Guest guest Posted February 10, 2005 Report Share Posted February 10, 2005 [......] > > Thank you, Kenji ! > > This passage was by Tolle. I just posted it here. > > Did you think, it was by me or are simply interested in discussing it with `me' in particular. > > With warm regards, > ac. Tolle ============ " Choice implies consciousness - a high degree of consciousness. Without it, I have no choice. Choice begins the moment I dis-identify from my mind and its conditioned patterns, the moment I become Self-present. Until I reach that point, I'm unconscious, spiritually speaking. This means that I'm compelled to think, feel, and act in certain ways according to the conditioning of my mind. Nobody consciously chooses dis-function, conflict, and pain. Nobody chooses insanity. They happen because there isn't enough conscious Self-presence to dissolve the past, not enough light to dispel the darkness. I'm never fully here in the now because I'm either time binding with the past or the future. I have not quite woken up, meaning I'm not fully Self-conscious yet. In the meantime, my conditioned mind is running my life. As long as my mind (with its conditioned patterns) runs my life, what choice do I have? NONE! I'm not even there yet, and I won't be there until I become Self- conscious. THE MIND-IDENTIFIED STATE IS SEVERELY DIS-FUNCTIONAL. It is a form of socially acceptable insanity. Almost everyone is suffering from this illness in varying degrees. The moment I realize this, there can be no more resentment or guilt. How can I resent someone's illness or my own? If I'm primarily run by my mind, I will suffer the consequences of my mind identification, and I'll create further suffering for myself and my loved ones. I will bear the burden of fear, conflict, problems, and pain. The suffering that I'm creating is my mind's false attempt to make me feel safe by ignoring, denying, or repressing that which I'm experiencing. " =============== Kenji: ****************************** ** Arvind, this whole scenario was constructed by mind. Identification, disidentification, resentment, bondage, conditioning, patterns, etc.--all of it, including the sufferer of it and the supposed remedy, which you call " Self-present, higher consciousness. " Yet you speak of 'mind' as if it is something separate, something other than what it has manufactured. Is that a fact? Is that possible? Really, isn't it a mind-trick to keep the whole self- replicating, circular game going? Now there's another level of falsity--a me, an observer, a believer or disbeliever in the previous constructions/imaginings, an entity or process that can assess, struggle, try to realign it in accordance with spiritual teachings-- in a effort to get 'free' of it. The question is: can you be quick enough, alert enough to catch it as it's happening? Can you be fully that awareness that doesn't require bringing in anything from memory, in the form of teachings, knowledge or experience? Ken *************************** Assuming ( based on you addressing me by name ) that you wanted to discuss it with me. Here are some more criticism-provoking thoughts. Food for denigration, ...so to speak. So much anti- " neo-advaita " that it smell ... Surface and gross thought. Polluted ( polluted because they are trying to talk of un-manifested in terms of particular manifestations ) also potentially quite inflaming, controversial, very Unpopular, " Not Trendy " , " Not part of neo-advaita " , " not part of Ramesh and Wayne's propaganda machine and their followers " , extremely unlikely to appeal to Kenji, ...criticism and arguments attracting thoughts. # Nonduality ...what does that mean ? ...... .... .. I AM. There is ... NO ...separate Whole. I AM ...THE WHOLE. I AM ...THE GOD. God creates ...Everything. .. .... ...... I create ...Mind. I create ...thoughts. I create ...dreams. Tendencies, vassanas, cycles, conditioning, are ...ALL ...my Creations. .. .... ...... There is a Programming, .......but, I AM ...THE Programmer !!! Knowing THIS, ...gives you Freedom. Knowing this, ...gives you CHOICE. You have a control over the Next Moment ... ....it is ....WHAT ...you do this Moment ! You create your conditioning, cycle, dream, illusion, bondage, ...whatever you want to call it. .. .... ...... Nonduality, ---- There is ...NO ONE ....else ----- ....that programs `you'. .. .... ...... I AM ...NOT ...just Created, .....I AM THE CREATOR !@!! ######## PS: Arvind : Non-established, non-stabilizing, non-un-established, non- enlightened, non-non-enlightened, non-seeker, non-non-seeker, Non- delude, non-non-deluded, Defending, attacking, fighting, debating, identified, Non - Defending Non -attacking, Non - fighting, Non - debating, un-identified, separatist, non-separatist, ignorant, non-ignorant, jnani, ajnani, fearful, courageous, changing, eternal, confined, infinite, egoist, non-egoist, God, Devil, Deep, shallow, beginner, profound, broad, narrow, ... Creative, Unimaginative, Intelligent, dumb.... Original, copycat, bold, meek ... .. .... ...... Chose any label that suits your NEED and then let us FOCUS on with discussion of the " MATTER of Discussion " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 10, 2005 Report Share Posted February 10, 2005 [......] > > Thank you, Kenji ! > > This passage was by Tolle. I just posted it here. > > Did you think, it was by me or are simply interested in discussing it with `me' in particular. > > With warm regards, > ac. Tolle ============ " Choice implies consciousness - a high degree of consciousness. Without it, I have no choice. Choice begins the moment I dis-identify from my mind and its conditioned patterns, the moment I become Self-present. Until I reach that point, I'm unconscious, spiritually speaking. This means that I'm compelled to think, feel, and act in certain ways according to the conditioning of my mind. Nobody consciously chooses dis-function, conflict, and pain. Nobody chooses insanity. They happen because there isn't enough conscious Self-presence to dissolve the past, not enough light to dispel the darkness. I'm never fully here in the now because I'm either time binding with the past or the future. I have not quite woken up, meaning I'm not fully Self-conscious yet. In the meantime, my conditioned mind is running my life. As long as my mind (with its conditioned patterns) runs my life, what choice do I have? NONE! I'm not even there yet, and I won't be there until I become Self- conscious. THE MIND-IDENTIFIED STATE IS SEVERELY DIS-FUNCTIONAL. It is a form of socially acceptable insanity. Almost everyone is suffering from this illness in varying degrees. The moment I realize this, there can be no more resentment or guilt. How can I resent someone's illness or my own? If I'm primarily run by my mind, I will suffer the consequences of my mind identification, and I'll create further suffering for myself and my loved ones. I will bear the burden of fear, conflict, problems, and pain. The suffering that I'm creating is my mind's false attempt to make me feel safe by ignoring, denying, or repressing that which I'm experiencing. " =============== Kenji: ****************************** ** Arvind, this whole scenario was constructed by mind. Identification, disidentification, resentment, bondage, conditioning, patterns, etc.--all of it, including the sufferer of it and the supposed remedy, which you call " Self-present, higher consciousness. " Yet you speak of 'mind' as if it is something separate, something other than what it has manufactured. Is that a fact? Is that possible? Really, isn't it a mind-trick to keep the whole self- replicating, circular game going? Now there's another level of falsity--a me, an observer, a believer or disbeliever in the previous constructions/imaginings, an entity or process that can assess, struggle, try to realign it in accordance with spiritual teachings-- in a effort to get 'free' of it. The question is: can you be quick enough, alert enough to catch it as it's happening? Can you be fully that awareness that doesn't require bringing in anything from memory, in the form of teachings, knowledge or experience? Ken *************************** Assuming ( based on you addressing me by name ) that you wanted to discuss it with me. Here are some more criticism-provoking thoughts. Food for denigration, ...so to speak. So much anti- " neo-advaita " that it smell ... Surface and gross thought. Polluted ( polluted because they are trying to talk of un-manifested in terms of particular manifestations ) also potentially quite inflaming, controversial, very Unpopular, " Not Trendy " , " Not part of neo-advaita " , " not part of Ramesh and Wayne's propaganda machine and their followers " , extremely unlikely to appeal to Kenji, ...criticism and arguments attracting thoughts. # Nonduality ...what does that mean ? ...... .... .. I AM. There is ... NO ...separate Whole. I AM ...THE WHOLE. I AM ...THE GOD. God creates ...Everything. .. .... ...... I create ...Mind. I create ...thoughts. I create ...dreams. Tendencies, vassanas, cycles, conditioning, are ...ALL ...my Creations. .. .... ...... There is a Programming, .......but, I AM ...THE Programmer !!! Knowing THIS, ...gives you Freedom. Knowing this, ...gives you CHOICE. You have a control over the Next Moment ... ....it is ....WHAT ...you do this Moment ! You create your conditioning, cycle, dream, illusion, bondage, ...whatever you want to call it. .. .... ...... Nonduality, ---- There is ...NO ONE ....else ----- ....that programs `you'. .. .... ...... I AM ...NOT ...just Created, .....I AM THE CREATOR !@!! ######## PS: Arvind : Non-established, non-stabilizing, non-un-established, non- enlightened, non-non-enlightened, non-seeker, non-non-seeker, Non- delude, non-non-deluded, Defending, attacking, fighting, debating, identified, Non - Defending Non -attacking, Non - fighting, Non - debating, un-identified, separatist, non-separatist, ignorant, non-ignorant, jnani, ajnani, fearful, courageous, changing, eternal, confined, infinite, egoist, non-egoist, God, Devil, Deep, shallow, beginner, profound, broad, narrow, ... Creative, Unimaginative, Intelligent, dumb.... Original, copycat, bold, meek ... .. .... ...... Chose any label that suits your NEED and then let us FOCUS on with discussion of the " MATTER of Discussion " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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