Guest guest Posted February 10, 2005 Report Share Posted February 10, 2005 > But wouldn't it be great if one could live without the past. I don't > mean losing memories, but not to be guided by them all the time. I > feel like my memories are hanging over me like a heavy cloud. It's a > great burden. > > /AL -------------------------------- Past memories become heavy clouds if one holds them bound within regret and guilt. What do you regret? What do you have guilt about? Can you change the past? Can you make recompense for the past? Can you learn from the past? can your present be different from things learned or applied from the past? Can one put down a gun and use their brain to solve a problem thereby learning from millenia of past war-like behavior? could memories guide without being a dark cloud looming overhead? Or is one going to continue to repeat the past and keep picking up that gun rather than finding different solutions that don't perpetuate so much guilt and regret, sadness. Future becomes a heavy clouds too if one worries over it. Why worry over it? Fear to control? Fear of being out of control? Having no control? Wanting control? Wanting something different than it is? Not being able to accept what is here and now? What you are here and now? Always chasing after something that is past or future? Wanting something to change and be other than it is? ~G. ------- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 10, 2005 Report Share Posted February 10, 2005 Nisargadatta , " goldenrainbowrider " <laughterx8@h...> wrote: > > > But wouldn't it be great if one could live without the past. I > don't > > mean losing memories, but not to be guided by them all the time. I > > feel like my memories are hanging over me like a heavy cloud. It's > a > > great burden. > > > > /AL > -------------------------------- > > Past memories become heavy clouds if one holds them bound within > regret and guilt. > What do you regret? What do you have guilt about? > Can you change the past? Can you make recompense for the past? > Can you learn from the past? > can your present be different from things learned or applied from > the past? > Can one put down a gun and use their brain to solve a problem > thereby learning from millenia of past war-like behavior? > could memories guide without being a dark cloud looming overhead? > Or is one going to continue to repeat the past and keep picking up > that gun rather than finding different solutions that don't > perpetuate so much guilt and regret, sadness. > > Future becomes a heavy clouds too if one worries over it. > Why worry over it? > Fear to control? Fear of being out of control? > Having no control? Wanting control? > Wanting something different than it is? Not being able to accept > what is here and now? What you are here and now? Always chasing > after something that is past or future? Wanting something to change > and be other than it is? > > ~G. > > ------- Giving a perscription to someone to change what they think they are.....is not accepting what is. toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 10, 2005 Report Share Posted February 10, 2005 Nisargadatta , " goldenrainbowrider " <laughterx8@h...> wrote: > > > But wouldn't it be great if one could live without the past. I > don't > > mean losing memories, but not to be guided by them all the time. I > > feel like my memories are hanging over me like a heavy cloud. It's > a > > great burden. > > > > /AL That cloud appears right now. It has no past, no future, no substance. The apparent heaviness is a momentary arising. The whole thing is constructed in your mind. Looking into it, it disappears. Like they tell you when you're young and you dream of boogeymen -- go right up to that bugger and confront him -- he disappears! Regards, Joe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 10, 2005 Report Share Posted February 10, 2005 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " goldenrainbowrider " <laughterx8@h...> wrote: > > > > > But wouldn't it be great if one could live without the past. I > > don't > > > mean losing memories, but not to be guided by them all the time. I > > > feel like my memories are hanging over me like a heavy cloud. It's > > a > > > great burden. > > > > > > /AL > > -------------------------------- > > > > Past memories become heavy clouds if one holds them bound within > > regret and guilt. > > What do you regret? What do you have guilt about? > > Can you change the past? Can you make recompense for the past? > > Can you learn from the past? > > can your present be different from things learned or applied from > > the past? > > Can one put down a gun and use their brain to solve a problem > > thereby learning from millenia of past war-like behavior? > > could memories guide without being a dark cloud looming overhead? > > Or is one going to continue to repeat the past and keep picking up > > that gun rather than finding different solutions that don't > > perpetuate so much guilt and regret, sadness. > > > > Future becomes a heavy clouds too if one worries over it. > > Why worry over it? > > Fear to control? Fear of being out of control? > > Having no control? Wanting control? > > Wanting something different than it is? Not being able to accept > > what is here and now? What you are here and now? Always chasing > > after something that is past or future? Wanting something to change > > and be other than it is? > > > > ~G. > > > > ------- > > > > Giving a perscription to someone to change what they think they are.....is not accepting what is. > > > toombaru ----------------- Are questions a perscription? Or is it merely a way with which to see ignorance for what it is and thereby clarify or ease or disperse the ideas/thoughts/choices/ways producing the ignorance? However, for some ignorance is bliss yes? If you change what you think you are then you no longer are that. Or perhaps realize that you have no interest in " that " . Does change preclude acceptance? Must everything be separate one from another in your thinking processes -- even the notion of acceptance? One day you'll leave this body. You'll leave the human idea of physical life altogether. This involves a change of some sort or other. And an acceptance of that change. Not coming back involves a change. The two don't exclude each other -- separate from each other. That time is a long way ahead for you dear, you're still very intrigued with the art and act of separating it all. That's just fine. ~G. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 10, 2005 Report Share Posted February 10, 2005 Nisargadatta , " josesiem " <josesiem> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " goldenrainbowrider " > <laughterx8@h...> wrote: > > > > > But wouldn't it be great if one could live without the past. I > > don't > > > mean losing memories, but not to be guided by them all the time. > I > > > feel like my memories are hanging over me like a heavy cloud. > It's > > a > > > great burden. > > > > > > /AL > > That cloud appears right now. It has no past, no future, no > substance. The apparent heaviness is a momentary arising. The whole > thing is constructed in your mind. Looking into it, it disappears. > > Like they tell you when you're young and you dream of boogeymen -- > go right up to that bugger and confront him -- he disappears! > > Regards, > Joe that would involve an acceptance of of the fear or a possiblity that there just might be a boogey man. From my readings of AL she is rather pre-occupied with the idea of non-acceptance. Coming from a place where similar non-dualists come from being: If it's non-dual then there is nothing to accept you see? Which is why the merry go round goes round and round and on and on. If people confronted that which is " not " then it would not exist...then there would be no more game to play and no more denouncing and labelling of this and this is separate and so and so is *non*. The game would be over then wouldn't it? hhhhhhmmmmmmmmmm ~G. --- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 10, 2005 Report Share Posted February 10, 2005 Nisargadatta , " goldenrainbowrider " <laughterx8@h...> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> > wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " goldenrainbowrider " > <laughterx8@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > But wouldn't it be great if one could live without the past. I > > > don't > > > > mean losing memories, but not to be guided by them all the > time. I > > > > feel like my memories are hanging over me like a heavy cloud. > It's > > > a > > > > great burden. > > > > > > > > /AL > > > -------------------------------- > > > > > > Past memories become heavy clouds if one holds them bound within > > > regret and guilt. > > > What do you regret? What do you have guilt about? > > > Can you change the past? Can you make recompense for the past? > > > Can you learn from the past? > > > can your present be different from things learned or applied > from > > > the past? > > > Can one put down a gun and use their brain to solve a problem > > > thereby learning from millenia of past war-like behavior? > > > could memories guide without being a dark cloud looming overhead? > > > Or is one going to continue to repeat the past and keep picking > up > > > that gun rather than finding different solutions that don't > > > perpetuate so much guilt and regret, sadness. > > > > > > Future becomes a heavy clouds too if one worries over it. > > > Why worry over it? > > > Fear to control? Fear of being out of control? > > > Having no control? Wanting control? > > > Wanting something different than it is? Not being able to > accept > > > what is here and now? What you are here and now? Always > chasing > > > after something that is past or future? Wanting something to > change > > > and be other than it is? > > > > > > ~G. > > > > > > ------- > > > > > > > > Giving a perscription to someone to change what they think they > are.....is not accepting what is. > > > > > > toombaru > > ----------------- > > Are questions a perscription? yes. Or is it merely a way with which to > see ignorance for what it is and thereby clarify or ease or disperse > the ideas/thoughts/choices/ways producing the ignorance? Thought cannot erace what it has created. > > However, for some ignorance is bliss yes? Ignorance is suffering. > > If you change what you think you are then you no longer are that. You cannot change what you are....You simlpy cannot be different then you are. > Or perhaps realize that you have no interest in " that " . > > Does change preclude acceptance? No. Must everything be separate one > from another in your thinking processes No. -- even the notion of > acceptance? > > One day you'll leave this body. No you won't. You'll leave the human idea of > physical life altogether. This involves a change of some sort or > other. And an acceptance of that change. Not coming back involves a > change. The two don't exclude each other -- separate from each > other. That time is a long way ahead for you dear, you're still > very intrigued with the art and act of separating it all. > > That's just fine. > > ~G. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 11, 2005 Report Share Posted February 11, 2005 > But wouldn't it be great if one could live without the past. I don't > mean losing memories, but not to be guided by them all the time. I > feel like my memories are hanging over me like a heavy cloud. It's a > great burden. > > /AL -------------------------------- Past memories become heavy clouds if one holds them bound within regret and guilt. What do you regret? What do you have guilt about? Can you change the past? Can you make recompense for the past? Can you learn from the past? can your present be different from things learned or applied from the past? Can one put down a gun and use their brain to solve a problem thereby learning from millenia of past war-like behavior? could memories guide without being a dark cloud looming overhead? Or is one going to continue to repeat the past and keep picking up that gun rather than finding different solutions that don't perpetuate so much guilt and regret, sadness. Future becomes a heavy clouds too if one worries over it. Why worry over it? Fear to control? Fear of being out of control? Having no control? Wanting control? Wanting something different than it is? Not being able to accept what is here and now? What you are here and now? Always chasing after something that is past or future? Wanting something to change and be other than it is? ~G. ------- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 11, 2005 Report Share Posted February 11, 2005 Nisargadatta , " goldenrainbowrider " <laughterx8@h...> wrote: > > > But wouldn't it be great if one could live without the past. I > don't > > mean losing memories, but not to be guided by them all the time. I > > feel like my memories are hanging over me like a heavy cloud. It's > a > > great burden. > > > > /AL > -------------------------------- > > Past memories become heavy clouds if one holds them bound within > regret and guilt. > What do you regret? What do you have guilt about? > Can you change the past? Can you make recompense for the past? > Can you learn from the past? > can your present be different from things learned or applied from > the past? > Can one put down a gun and use their brain to solve a problem > thereby learning from millenia of past war-like behavior? > could memories guide without being a dark cloud looming overhead? > Or is one going to continue to repeat the past and keep picking up > that gun rather than finding different solutions that don't > perpetuate so much guilt and regret, sadness. > > Future becomes a heavy clouds too if one worries over it. > Why worry over it? > Fear to control? Fear of being out of control? > Having no control? Wanting control? > Wanting something different than it is? Not being able to accept > what is here and now? What you are here and now? Always chasing > after something that is past or future? Wanting something to change > and be other than it is? > > ~G. > > ------- Giving a perscription to someone to change what they think they are.....is not accepting what is. toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 11, 2005 Report Share Posted February 11, 2005 Nisargadatta , " goldenrainbowrider " <laughterx8@h...> wrote: > > > But wouldn't it be great if one could live without the past. I > don't > > mean losing memories, but not to be guided by them all the time. I > > feel like my memories are hanging over me like a heavy cloud. It's > a > > great burden. > > > > /AL That cloud appears right now. It has no past, no future, no substance. The apparent heaviness is a momentary arising. The whole thing is constructed in your mind. Looking into it, it disappears. Like they tell you when you're young and you dream of boogeymen -- go right up to that bugger and confront him -- he disappears! Regards, Joe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 11, 2005 Report Share Posted February 11, 2005 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " goldenrainbowrider " <laughterx8@h...> wrote: > > > > > But wouldn't it be great if one could live without the past. I > > don't > > > mean losing memories, but not to be guided by them all the time. I > > > feel like my memories are hanging over me like a heavy cloud. It's > > a > > > great burden. > > > > > > /AL > > -------------------------------- > > > > Past memories become heavy clouds if one holds them bound within > > regret and guilt. > > What do you regret? What do you have guilt about? > > Can you change the past? Can you make recompense for the past? > > Can you learn from the past? > > can your present be different from things learned or applied from > > the past? > > Can one put down a gun and use their brain to solve a problem > > thereby learning from millenia of past war-like behavior? > > could memories guide without being a dark cloud looming overhead? > > Or is one going to continue to repeat the past and keep picking up > > that gun rather than finding different solutions that don't > > perpetuate so much guilt and regret, sadness. > > > > Future becomes a heavy clouds too if one worries over it. > > Why worry over it? > > Fear to control? Fear of being out of control? > > Having no control? Wanting control? > > Wanting something different than it is? Not being able to accept > > what is here and now? What you are here and now? Always chasing > > after something that is past or future? Wanting something to change > > and be other than it is? > > > > ~G. > > > > ------- > > > > Giving a perscription to someone to change what they think they are.....is not accepting what is. > > > toombaru ----------------- Are questions a perscription? Or is it merely a way with which to see ignorance for what it is and thereby clarify or ease or disperse the ideas/thoughts/choices/ways producing the ignorance? However, for some ignorance is bliss yes? If you change what you think you are then you no longer are that. Or perhaps realize that you have no interest in " that " . Does change preclude acceptance? Must everything be separate one from another in your thinking processes -- even the notion of acceptance? One day you'll leave this body. You'll leave the human idea of physical life altogether. This involves a change of some sort or other. And an acceptance of that change. Not coming back involves a change. The two don't exclude each other -- separate from each other. That time is a long way ahead for you dear, you're still very intrigued with the art and act of separating it all. That's just fine. ~G. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 11, 2005 Report Share Posted February 11, 2005 Nisargadatta , " josesiem " <josesiem> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " goldenrainbowrider " > <laughterx8@h...> wrote: > > > > > But wouldn't it be great if one could live without the past. I > > don't > > > mean losing memories, but not to be guided by them all the time. > I > > > feel like my memories are hanging over me like a heavy cloud. > It's > > a > > > great burden. > > > > > > /AL > > That cloud appears right now. It has no past, no future, no > substance. The apparent heaviness is a momentary arising. The whole > thing is constructed in your mind. Looking into it, it disappears. > > Like they tell you when you're young and you dream of boogeymen -- > go right up to that bugger and confront him -- he disappears! > > Regards, > Joe that would involve an acceptance of of the fear or a possiblity that there just might be a boogey man. From my readings of AL she is rather pre-occupied with the idea of non-acceptance. Coming from a place where similar non-dualists come from being: If it's non-dual then there is nothing to accept you see? Which is why the merry go round goes round and round and on and on. If people confronted that which is " not " then it would not exist...then there would be no more game to play and no more denouncing and labelling of this and this is separate and so and so is *non*. The game would be over then wouldn't it? hhhhhhmmmmmmmmmm ~G. --- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 11, 2005 Report Share Posted February 11, 2005 Nisargadatta , " goldenrainbowrider " <laughterx8@h...> wrote: > > > But wouldn't it be great if one could live without the past. I > don't > > mean losing memories, but not to be guided by them all the time. I > > feel like my memories are hanging over me like a heavy cloud. It's > a > > great burden. > > > > /AL > -------------------------------- > > Past memories become heavy clouds if one holds them bound within > regret and guilt. > What do you regret? What do you have guilt about? > Can you change the past? Can you make recompense for the past? > Can you learn from the past? > can your present be different from things learned or applied from > the past? > Can one put down a gun and use their brain to solve a problem > thereby learning from millenia of past war-like behavior? > could memories guide without being a dark cloud looming overhead? > Or is one going to continue to repeat the past and keep picking up > that gun rather than finding different solutions that don't > perpetuate so much guilt and regret, sadness. > > Future becomes a heavy clouds too if one worries over it. > Why worry over it? > Fear to control? Fear of being out of control? > Having no control? Wanting control? > Wanting something different than it is? Not being able to accept > what is here and now? What you are here and now? Always chasing > after something that is past or future? Wanting something to change > and be other than it is? > > ~G. > > ------- Right now, there is me and there is time. I am only a fragment of time. So even though I am time in a way, there is a split between me as a fragment of time and time itself as a massive mover of worlds. Now, the me, being only a fragment consisting of desires and fears can never be friend with time as a whole. Desires and fears are genetically inherited knowledge and knowledge learned during my lifetime in the form of experience, education, e t c. My knowledge is limited and static, therefore I can never be friend with time as a whole which creates a world everlastingly moving and in flux. So I as a fragment of time cannot accept what is because it is time as a whole massive mover of worlds who is determining what is, and my little knowledge is always helplessly several steps behind. And if I try to run away on my own without acting in harmony with all of time, then time will strike me down with fears, with anguish, with remorse, with guilt and shame. This is not an act of punishment; time is not really punishing itself, although it may appear that way. These negative emotions function as a " dead end " that prevents the " separate " me from running away too far or too fast on my own. One example of trying to run away too fast is when I have the idea that things should change to the better faster than what is happening. This idea is not bad in itself, but when I want the " external " world to change according to my desires (which is what it is all about) I have a too narrow perspective. Time as a massive mover must see to it that _everything_ unfolds in harmony. My own little desires are only focusing on a tiny, tiny aspect of the world: my private wishes - all of them consisting of old ideas. So it is this narrowness of my perspective that is the problem. A smarter way of demanding change is to demand that _I_ change instead of the external world having to adjust itself according to my narrow desires. When I find a natural balance with time as a whole, then negative emotions like anger, fear, hatred and guilt are not needed. /AL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 11, 2005 Report Share Posted February 11, 2005 Nisargadatta , " goldenrainbowrider " <laughterx8@h...> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " toombaru2004 " <cptc@w...> > wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " goldenrainbowrider " > <laughterx8@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > But wouldn't it be great if one could live without the past. I > > > don't > > > > mean losing memories, but not to be guided by them all the > time. I > > > > feel like my memories are hanging over me like a heavy cloud. > It's > > > a > > > > great burden. > > > > > > > > /AL > > > -------------------------------- > > > > > > Past memories become heavy clouds if one holds them bound within > > > regret and guilt. > > > What do you regret? What do you have guilt about? > > > Can you change the past? Can you make recompense for the past? > > > Can you learn from the past? > > > can your present be different from things learned or applied > from > > > the past? > > > Can one put down a gun and use their brain to solve a problem > > > thereby learning from millenia of past war-like behavior? > > > could memories guide without being a dark cloud looming overhead? > > > Or is one going to continue to repeat the past and keep picking > up > > > that gun rather than finding different solutions that don't > > > perpetuate so much guilt and regret, sadness. > > > > > > Future becomes a heavy clouds too if one worries over it. > > > Why worry over it? > > > Fear to control? Fear of being out of control? > > > Having no control? Wanting control? > > > Wanting something different than it is? Not being able to > accept > > > what is here and now? What you are here and now? Always > chasing > > > after something that is past or future? Wanting something to > change > > > and be other than it is? > > > > > > ~G. > > > > > > ------- > > > > > > > > Giving a perscription to someone to change what they think they > are.....is not accepting what is. > > > > > > toombaru > > ----------------- > > Are questions a perscription? yes. Or is it merely a way with which to > see ignorance for what it is and thereby clarify or ease or disperse > the ideas/thoughts/choices/ways producing the ignorance? Thought cannot erace what it has created. > > However, for some ignorance is bliss yes? Ignorance is suffering. > > If you change what you think you are then you no longer are that. You cannot change what you are....You simlpy cannot be different then you are. > Or perhaps realize that you have no interest in " that " . > > Does change preclude acceptance? No. Must everything be separate one > from another in your thinking processes No. -- even the notion of > acceptance? > > One day you'll leave this body. No you won't. You'll leave the human idea of > physical life altogether. This involves a change of some sort or > other. And an acceptance of that change. Not coming back involves a > change. The two don't exclude each other -- separate from each > other. That time is a long way ahead for you dear, you're still > very intrigued with the art and act of separating it all. > > That's just fine. > > ~G. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 11, 2005 Report Share Posted February 11, 2005 Nisargadatta , " goldenrainbowrider " <laughterx8@h...> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " josesiem " <josesiem> > wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " goldenrainbowrider " > > <laughterx8@h...> wrote: > > > > > > > But wouldn't it be great if one could live without the past. I > > > don't > > > > mean losing memories, but not to be guided by them all the > time. > > I > > > > feel like my memories are hanging over me like a heavy cloud. > > It's > > > a > > > > great burden. > > > > > > > > /AL > > > > That cloud appears right now. It has no past, no future, no > > substance. The apparent heaviness is a momentary arising. The > whole > > thing is constructed in your mind. Looking into it, it disappears. > > > > Like they tell you when you're young and you dream of boogeymen -- > > go right up to that bugger and confront him -- he disappears! > > > > Regards, > > Joe > > > > that would involve an acceptance of of the fear or a possiblity that > there just might be a boogey man. > > From my readings of AL she is rather pre-occupied with the idea of > non-acceptance. Coming from a place where similar non-dualists > come from being: If it's non-dual then there is nothing to accept > you see? Which is why the merry go round goes round and round and > on and on. > > If people confronted that which is " not " then it would not > exist...then there would be no more game to play and no more > denouncing and labelling of this and this is separate and so and so > is *non*. The game would be over then wouldn't it? > > hhhhhhmmmmmmmmmm > > ~G. > > --- Both what we normally call acceptance and non-acceptance are in the world of duality. B t w, I am male. :-) /AL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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