Guest guest Posted March 8, 2005 Report Share Posted March 8, 2005 Hi Lewis, That remark about 2nd. and 3rd.hand knowledge was posted while it still required work at the aphorism shop. I thought so at the time. These things unless they are immediately intelligible are doomed and until anchored in a concrete image they hang flaccid as a leaking balloon. What Richard wanted answered was as simple as 'how do I get to Central Park from here?'. Within a metaphysical system whose elements are well known and agreed upon a Master makes a point which is not clear to someone who is unfamiliar with the terrain. It's very Lewis to say that whatever answer he is given will be faulty. There's an element of the fog machine about your perorations. Michael Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 8, 2005 Report Share Posted March 8, 2005 ombhurbhuva wrote: > Hi Lewis, > > That remark about 2nd. and 3rd.hand > knowledge was posted while it still > required work at the aphorism shop. I > thought so at the time. These things > unless they are immediately intelligible > are doomed and until anchored in a > concrete image they hang flaccid as a > leaking balloon. What do you mean " until anchored in a concrete image " Michael? Please elaborate so it is clear what you mean. > What Richard wanted answered was as simple > as 'how do I get to Central Park from > here?'. Was that what Richard wanted? I do not know. Richard can tell us. > Within a metaphysical system > whose elements are well known and agreed > upon a Master makes a point which is not > clear to someone who is unfamiliar with > the terrain. That is the case with many. That may be the case with Richard. I do not know. He can tell us if that was what his questions were about. > It's very Lewis to say that > whatever answer he is given will be > faulty. It was not said that answers given to Richard are or were faulty. It was said in the first post that such knowledge is troublesome and in the second it was asked which of the answers is most suitable to represent Nisargadatta's meaning. These words have different meanings. " Faulty " means to be marked by fault, imperfection, blemish or defect. It was not said that the answers were faulty or untrue or true or any such thing. " Troublesome " means difficult or difficult to deal with. " Suitable " means similar or matching or proper. How did you derive faulty from the words troublesome and suitable? Perhaps it is the word " phantoms " that touch. Well that does happen does it not? And the scriptural and personage warnings are about that in part is that not so? And that phenomena of phantom creation and seeking has little to do with words themselves of any type. The words lie there do nothing of their own accord. They are " lifeless " as it is. The gain life and meaning and shape and form and experience when taken up. > There's an element of the fog > machine about your perorations. > > Michael There is no fog or fog machine. There are no conclusions about answers, Michael, yours or others. Just simple statements about the nature of knowledge production and how it can used and experienced. The veracity of the knowledge presented or the lack of it in the answers provided was not considered or debated. The latter is a matter that each appearance undergoes and deals with. It can be said that the answers were similar and different in the way that they are simply from examining the different scriptures and similar and different concepts used. A great service would be to pull all the answers to Richard's questions together and put them in one post to see them as they are and then to comment as to their relation to Richard's question and Nisargadatta's words, and how they answer or deal with his questions. This may prove to be an illuminating experience for all concerned. Lewis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 8, 2005 Report Share Posted March 8, 2005 Hi Group, Your answers were wide-ranging and I took what I could use at this time and left the rest. I don't presume to tell others how to respond and am appreciative of all your selfless replies.Your answers plus further reading of Nisargadatta's later books, were indeed helpful. As is probably known, N's guru changed the teaching of the lineage from only meditating and worship, to also include understanding along with the other practices. So I ask questions, while knowing that " ...outside the mind there is only being. " Nisargadatta Maharaj I have been to Central Park, literally and figuratively, and did think I asked a question as simple as how to get there from here. But now realize that If my " from here " is unknown, how can I be directed? Actually, more than directions, I wanted to know the view from Central Park and indeed if there were any view or awareness of anything when in the Absolute spoken of by N. Thanks, Richard Lewis Burgess <lbb10 wrote: ombhurbhuva wrote: > Hi Lewis, > > That remark about 2nd. and 3rd.hand > knowledge was posted while it still > required work at the aphorism shop. I > thought so at the time. These things > unless they are immediately intelligible > are doomed and until anchored in a > concrete image they hang flaccid as a > leaking balloon. What do you mean " until anchored in a concrete image " Michael? Please elaborate so it is clear what you mean. > What Richard wanted answered was as simple > as 'how do I get to Central Park from > here?'. Was that what Richard wanted? I do not know. Richard can tell us. > Within a metaphysical system > whose elements are well known and agreed > upon a Master makes a point which is not > clear to someone who is unfamiliar with > the terrain. That is the case with many. That may be the case with Richard. I do not know. He can tell us if that was what his questions were about. > It's very Lewis to say that > whatever answer he is given will be > faulty. It was not said that answers given to Richard are or were faulty. It was said in the first post that such knowledge is troublesome and in the second it was asked which of the answers is most suitable to represent Nisargadatta's meaning. These words have different meanings. " Faulty " means to be marked by fault, imperfection, blemish or defect. It was not said that the answers were faulty or untrue or true or any such thing. " Troublesome " means difficult or difficult to deal with. " Suitable " means similar or matching or proper. How did you derive faulty from the words troublesome and suitable? Perhaps it is the word " phantoms " that touch. Well that does happen does it not? And the scriptural and personage warnings are about that in part is that not so? And that phenomena of phantom creation and seeking has little to do with words themselves of any type. The words lie there do nothing of their own accord. They are " lifeless " as it is. The gain life and meaning and shape and form and experience when taken up. > There's an element of the fog > machine about your perorations. > > Michael There is no fog or fog machine. There are no conclusions about answers, Michael, yours or others. Just simple statements about the nature of knowledge production and how it can used and experienced. The veracity of the knowledge presented or the lack of it in the answers provided was not considered or debated. The latter is a matter that each appearance undergoes and deals with. It can be said that the answers were similar and different in the way that they are simply from examining the different scriptures and similar and different concepts used. A great service would be to pull all the answers to Richard's questions together and put them in one post to see them as they are and then to comment as to their relation to Richard's question and Nisargadatta's words, and how they answer or deal with his questions. This may prove to be an illuminating experience for all concerned. Lewis ** If you do not wish to receive individual emails, to change your subscription, sign in with your ID and go to Edit My Groups: /mygroups?edit=1 Under the Message Delivery option, choose " No Email " for the Nisargadatta group and click on Save Changes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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