Guest guest Posted January 10, 2006 Report Share Posted January 10, 2006 Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " <bigwaaba> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " <bigwaaba> > wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " <bigwaaba> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " Anna > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > > > > > > dennis_travis33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta > > > > > > > > > > > > > Monday, January 09, 2006 6:50 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: Quotes from > Alan > > > Paton > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In Nisargadatta , " Anna > > > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dennis_travis33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Monday, January 09, 2006 6:15 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: Quotes from > > > Alan > > > > > Paton > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > Nisargadatta , " Anna > > > > > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " To give up the task of reforming > > society > > > > is > > > > > to > > > > > > > up > > > > > > > > > > one's > > > > > > > > > > > > > > responsibility as a free man. " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " What broke in a man that he can > bring > > > > > himself > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > kill > > > > > > > > > > > > another? " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " Who knows for what we live and > > struggle > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > die?...Wise > > > > > > > > > > > > men > > > > > > > > > > > > > write > > > > > > > > > > > > > > many books, in words to hard to > > > understand. > > > > > But > > > > > > > > this, > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > purpose of > > > > > > > > > > > > > > our lives, the end of all struggle, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is beyond all human wisdom. " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Alan Paton 1/11/1903-4/12/1988 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > South African novelist and activist > > > against > > > > > > > > apartheid > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >....everybody is indead....free.....to > > > live > > > > > > > > > > > > life.....however, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > whenever,wherever,.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > some who don't feel to be free....fight > > to > > > > > reach > > > > > > > > > > this...... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > some who feel to be free......enjoy the > > > peace > > > > > > > > > of....being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and some who are free in spirit ARE the > > > > > skillful > > > > > > > > means > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > bring > > > > > > > > > > > > > > peace into the mind-body-soul-spirit of > > the > > > > > > world. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > we have become the wounded healer. we > > are > > > > the > > > > > > > peace- > > > > > > > > > > being > > > > > > > > > > > > > bringing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > light where darkness exists. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > do you want the waves to be transformed > into > > > > > > ocean?.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > i believe this is a nice ideal.....but it > > will > > > > not > > > > > > > > work..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remember my Beloved Marc, it is always a > > beLIEf > > > > > > first, > > > > > > > > > > > > > an act of faith second and experienced at > > long > > > > last. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We do who we are. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Love > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > this is what is your pesonal " experience " > > about.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > remember that it's this your > individual " concept " > > > and > > > > > > > > > perception > > > > > > > > > > > > about.......peace is concerned about absolutely > > > > Nothing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear Marc, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > love is not personal... counsciousness is not > > > personal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ...if with personal you mean that is confined > > > > somewhere... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hi, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > love is always in relation with the emotions of a > > mind- > > > > > > concept > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > being....of identification with body-mind- intellect > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > consciousness also.....because it change in same > > > movement > > > > > > than > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > body-mind-intellect concept of being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (i thought that Werner explained the consciousness- > > > > subject > > > > > > > nicely > > > > > > > > > > last week) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at least....i enjoyed his " view " about.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you would get another identification than with > > this > > > > your > > > > > > > body- > > > > > > > > > mind- > > > > > > > > > > intellect....than.... " who " is there > > > > still.....to " love " ..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > than there is nothing but Self.......and all the > > change > > > > of > > > > > > > forms > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > It.......the reflection of the formless and > changless > > > > > > Self..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > falling in love to this reflections?...... > > > > > > > > > > to love this refelctions of oneSelf....?..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ok.... " who " care.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thats about your personal ego-mind > > perception......but > > > > the > > > > > > Self > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > always untouched by this moving mind > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ...the Self is taking care, the Self is loving... > > > > > > > > > falling in love with the Self? YES > > > > > > > > > to love this loving game of self reflection? YES > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so Marc...ok...who cares? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the Self is the Self......nothing else > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you think that the Self is " loving " .....thats your > > > > personal > > > > > > idea > > > > > > > > of.........nobody cares > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > i know that you are attached (love) this game of self > > > > > > > > reflections.........nobody realy cares...... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it's your ego " who " take care (result) for/of your > > > > ego.....not > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > Self..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the Self is untouched.....to all your illusions and > > related > > > > > > > > attachments and games and " loving " concepts....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you want to wake up........give up the ego..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thats what your real identity Is......the Self > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc, where does this knowledge come from? > > > > > > > > > > > > pure knowledge is pure love..... > > > > > > existing since ever....and forever......wherever (your) > mind > > > > could, > > > > > > ever, be conscious of.....whatever....however > > > > > > > > > > > > to be....Is this " knowledge " ...... > > > > > > > > > > > > if this your " love " is realy pure....then you > > > > > > also " know " .....that " knowledge " is all there > is.......there > > is > > > > > > nothing else what you could percieve......with the Self as > > > witness > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you don't know the answer to my question, do you? > > > > > be sincere... > > > > > > > > do you mean the answer that " you " expect....? > > > > > > > > maybe you don't agree with the answer i gave you.....but the > > > > question " where knowledge come from " .....is like the > > > question " where > > > > are the waves of the ocean come from " ......or " do the ocean > only > > > > become real, when there is awareness of an existing source of > > this > > > > waves " > > > > > > > > nobody ever care for any knowledge.....knowledge is " here and > now " > > > > > > > > whenever you are " here and now " ....the question of " where does > > > > knowledge come from " .....disappear.... > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > hello marc, > > > > > > the verb disappear may imply that the question goes into a place > > > where you are no more able to see it, or that you simply close > your > > > eyes...and goes into darkness, unconsciousness. you go asleep for > a > > > while, and the world disappears...a veil of ignorance is there > > around > > > the word disappear. > > > i prefer to use the verb dissolve. when the question dissolve, i > am > > > still here to see what happens...what the question dissolve > > into...i > > > witness it. Energy previously structured into the question is > > > released, the question dissolved...this energy is love, the > energy > > of > > > our own heart. > > > have a good day, my luminous friend > > > > Hi, > > > > you question has been " where does knowledge come from " ....i gave > you > > few answers.... > > maybe there is still misunderstanding ......but i think it's more > > a " different " kind of " view " ...... > > you seem to " expect " that " your " answer to the question is the only > > valuable.....i can accept this your point.....but then, why you > want > > to continue the discussion..... > > do you want me to enter in some " illusions " ....in which i'm not > > interested to enter in...?.......i'm sorry...no interests > > > > this your " energy of love " .... " the energy of our own heart " ..... > > > > this is related to your " ego-identification " ......missing, with > deep > > love......endless peace > > > > yes...your expression of " dissolve " is better than > the " disappear " .... > > > > i agree that the question dissolve for some reason..... > > and i know that this reason is....inner peace...... > > > > this your " love " is only the effect of some mixture of " truth " > > and " illusions " ....this give for many people....some more of less > > wonderful and nice ....emotions.....thats all > > > > Marc > > > > > no... i do not want you to enter into some illusion...it is > interesting this expression: mixture of truth and illusions...it > could be fun, don't you think? at least a way to stay far from being > a fanatic! > and i do prefer it indeed: being a mixture is being richer, more > fluid, more dinamic, alive. > points of view are different, of course but meeting, coming closer, a > new point of view, a new mixture is given the possibility to be born, > an expanded point of view, a new world, not yours, not mine... > > good....that you let me....in peace..... maybe you don't understand what i mean,,,,,,and maybe my expression is not enough ....... but i don't want to exchange this my peace with some illusions.....of being " this or that " ..... worlds are not real....the world change as fast as your mind change.... no need to exchange emotions and funny talk to some " others " .... you can change this your " world-perception " with all thoughts you get.....and all moments of peace you get.....and all the deepest love you can ever feel....and so on....... just like being sure...that today....when you will enter in dream....during sleep.....next night.......you will dream another " world " ......another one than last night .......world is a fiction....a construction of ego-mind......limited by time and space........ when the ego-mind is destroyed......there is only a " relative world.....and relative ego existing.... " which realy (message of Silver) give the impression ....to be " invisible " ......to no more " existing " .......except as " witness " of a " world " ....which is no more " of mine " .... Marc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 10, 2006 Report Share Posted January 10, 2006 Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " <bigwaaba> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " <bigwaaba> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > <bigwaaba> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > > > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " Anna > > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dennis_travis33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Monday, January 09, 2006 6:50 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: Quotes from > > Alan > > > > Paton > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > Nisargadatta , " Anna > > > > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dennis_travis33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Monday, January 09, 2006 6:15 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: Quotes > from > > > > Alan > > > > > > Paton > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > Nisargadatta , " Anna > > > > > > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " To give up the task of reforming > > > society > > > > > is > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > up > > > > > > > > > > > one's > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > responsibility as a free man. " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " What broke in a man that he can > > bring > > > > > > himself > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > kill > > > > > > > > > > > > > another? " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " Who knows for what we live and > > > struggle > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > die?...Wise > > > > > > > > > > > > > men > > > > > > > > > > > > > > write > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > many books, in words to hard to > > > > understand. > > > > > > But > > > > > > > > > this, > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > purpose of > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > our lives, the end of all struggle, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is beyond all human wisdom. " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Alan Paton 1/11/1903-4/12/1988 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > South African novelist and activist > > > > against > > > > > > > > > apartheid > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >....everybody is > indead....free.....to > > > > live > > > > > > > > > > > > > life.....however, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > whenever,wherever,.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > some who don't feel to be > free....fight > > > to > > > > > > reach > > > > > > > > > > > this...... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > some who feel to be free......enjoy > the > > > > peace > > > > > > > > > > of....being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and some who are free in spirit ARE > the > > > > > > skillful > > > > > > > > > means > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > > bring > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > peace into the mind-body-soul- spirit > of > > > the > > > > > > > world. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > we have become the wounded healer. > we > > > are > > > > > the > > > > > > > > peace- > > > > > > > > > > > being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > bringing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > light where darkness exists. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > do you want the waves to be transformed > > into > > > > > > > ocean?.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > i believe this is a nice ideal.....but it > > > will > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > work..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remember my Beloved Marc, it is always a > > > beLIEf > > > > > > > first, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > an act of faith second and experienced at > > > long > > > > > last. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We do who we are. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Love > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > this is what is your pesonal " experience " > > > about.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > remember that it's this your > > individual " concept " > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > perception > > > > > > > > > > > > > about.......peace is concerned about > absolutely > > > > > Nothing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear Marc, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > love is not personal... counsciousness is not > > > > personal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ...if with personal you mean that is confined > > > > > somewhere... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hi, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > love is always in relation with the emotions of a > > > mind- > > > > > > > concept > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > being....of identification with body-mind- > intellect > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > consciousness also.....because it change in same > > > > movement > > > > > > > than > > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > > body-mind-intellect concept of being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (i thought that Werner explained the > consciousness- > > > > > subject > > > > > > > > nicely > > > > > > > > > > > last week) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at least....i enjoyed his " view " about.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you would get another identification than with > > > this > > > > > your > > > > > > > > body- > > > > > > > > > > mind- > > > > > > > > > > > intellect....than.... " who " is there > > > > > still.....to " love " ..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > than there is nothing but Self.......and all the > > > change > > > > > of > > > > > > > > forms > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > It.......the reflection of the formless and > > changless > > > > > > > Self..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > falling in love to this reflections?...... > > > > > > > > > > > to love this refelctions of oneSelf....?..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ok.... " who " care.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thats about your personal ego-mind > > > perception......but > > > > > the > > > > > > > Self > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > always untouched by this moving mind > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ...the Self is taking care, the Self is loving... > > > > > > > > > > falling in love with the Self? YES > > > > > > > > > > to love this loving game of self reflection? YES > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so Marc...ok...who cares? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the Self is the Self......nothing else > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you think that the Self is " loving " .....thats your > > > > > personal > > > > > > > idea > > > > > > > > > of.........nobody cares > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > i know that you are attached (love) this game of self > > > > > > > > > reflections.........nobody realy cares...... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it's your ego " who " take care (result) for/of your > > > > > ego.....not > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > Self..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the Self is untouched.....to all your illusions and > > > related > > > > > > > > > attachments and games and " loving " concepts....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you want to wake up........give up the ego..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thats what your real identity Is......the Self > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc, where does this knowledge come from? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > pure knowledge is pure love..... > > > > > > > existing since ever....and forever......wherever (your) > > mind > > > > > could, > > > > > > > ever, be conscious of.....whatever....however > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to be....Is this " knowledge " ...... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if this your " love " is realy pure....then you > > > > > > > also " know " .....that " knowledge " is all there > > is.......there > > > is > > > > > > > nothing else what you could percieve......with the Self > as > > > > witness > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you don't know the answer to my question, do you? > > > > > > be sincere... > > > > > > > > > > do you mean the answer that " you " expect....? > > > > > > > > > > maybe you don't agree with the answer i gave you.....but the > > > > > question " where knowledge come from " .....is like the > > > > question " where > > > > > are the waves of the ocean come from " ......or " do the ocean > > only > > > > > become real, when there is awareness of an existing source of > > > this > > > > > waves " > > > > > > > > > > nobody ever care for any knowledge.....knowledge is " here and > > now " > > > > > > > > > > whenever you are " here and now " ....the question of " where > does > > > > > knowledge come from " .....disappear.... > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > hello marc, > > > > > > > > the verb disappear may imply that the question goes into a > place > > > > where you are no more able to see it, or that you simply close > > your > > > > eyes...and goes into darkness, unconsciousness. you go asleep > for > > a > > > > while, and the world disappears...a veil of ignorance is there > > > around > > > > the word disappear. > > > > i prefer to use the verb dissolve. when the question dissolve, > i > > am > > > > still here to see what happens...what the question dissolve > > > into...i > > > > witness it. Energy previously structured into the question is > > > > released, the question dissolved...this energy is love, the > > energy > > > of > > > > our own heart. > > > > have a good day, my luminous friend > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > you question has been " where does knowledge come from " ....i gave > > you > > > few answers.... > > > maybe there is still misunderstanding ......but i think it's more > > > a " different " kind of " view " ...... > > > you seem to " expect " that " your " answer to the question is the > only > > > valuable.....i can accept this your point.....but then, why you > > want > > > to continue the discussion..... > > > do you want me to enter in some " illusions " ....in which i'm not > > > interested to enter in...?.......i'm sorry...no interests > > > > > > this your " energy of love " .... " the energy of our own heart " ..... > > > > > > this is related to your " ego-identification " ......missing, with > > deep > > > love......endless peace > > > > > > yes...your expression of " dissolve " is better than > > the " disappear " .... > > > > > > i agree that the question dissolve for some reason..... > > > and i know that this reason is....inner peace...... > > > > > > this your " love " is only the effect of some mixture of " truth " > > > and " illusions " ....this give for many people....some more of less > > > wonderful and nice ....emotions.....thats all > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > no... i do not want you to enter into some illusion...it is > > interesting this expression: mixture of truth and illusions...it > > could be fun, don't you think? at least a way to stay far from > being > > a fanatic! > > and i do prefer it indeed: being a mixture is being richer, more > > fluid, more dinamic, alive. > > points of view are different, of course but meeting, coming closer, > a > > new point of view, a new mixture is given the possibility to be > born, > > an expanded point of view, a new world, not yours, not mine... > > > > > good....that you let me....in peace..... > > maybe you don't understand what i mean,,,,,,and maybe my expression > is not enough ....... > > but i don't want to exchange this my peace with some illusions.....of > being " this or that " ..... > > worlds are not real....the world change as fast as your mind > change.... > > no need to exchange emotions and funny talk to some " others " .... > > you can change this your " world-perception " with all thoughts you > get.....and all moments of peace you get.....and all the deepest love > you can ever feel....and so on....... > > just like being sure...that today....when you will enter in > dream....during sleep.....next night.......you will dream > another " world " ......another one than last night > > ......world is a fiction....a construction of ego-mind......limited > by time and space........ > > when the ego-mind is destroyed......there is only a " relative > world.....and relative ego existing.... " > > which realy (message of Silver) give the impression ....to > be " invisible " ......to no more " existing " .......except as " witness " > of a " world " ....which is no more " of mine " .... > > Marc > thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 10, 2006 Report Share Posted January 10, 2006 Nisargadatta , " Anna Ruiz " <nli10u@c...> wrote: > > > - > dennis_travis33 > Nisargadatta > Tuesday, January 10, 2006 5:54 AM > Re: dissolve > > > Nisargadatta , " Anna Ruiz " <nli10u@c...> wrote: > > > > > > - > > dennis_travis33 > > Nisargadatta > > Tuesday, January 10, 2006 5:42 AM > > Re: dissolve > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " Anna Ruiz " <nli10u@c...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > - > > > dennis_travis33 > > > Nisargadatta > > > Tuesday, January 10, 2006 5:17 AM > > > Re: dissolve > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > <bigwaaba> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > <bigwaaba> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > > > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > Nisargadatta , " Anna > > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dennis_travis33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Monday, January 09, 2006 6:50 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: Quotes > from > > Alan > > > > Paton > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > Nisargadatta , " Anna > > > > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dennis_travis33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To: Nisargadatta > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Monday, January 09, 2006 > 6:15 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: > Quotes > > from > > > > Alan > > > > > > Paton > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > Nisargadatta , " Anna > > > > > > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " To give up the task of > reforming > > > society > > > > > is > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > up > > > > > > > > > > > one's > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > responsibility as a free man. " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " What broke in a man that he > can > > bring > > > > > > himself > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > kill > > > > > > > > > > > > > another? " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " Who knows for what we live and > > > struggle > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > die?...Wise > > > > > > > > > > > > > men > > > > > > > > > > > > > > write > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > many books, in words to hard to > > > > understand. > > > > > > But > > > > > > > > > this, > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > purpose of > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > our lives, the end of all > struggle, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is beyond all human wisdom. " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Alan Paton 1/11/1903- 4/12/1988 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > South African novelist and > activist > > > > against > > > > > > > > > apartheid > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >....everybody is > > indead....free.....to > > > > live > > > > > > > > > > > > > life.....however, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > whenever,wherever,.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > some who don't feel to be > > free....fight > > > to > > > > > > reach > > > > > > > > > > > this...... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > some who feel to be > free......enjoy > > the > > > > peace > > > > > > > > > > of....being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and some who are free in spirit > ARE > > the > > > > > > skillful > > > > > > > > > means > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > > bring > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > peace into the mind-body-soul- > spirit > > of > > > the > > > > > > > world. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > we have become the wounded > healer. > > we > > > are > > > > > the > > > > > > > > peace- > > > > > > > > > > > being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > bringing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > light where darkness exists. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > do you want the waves to be > transformed > > into > > > > > > > ocean?.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > i believe this is a nice > ideal.....but it > > > will > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > work..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remember my Beloved Marc, it is > always a > > > beLIEf > > > > > > > first, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > an act of faith second and > experienced at > > > long > > > > > last. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We do who we are. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Love > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > this is what is your pesonal " experience " > > > about.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > remember that it's this your > > individual " concept " > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > perception > > > > > > > > > > > > > about.......peace is concerned about > > absolutely > > > > > Nothing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear Marc, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > love is not personal... counsciousness is > not > > > > personal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ...if with personal you mean that is > confined > > > > > somewhere... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hi, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > love is always in relation with the emotions > of a > > > mind- > > > > > > > concept > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > being....of identification with body-mind- > > intellect > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > consciousness also.....because it change in > same > > > > movement > > > > > > > than > > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > > body-mind-intellect concept of being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (i thought that Werner explained the > > consciousness- > > > > > subject > > > > > > > > nicely > > > > > > > > > > > last week) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at least....i enjoyed his " view " about.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you would get another identification than > with > > > this > > > > > your > > > > > > > > body- > > > > > > > > > > mind- > > > > > > > > > > > intellect....than.... " who " is there > > > > > still.....to " love " ..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > than there is nothing but Self.......and all > the > > > change > > > > > of > > > > > > > > forms > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > It.......the reflection of the formless and > > changless > > > > > > > Self..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > falling in love to this reflections?...... > > > > > > > > > > > to love this refelctions of oneSelf....?..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ok.... " who " care.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thats about your personal ego-mind > > > perception......but > > > > > the > > > > > > > Self > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > always untouched by this moving mind > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ...the Self is taking care, the Self is > loving... > > > > > > > > > > falling in love with the Self? YES > > > > > > > > > > to love this loving game of self reflection? YES > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so Marc...ok...who cares? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the Self is the Self......nothing else > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you think that the Self is " loving " .....thats > your > > > > > personal > > > > > > > idea > > > > > > > > > of.........nobody cares > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > i know that you are attached (love) this game of > self > > > > > > > > > reflections.........nobody realy cares...... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it's your ego " who " take care (result) for/of > your > > > > > ego.....not > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > Self..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the Self is untouched.....to all your illusions > and > > > related > > > > > > > > > attachments and games and " loving " concepts....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you want to wake up........give up the ego..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thats what your real identity Is......the Self > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc, where does this knowledge come from? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > pure knowledge is pure love..... > > > > > > > existing since ever....and forever......wherever > (your) > > mind > > > > > could, > > > > > > > ever, be conscious of.....whatever....however > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to be....Is this " knowledge " ...... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if this your " love " is realy pure....then you > > > > > > > also " know " .....that " knowledge " is all there > > is.......there > > > is > > > > > > > nothing else what you could percieve......with the > Self > > as > > > > witness > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you don't know the answer to my question, do you? > > > > > > be sincere... > > > > > > > > > > do you mean the answer that " you " expect....? > > > > > > > > > > maybe you don't agree with the answer i gave you.....but > the > > > > > question " where knowledge come from " .....is like the > > > > question " where > > > > > are the waves of the ocean come from " ......or " do the > ocean > > only > > > > > become real, when there is awareness of an existing > source of > > > this > > > > > waves " > > > > > > > > > > nobody ever care for any knowledge.....knowledge is " here > and > > now " > > > > > > > > > > whenever you are " here and now " ....the question of " where > > does > > > > > knowledge come from " .....disappear.... > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > hello marc, > > > > > > > > the verb disappear may imply that the question goes into a > > place > > > > where you are no more able to see it, or that you simply > close > > your > > > > eyes...and goes into darkness, unconsciousness. you go > asleep > > for a > > > > while, and the world disappears...a veil of ignorance is > there > > > around > > > > the word disappear. > > > > i prefer to use the verb dissolve. when the question > dissolve, > > i am > > > > still here to see what happens...what the question dissolve > > > into...i > > > > witness it. Energy previously structured into the question > is > > > > released, the question dissolved...this energy is love, the > > energy > > > of > > > > our own heart. > > > > have a good day, my luminous friend > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > you question has been " where does knowledge come from " ....i > gave > > you > > > few answers.... > > > maybe there is still misunderstanding ......but i think it's > more > > > a " different " kind of " view " ...... > > > you seem to " expect " that " your " answer to the question is > the > > only > > > valuable.....i can accept this your point.....but then, why > you > > want > > > to continue the discussion..... > > > do you want me to enter in some " illusions " ....in which i'm > not > > > interested to enter in...?.......i'm sorry...no interests > > > > > > this your " energy of love " .... " the energy of our own > heart " ..... > > > > > > this is related to your " ego- identification " ......missing, > with > > deep > > > love......endless peace > > > > > > yes...your expression of " dissolve " is better than > > the " disappear " .... > > > > > > i agree that the question dissolve for some reason..... > > > and i know that this reason is....inner peace...... > > > > > > this your " love " is only the effect of some mixture > of " truth " > > > and " illusions " ....this give for many people....some more of > less > > > wonderful and nice ....emotions.....thats all > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > Bon Jour, mes amies, > > > > > > the truth of the matter is This, > > > every thought without thinking > > > every emotion without > > > being > > > That > > > > > > creates endless love. > > > > > > " I Am " in experience, self-referenced in categorical > allegorical > > marked indispensible and crucially obcuring the essence of the > > presence that is ONE. > > > > > > Carpe Diem, > > > > > > Ana > > > > ...yes mon amie Ana....oui oui oui > > > > but wish you to get over this emotions....... > > which have definetly nothing to do with the peace of being > > > > Marc > > > > > > Non, mon amour, > > > > The emotions are exactly this perfect moment in time, > > all beautifully packaged in Now, tied with the roses of Love, > > > > Ana > > > you forgot..... " Nisargadatta-group " , at the feet of Ana > > lol > > > LOL, last poet standiing? > > I often do have a fierce, Niz face ;-) > > Blessings and Love, > Ana > > nobody realy care about " illusions " here.....don't worry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 10, 2006 Report Share Posted January 10, 2006 Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " Anna Ruiz " <nli10u@c...> wrote: > > > > > > - > > dennis_travis33 > > Nisargadatta > > Tuesday, January 10, 2006 5:54 AM > > Re: dissolve > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " Anna Ruiz " <nli10u@c...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > - > > > dennis_travis33 > > > Nisargadatta > > > Tuesday, January 10, 2006 5:42 AM > > > Re: dissolve > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " Anna Ruiz " > <nli10u@c...> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > dennis_travis33 > > > > Nisargadatta > > > > Tuesday, January 10, 2006 5:17 AM > > > > Re: dissolve > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > <bigwaaba> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > --- In Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > > > > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > Nisargadatta , " Anna > > > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dennis_travis33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To: Nisargadatta > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Monday, January 09, 2006 > 6:50 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: > Quotes > > from > > > Alan > > > > > Paton > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > Nisargadatta , " Anna > > > > > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dennis_travis33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To: > Nisargadatta > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Monday, January 09, > 2006 > > 6:15 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: > > Quotes > > > from > > > > > Alan > > > > > > > Paton > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > Nisargadatta , " Anna > > > > > > > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " To give up the task of > > reforming > > > > society > > > > > > is > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > up > > > > > > > > > > > > one's > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > responsibility as a free man. " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " What broke in a man that > he > > can > > > bring > > > > > > > himself > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > kill > > > > > > > > > > > > > > another? " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " Who knows for what we live > and > > > > struggle > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > die?...Wise > > > > > > > > > > > > > > men > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > write > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > many books, in words to hard > to > > > > > understand. > > > > > > > But > > > > > > > > > > this, > > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > purpose of > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > our lives, the end of all > > struggle, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is beyond all human wisdom. " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Alan Paton 1/11/1903- > 4/12/1988 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > South African novelist and > > activist > > > > > against > > > > > > > > > > apartheid > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >....everybody is > > > indead....free.....to > > > > > live > > > > > > > > > > > > > > life.....however, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > whenever,wherever,.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > some who don't feel to be > > > free....fight > > > > to > > > > > > > reach > > > > > > > > > > > > this...... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > some who feel to be > > free......enjoy > > > the > > > > > peace > > > > > > > > > > > of....being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and some who are free in > spirit > > ARE > > > the > > > > > > > skillful > > > > > > > > > > means > > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > bring > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > peace into the mind-body- soul- > > spirit > > > of > > > > the > > > > > > > > world. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > we have become the wounded > > healer. > > > we > > > > are > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > peace- > > > > > > > > > > > > being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > bringing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > light where darkness exists. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > do you want the waves to be > > transformed > > > into > > > > > > > > ocean?.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > i believe this is a nice > > ideal.....but it > > > > will > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > work..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remember my Beloved Marc, it is > > always a > > > > beLIEf > > > > > > > > first, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > an act of faith second and > > experienced at > > > > long > > > > > > last. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We do who we are. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Love > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > this is what is your > pesonal " experience " > > > > about.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > remember that it's this your > > > individual " concept " > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > perception > > > > > > > > > > > > > > about.......peace is concerned about > > > absolutely > > > > > > Nothing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear Marc, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > love is not personal... counsciousness > is > > not > > > > > personal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ...if with personal you mean that is > > confined > > > > > > somewhere... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hi, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > love is always in relation with the > emotions > > of a > > > > mind- > > > > > > > > concept > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > being....of identification with body- mind- > > > intellect > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > consciousness also.....because it change > in > > same > > > > > movement > > > > > > > > than > > > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > > > body-mind-intellect concept of being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (i thought that Werner explained the > > > consciousness- > > > > > > subject > > > > > > > > > nicely > > > > > > > > > > > > last week) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at least....i enjoyed his " view " about.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you would get another identification > than > > with > > > > this > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > body- > > > > > > > > > > > mind- > > > > > > > > > > > > intellect....than.... " who " is there > > > > > > still.....to " love " ..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > than there is nothing but Self.......and > all > > the > > > > change > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > forms > > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > It.......the reflection of the formless > and > > > changless > > > > > > > > Self..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > falling in love to this reflections?...... > > > > > > > > > > > > to love this refelctions of > oneSelf....?..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ok.... " who " care.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thats about your personal ego-mind > > > > perception......but > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > Self > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > always untouched by this moving mind > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ...the Self is taking care, the Self is > > loving... > > > > > > > > > > > falling in love with the Self? YES > > > > > > > > > > > to love this loving game of self > reflection? YES > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so Marc...ok...who cares? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the Self is the Self......nothing else > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you think that the Self > is " loving " .....thats > > your > > > > > > personal > > > > > > > > idea > > > > > > > > > > of.........nobody cares > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > i know that you are attached (love) this game > of > > self > > > > > > > > > > reflections.........nobody realy cares...... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it's your ego " who " take care (result) for/of > > your > > > > > > ego.....not > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > Self..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the Self is untouched.....to all your > illusions > > and > > > > related > > > > > > > > > > attachments and games and " loving " > concepts....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you want to wake up........give up the > ego..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thats what your real identity Is......the Self > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc, where does this knowledge come from? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > pure knowledge is pure love..... > > > > > > > > existing since ever....and forever......wherever > > (your) > > > mind > > > > > > could, > > > > > > > > ever, be conscious of.....whatever....however > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to be....Is this " knowledge " ...... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if this your " love " is realy pure....then you > > > > > > > > also " know " .....that " knowledge " is all there > > > is.......there > > > > is > > > > > > > > nothing else what you could percieve......with > the > > Self > > > as > > > > > witness > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you don't know the answer to my question, do you? > > > > > > > be sincere... > > > > > > > > > > > > do you mean the answer that " you " expect....? > > > > > > > > > > > > maybe you don't agree with the answer i gave > you.....but > > the > > > > > > question " where knowledge come from " .....is like the > > > > > question " where > > > > > > are the waves of the ocean come from " ......or " do the > > ocean > > > only > > > > > > become real, when there is awareness of an existing > > source of > > > > this > > > > > > waves " > > > > > > > > > > > > nobody ever care for any knowledge.....knowledge > is " here > > and > > > now " > > > > > > > > > > > > whenever you are " here and now " ....the question > of " where > > > does > > > > > > knowledge come from " .....disappear.... > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > hello marc, > > > > > > > > > > the verb disappear may imply that the question goes > into a > > > place > > > > > where you are no more able to see it, or that you > simply > > close > > > your > > > > > eyes...and goes into darkness, unconsciousness. you go > > asleep > > > for a > > > > > while, and the world disappears...a veil of ignorance > is > > there > > > > around > > > > > the word disappear. > > > > > i prefer to use the verb dissolve. when the question > > dissolve, > > > i am > > > > > still here to see what happens...what the question > dissolve > > > > into...i > > > > > witness it. Energy previously structured into the > question > > is > > > > > released, the question dissolved...this energy is love, > the > > > energy > > > > of > > > > > our own heart. > > > > > have a good day, my luminous friend > > > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > you question has been " where does knowledge come > from " ....i > > gave > > > you > > > > few answers.... > > > > maybe there is still misunderstanding ......but i think > it's > > more > > > > a " different " kind of " view " ...... > > > > you seem to " expect " that " your " answer to the question > is > > the > > > only > > > > valuable.....i can accept this your point.....but then, > why > > you > > > want > > > > to continue the discussion..... > > > > do you want me to enter in some " illusions " ....in which > i'm > > not > > > > interested to enter in...?.......i'm sorry...no interests > > > > > > > > this your " energy of love " .... " the energy of our own > > heart " ..... > > > > > > > > this is related to your " ego- > identification " ......missing, > > with > > > deep > > > > love......endless peace > > > > > > > > yes...your expression of " dissolve " is better than > > > the " disappear " .... > > > > > > > > i agree that the question dissolve for some reason..... > > > > and i know that this reason is....inner peace...... > > > > > > > > this your " love " is only the effect of some mixture > > of " truth " > > > > and " illusions " ....this give for many people....some more > of > > less > > > > wonderful and nice ....emotions.....thats all > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > Bon Jour, mes amies, > > > > > > > > the truth of the matter is This, > > > > every thought without thinking > > > > every emotion without > > > > being > > > > That > > > > > > > > creates endless love. > > > > > > > > " I Am " in experience, self-referenced in categorical > > allegorical > > > marked indispensible and crucially obcuring the essence of > the > > > presence that is ONE. > > > > > > > > Carpe Diem, > > > > > > > > Ana > > > > > > ...yes mon amie Ana....oui oui oui > > > > > > but wish you to get over this emotions....... > > > which have definetly nothing to do with the peace of being > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > Non, mon amour, > > > > > > The emotions are exactly this perfect moment in time, > > > all beautifully packaged in Now, tied with the roses of Love, > > > > > > Ana > > > > > > you forgot..... " Nisargadatta-group " , at the feet of Ana > > > > lol > > > > > > LOL, last poet standiing? > > > > I often do have a fierce, Niz face ;-) > > > > Blessings and Love, > > Ana > > > > > > nobody realy care about " illusions " here.....don't worry > > > lol maybe that's the reason you're surrounded by them... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 10, 2006 Report Share Posted January 10, 2006 Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " <bigwaaba> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " <bigwaaba> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > <bigwaaba> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > > > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " Anna > > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dennis_travis33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Monday, January 09, 2006 6:50 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: Quotes from > > Alan > > > > Paton > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > Nisargadatta , " Anna > > > > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dennis_travis33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Monday, January 09, 2006 6:15 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: Quotes > from > > > > Alan > > > > > > Paton > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > Nisargadatta , " Anna > > > > > > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " To give up the task of reforming > > > society > > > > > is > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > up > > > > > > > > > > > one's > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > responsibility as a free man. " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " What broke in a man that he can > > bring > > > > > > himself > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > kill > > > > > > > > > > > > > another? " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " Who knows for what we live and > > > struggle > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > die?...Wise > > > > > > > > > > > > > men > > > > > > > > > > > > > > write > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > many books, in words to hard to > > > > understand. > > > > > > But > > > > > > > > > this, > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > purpose of > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > our lives, the end of all struggle, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is beyond all human wisdom. " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Alan Paton 1/11/1903-4/12/1988 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > South African novelist and activist > > > > against > > > > > > > > > apartheid > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >....everybody is > indead....free.....to > > > > live > > > > > > > > > > > > > life.....however, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > whenever,wherever,.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > some who don't feel to be > free....fight > > > to > > > > > > reach > > > > > > > > > > > this...... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > some who feel to be free......enjoy > the > > > > peace > > > > > > > > > > of....being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and some who are free in spirit ARE > the > > > > > > skillful > > > > > > > > > means > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > > bring > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > peace into the mind-body-soul- spirit > of > > > the > > > > > > > world. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > we have become the wounded healer. > we > > > are > > > > > the > > > > > > > > peace- > > > > > > > > > > > being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > bringing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > light where darkness exists. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > do you want the waves to be transformed > > into > > > > > > > ocean?.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > i believe this is a nice ideal.....but it > > > will > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > work..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remember my Beloved Marc, it is always a > > > beLIEf > > > > > > > first, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > an act of faith second and experienced at > > > long > > > > > last. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We do who we are. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Love > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > this is what is your pesonal " experience " > > > about.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > remember that it's this your > > individual " concept " > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > perception > > > > > > > > > > > > > about.......peace is concerned about > absolutely > > > > > Nothing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear Marc, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > love is not personal... counsciousness is not > > > > personal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ...if with personal you mean that is confined > > > > > somewhere... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hi, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > love is always in relation with the emotions of a > > > mind- > > > > > > > concept > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > being....of identification with body-mind- > intellect > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > consciousness also.....because it change in same > > > > movement > > > > > > > than > > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > > body-mind-intellect concept of being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (i thought that Werner explained the > consciousness- > > > > > subject > > > > > > > > nicely > > > > > > > > > > > last week) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at least....i enjoyed his " view " about.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you would get another identification than with > > > this > > > > > your > > > > > > > > body- > > > > > > > > > > mind- > > > > > > > > > > > intellect....than.... " who " is there > > > > > still.....to " love " ..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > than there is nothing but Self.......and all the > > > change > > > > > of > > > > > > > > forms > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > It.......the reflection of the formless and > > changless > > > > > > > Self..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > falling in love to this reflections?...... > > > > > > > > > > > to love this refelctions of oneSelf....?..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ok.... " who " care.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thats about your personal ego-mind > > > perception......but > > > > > the > > > > > > > Self > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > always untouched by this moving mind > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ...the Self is taking care, the Self is loving... > > > > > > > > > > falling in love with the Self? YES > > > > > > > > > > to love this loving game of self reflection? YES > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so Marc...ok...who cares? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the Self is the Self......nothing else > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you think that the Self is " loving " .....thats your > > > > > personal > > > > > > > idea > > > > > > > > > of.........nobody cares > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > i know that you are attached (love) this game of self > > > > > > > > > reflections.........nobody realy cares...... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it's your ego " who " take care (result) for/of your > > > > > ego.....not > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > Self..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the Self is untouched.....to all your illusions and > > > related > > > > > > > > > attachments and games and " loving " concepts....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you want to wake up........give up the ego..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thats what your real identity Is......the Self > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc, where does this knowledge come from? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > pure knowledge is pure love..... > > > > > > > existing since ever....and forever......wherever (your) > > mind > > > > > could, > > > > > > > ever, be conscious of.....whatever....however > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to be....Is this " knowledge " ...... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if this your " love " is realy pure....then you > > > > > > > also " know " .....that " knowledge " is all there > > is.......there > > > is > > > > > > > nothing else what you could percieve......with the Self > as > > > > witness > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you don't know the answer to my question, do you? > > > > > > be sincere... > > > > > > > > > > do you mean the answer that " you " expect....? > > > > > > > > > > maybe you don't agree with the answer i gave you.....but the > > > > > question " where knowledge come from " .....is like the > > > > question " where > > > > > are the waves of the ocean come from " ......or " do the ocean > > only > > > > > become real, when there is awareness of an existing source of > > > this > > > > > waves " > > > > > > > > > > nobody ever care for any knowledge.....knowledge is " here and > > now " > > > > > > > > > > whenever you are " here and now " ....the question of " where > does > > > > > knowledge come from " .....disappear.... > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > hello marc, > > > > > > > > the verb disappear may imply that the question goes into a > place > > > > where you are no more able to see it, or that you simply close > > your > > > > eyes...and goes into darkness, unconsciousness. you go asleep > for > > a > > > > while, and the world disappears...a veil of ignorance is there > > > around > > > > the word disappear. > > > > i prefer to use the verb dissolve. when the question dissolve, > i > > am > > > > still here to see what happens...what the question dissolve > > > into...i > > > > witness it. Energy previously structured into the question is > > > > released, the question dissolved...this energy is love, the > > energy > > > of > > > > our own heart. > > > > have a good day, my luminous friend > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > you question has been " where does knowledge come from " ....i gave > > you > > > few answers.... > > > maybe there is still misunderstanding ......but i think it's more > > > a " different " kind of " view " ...... > > > you seem to " expect " that " your " answer to the question is the > only > > > valuable.....i can accept this your point.....but then, why you > > want > > > to continue the discussion..... > > > do you want me to enter in some " illusions " ....in which i'm not > > > interested to enter in...?.......i'm sorry...no interests > > > > > > this your " energy of love " .... " the energy of our own heart " ..... > > > > > > this is related to your " ego-identification " ......missing, with > > deep > > > love......endless peace > > > > > > yes...your expression of " dissolve " is better than > > the " disappear " .... > > > > > > i agree that the question dissolve for some reason..... > > > and i know that this reason is....inner peace...... > > > > > > this your " love " is only the effect of some mixture of " truth " > > > and " illusions " ....this give for many people....some more of less > > > wonderful and nice ....emotions.....thats all > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > no... i do not want you to enter into some illusion...it is > > interesting this expression: mixture of truth and illusions...it > > could be fun, don't you think? at least a way to stay far from > being > > a fanatic! > > and i do prefer it indeed: being a mixture is being richer, more > > fluid, more dinamic, alive. > > points of view are different, of course but meeting, coming closer, > a > > new point of view, a new mixture is given the possibility to be > born, > > an expanded point of view, a new world, not yours, not mine... > > > > > good....that you let me....in peace..... > > maybe you don't understand what i mean,,,,,,and maybe my expression > is not enough ....... > > but i don't want to exchange this my peace with some illusions.....of > being " this or that " ..... > > worlds are not real....the world change as fast as your mind > change.... > > no need to exchange emotions and funny talk to some " others " .... > > you can change this your " world-perception " with all thoughts you > get.....and all moments of peace you get.....and all the deepest love > you can ever feel....and so on....... > > just like being sure...that today....when you will enter in > dream....during sleep.....next night.......you will dream > another " world " ......another one than last night > > ......world is a fiction....a construction of ego-mind......limited > by time and space........ > > when the ego-mind is destroyed......there is only a " relative > world.....and relative ego existing.... " > > which realy (message of Silver) give the impression ....to > be " invisible " ......to no more " existing " .......except as " witness " > of a " world " ....which is no more " of mine " .... > > Marc I heard my name. Just thought I'd come and watch with you. " Silver " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 10, 2006 Report Share Posted January 10, 2006 - dennis_travis33 Nisargadatta Tuesday, January 10, 2006 6:02 AM Re: dissolve Nisargadatta , " Anna Ruiz " <nli10u@c...> wrote: > > > - > dennis_travis33 > Nisargadatta > Tuesday, January 10, 2006 5:54 AM > Re: dissolve > > > Nisargadatta , " Anna Ruiz " <nli10u@c...> wrote: > > > > > > - > > dennis_travis33 > > Nisargadatta > > Tuesday, January 10, 2006 5:42 AM > > Re: dissolve > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " Anna Ruiz " <nli10u@c...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > - > > > dennis_travis33 > > > Nisargadatta > > > Tuesday, January 10, 2006 5:17 AM > > > Re: dissolve > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > <bigwaaba> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > <bigwaaba> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > > > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > Nisargadatta , " Anna > > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dennis_travis33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Monday, January 09, 2006 6:50 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: Quotes > from > > Alan > > > > Paton > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > Nisargadatta , " Anna > > > > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dennis_travis33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To: Nisargadatta > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Monday, January 09, 2006 > 6:15 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: > Quotes > > from > > > > Alan > > > > > > Paton > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > Nisargadatta , " Anna > > > > > > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " To give up the task of > reforming > > > society > > > > > is > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > up > > > > > > > > > > > one's > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > responsibility as a free man. " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " What broke in a man that he > can > > bring > > > > > > himself > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > kill > > > > > > > > > > > > > another? " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " Who knows for what we live and > > > struggle > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > die?...Wise > > > > > > > > > > > > > men > > > > > > > > > > > > > > write > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > many books, in words to hard to > > > > understand. > > > > > > But > > > > > > > > > this, > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > purpose of > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > our lives, the end of all > struggle, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is beyond all human wisdom. " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Alan Paton 1/11/1903- 4/12/1988 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > South African novelist and > activist > > > > against > > > > > > > > > apartheid > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >....everybody is > > indead....free.....to > > > > live > > > > > > > > > > > > > life.....however, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > whenever,wherever,.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > some who don't feel to be > > free....fight > > > to > > > > > > reach > > > > > > > > > > > this...... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > some who feel to be > free......enjoy > > the > > > > peace > > > > > > > > > > of....being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and some who are free in spirit > ARE > > the > > > > > > skillful > > > > > > > > > means > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > > bring > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > peace into the mind-body-soul- > spirit > > of > > > the > > > > > > > world. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > we have become the wounded > healer. > > we > > > are > > > > > the > > > > > > > > peace- > > > > > > > > > > > being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > bringing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > light where darkness exists. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > do you want the waves to be > transformed > > into > > > > > > > ocean?.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > i believe this is a nice > ideal.....but it > > > will > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > work..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remember my Beloved Marc, it is > always a > > > beLIEf > > > > > > > first, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > an act of faith second and > experienced at > > > long > > > > > last. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We do who we are. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Love > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > this is what is your pesonal " experience " > > > about.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > remember that it's this your > > individual " concept " > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > perception > > > > > > > > > > > > > about.......peace is concerned about > > absolutely > > > > > Nothing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear Marc, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > love is not personal... counsciousness is > not > > > > personal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ...if with personal you mean that is > confined > > > > > somewhere... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hi, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > love is always in relation with the emotions > of a > > > mind- > > > > > > > concept > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > being....of identification with body-mind- > > intellect > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > consciousness also.....because it change in > same > > > > movement > > > > > > > than > > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > > body-mind-intellect concept of being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (i thought that Werner explained the > > consciousness- > > > > > subject > > > > > > > > nicely > > > > > > > > > > > last week) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at least....i enjoyed his " view " about.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you would get another identification than > with > > > this > > > > > your > > > > > > > > body- > > > > > > > > > > mind- > > > > > > > > > > > intellect....than.... " who " is there > > > > > still.....to " love " ..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > than there is nothing but Self.......and all > the > > > change > > > > > of > > > > > > > > forms > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > It.......the reflection of the formless and > > changless > > > > > > > Self..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > falling in love to this reflections?...... > > > > > > > > > > > to love this refelctions of oneSelf....?..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ok.... " who " care.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thats about your personal ego-mind > > > perception......but > > > > > the > > > > > > > Self > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > always untouched by this moving mind > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ...the Self is taking care, the Self is > loving... > > > > > > > > > > falling in love with the Self? YES > > > > > > > > > > to love this loving game of self reflection? YES > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so Marc...ok...who cares? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the Self is the Self......nothing else > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you think that the Self is " loving " .....thats > your > > > > > personal > > > > > > > idea > > > > > > > > > of.........nobody cares > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > i know that you are attached (love) this game of > self > > > > > > > > > reflections.........nobody realy cares...... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it's your ego " who " take care (result) for/of > your > > > > > ego.....not > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > Self..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the Self is untouched.....to all your illusions > and > > > related > > > > > > > > > attachments and games and " loving " concepts....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you want to wake up........give up the ego..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thats what your real identity Is......the Self > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc, where does this knowledge come from? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > pure knowledge is pure love..... > > > > > > > existing since ever....and forever......wherever > (your) > > mind > > > > > could, > > > > > > > ever, be conscious of.....whatever....however > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to be....Is this " knowledge " ...... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if this your " love " is realy pure....then you > > > > > > > also " know " .....that " knowledge " is all there > > is.......there > > > is > > > > > > > nothing else what you could percieve......with the > Self > > as > > > > witness > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you don't know the answer to my question, do you? > > > > > > be sincere... > > > > > > > > > > do you mean the answer that " you " expect....? > > > > > > > > > > maybe you don't agree with the answer i gave you.....but > the > > > > > question " where knowledge come from " .....is like the > > > > question " where > > > > > are the waves of the ocean come from " ......or " do the > ocean > > only > > > > > become real, when there is awareness of an existing > source of > > > this > > > > > waves " > > > > > > > > > > nobody ever care for any knowledge.....knowledge is " here > and > > now " > > > > > > > > > > whenever you are " here and now " ....the question of " where > > does > > > > > knowledge come from " .....disappear.... > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > hello marc, > > > > > > > > the verb disappear may imply that the question goes into a > > place > > > > where you are no more able to see it, or that you simply > close > > your > > > > eyes...and goes into darkness, unconsciousness. you go > asleep > > for a > > > > while, and the world disappears...a veil of ignorance is > there > > > around > > > > the word disappear. > > > > i prefer to use the verb dissolve. when the question > dissolve, > > i am > > > > still here to see what happens...what the question dissolve > > > into...i > > > > witness it. Energy previously structured into the question > is > > > > released, the question dissolved...this energy is love, the > > energy > > > of > > > > our own heart. > > > > have a good day, my luminous friend > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > you question has been " where does knowledge come from " ....i > gave > > you > > > few answers.... > > > maybe there is still misunderstanding ......but i think it's > more > > > a " different " kind of " view " ...... > > > you seem to " expect " that " your " answer to the question is > the > > only > > > valuable.....i can accept this your point.....but then, why > you > > want > > > to continue the discussion..... > > > do you want me to enter in some " illusions " ....in which i'm > not > > > interested to enter in...?.......i'm sorry...no interests > > > > > > this your " energy of love " .... " the energy of our own > heart " ..... > > > > > > this is related to your " ego- identification " ......missing, > with > > deep > > > love......endless peace > > > > > > yes...your expression of " dissolve " is better than > > the " disappear " .... > > > > > > i agree that the question dissolve for some reason..... > > > and i know that this reason is....inner peace...... > > > > > > this your " love " is only the effect of some mixture > of " truth " > > > and " illusions " ....this give for many people....some more of > less > > > wonderful and nice ....emotions.....thats all > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > Bon Jour, mes amies, > > > > > > the truth of the matter is This, > > > every thought without thinking > > > every emotion without > > > being > > > That > > > > > > creates endless love. > > > > > > " I Am " in experience, self-referenced in categorical > allegorical > > marked indispensible and crucially obcuring the essence of the > > presence that is ONE. > > > > > > Carpe Diem, > > > > > > Ana > > > > ...yes mon amie Ana....oui oui oui > > > > but wish you to get over this emotions....... > > which have definetly nothing to do with the peace of being > > > > Marc > > > > > > Non, mon amour, > > > > The emotions are exactly this perfect moment in time, > > all beautifully packaged in Now, tied with the roses of Love, > > > > Ana > > > you forgot..... " Nisargadatta-group " , at the feet of Ana > > lol > > > LOL, last poet standiing? > > I often do have a fierce, Niz face ;-) > > Blessings and Love, > Ana > > nobody realy care about " illusions " here.....don't worry noOne is an illusion though everyOne is of a delusional mind rowing ashore in sinking ship, you know what they say about loose lips ;-) now who minds that mind is another story... and how many stories does it take to unmind oneSelf? when there is just One mind, it gets quite lonely and quite Silent VOILA the mind starts mining again for the multifaceted, uncut diamond-in-the-rock that calls him/herself " I AM " or in my case, since I AM the only One -- " YOU " . hehe, Ana ** If you do not wish to receive individual emails, to change your subscription, sign in with your ID and go to Edit My Groups: /mygroups?edit=1 Under the Message Delivery option, choose " No Email " for the Nisargadatta group and click on Save Changes. 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Guest guest Posted January 10, 2006 Report Share Posted January 10, 2006 Nisargadatta , " Anna Ruiz " <nli10u@c...> wrote: > > > - > dennis_travis33 > Nisargadatta > Tuesday, January 10, 2006 6:02 AM > Re: dissolve > > > Nisargadatta , " Anna Ruiz " <nli10u@c...> wrote: > > > > > > - > > dennis_travis33 > > Nisargadatta > > Tuesday, January 10, 2006 5:54 AM > > Re: dissolve > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " Anna Ruiz " <nli10u@c...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > - > > > dennis_travis33 > > > Nisargadatta > > > Tuesday, January 10, 2006 5:42 AM > > > Re: dissolve > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " Anna Ruiz " > <nli10u@c...> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > dennis_travis33 > > > > Nisargadatta > > > > Tuesday, January 10, 2006 5:17 AM > > > > Re: dissolve > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > <bigwaaba> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > --- In Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " > > > > > > > > <bigwaaba> > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > > > > > > > > > > > <dennis_travis33> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > Nisargadatta , " Anna > > > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dennis_travis33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To: Nisargadatta > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Monday, January 09, 2006 > 6:50 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: > Quotes > > from > > > Alan > > > > > Paton > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > Nisargadatta , " Anna > > > > > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message --- -- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dennis_travis33 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To: > Nisargadatta > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Monday, January 09, > 2006 > > 6:15 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Re: > > Quotes > > > from > > > > > Alan > > > > > > > Paton > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In > > > > Nisargadatta , " Anna > > > > > > > Ruiz " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <nli10u@c...> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " To give up the task of > > reforming > > > > society > > > > > > is > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > up > > > > > > > > > > > > one's > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > responsibility as a free man. " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " What broke in a man that > he > > can > > > bring > > > > > > > himself > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > kill > > > > > > > > > > > > > > another? " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " Who knows for what we live > and > > > > struggle > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > die?...Wise > > > > > > > > > > > > > > men > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > write > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > many books, in words to hard > to > > > > > understand. > > > > > > > But > > > > > > > > > > this, > > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > purpose of > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > our lives, the end of all > > struggle, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > is beyond all human wisdom. " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Alan Paton 1/11/1903- > 4/12/1988 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > South African novelist and > > activist > > > > > against > > > > > > > > > > apartheid > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >....everybody is > > > indead....free.....to > > > > > live > > > > > > > > > > > > > > life.....however, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > whenever,wherever,.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > some who don't feel to be > > > free....fight > > > > to > > > > > > > reach > > > > > > > > > > > > this...... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > some who feel to be > > free......enjoy > > > the > > > > > peace > > > > > > > > > > > of....being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and some who are free in > spirit > > ARE > > > the > > > > > > > skillful > > > > > > > > > > means > > > > > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > bring > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > peace into the mind-body- soul- > > spirit > > > of > > > > the > > > > > > > > world. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > we have become the wounded > > healer. > > > we > > > > are > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > peace- > > > > > > > > > > > > being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > bringing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > light where darkness exists. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > do you want the waves to be > > transformed > > > into > > > > > > > > ocean?.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > i believe this is a nice > > ideal.....but it > > > > will > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > work..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Remember my Beloved Marc, it is > > always a > > > > beLIEf > > > > > > > > first, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > an act of faith second and > > experienced at > > > > long > > > > > > last. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > We do who we are. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Love > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > this is what is your > pesonal " experience " > > > > about.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > remember that it's this your > > > individual " concept " > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > perception > > > > > > > > > > > > > > about.......peace is concerned about > > > absolutely > > > > > > Nothing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > dear Marc, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > love is not personal... counsciousness > is > > not > > > > > personal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ...if with personal you mean that is > > confined > > > > > > somewhere... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hi, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > love is always in relation with the > emotions > > of a > > > > mind- > > > > > > > > concept > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > being....of identification with body- mind- > > > intellect > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > consciousness also.....because it change > in > > same > > > > > movement > > > > > > > > than > > > > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > > > body-mind-intellect concept of being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (i thought that Werner explained the > > > consciousness- > > > > > > subject > > > > > > > > > nicely > > > > > > > > > > > > last week) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > at least....i enjoyed his " view " about.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you would get another identification > than > > with > > > > this > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > body- > > > > > > > > > > > mind- > > > > > > > > > > > > intellect....than.... " who " is there > > > > > > still.....to " love " ..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > than there is nothing but Self.......and > all > > the > > > > change > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > forms > > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > It.......the reflection of the formless > and > > > changless > > > > > > > > Self..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > falling in love to this reflections?...... > > > > > > > > > > > > to love this refelctions of > oneSelf....?..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ok.... " who " care.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thats about your personal ego-mind > > > > perception......but > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > Self > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > always untouched by this moving mind > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ...the Self is taking care, the Self is > > loving... > > > > > > > > > > > falling in love with the Self? YES > > > > > > > > > > > to love this loving game of self > reflection? YES > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so Marc...ok...who cares? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the Self is the Self......nothing else > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you think that the Self > is " loving " .....thats > > your > > > > > > personal > > > > > > > > idea > > > > > > > > > > of.........nobody cares > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > i know that you are attached (love) this game > of > > self > > > > > > > > > > reflections.........nobody realy cares...... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it's your ego " who " take care (result) for/of > > your > > > > > > ego.....not > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > Self..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the Self is untouched.....to all your > illusions > > and > > > > related > > > > > > > > > > attachments and games and " loving " > concepts....... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if you want to wake up........give up the > ego..... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thats what your real identity Is......the Self > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc, where does this knowledge come from? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > pure knowledge is pure love..... > > > > > > > > existing since ever....and forever......wherever > > (your) > > > mind > > > > > > could, > > > > > > > > ever, be conscious of.....whatever....however > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > to be....Is this " knowledge " ...... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if this your " love " is realy pure....then you > > > > > > > > also " know " .....that " knowledge " is all there > > > is.......there > > > > is > > > > > > > > nothing else what you could percieve......with > the > > Self > > > as > > > > > witness > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you don't know the answer to my question, do you? > > > > > > > be sincere... > > > > > > > > > > > > do you mean the answer that " you " expect....? > > > > > > > > > > > > maybe you don't agree with the answer i gave > you.....but > > the > > > > > > question " where knowledge come from " .....is like the > > > > > question " where > > > > > > are the waves of the ocean come from " ......or " do the > > ocean > > > only > > > > > > become real, when there is awareness of an existing > > source of > > > > this > > > > > > waves " > > > > > > > > > > > > nobody ever care for any knowledge.....knowledge > is " here > > and > > > now " > > > > > > > > > > > > whenever you are " here and now " ....the question > of " where > > > does > > > > > > knowledge come from " .....disappear.... > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > hello marc, > > > > > > > > > > the verb disappear may imply that the question goes > into a > > > place > > > > > where you are no more able to see it, or that you > simply > > close > > > your > > > > > eyes...and goes into darkness, unconsciousness. you go > > asleep > > > for a > > > > > while, and the world disappears...a veil of ignorance > is > > there > > > > around > > > > > the word disappear. > > > > > i prefer to use the verb dissolve. when the question > > dissolve, > > > i am > > > > > still here to see what happens...what the question > dissolve > > > > into...i > > > > > witness it. Energy previously structured into the > question > > is > > > > > released, the question dissolved...this energy is love, > the > > > energy > > > > of > > > > > our own heart. > > > > > have a good day, my luminous friend > > > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > you question has been " where does knowledge come > from " ....i > > gave > > > you > > > > few answers.... > > > > maybe there is still misunderstanding ......but i think > it's > > more > > > > a " different " kind of " view " ...... > > > > you seem to " expect " that " your " answer to the question > is > > the > > > only > > > > valuable.....i can accept this your point.....but then, > why > > you > > > want > > > > to continue the discussion..... > > > > do you want me to enter in some " illusions " ....in which > i'm > > not > > > > interested to enter in...?.......i'm sorry...no interests > > > > > > > > this your " energy of love " .... " the energy of our own > > heart " ..... > > > > > > > > this is related to your " ego- > identification " ......missing, > > with > > > deep > > > > love......endless peace > > > > > > > > yes...your expression of " dissolve " is better than > > > the " disappear " .... > > > > > > > > i agree that the question dissolve for some reason..... > > > > and i know that this reason is....inner peace...... > > > > > > > > this your " love " is only the effect of some mixture > > of " truth " > > > > and " illusions " ....this give for many people....some more > of > > less > > > > wonderful and nice ....emotions.....thats all > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > Bon Jour, mes amies, > > > > > > > > the truth of the matter is This, > > > > every thought without thinking > > > > every emotion without > > > > being > > > > That > > > > > > > > creates endless love. > > > > > > > > " I Am " in experience, self-referenced in categorical > > allegorical > > > marked indispensible and crucially obcuring the essence of > the > > > presence that is ONE. > > > > > > > > Carpe Diem, > > > > > > > > Ana > > > > > > ...yes mon amie Ana....oui oui oui > > > > > > but wish you to get over this emotions....... > > > which have definetly nothing to do with the peace of being > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > Non, mon amour, > > > > > > The emotions are exactly this perfect moment in time, > > > all beautifully packaged in Now, tied with the roses of Love, > > > > > > Ana > > > > > > you forgot..... " Nisargadatta-group " , at the feet of Ana > > > > lol > > > > > > LOL, last poet standiing? > > > > I often do have a fierce, Niz face ;-) > > > > Blessings and Love, > > Ana > > > > > > nobody realy care about " illusions " here.....don't worry > > > > > noOne is an illusion > though everyOne is of a delusional mind rowing ashore in sinking ship, > you know what they say about loose lips ;-) > > now who minds that mind > is another story... > > and how many stories does it take to unmind oneSelf? > > when there is just One mind, > it gets quite lonely and quite Silent > > VOILA > > the mind starts mining again for the multifaceted, uncut > diamond-in-the-rock that calls him/herself " I AM " or in > my case, since I AM the only One -- " YOU " . > > hehe, > > Ana ....yes true....you write about this " your case " ..... whatever is....is " your " fiction...... the problem is that you make identification of this " You " ....with the fiction that " you " percieve get out of dream.....or, if you want....keep on dreaming...... you are free to do what you want..... but know that " you " are the One.... " who " is responsible for this your " view " of things.......nobody else Marc > > > ** > > If you do not wish to receive individual emails, to change your subscription, sign in with your ID and go to Edit My Groups: > > /mygroups?edit=1 > > Under the Message Delivery option, choose " No Email " for the Nisargadatta group and click on Save Changes. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 11, 2006 Report Share Posted January 11, 2006 Hi, you question has been " where does knowledge come from " ....i gave you few answers.... maybe there is still misunderstanding ......but i think it's more a " different " kind of " view " ...... you seem to " expect " that " your " answer to the question is the only valuable.....i can accept this your point.....but then, why you want to continue the discussion..... do you want me to enter in some " illusions " ....in which i'm not interested to enter in...?.......i'm sorry...no interests this your " energy of love " .... " the energy of our own heart " ..... this is related to your " ego-identification " ......missing, with deep love......endless peace yes...your expression of " dissolve " is better than the " disappear " .... i agree that the question dissolve for some reason..... and i know that this reason is....inner peace...... this your " love " is only the effect of some mixture of " truth " and " illusions " ....this give for many people....some more of less wonderful and nice ....emotions.....thats all Marc Yes, Marc, I agree with what you've been saying. I used to have meditations in which I knew all the answers to God, the universe and everything. The moment my mind engaged it, it was like grasping at air. Not only did I not know the answers, I didn't even know the questions. This happened repeatedly until I finally realized that it's not that there were no answers so much as the questions were meaningless. The mind is not designed to grasp Truth. All questions asked within the illusion can only have illusory answers because the question is based on the false premise of illusion. Where does knowledge come from? What book did you read it in? What teacher did you hear it from? If we're talking about the absolute source of knowledge, there is no answer because knowledge is the province of mind only. Knowledge presupposes a knower and that which is known. It assumes a process of acquiring information about something that is not known. It assumes facts and falsehoods. These are all illusions. It's much simpler than that for that which IS truth. Is it believed that God has to figure out how He works? Phil P.S. The digests have started coming through as attachments that I can't download, so I'm on a campaign to shorten these posts. ~ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 11, 2006 Report Share Posted January 11, 2006 > Hi, > > you question has been " where does knowledge come from " ....i gave you > few answers.... > maybe there is still misunderstanding ......but i think it's more > a " different " kind of " view " ...... > you seem to " expect " that " your " answer to the question is the only > valuable.....i can accept this your point.....but then, why you want > to continue the discussion..... > do you want me to enter in some " illusions " ....in which i'm not > interested to enter in...?.......i'm sorry...no interests > > this your " energy of love " .... " the energy of our own heart " ..... > > this is related to your " ego-identification " ......missing, with deep > love......endless peace > > yes...your expression of " dissolve " is better than the " disappear " .... > > i agree that the question dissolve for some reason..... > and i know that this reason is....inner peace...... > > this your " love " is only the effect of some mixture of " truth " > and " illusions " ....this give for many people....some more of less > wonderful and nice ....emotions.....thats all > > Marc > > no... i do not want you to enter into some illusion...it is interesting this expression: mixture of truth and illusions...it could be fun, don't you think? at least a way to stay far from being a fanatic! and i do prefer it indeed: being a mixture is being richer, more fluid, more dinamic, alive. points of view are different, of course but meeting, coming closer, a new point of view, a new mixture is given the possibility to be born, an expanded point of view, a new world, not yours, not mine... I agree that being a mixture of truth and illusion, as you say, is better than wallowing in illusion only. There is value in such powerful experiences that have tempered the illusion for you. All that is being said is that there remains a third option (Truth). Keep going and don't get stuck in the mixture. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 11, 2006 Report Share Posted January 11, 2006 Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@A... wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > you question has been " where does knowledge come from " ....i gave > you > > few answers.... > > maybe there is still misunderstanding ......but i think it's more > > a " different " kind of " view " ...... > > you seem to " expect " that " your " answer to the question is the only > > valuable.....i can accept this your point.....but then, why you > want > > to continue the discussion..... > > do you want me to enter in some " illusions " ....in which i'm not > > interested to enter in...?.......i'm sorry...no interests > > > > this your " energy of love " .... " the energy of our own heart " ..... > > > > this is related to your " ego-identification " ......missing, with > deep > > love......endless peace > > > > yes...your expression of " dissolve " is better than > the " disappear " .... > > > > i agree that the question dissolve for some reason..... > > and i know that this reason is....inner peace...... > > > > this your " love " is only the effect of some mixture of " truth " > > and " illusions " ....this give for many people....some more of less > > wonderful and nice ....emotions.....thats all > > > > Marc > > > > > no... i do not want you to enter into some illusion...it is > interesting this expression: mixture of truth and illusions...it > could be fun, don't you think? at least a way to stay far from being > a fanatic! > and i do prefer it indeed: being a mixture is being richer, more > fluid, more dinamic, alive. > points of view are different, of course but meeting, coming closer, a > new point of view, a new mixture is given the possibility to be born, > an expanded point of view, a new world, not yours, not mine... > > > > > I agree that being a mixture of truth and illusion, as you say, is better > than wallowing in illusion only. There is value in such powerful experiences > that have tempered the illusion for you. All that is being said is that there > remains a third option (Truth). Keep going and don't get stuck in the mixture. > > Phil > > thank you Phil, i will keep going... i am going...what gets stuck is the thought to possess Truth, in every form mind can picture... love to you > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 11, 2006 Report Share Posted January 11, 2006 - bigwaaba Nisargadatta Wednesday, January 11, 2006 5:33 AM Re: Dissolve Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@A... wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > you question has been " where does knowledge come from " ....i gave > you > > few answers.... > > maybe there is still misunderstanding ......but i think it's more > > a " different " kind of " view " ...... > > you seem to " expect " that " your " answer to the question is the only > > valuable.....i can accept this your point.....but then, why you > want > > to continue the discussion..... > > do you want me to enter in some " illusions " ....in which i'm not > > interested to enter in...?.......i'm sorry...no interests > > > > this your " energy of love " .... " the energy of our own heart " ..... > > > > this is related to your " ego-identification " ......missing, with > deep > > love......endless peace > > > > yes...your expression of " dissolve " is better than > the " disappear " .... > > > > i agree that the question dissolve for some reason..... > > and i know that this reason is....inner peace...... > > > > this your " love " is only the effect of some mixture of " truth " > > and " illusions " ....this give for many people....some more of less > > wonderful and nice ....emotions.....thats all > > > > Marc > > > > > no... i do not want you to enter into some illusion...it is > interesting this expression: mixture of truth and illusions...it > could be fun, don't you think? at least a way to stay far from being > a fanatic! > and i do prefer it indeed: being a mixture is being richer, more > fluid, more dinamic, alive. > points of view are different, of course but meeting, coming closer, a > new point of view, a new mixture is given the possibility to be born, > an expanded point of view, a new world, not yours, not mine... > > > > > I agree that being a mixture of truth and illusion, as you say, is better > than wallowing in illusion only. There is value in such powerful experiences > that have tempered the illusion for you. All that is being said is that there > remains a third option (Truth). Keep going and don't get stuck in the mixture. > > Phil > > thank you Phil, i will keep going... i am going...what gets stuck is the thought to possess Truth, in every form mind can picture... love to you AHHHHHHHHHHH..... OOOOOOOOmmmmmmm. ana > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 11, 2006 Report Share Posted January 11, 2006 Nisargadatta , " Anna Ruiz " <nli10u@c...> wrote: > > > - > bigwaaba > Nisargadatta > Wednesday, January 11, 2006 5:33 AM > Re: Dissolve > > > Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@A... wrote: > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > you question has been " where does knowledge come from " ....i gave > > you > > > few answers.... > > > maybe there is still misunderstanding ......but i think it's more > > > a " different " kind of " view " ...... > > > you seem to " expect " that " your " answer to the question is the > only > > > valuable.....i can accept this your point.....but then, why you > > want > > > to continue the discussion..... > > > do you want me to enter in some " illusions " ....in which i'm not > > > interested to enter in...?.......i'm sorry...no interests > > > > > > this your " energy of love " .... " the energy of our own heart " ..... > > > > > > this is related to your " ego-identification " ......missing, with > > deep > > > love......endless peace > > > > > > yes...your expression of " dissolve " is better than > > the " disappear " .... > > > > > > i agree that the question dissolve for some reason..... > > > and i know that this reason is....inner peace...... > > > > > > this your " love " is only the effect of some mixture of " truth " > > > and " illusions " ....this give for many people....some more of less > > > wonderful and nice ....emotions.....thats all > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > no... i do not want you to enter into some illusion...it is > > interesting this expression: mixture of truth and illusions...it > > could be fun, don't you think? at least a way to stay far from > being > > a fanatic! > > and i do prefer it indeed: being a mixture is being richer, more > > fluid, more dinamic, alive. > > points of view are different, of course but meeting, coming > closer, a > > new point of view, a new mixture is given the possibility to be > born, > > an expanded point of view, a new world, not yours, not mine... > > > > > > > > > > I agree that being a mixture of truth and illusion, as you say, is > better > > than wallowing in illusion only. There is value in such powerful > experiences > > that have tempered the illusion for you. All that is being said is > that there > > remains a third option (Truth). Keep going and don't get stuck in > the mixture. > > > > Phil > > > > > thank you Phil, i will keep going... > i am going...what gets stuck is the thought to possess Truth, in > every form mind can picture... > > love to you > > AHHHHHHHHHHH..... > > > OOOOOOOOmmmmmmm. > > ana > Yes, this is Truth love > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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