Guest guest Posted May 14, 2005 Report Share Posted May 14, 2005 People commonly accept the metaphor of 'Thou Art That', 'I Am', etc, as being a statement of fact. The fact is, even if it were true (and not merely a metaphor), once this 'knowledge' is 'known', does anything necessariy change? Does such 'knowledge' make a 'better person'? Is there a distinct 'before' and 'after' change upon understanding this 'knowledge'? SPV made an excellent point, a while back; he pointed out that The Buddha showed up to state 'Anatman', thus invalidating the keystone of Hinduism. If nothing is born, and nothing dies, there is nothing to 'reincarnate'. But even this 'understanding' does not necessarily 'liberate' anyone. What does it really 'mean' that there is nothing to reincarnate? The 'meaning' of that, is clear, only if we add 'nothing is born' and 'nothing dies'. But then, the 'seeker brain pattern' will emit; 'right, all of life is an illusion'. But I digress. I say that Devi et al, will continue to 'think as they do', until the drive to 'worship' becomes extinct. Such 'thinking' is indeed akin to the chaotic arisings of the Lava-Lamp; as long as the heat of emotion stirs the mind, such 'thoughts' will continue to arise. The next part is this; there are very many people, who have this 'Lava Lamp' experience. They learn to look for and find each-other. Thy cluster and form 'religions', which are comprised of 'worshipped' and 'worshipper'. This dichotomy (dualism) above, is the problem that I point to. But I have seen that this is too simple to grab the attention of the 'seeker'. It just 'sinks beneath their wisdom, like a stone'. 'Worship' is like 'truth'. It is possible to 'do it', to 'have it', even though it is nothing, in that it has no independent existence of its own. It is clearly a product of the human 'experience'. But even if this is seen, it will usually go 'on and on', for there is nothing (else) to fill the gaping chasm which is 'ignorance'. 'Worship' and 'truth' are created to fill this yawning void of ignorance, but it takes a constant act of 'filling' to make even the slightest difference to the 'seeker'. There must be a constant convoy of huge bhakti dump-trucks, each depositing its load, to relieve the anxiety and fear produced by enforced ignorance. Ignorance is not enforced by any religion; instead, social pressures are what enforces ignorance. Religion is the product of such social pressures. It is an obvious 'set-up' if you care to examine it in its naked form. 'Worship' and 'truth' are the stand-ins for what could otherwise be 'living knowledge'; that is, 'knowledge' which is a constant dynamic of displayed information. This is similar to the metaphor of 'watching the movie', mentioned by Durga recently. It is in constant flux, but it is not meaningless, no matter what the 'no-mind' fluff-boys say about it. It speaks loudly and consistently. If the human mind is released from the matrix of social pressures (pressures to conform; the constant demand to submit to homogenization), the nature of this dynamic knowledge, this 'display', may suddenly appear. Historically, when it has appeared to a person (for the first time), panic ensues. 'No! NO! It can't be real!' is the immediate reaction. This is the reason for the name 'Panic', derived from 'Pan', meaning 'All'. It is the 'living spirit of All' as it appears in Display. The Sufi 'Green Man' is the same 'entity'. In fact, this 'spirit' can emerge in form, at any time. The recent TV show 'Joan of Arcadia' is about this reality. As 'ALL', it beckons to you, in its own way. Can you withstand the 'stresses' of allowing yourself to be subsumed, into 'It'? Usually, not. So thus the panic and fleeing and psychosis of 'mind-pattern-breaking'. Years ago, I was in the midst of an unexpected 'realization', while on a shopping trip. I sat in my car and watched, afraid, as 'It' did its 'thing' 'out there'. During the peak of this wild (and harmless) experience, a small delivery van drove up and idled next to my car. Painted on its side was the company name: " Perceptual Delivery " This was all it took to break my last hold on my 'ignorance'. I laughed. I had been taking all of this 'spiritual' stuff waaaaay to seriously. Here is the living universe, consciousness 'at large', showing me puns, and gently prodding my will. 'I am being communicated with' Now, is that sweet, or what? ==Gene Poole== Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 14, 2005 Report Share Posted May 14, 2005 devi: really pete, it would have been *nice* and *thoughtful* had you left my name off the post, since gene poole has a few delusional ideas about me...once a creep always a creep, eh? i guess people once they reach a certain age can't change... a statement of fact. > > The fact is, even if it were true (and > not merely a metaphor), once this 'knowledge' > is 'known', does anything necessariy change? > > Does such 'knowledge' make a 'better person'? > > Is there a distinct 'before' and 'after' change > upon understanding this 'knowledge'? > > SPV made an excellent point, a while back; he > pointed out that The Buddha showed up to state > 'Anatman', thus invalidating the keystone of > Hinduism. > > If nothing is born, and nothing dies, > there is nothing to 'reincarnate'. But even > this 'understanding' does not necessarily > 'liberate' anyone. What does it really 'mean' > that there is nothing to reincarnate? > > The 'meaning' of that, is clear, only if > we add 'nothing is born' and 'nothing dies'. > But then, the 'seeker brain pattern' will > emit; 'right, all of life is an illusion'. > > But I digress. I say that Devi et al, will > continue to 'think as they do', until the > drive to 'worship' becomes extinct. Such > 'thinking' is indeed akin to the chaotic > arisings of the Lava-Lamp; as long as the > heat of emotion stirs the mind, such > 'thoughts' will continue to arise. > > The next part is this; there are very many > people, who have this 'Lava Lamp' experience. > They learn to look for and find each-other. > Thy cluster and form 'religions', which > are comprised of 'worshipped' and 'worshipper'. > > This dichotomy (dualism) above, is the > problem that I point to. But I have seen > that this is too simple to grab the attention > of the 'seeker'. It just 'sinks beneath > their wisdom, like a stone'. > > 'Worship' is like 'truth'. It is possible to > 'do it', to 'have it', even though it is > nothing, in that it has no independent > existence of its own. It is clearly a product > of the human 'experience'. But even if this > is seen, it will usually go 'on and on', for > there is nothing (else) to fill the gaping chasm > which is 'ignorance'. > > 'Worship' and 'truth' are created to fill > this yawning void of ignorance, but it takes > a constant act of 'filling' to make even the > slightest difference to the 'seeker'. There > must be a constant convoy of huge bhakti > dump-trucks, each depositing its load, to > relieve the anxiety and fear produced by > enforced ignorance. > > Ignorance is not enforced by any religion; > instead, social pressures are what enforces > ignorance. Religion is the product of such > social pressures. It is an obvious 'set-up' > if you care to examine it in its naked form. > > 'Worship' and 'truth' are the stand-ins for > what could otherwise be 'living knowledge'; > that is, 'knowledge' which is a constant > dynamic of displayed information. This is > similar to the metaphor of 'watching the > movie', mentioned by Durga recently. It is > in constant flux, but it is not meaningless, > no matter what the 'no-mind' fluff-boys > say about it. It speaks loudly and consistently. > > If the human mind is released from the matrix > of social pressures (pressures to conform; > the constant demand to submit to homogenization), > the nature of this dynamic knowledge, this > 'display', may suddenly appear. > > Historically, when it has appeared to a > person (for the first time), panic ensues. > 'No! NO! It can't be real!' is the > immediate reaction. This is the reason > for the name 'Panic', derived from 'Pan', > meaning 'All'. It is the 'living spirit > of All' as it appears in Display. > > The Sufi 'Green Man' is the same 'entity'. > > In fact, this 'spirit' can emerge in form, > at any time. The recent TV show 'Joan of > Arcadia' is about this reality. > > As 'ALL', it beckons to you, in its own > way. Can you withstand the 'stresses' of > allowing yourself to be subsumed, into 'It'? > > Usually, not. So thus the panic and fleeing > and psychosis of 'mind-pattern-breaking'. > > Years ago, I was in the midst of an unexpected > 'realization', while on a shopping trip. I sat > in my car and watched, afraid, as 'It' did its > 'thing' 'out there'. > > During the peak of this wild (and harmless) > experience, a small delivery van drove up and > idled next to my car. Painted on its side was > the company name: > > " Perceptual Delivery " > > This was all it took to break my last hold > on my 'ignorance'. I laughed. I had been taking > all of this 'spiritual' stuff waaaaay to seriously. > Here is the living universe, consciousness 'at large', > showing me puns, and gently prodding my will. > > > 'I am being communicated with' > > > Now, is that sweet, or what? > > > ==Gene Poole== > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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