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Phi, 1/1/06 The Relative and the Absolute

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In a message dated 1/1/2006 3:19:10 PM Pacific Standard Time, ADHHUB

writes:

 

Yes, emptiness and Absolute are the same. There cannot be the Absolute, and

then other than Absolute. The Absolute, then, doesn't arise out of anything;

 

it just IS. The illusion (relative) is given birth within the Absolute,

rather than the reverse.who the mommy is. It keeps the

youngins from trying to create God. :)

 

Phil

 

L.E: Well Phil, this is really a delightful conversation. A verbal

meditation of talking to myself about what is, what exists.

 

Yes, emptiness and Absolute are the same. There cannot be the Absolute, and

then other than Absolute.

 

LE: That's accurate from the direction of the Absolute. I think if you were

at present in that Absolute state and coming from that state directly, you

would have nothing to say about anything. You would just be, and are, in a

sense, actually in that state, but you yourself are talking about it from the

relative, which is also here and now. Both exist simultaneously, and you can

choose, as intelligence itself, which state you want to be in. That is your

blessed and divine freedom.

 

The Absolute, then, doesn't arise out of anything;

it just IS. The illusion (relative) is given birth within the Absolute,

rather than the reverse.

 

L.E: There is no directionality in this process, this existence. It can go

in either direction, or no direction. I know it's not rational, black and

white, but it still is.

You cannot make sense of it in ordinary state of mind, which is where you

are, arguing about the idea of the Absolute. And that's not bad, or wrong, it's

just that in the relative, you and I are also in the Absolute, They are

simultaneous. It's really simple: when you shut up, you are right there in

infinite existence, and when you start talking, Bang! You are back in the

relative.

Freaky!!!!

 

It's important to know who the mommy is. It keeps the

youngins from trying to create God. :)

 

L.E. I know your rational mind, your ordinary state of consciousness wants

the beginning to be in the beginning and then the middle, and then the end. You

want it to make ordinary sense and be sure who is the mommy, who is the

daddy, and who is the child. You can't do this in the state of the Absolute,

only

in the ordinary.

 

It keeps the youngins from trying to create God. :)

 

L.E: I can understand your concerns, but it is not the ' " youngins " that are

" trying to create God, " it is the preachers, ministers, and priests that have

no real of experience of anything beyond the ordinary, and try to find the

Absolute, Reality, the Truth, in a so-called holy book, and totally fail. And,

" god " is only a word. No one can create something that doesn't exist, never

has, never will. (oooooo! past and future references.)

 

 

Phil and Larry,

Talking it over.

 

 

 

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Nisargadatta , epston@a... wrote:

>

LE: That's accurate from the direction of the Absolute. I think if you

were

at present in that Absolute state and coming from that state directly, you

would have nothing to say about anything. You would just be...

 

 

DC: Now, you're talking... ;-)

 

dc

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The Absolute, then, doesn't arise out of anything;

it just IS. The illusion (relative) is given birth within the Absolute,

rather than the reverse.

 

L.E: There is no directionality in this process, this existence. It can go

in either direction, or no direction. I know it's not rational, black and

white, but it still is.

You cannot make sense of it in ordinary state of mind, which is where you

are, arguing about the idea of the Absolute. And that's not bad, or wrong,

it's

just that in the relative, you and I are also in the Absolute, They are

simultaneous. It's really simple: when you shut up, you are right there in

infinite existence, and when you start talking, Bang! You are back in the

relative.

Freaky!!!!

 

 

 

Phil: But, Larry, you are also in the " normal " state of mind arguing about

the Absolute. As such, here we are discussing concepts that have nothing at all

to do with Absolute Truth. To use the concept of Absolute Truth to try to

nullify a concept is just tail chasing. We either conceptualize or we remain

silent. We can't do both at once.

 

As far as being in the Absolute and the relative at once, of course. I never

had a problem with that because I never separated them in time or space to

begin with. It appears to me that you want to insist that you're a human while

embracing your Absolute nature at the same time. Perhaps this is what makes

it necessary for you to equate the relative and the Absolute. You don't exist

as a volitional human being, you only exist in, and as, the Absolute. The

human is contained in what you are. You don't need to see yourself in two

places

at once. You are no place, Now.

 

 

 

 

 

It's important to know who the mommy is. It keeps the

youngins from trying to create God. :)

 

L.E. I know your rational mind, your ordinary state of consciousness wants

the beginning to be in the beginning and then the middle, and then the end.

You

want it to make ordinary sense and be sure who is the mommy, who is the

daddy, and who is the child. You can't do this in the state of the

Absolute, only

in the ordinary.

 

 

 

 

Phil: Welcome to the ordinary, Larry. That's where this conversation is

taking place. It had a beginning, this is the middle, and there will be an end.

To deny this is so in the conversation that can exist only in that framework

is absurd. Like writing out a long dissertation attempting to prove that pens

don't exist. The effort is doomed by the effort itself.

 

 

 

 

 

It keeps the youngins from trying to create God. :)

 

L.E: I can understand your concerns, but it is not the ' " youngins " that are

" trying to create God, " it is the preachers, ministers, and priests that

have

no real of experience of anything beyond the ordinary, and try to find the

Absolute, Reality, the Truth, in a so-called holy book, and totally fail.

And,

" god " is only a word. No one can create something that doesn't exist, never

has, never will. (oooooo! past and future references.)

 

 

 

 

Phil: Twas just a metaphor. Youngins=humanity, humanity=youngins.

Not even going to address the " God " comment. I'm fairly sure you know what I

mean.

 

Phil

 

 

 

In a message dated 1/2/2006 2:44:44 AM Pacific Standard Time,

Nisargadatta writes:

 

epston

Re: Phi, 1/1/06 The Relative and the Absolute

 

In a message dated 1/1/2006 3:19:10 PM Pacific Standard Time, ADHHUB

writes:

 

Yes, emptiness and Absolute are the same. There cannot be the Absolute, and

then other than Absolute. The Absolute, then, doesn't arise out of

anything;

 

it just IS. The illusion (relative) is given birth within the Absolute,

rather than the reverse.who the mommy is. It keeps the

youngins from trying to create God. :)

 

Phil

 

L.E: Well Phil, this is really a delightful conversation. A verbal

meditation of talking to myself about what is, what exists.

 

Yes, emptiness and Absolute are the same. There cannot be the Absolute, and

then other than Absolute.

 

LE: That's accurate from the direction of the Absolute. I think if you were

 

at present in that Absolute state and coming from that state directly, you

would have nothing to say about anything. You would just be, and are, in a

sense, actually in that state, but you yourself are talking about it from

the

relative, which is also here and now. Both exist simultaneously, and you

can

choose, as intelligence itself, which state you want to be in. That is your

blessed and divine freedom.

 

The Absolute, then, doesn't arise out of anything;

it just IS. The illusion (relative) is given birth within the Absolute,

rather than the reverse.

 

L.E: There is no directionality in this process, this existence. It can go

in either direction, or no direction. I know it's not rational, black and

white, but it still is.

You cannot make sense of it in ordinary state of mind, which is where you

are, arguing about the idea of the Absolute. And that's not bad, or wrong,

it's

just that in the relative, you and I are also in the Absolute, They are

simultaneous. It's really simple: when you shut up, you are right there in

infinite existence, and when you start talking, Bang! You are back in the

relative.

Freaky!!!!

 

It's important to know who the mommy is. It keeps the

youngins from trying to create God. :)

 

L.E. I know your rational mind, your ordinary state of consciousness wants

the beginning to be in the beginning and then the middle, and then the end.

You

want it to make ordinary sense and be sure who is the mommy, who is the

daddy, and who is the child. You can't do this in the state of the

Absolute, only

in the ordinary.

 

It keeps the youngins from trying to create God. :)

 

L.E: I can understand your concerns, but it is not the ' " youngins " that are

" trying to create God, " it is the preachers, ministers, and priests that

have

no real of experience of anything beyond the ordinary, and try to find the

Absolute, Reality, the Truth, in a so-called holy book, and totally fail.

And,

" god " is only a word. No one can create something that doesn't exist, never

 

has, never will. (oooooo! past and future references.)

 

 

Phil and Larry,

Talking it over.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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In a message dated 1/2/2006 2:44:44 AM Pacific Standard Time,

Nisargadatta writes:

 

" dannyc_1eyeluv " <dannyc_1eyeluv

Re: Phi, 1/1/06 The Relative and the Absolute

 

Nisargadatta , epston@a... wrote:

>

LE: That's accurate from the direction of the Absolute. I think if you

were

at present in that Absolute state and coming from that state directly, you

would have nothing to say about anything. You would just be...

 

 

DC: Now, you're talking... ;-)

 

dc

 

 

 

 

And therein lies the dilemma :)

 

Phil

 

 

 

 

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-

ADHHUB

Nisargadatta

Tuesday, January 03, 2006 5:54 AM

Re: Phi, 1/1/06 The Relative and the Absolute

 

 

 

In a message dated 1/2/2006 2:44:44 AM Pacific Standard Time,

Nisargadatta writes:

 

" dannyc_1eyeluv " <dannyc_1eyeluv

Re: Phi, 1/1/06 The Relative and the Absolute

 

Nisargadatta , epston@a... wrote:

>

LE: That's accurate from the direction of the Absolute. I think if you

were

at present in that Absolute state and coming from that state directly, you

would have nothing to say about anything. You would just be...

 

 

DC: Now, you're talking... ;-)

 

dc

 

 

 

 

And therein lies the dilemma :)

 

Phil

 

 

" you' would just 'be'?

'I Am " ?

walking the talk?

being All?

and Nothing at All??

 

in This?

Is?

 

darn I should have known better and kept this to myself... ;-)

 

 

 

 

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