I cannot trust any of the so-called sages, yet I am very curious to find out if they really are speaking the truth. And I have felt some opening up of my heart because of spiritual teachers, but nothing near the Oneness they are pointing to. /AL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2005 Report Share Posted February 8, 2005 Nisargadatta , " anders_lindman " <anders_lindman> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " anders_lindman " > <anders_lindman> wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> wrote: > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " dabo_now " <dscasta> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " anders_lindman " > > > > > <anders_lindman> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > I found this description of nonduality on the web: > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.francislucille.com/excerpt.html > > > > > > > > > > > > An excerpt from that page: > > > > > > > > > > > > " To learn not to expect. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so, nonduality can be learned? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Not expecting is a great art. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so, nonduality is an art? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When you no > > > > > > longer live in expectation, you live in a new dimension. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so, nonduality is a dimension? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You are free. > > > > > > Your mind is free. Your body is free. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you, you, you... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To understand intellectually > > > > > > that we are not a psycho-physical entity in the process of > becoming > > > > > is > > > > > > a necessary first step, but this understanding is not > sufficient. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so, there are steps to nonduality? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The > > > > > > fact that we are not the body must become an actual > experience that > > > > > > penetrates and liberates our muscles, our internal organs > and even > > > > > our > > > > > > cells. An intellectual understanding that corresponds to a > sudden, > > > > > > fleeting recognition of our true nature > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so, a recognition of our true nature can come and go? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > brings us a flash of pure joy, > > > > > > but when we have full knowledge that we are not the body, we > are > > > > > that > > > > > > joy. " -- Francis Lucille > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > joy is good, gimme joy... you got joy? > > > > > > > > > > it's so obvious Francis got joy. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Can we tell if Francis Lucille is a real sage or not? > > > > > > > > > > > > /AL > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > let's say he is, how does that help me? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Every one ......including every guru is in prison......... > > > > > > > > Every character in the dream.....received a life sentence.....with > > > no possibility of parole.... > > > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > " Non-duality is an experience in which there is no separation between > > > subject and object; a " me " and the rest of the universe; a " me " and > > > God. It is the experience of *consciousness*, our true nature, which > > > reveals itself as absolute happiness, love and beauty. Consciousness > > > is defined as that, whatever that is, which is aware of these very > > > words right here, right now. " -- From Francis Lucille's web site. > > > > > > To hell with Francis Lucille. > > > > He's just another delusional prisoner...trying to sell books. > > > > He shakes his bag of bones......throws them on the floor.......and a > few prisoners gather > > around to be anointed with his interpretation of their pattern. > > > > > > > > You are not going to find This in the bone-bags of > another............... > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > Hehe. Sorry for trying to push this sage onto you. I was just taking > my own feelings and projected them onto you. I feel like I cannot > trust any of the so-called sages, yet I am very curious to find out if > they really are speaking the truth. And I have felt some opening up of > my heart because of spiritual teachers, but nothing near the Oneness > they are pointing to. > > /AL As long as the " you " is in present....the " Oneness " isn't. t. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2005 Report Share Posted February 8, 2005 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " anders_lindman " <anders_lindman> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " anders_lindman " > > <anders_lindman> wrote: > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " dabo_now " <dscasta> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " anders_lindman " > > > > > > <anders_lindman> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I found this description of nonduality on the web: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.francislucille.com/excerpt.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > An excerpt from that page: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " To learn not to expect. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so, nonduality can be learned? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Not expecting is a great art. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so, nonduality is an art? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When you no > > > > > > > longer live in expectation, you live in a new dimension. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so, nonduality is a dimension? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > You are free. > > > > > > > Your mind is free. Your body is free. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you, you, you... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To understand intellectually > > > > > > > that we are not a psycho-physical entity in the process of > > becoming > > > > > > is > > > > > > > a necessary first step, but this understanding is not > > sufficient. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so, there are steps to nonduality? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The > > > > > > > fact that we are not the body must become an actual > > experience that > > > > > > > penetrates and liberates our muscles, our internal organs > > and even > > > > > > our > > > > > > > cells. An intellectual understanding that corresponds to a > > sudden, > > > > > > > fleeting recognition of our true nature > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so, a recognition of our true nature can come and go? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > brings us a flash of pure joy, > > > > > > > but when we have full knowledge that we are not the body, we > > are > > > > > > that > > > > > > > joy. " -- Francis Lucille > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > joy is good, gimme joy... you got joy? > > > > > > > > > > > > it's so obvious Francis got joy. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Can we tell if Francis Lucille is a real sage or not? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > /AL > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > let's say he is, how does that help me? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Every one ......including every guru is in prison......... > > > > > > > > > > Every character in the dream.....received a life sentence.....with > > > > no possibility of parole.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > > " Non-duality is an experience in which there is no separation between > > > > subject and object; a " me " and the rest of the universe; a " me " and > > > > God. It is the experience of *consciousness*, our true nature, which > > > > reveals itself as absolute happiness, love and beauty. Consciousness > > > > is defined as that, whatever that is, which is aware of these very > > > > words right here, right now. " -- From Francis Lucille's web site. > > > > > > > > > To hell with Francis Lucille. > > > > > > He's just another delusional prisoner...trying to sell books. > > > > > > He shakes his bag of bones......throws them on the floor.......and a > > few prisoners gather > > > around to be anointed with his interpretation of their pattern. > > > > > > > > > > > > You are not going to find This in the bone-bags of > > another............... > > > > > > > > > > > > toombaru > > > > > > > Hehe. Sorry for trying to push this sage onto you. I was just taking > > my own feelings and projected them onto you. I feel like I cannot > > trust any of the so-called sages, yet I am very curious to find out if > > they really are speaking the truth. And I have felt some opening up of > > my heart because of spiritual teachers, but nothing near the Oneness > > they are pointing to. > > > > /AL > > > > As long as the " you " is in present....the " Oneness " isn't. > It is the shadow....in search of the sun. > t. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2005 Report Share Posted February 8, 2005 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> wrote: > > .... > > > > > > As long as the " you " is in present....the " Oneness " isn't. > > > > It is the shadow....in search of the sun. > > > > > t. Good metaphor. I feel like the shadow is memories and the sun awareness. /AL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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