Guest guest Posted May 13, 2005 Report Share Posted May 13, 2005 The flag waivers of nonduality may think that the believing in, and the understanding of that concept, is what it is all about. That if you can talk nondual, you are sage. But the concept, useful and beautiful as it might be, is still a dead thing. The fruition, the enjoyment is everything. Do you live the nondual life? When you wake up in the morning, does the bed wake up with you, does the whole room wake up? Or is it just your body and cut off mind who awakes? When you walk outside, do you look at the world, or it's the world who enjoys itself thru your eyes? Does the sky learn how it feels to be sky thru your mind? Does trees, and things come to life and consciousness in you? Until this fruition, this enjoyment is vibrantly alive, you have understood not a thing about nonduality. So stop blabbering about how everything is the same, and nothing matters, and a tree is just the same as a truck, and criminals are equal to saints. Till you feel that way, you are just a parrot repeating words you really don't understand. And it's the same with no-doer, it doesn't mean you are free to do as you please, it is not just a concept. It's a feeling that acting flows thru you from the unknown with certainty and inevitability. It's the joy of acting as one with the act, of seeing the act unfold thru you like a dance. It doesn't mean you are free to do what you want. It means no regrets, no pride in your acts. The knowledge that you have no choice, doesn't mean you don't deliberate sometimes, and take great care. It's the feeling that even the deliberation is a choiceless act. Pete Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 13, 2005 Report Share Posted May 13, 2005 Nisargadatta , Pedsie2@a... wrote: > The flag waivers of nonduality may think that the believing in, > and the understanding of that concept, is what it is all about. That > if you can talk nondual, you are sage. But the concept, useful > and beautiful as it might be, is still a dead thing. > > The fruition, the enjoyment is everything. Do you live the nondual > life? When you wake up in the morning, does the bed wake up > with you, does the whole room wake up? Or is it just your body > and cut off mind who awakes? When you walk outside, do you > look at the world, or it's the world who enjoys itself thru your eyes? > Does the sky learn how it feels to be sky thru your mind? Does trees, > and things come to life and consciousness in you? Until this > fruition, this enjoyment is vibrantly alive, you have understood > not a thing about nonduality. > > So stop blabbering about how everything is the same, and nothing > matters, and a tree is just the same as a truck, and > criminals are equal to saints. Till you feel that way, you are just > a parrot repeating words you really don't understand. > > And it's the same with no-doer, it doesn't mean you are free to > do as you please, it is not just a concept. It's a feeling that > acting flows thru you from the unknown with certainty > and inevitability. It's the joy of acting as one with the act, of seeing > the act unfold thru you like a dance. It doesn't mean you are > free to do what you want. It means no regrets, no pride in your acts. > The knowledge that you have no choice, doesn't mean you don't > deliberate sometimes, and take great care. It's the feeling that > even the deliberation is a choiceless act. > > Pete > > Pete > > Very nice. ........but it appears that there are still two of you. :-) toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 13, 2005 Report Share Posted May 13, 2005 Nisargadatta , Pedsie2@a... wrote: > The flag waivers of nonduality may think that the believing in, > and the understanding of that concept, is what it is all about. > That if you can talk nondual, you are sage. You make a good point. The flag wavers confuse words (intangibles) for things (tangibles), though that's nothing special, since virtually everybody confuses words for things. But, what the flag wavers, and love makers and god pushers do (unbeknownst to them, or they'd stop it!), is a trick of the mind only - shoving words around into particular, somewhat clever linguistic forms, which merely give the appearance of substance, yet are still, entirely substanceless. The love-makers (and god-pushers) believe that capitalizing LOVE (or GOD or many other similar CODE-WORDS) 15 times in one post, indicates the author understands the concept, which they don't, of course, but they certainly BELIEVE they do, since they just LUV to capitalize it, because it lends a " sense of " weightiness (tangible-ness) which it in fact does not have, except in their own minds, which is tricking itself out, over and over and over, ad nauseum - here and countless other venues. But the concept, useful > and beautiful as it might be, is still a dead thing. > > The fruition, the enjoyment is everything. Do you live the nondual > life? When you wake up in the morning, does the bed wake up > with you, does the whole room wake up? Or is it just your body > and cut off mind who awakes? When you walk outside, do you > look at the world, or it's the world who enjoys itself thru your eyes? > Does the sky learn how it feels to be sky thru your mind? Does trees, > and things come to life and consciousness in you? Until this > fruition, this enjoyment is vibrantly alive, you have understood > not a thing about nonduality. > > So stop blabbering about how everything is the same, and nothing > matters, and a tree is just the same as a truck, and > criminals are equal to saints. Till you feel that way, you are just > a parrot repeating words you really don't understand. > > And it's the same with no-doer, it doesn't mean you are free to > do as you please, it is not just a concept. It's a feeling that > acting flows thru you from the unknown with certainty > and inevitability. It's the joy of acting as one with the act, of seeing > the act unfold thru you like a dance. It doesn't mean you are > free to do what you want. It means no regrets, no pride in your acts. > The knowledge that you have no choice, doesn't mean you don't > deliberate sometimes, and take great care. It's the feeling that > even the deliberation is a choiceless act. > > Pete > > Pete > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 13, 2005 Report Share Posted May 13, 2005 Nisargadatta , " fmraerdy " <mybox234@b...> wrote: > Nisargadatta , Pedsie2@a... wrote: > > The flag waivers of nonduality may think that the believing in, > > and the understanding of that concept, is what it is all about. > > That if you can talk nondual, you are sage. > > You make a good point. No...........Pete's delusion merely coincides with your own. toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 13, 2005 Report Share Posted May 13, 2005 Nisargadatta , Pedsie2@a... wrote: > The flag waivers of nonduality may think that the believing in, > and the understanding of that concept, is what it is all about. That > if you can talk nondual, you are sage. But the concept, useful > and beautiful as it might be, is still a dead thing. > > The fruition, the enjoyment is everything. Do you live the nondual > life? When you wake up in the morning, does the bed wake up > with you, does the whole room wake up? Or is it just your body > and cut off mind who awakes? When you walk outside, do you > look at the world, or it's the world who enjoys itself thru your eyes? > Does the sky learn how it feels to be sky thru your mind? Does trees, > and things come to life and consciousness in you? Until this > fruition, this enjoyment is vibrantly alive, you have understood > not a thing about nonduality. > > So stop blabbering about how everything is the same, and nothing > matters, and a tree is just the same as a truck, and > criminals are equal to saints. Till you feel that way, you are just > a parrot repeating words you really don't understand. > > And it's the same with no-doer, it doesn't mean you are free to > do as you please, it is not just a concept. It's a feeling that > acting flows thru you from the unknown with certainty > and inevitability. It's the joy of acting as one with the act, of seeing > the act unfold thru you like a dance. It doesn't mean you are > free to do what you want. It means no regrets, no pride in your acts. > The knowledge that you have no choice, doesn't mean you don't > deliberate sometimes, and take great care. It's the feeling that > even the deliberation is a choiceless act. > > Pete Look who's talking? Physician, heal thyself. Yours, fuzzie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 15, 2005 Report Share Posted May 15, 2005 NonDualPhil , " Tony OClery " <aoclery> wrote: NonDualPhil , " Wim Borsboom " <wim_borsboom> wrote: > > > > Pete: Welcome to the list Marifa. Good to have people around > > > > like you and Win, who as Toombaru put it in another list, > > > > share my delusions. > > > > Wim: Dear Marifa and Pete, > > > That is so very touching, my heart just got a sweet kick out of that! > > > I'm not a woman and even less a pregnant one, but I imagine that what > > > I felt was similar to a baby's kick in the child's/mother's womb that > > > Tony: Sankara said death is separation from our attachments. (desires, > > aversions, joys, griefs, etc). That about sums it all up. Except for > > his guru's guru saying it never happened at all..........ONS...Tony. > > Dear Tony, > > One who lives an unconditional existence in direct knowledge and > un-reasoned bliss (sat chit ananda) is not attached - is authentically > free. It is the innate state of reality. > > " You have no reason to be happy... > as you need no reason to be happy! " > ~Wim > > Tony, your attachments (anybody's really) result from having been > forced into a state of illusion that only seems more real than > reality, simply because - while you were put in a state of fear, > disempowerment and conditional dependence - you (and anybody who > suffers from the artifice of attachment) have been told that such is > Namaste W, You don't give up on trying to convince to back track to where I was when I was a worshipper of Saguna Brahman. If I worship Saguna Brahman, and the forms of Love, and attributes of Sat-Cit-Ananada then two things can happen. 1. My Love becomes absolutely non dual and I have total surrender and leave loving a form or Saguna. 2. I still have something to Love or some thought, and I don't achieve Moksha but a state of Brahmaloka, or perhaps less. Therefore I choose the path to Nirguna. All the other attributes in existence I wean myself off, in the meantime for those that love me, I love them.......ONS..Tony. --- End forwarded message --- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 15, 2005 Report Share Posted May 15, 2005 NonDualPhil , " Tony OClery " <aoclery> wrote: NonDualPhil , " Anna Ruiz " <nli10u@c...> wrote: > > - > > Tony: > > All the other attributes in existence I wean myself off, in the > meantime for those that love me, I love them.......ONS..Tony. > > > Tony, > > As long as Tony thinks that it is a matter of " Tony's choice " it matters not what " Tony chooses " . > > See Who really Sees how " Tony " thinks Tony chooses and then maybe Love will not be a choice..... > Anna Namaste A, This is all just semantics and circumlocution, it is what I call verbal non dualism or vndism. Sankara said that it is real whilst one is in it and presumably we have to deal with it. in the interim. Love is for all, but unfortunately I'm not that advanced, so I deal with my world, and people that touch me. Not only people but animals as well. I'm a vegetarian for it is a step on the road to daya or compassion and without daya there is no road to liberation...just verbiage..ONS..Tony. --- End forwarded message --- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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