Guest guest Posted October 23, 2005 Report Share Posted October 23, 2005 Sure. Mind/ego would have us search for the right formula, suspecting that it's all too complex to comprehend, when actually it's too simple to comprehend and mind needs something to do to keep itself working on it so that it doesn't have to actually do it. If what we want in our lives is love, joy, and peace, we need to stop doing the opposite and it's done. How much simpler can it be? If we don't want resistance and struggle, we have to accept and surrender. If we want to be fulfilled, we have to release want/need/desire. If we want peace, we have to stop creating drama to entertain ourselves. Yes, ego's gonna scream bloody murder and for good reason. The Truth is already present, so why don't we see it? We have no business asking that question until there is no more desire for anything to be any way other than exactly as it is. And then we won't need to ask cause how it really is, is the Truth we seek. That simple willingness IS the answer. Phil In a message dated 10/23/2005 11:26:14 AM Pacific Daylight Time, pedsie4 writes: Thanks, Kip, The excerpt below, very concisely points out how the urge to survive is the enemy of true life, and how death, our misunderstood friend, is the way out. Pete All these myths make one grave mistake: they hold out the lie that you can find value in life by seeking it through your own psychology. ---------- True rebirth demands something more than psychology. It demands “death.†Death of all self-importance, death of all we “think†we are, death of all pride in our illusory identities. It is the death described so well through the ages by religious mystics such as Saint John of the Cross.[1,2] It is the death of all attempts to seduce your despair. From this death comes spiritual healing, the end to all the frantic defenses against your vulnerability and the beginning of the acceptance of vulnerability itself as the very strength of true love. It’s a rebirth into honest humility, the only path that leads to meaningful life, mental health, and genuine religion. And, sadly enough, all those who haven’t learned this lesson—even the most outwardly religious of us still trapped in false spirituality—will fall, time and time again, into the hands of that dark ego state in which we, like a useless letter, are rolled angrily into a ball of trash. On Oct 22, 2005, at 11:25 PM, kipalmazy wrote: > http://www.guidetopsychology.com/death.htm > > > kind regards, > Kip Almazy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 23, 2005 Report Share Posted October 23, 2005 Simple and easy are not the same thing. Phil In a message dated 10/23/2005 1:43:27 PM Pacific Daylight Time, wwoehr writes: Aha Phil, If it is so simple then why don't you just do it ? Or is it to humiliating to face that you can't do it ? It is just this arrogance to believe that it is given in our hands to do it without having to die which will invent all kinds of excuses. Werner Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@A... wrote: > > > Sure. Mind/ego would have us search for the right formula, suspecting that > it's all too complex to comprehend, when actually it's too simple to comprehend > and mind needs something to do to keep itself working on it so that it > doesn't have to actually do it. > > If what we want in our lives is love, joy, and peace, we need to stop doing > the opposite and it's done. How much simpler can it be? If we don't want > resistance and struggle, we have to accept and surrender. If we want to be > fulfilled, we have to release want/need/desire. If we want peace, we have to stop > creating drama to entertain ourselves. Yes, ego's gonna scream bloody murder > and for good reason. > > The Truth is already present, so why don't we see it? We have no business > asking that question until there is no more desire for anything to be any way > other than exactly as it is. And then we won't need to ask cause how it really > is, is the Truth we seek. That simple willingness IS the answer. > > Phil > > > > In a message dated 10/23/2005 11:26:14 AM Pacific Daylight Time, > pedsie4@e... writes: > > Thanks, Kip, The excerpt below, very concisely points > out how the urge to survive is the enemy of true life, and > how death, our misunderstood friend, is the way out. > > Pete > > All these myths make one grave mistake: they hold out the lie that you > can find value in life by seeking it through your own psychology. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 23, 2005 Report Share Posted October 23, 2005 Thanks, Kip, The excerpt below, very concisely points out how the urge to survive is the enemy of true life, and how death, our misunderstood friend, is the way out. Pete All these myths make one grave mistake: they hold out the lie that you can find value in life by seeking it through your own psychology. ---------- True rebirth demands something more than psychology. It demands “death.” Death of all self-importance, death of all we “think” we are, death of all pride in our illusory identities. It is the death described so well through the ages by religious mystics such as Saint John of the Cross.[1,2] It is the death of all attempts to seduce your despair. From this death comes spiritual healing, the end to all the frantic defenses against your vulnerability and the beginning of the acceptance of vulnerability itself as the very strength of true love. It’s a rebirth into honest humility, the only path that leads to meaningful life, mental health, and genuine religion. And, sadly enough, all those who haven’t learned this lesson—even the most outwardly religious of us still trapped in false spirituality—will fall, time and time again, into the hands of that dark ego state in which we, like a useless letter, are rolled angrily into a ball of trash. On Oct 22, 2005, at 11:25 PM, kipalmazy wrote: > http://www.guidetopsychology.com/death.htm > > > kind regards, > Kip Almazy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 23, 2005 Report Share Posted October 23, 2005 Aha Phil, If it is so simple then why don't you just do it ? Or is it to humiliating to face that you can't do it ? It is just this arrogance to believe that it is given in our hands to do it without having to die which will invent all kinds of excuses. Werner Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@A... wrote: > > > Sure. Mind/ego would have us search for the right formula, suspecting that > it's all too complex to comprehend, when actually it's too simple to comprehend > and mind needs something to do to keep itself working on it so that it > doesn't have to actually do it. > > If what we want in our lives is love, joy, and peace, we need to stop doing > the opposite and it's done. How much simpler can it be? If we don't want > resistance and struggle, we have to accept and surrender. If we want to be > fulfilled, we have to release want/need/desire. If we want peace, we have to stop > creating drama to entertain ourselves. Yes, ego's gonna scream bloody murder > and for good reason. > > The Truth is already present, so why don't we see it? We have no business > asking that question until there is no more desire for anything to be any way > other than exactly as it is. And then we won't need to ask cause how it really > is, is the Truth we seek. That simple willingness IS the answer. > > Phil > > > > In a message dated 10/23/2005 11:26:14 AM Pacific Daylight Time, > pedsie4@e... writes: > > Thanks, Kip, The excerpt below, very concisely points > out how the urge to survive is the enemy of true life, and > how death, our misunderstood friend, is the way out. > > Pete > > All these myths make one grave mistake: they hold out the lie that you > can find value in life by seeking it through your own psychology. > > > ---------- > > True rebirth demands something more than psychology. It demands > “death.†Death of all self-importance, death of all we “think†we are, > death of all pride in our illusory identities. It is the death > described so well through the ages by religious mystics such as Saint > John of the Cross.[1,2] It is the death of all attempts to seduce > your despair. > > From this death comes spiritual healing, the end to all the frantic > defenses against your vulnerability and the beginning of the > acceptance of vulnerability itself as the very strength of true love. > It’s a rebirth into honest humility, the only path that leads to > meaningful life, mental health, and genuine religion. > > And, sadly enough, all those who haven’t learned this lesson†" even the > most outwardly religious of us still trapped in false > spirituality†" will fall, time and time again, into the hands of that > dark ego state in which we, like a useless letter, are rolled angrily > into a ball of trash. > > > > On Oct 22, 2005, at 11:25 PM, kipalmazy wrote: > > > http://www.guidetopsychology.com/death.htm > > > > > > kind regards, > > Kip Almazy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 23, 2005 Report Share Posted October 23, 2005 * It's 'simple', but 'arduous'. Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr@p...> wrote: > > Aha Phil, > > If it is so simple then why don't you just do it ? > > Or is it to humiliating to face that you can't do it ? > > It is just this arrogance to believe that it is given in our hands to > do it without having to die which will invent all kinds of excuses. > > Werner > > > Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@A... wrote: > > > > > > Sure. Mind/ego would have us search for the right formula, > suspecting that > > it's all too complex to comprehend, when actually it's too simple > to comprehend > > and mind needs something to do to keep itself working on it so > that it > > doesn't have to actually do it. > > > > If what we want in our lives is love, joy, and peace, we need to > stop doing > > the opposite and it's done. How much simpler can it be? If we don't > want > > resistance and struggle, we have to accept and surrender. If we > want to be > > fulfilled, we have to release want/need/desire. If we want peace, > we have to stop > > creating drama to entertain ourselves. Yes, ego's gonna scream > bloody murder > > and for good reason. > > > > The Truth is already present, so why don't we see it? We have no > business > > asking that question until there is no more desire for anything to > be any way > > other than exactly as it is. And then we won't need to ask cause > how it really > > is, is the Truth we seek. That simple willingness IS the answer. > > > > Phil > > > > > > > > In a message dated 10/23/2005 11:26:14 AM Pacific Daylight Time, > > pedsie4@e... writes: > > > > Thanks, Kip, The excerpt below, very concisely points > > out how the urge to survive is the enemy of true life, and > > how death, our misunderstood friend, is the way out. > > > > Pete > > > > All these myths make one grave mistake: they hold out the lie that > you > > can find value in life by seeking it through your own psychology. > > > > > > ---------- > > > > True rebirth demands something more than psychology. It demands > > “death.†Death of all self-importance, death of all we > “think†we are, > > death of all pride in our illusory identities. It is the death > > described so well through the ages by religious mystics such as > Saint > > John of the Cross.[1,2] It is the death of all attempts to seduce > > your despair. > > > > From this death comes spiritual healing, the end to all the frantic > > defenses against your vulnerability and the beginning of the > > acceptance of vulnerability itself as the very strength of true > love. > > It’s a rebirth into honest humility, the only path that leads to > > meaningful life, mental health, and genuine religion. > > > > And, sadly enough, all those who haven’t learned this > lesson†" even the > > most outwardly religious of us still trapped in false > > spirituality†" will fall, time and time again, into the hands of > that > > dark ego state in which we, like a useless letter, are rolled > angrily > > into a ball of trash. > > > > > > > > On Oct 22, 2005, at 11:25 PM, kipalmazy wrote: > > > > > http://www.guidetopsychology.com/death.htm > > > > > > > > > kind regards, > > > Kip Almazy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 23, 2005 Report Share Posted October 23, 2005 Welcome RF, Nice to see you here. It is an interesting alternative to the K list. Werner Nisargadatta , " assiduity2004 " <asimpjoy@e...> wrote: > > > * It's 'simple', but 'arduous'. > > > Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr@p...> > wrote: > > > > Aha Phil, > > > > If it is so simple then why don't you just do it ? > > > > Or is it to humiliating to face that you can't do it ? > > > > It is just this arrogance to believe that it is given in our hands > to > > do it without having to die which will invent all kinds of excuses. > > > > Werner > > > > > > Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@A... wrote: > > > > > > > > > Sure. Mind/ego would have us search for the right formula, > > suspecting that > > > it's all too complex to comprehend, when actually it's too simple > > to comprehend > > > and mind needs something to do to keep itself working on it so > > that it > > > doesn't have to actually do it. > > > > > > If what we want in our lives is love, joy, and peace, we need to > > stop doing > > > the opposite and it's done. How much simpler can it be? If we > don't > > want > > > resistance and struggle, we have to accept and surrender. If we > > want to be > > > fulfilled, we have to release want/need/desire. If we want peace, > > we have to stop > > > creating drama to entertain ourselves. Yes, ego's gonna scream > > bloody murder > > > and for good reason. > > > > > > The Truth is already present, so why don't we see it? We have no > > business > > > asking that question until there is no more desire for anything > to > > be any way > > > other than exactly as it is. And then we won't need to ask cause > > how it really > > > is, is the Truth we seek. That simple willingness IS the answer. > > > > > > Phil > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 10/23/2005 11:26:14 AM Pacific Daylight Time, > > > pedsie4@e... writes: > > > > > > Thanks, Kip, The excerpt below, very concisely points > > > out how the urge to survive is the enemy of true life, and > > > how death, our misunderstood friend, is the way out. > > > > > > Pete > > > > > > All these myths make one grave mistake: they hold out the lie > that > > you > > > can find value in life by seeking it through your own > psychology. > > > > > > > > > ---------- > > > > > > True rebirth demands something more than psychology. It demands > > > “death.†Death of all self-importance, death of all we > > “think†we are, > > > death of all pride in our illusory identities. It is the death > > > described so well through the ages by religious mystics such as > > Saint > > > John of the Cross.[1,2] It is the death of all attempts to seduce > > > your despair. > > > > > > From this death comes spiritual healing, the end to all the > frantic > > > defenses against your vulnerability and the beginning of the > > > acceptance of vulnerability itself as the very strength of true > > love. > > > It’s a rebirth into honest humility, the only path that leads > to > > > meaningful life, mental health, and genuine religion. > > > > > > And, sadly enough, all those who haven’t learned this > > lesson†" even the > > > most outwardly religious of us still trapped in false > > > spirituality†" will fall, time and time again, into the hands of > > that > > > dark ego state in which we, like a useless letter, are rolled > > angrily > > > into a ball of trash. > > > > > > > > > > > > On Oct 22, 2005, at 11:25 PM, kipalmazy wrote: > > > > > > > http://www.guidetopsychology.com/death.htm > > > > > > > > > > > > kind regards, > > > > Kip Almazy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 23, 2005 Report Share Posted October 23, 2005 * Thank you for the warm welcome. Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr@p...> wrote: > > Welcome RF, > > Nice to see you here. It is an interesting alternative to the K list. > > Werner > > > Nisargadatta , " assiduity2004 " <asimpjoy@e...> > wrote: > > > > > > * It's 'simple', but 'arduous'. > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr@p...> > > wrote: > > > > > > Aha Phil, > > > > > > If it is so simple then why don't you just do it ? > > > > > > Or is it to humiliating to face that you can't do it ? > > > > > > It is just this arrogance to believe that it is given in our > hands > > to > > > do it without having to die which will invent all kinds of > excuses. > > > > > > Werner > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@A... wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Sure. Mind/ego would have us search for the right formula, > > > suspecting that > > > > it's all too complex to comprehend, when actually it's too > simple > > > to comprehend > > > > and mind needs something to do to keep itself working on it so > > > that it > > > > doesn't have to actually do it. > > > > > > > > If what we want in our lives is love, joy, and peace, we need > to > > > stop doing > > > > the opposite and it's done. How much simpler can it be? If we > > don't > > > want > > > > resistance and struggle, we have to accept and surrender. If we > > > want to be > > > > fulfilled, we have to release want/need/desire. If we want > peace, > > > we have to stop > > > > creating drama to entertain ourselves. Yes, ego's gonna scream > > > bloody murder > > > > and for good reason. > > > > > > > > The Truth is already present, so why don't we see it? We have > no > > > business > > > > asking that question until there is no more desire for anything > > to > > > be any way > > > > other than exactly as it is. And then we won't need to ask > cause > > > how it really > > > > is, is the Truth we seek. That simple willingness IS the answer. > > > > > > > > Phil > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 10/23/2005 11:26:14 AM Pacific Daylight > Time, > > > > pedsie4@e... writes: > > > > > > > > Thanks, Kip, The excerpt below, very concisely points > > > > out how the urge to survive is the enemy of true life, and > > > > how death, our misunderstood friend, is the way out. > > > > > > > > Pete > > > > > > > > All these myths make one grave mistake: they hold out the lie > > that > > > you > > > > can find value in life by seeking it through your own > > psychology. > > > > > > > > > > > > ---------- > > > > > > > > True rebirth demands something more than psychology. It demands > > > > “death.†Death of all self-importance, death of all we > > > “think†we are, > > > > death of all pride in our illusory identities. It is the death > > > > described so well through the ages by religious mystics such > as > > > Saint > > > > John of the Cross.[1,2] It is the death of all attempts to > seduce > > > > your despair. > > > > > > > > From this death comes spiritual healing, the end to all the > > frantic > > > > defenses against your vulnerability and the beginning of the > > > > acceptance of vulnerability itself as the very strength of > true > > > love. > > > > It’s a rebirth into honest humility, the only path that > leads > > to > > > > meaningful life, mental health, and genuine religion. > > > > > > > > And, sadly enough, all those who haven’t learned this > > > lesson†" even the > > > > most outwardly religious of us still trapped in false > > > > spirituality†" will fall, time and time again, into the hands > of > > > that > > > > dark ego state in which we, like a useless letter, are rolled > > > angrily > > > > into a ball of trash. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Oct 22, 2005, at 11:25 PM, kipalmazy wrote: > > > > > > > > > http://www.guidetopsychology.com/death.htm > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > kind regards, > > > > > Kip Almazy > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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