Guest guest Posted December 17, 2005 Report Share Posted December 17, 2005 In a message dated 12/17/2005 10:53:46 PM Pacific Standard Time, anders_lindman writes: > I think the desire for food, clothing and shelter is the root cause of > the problem, because it is the beginning of separation from " God " , Epston: There is no separation. Never was, never will be. There is only the present here and now existence that is perfect and complete. When you can see the truth of this, your perception of yourself and life with change. To the extent you insist this is not true, you will continue to suffer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 So true, Everyone who doesn't think positive has to get his head chopped off. Werner Nisargadatta , epston@a... wrote: > > In a message dated 12/17/2005 10:53:46 PM Pacific Standard Time, > anders_lindman writes: > > > I think the desire for food, clothing and shelter is the root cause of > > the problem, because it is the beginning of separation from " God " , > > Epston: There is no separation. Never was, never will be. There is only > the present here and now existence that is perfect and complete. When you can > see the truth of this, your perception of yourself and life with change. To > the extent you insist this is not true, you will continue to suffer. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 Nisargadatta , epston@a... wrote: > > In a message dated 12/17/2005 10:53:46 PM Pacific Standard Time, > anders_lindman writes: > > > I think the desire for food, clothing and shelter is the root cause of > > the problem, because it is the beginning of separation from " God " , > > Epston: There is no separation. Never was, never will be. There is only > the present here and now existence that is perfect and complete. When you can > see the truth of this, your perception of yourself and life with change. To > the extent you insist this is not true, you will continue to suffer. > Hi Epston, That's probably true. Maybe the truth is too simple for the intellect. The intellect can't just " let go " , perhaps because it is the result of millions of years of evolution. To the intellect, letting go means going back to the animal state of no thought. I can for example see that my own thinking should relax tremendously if I/it could let go of its holding on to 1001 problems. al. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 you have no idea of what is the animal state of no thought, as you define it in your mail. what is really funny is that you go on in your expression to personalize the intellect, as if it was a someone! Nisargadatta , " anders_lindman " <anders_lindman> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , epston@a... wrote: > > > > In a message dated 12/17/2005 10:53:46 PM Pacific Standard Time, > > anders_lindman writes: > > > > > I think the desire for food, clothing and shelter is the root cause of > > > the problem, because it is the beginning of separation from " God " , > > > > Epston: There is no separation. Never was, never will be. There > is only > > the present here and now existence that is perfect and complete. > When you can > > see the truth of this, your perception of yourself and life with > change. To > > the extent you insist this is not true, you will continue to suffer. > > > > Hi Epston, > > That's probably true. Maybe the truth is too simple for the intellect. > The intellect can't just " let go " , perhaps because it is the result of > millions of years of evolution. To the intellect, letting go means > going back to the animal state of no thought. I can for example see > that my own thinking should relax tremendously if I/it could let go of > its holding on to 1001 problems. > > al. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " <bigwaaba> wrote: > > you have no idea of what is the animal state of no thought, as you > define it in your mail. what is really funny is that you go on in > your expression to personalize the intellect, as if it was a someone! > The intellect is much of what we think of as a personal me. And when we are totally stuck in thought then we think we ARE the intellect. I don't know if it is possible to rise " above " thought, but that doesn't mean it is impossible. Ken Wilber describes it as moving into the transpersonal realms of consciousness. This doesn't mean losing the ability of thinking, but recognizing/entering a level of awareness that is higher than thought. The animal level of no thinking can perhaps be reached after drinking a lot of alcohol. al. > > Nisargadatta , " anders_lindman " > <anders_lindman> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , epston@a... wrote: > > > > > > In a message dated 12/17/2005 10:53:46 PM Pacific Standard Time, > > > anders_lindman writes: > > > > > > > I think the desire for food, clothing and shelter is the root > cause of > > > > the problem, because it is the beginning of separation > from " God " , > > > > > > Epston: There is no separation. Never was, never will be. There > > is only > > > the present here and now existence that is perfect and complete. > > When you can > > > see the truth of this, your perception of yourself and life with > > change. To > > > the extent you insist this is not true, you will continue to > suffer. > > > > > > > Hi Epston, > > > > That's probably true. Maybe the truth is too simple for the > intellect. > > The intellect can't just " let go " , perhaps because it is the result > of > > millions of years of evolution. To the intellect, letting go means > > going back to the animal state of no thought. I can for example see > > that my own thinking should relax tremendously if I/it could let go > of > > its holding on to 1001 problems. > > > > al. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 oh al!! lol that would be an intoxicated human state of poor thinking! lol about a level higher than thought, i mean, aren't you now aware of this one?!? love Nisargadatta , " anders_lindman " <anders_lindman> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " <bigwaaba> wrote: > > > > you have no idea of what is the animal state of no thought, as you > > define it in your mail. what is really funny is that you go on in > > your expression to personalize the intellect, as if it was a someone! > > > > The intellect is much of what we think of as a personal me. And when > we are totally stuck in thought then we think we ARE the intellect. I > don't know if it is possible to rise " above " thought, but that doesn't > mean it is impossible. Ken Wilber describes it as moving into the > transpersonal realms of consciousness. This doesn't mean losing the > ability of thinking, but recognizing/entering a level of awareness > that is higher than thought. The animal level of no thinking can > perhaps be reached after drinking a lot of alcohol. > > al. > > > > > Nisargadatta , " anders_lindman " > > <anders_lindman> wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , epston@a... wrote: > > > > > > > > In a message dated 12/17/2005 10:53:46 PM Pacific Standard Time, > > > > anders_lindman writes: > > > > > > > > > I think the desire for food, clothing and shelter is the root > > cause of > > > > > the problem, because it is the beginning of separation > > from " God " , > > > > > > > > Epston: There is no separation. Never was, never will be. There > > > is only > > > > the present here and now existence that is perfect and complete. > > > When you can > > > > see the truth of this, your perception of yourself and life with > > > change. To > > > > the extent you insist this is not true, you will continue to > > suffer. > > > > > > > > > > Hi Epston, > > > > > > That's probably true. Maybe the truth is too simple for the > > intellect. > > > The intellect can't just " let go " , perhaps because it is the result > > of > > > millions of years of evolution. To the intellect, letting go means > > > going back to the animal state of no thought. I can for example see > > > that my own thinking should relax tremendously if I/it could let go > > of > > > its holding on to 1001 problems. > > > > > > al. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " <bigwaaba> wrote: > > > > oh al!! > > lol > that would be an intoxicated human state of poor thinking! lol > > about a level higher than thought, i mean, aren't you now aware of > this one?!? > > love I have an idea of how a realized person should feel, and I notice that I am not self-realized at all according to my own idea about it! :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 Just imagine you have two noses. What a shock then to realize you are a one-nosed Anders ... Sniff, sniff, sniff ... Werner Nisargadatta , " anders_lindman " <anders_lindman> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " <bigwaaba> wrote: > > > > > > > > oh al!! > > > > lol > > that would be an intoxicated human state of poor thinking! lol > > > > about a level higher than thought, i mean, aren't you now aware of > > this one?!? > > > > love > > > I have an idea of how a realized person should feel, and I notice that > I am not self-realized at all according to my own idea about it! :-) > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 " anders_lindman " <anders_lindman Re: There Is No Separation Nisargadatta , epston@a... wrote: > > In a message dated 12/17/2005 10:53:46 PM Pacific Standard Time, > anders_lindman writes: > > > I think the desire for food, clothing and shelter is the root cause of > > the problem, because it is the beginning of separation from " God " , > > Epston: There is no separation. Never was, never will be. There is only > the present here and now existence that is perfect and complete. When you can > see the truth of this, your perception of yourself and life with change. To > the extent you insist this is not true, you will continue to suffer. > Hi Epston, That's probably true. Maybe the truth is too simple for the intellect. The intellect can't just " let go " , perhaps because it is the result of millions of years of evolution. To the intellect, letting go means going back to the animal state of no thought. I can for example see that my own thinking should relax tremendously if I/it could let go of its holding on to 1001 problems. al. Your thoughts are what seem to confirm, for you, that you exist as an individual. To cease thought is equivalent to ceasing to exist, and this is why the mind hesitates to stop, even when no immediate desires are being pursued. " I think, therefore I am " is not correct, but it's certainly the conclusion the mind comes to. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 - ADHHUB Nisargadatta Sunday, December 18, 2005 8:44 PM Re: There Is No Separation " anders_lindman " <anders_lindman Re: There Is No Separation Nisargadatta , epston@a... wrote: > > In a message dated 12/17/2005 10:53:46 PM Pacific Standard Time, > anders_lindman writes: > > > I think the desire for food, clothing and shelter is the root cause of > > the problem, because it is the beginning of separation from " God " , > > Epston: There is no separation. Never was, never will be. There is only > the present here and now existence that is perfect and complete. When you can > see the truth of this, your perception of yourself and life with change. To > the extent you insist this is not true, you will continue to suffer. > Hi Epston, That's probably true. Maybe the truth is too simple for the intellect. The intellect can't just " let go " , perhaps because it is the result of millions of years of evolution. To the intellect, letting go means going back to the animal state of no thought. I can for example see that my own thinking should relax tremendously if I/it could let go of its holding on to 1001 problems. al. What if instead of thinking about letting go, be with it until it leaves of it's own accord. " It is finished " problems, thoughts, love, rain, clouds, come and go. it is our thinking about the shoulds that gets weighty, else all is a cloudless sky, it moves as it moves... Love, Ana Your thoughts are what seem to confirm, for you, that you exist as an individual. To cease thought is equivalent to ceasing to exist, and this is why the mind hesitates to stop, even when no immediate desires are being pursued. " I think, therefore I am " is not correct, but it's certainly the conclusion the mind comes to. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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