Guest guest Posted January 11, 2006 Report Share Posted January 11, 2006 On Jan 10, 2006, at 4:58 PM, Wim Borsboom wrote: >> On Jan 10, 2006, at 8:59 AM, Wim Borsboom wrote: > http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/10/science/10mirr.html? > th= & emc=th & pagewanted=all > P: Yes, very good questions! And another one to ponder for us, Is there a realization mirror neuron? Can we get a sense of realization by watching it in another? The Buddhist concept of " the transmission of mind with mind " , comes to mind. NNB > Nisargadatta , Pete S <pedsie4@e...> wrote: >> P: Thanks Wim. Since I first read about mirror neurons >> I thought it was a landmark discovery. This article is >> very good at bringing its implications to laymen. > > It is! And I'm still thankful that you called attention to this topic > a while ago. > > The implications for psychology are enormous, the regular > understanding of bonding, projection, learning, transference, > empathy/apathy/empathy, obsession, compulsion, being 'anal' - all that > and more needs to be reviewed. > This may even form some basis for seriously discussing legislation to > limit access to violent depictions in games, films or plays for young > children now that we may have some physio-biological understanding > behind the process of almost (?) automatic absorption of what children > 'see' and thus can (?) act out. How do we create 'control or error's > or 'checks and balances'? A lot of rethinking is warranted... > > Are we ready for a possible paradigm shift in education... > > Even some popular notions developed by Piaget, some of his conclusions > (that I was almost forced to accept when I was studying psychology and > didactics) need to be thoroughly reviewed. Some of them even became > urban myths..., and urban myths are so resilient... (Maybe there > are specialized mirror neurons that turn modeling based on flawed > thinking when brought forward 'cleverly and craftily' into urban > mythology.:-) > > Can we implant new mirror neurons? Should we? > Can we replace those neurons that replicated/duplicated less savory or > less acceptable impressions and thus produced less beneficial social > behavior? Should we? > Can we fix the broken neurons? Should we? > Can we now also find out what actually causes autism and even > sociopathic or psychopathic behavior? > > There is an issue not touched upon in depth yet: is there not a > certain 'proposal' quality to what mirror neurons replicate/duplicate? > The way I see it, in humans, there seems to be a choice somewhere in > the individual to take the impressions seriously and follow up on them > as though they were one's own OR... to hold them in abeyance for the > time being and not choosing - after certain considerations - to act > them out in perpetuity 'thoughtlessly'? > > Is that where consciousness or conscience comes in? > And if there is an 'observer' to all this, a witness, how is that > witness/observer present, does the possible presence of the witness > fade? > > What is it, if so, what makes that occur? > > If we, instead of using the word, " MIRROR " neuron, would use the word > " ECHO " neuron, is there a 'fade' effect? (As in the theory of sound: > 'attack', 'sustain', 'decay'. Is there volume, loudness or intensity > control?) > > Do initial 'impressions' (when they are verbal, they are called > 'engrams') need to be rekindled once in a while, to stay active? > > How do we forget? > How do (if we believe that they do) because of' therapy, mediation or > whatever we do to become less driven and attached) 'compulsive > actions' stop? > What have we done with those mirror neurons when we deactivated them > (if we did , if they were involved in creating obsessive compulsive > behavior?! > > +Wim > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 11, 2006 Report Share Posted January 11, 2006 of course there is transmision of mind to mind, we feed on that. (I am a vampire, I feed on light that I extract from the best sources available). And I think the only way I am going to truly understand and make it " mine " is by recommunicating it to other. Receiving..giving back. Not holding on any knowedge. Winnie the Pooh --- Pete S <pedsie4 a écrit : On Jan 10, 2006, at 4:58 PM, Wim Borsboom wrote: >> On Jan 10, 2006, at 8:59 AM, Wim Borsboom wrote: > http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/10/science/10mirr.html? > th= & emc=th & pagewanted=all > P: Yes, very good questions! And another one to ponder for us, Is there a realization mirror neuron? Can we get a sense of realization by watching it in another? The Buddhist concept of " the transmission of mind with mind " , comes to mind. NNB > Nisargadatta , Pete S <pedsie4@e...> wrote: >> P: Thanks Wim. Since I first read about mirror neurons >> I thought it was a landmark discovery. This article is >> very good at bringing its implications to laymen. > > It is! And I'm still thankful that you called attention to this topic > a while ago. > > The implications for psychology are enormous, the regular > understanding of bonding, projection, learning, transference, > empathy/apathy/empathy, obsession, compulsion, being 'anal' - all that > and more needs to be reviewed. > This may even form some basis for seriously discussing legislation to > limit access to violent depictions in games, films or plays for young > children now that we may have some physio-biological understanding > behind the process of almost (?) automatic absorption of what children > 'see' and thus can (?) act out. How do we create 'control or error's > or 'checks and balances'? A lot of rethinking is warranted... > > Are we ready for a possible paradigm shift in education... > > Even some popular notions developed by Piaget, some of his conclusions > (that I was almost forced to accept when I was studying psychology and > didactics) need to be thoroughly reviewed. Some of them even became > urban myths..., and urban myths are so resilient... (Maybe there > are specialized mirror neurons that turn modeling based on flawed > thinking when brought forward 'cleverly and craftily' into urban > mythology.:-) > > Can we implant new mirror neurons? Should we? > Can we replace those neurons that replicated/duplicated less savory or > less acceptable impressions and thus produced less beneficial social > behavior? Should we? > Can we fix the broken neurons? Should we? > Can we now also find out what actually causes autism and even > sociopathic or psychopathic behavior? > > There is an issue not touched upon in depth yet: is there not a > certain 'proposal' quality to what mirror neurons replicate/duplicate? > The way I see it, in humans, there seems to be a choice somewhere in > the individual to take the impressions seriously and follow up on them > as though they were one's own OR... to hold them in abeyance for the > time being and not choosing - after certain considerations - to act > them out in perpetuity 'thoughtlessly'? > > Is that where consciousness or conscience comes in? > And if there is an 'observer' to all this, a witness, how is that > witness/observer present, does the possible presence of the witness > fade? > > What is it, if so, what makes that occur? > > If we, instead of using the word, " MIRROR " neuron, would use the word > " ECHO " neuron, is there a 'fade' effect? (As in the theory of sound: > 'attack', 'sustain', 'decay'. Is there volume, loudness or intensity > control?) > > Do initial 'impressions' (when they are verbal, they are called > 'engrams') need to be rekindled once in a while, to stay active? > > How do we forget? > How do (if we believe that they do) because of' therapy, mediation or > whatever we do to become less driven and attached) 'compulsive > actions' stop? > What have we done with those mirror neurons when we deactivated them > (if we did , if they were involved in creating obsessive compulsive > behavior?! > > +Wim > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 11, 2006 Report Share Posted January 11, 2006 Poor Pooh Bear, here is some help, Sweet honey thoughts are one thing. But changing thoughts into real honey, only Winnie-the-Pooh can do! His dilema is about sharing honey. Patricia --- OConnor Patricia <gdtige a écrit : of course there is transmision of mind to mind, we feed on that. (I am a vampire, I feed on light that I extract from the best sources available). And I think the only way I am going to truly understand and make it " mine " is by recommunicating it to other. Receiving..giving back. Not holding on any knowedge. Winnie the Pooh --- Pete S <pedsie4 a écrit : On Jan 10, 2006, at 4:58 PM, Wim Borsboom wrote: >> On Jan 10, 2006, at 8:59 AM, Wim Borsboom wrote: > http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/10/science/10mirr.html? > th= & emc=th & pagewanted=all > P: Yes, very good questions! And another one to ponder for us, Is there a realization mirror neuron? Can we get a sense of realization by watching it in another? The Buddhist concept of " the transmission of mind with mind " , comes to mind. NNB > Nisargadatta , Pete S <pedsie4@e...> wrote: >> P: Thanks Wim. Since I first read about mirror neurons >> I thought it was a landmark discovery. This article is >> very good at bringing its implications to laymen. > > It is! And I'm still thankful that you called attention to this topic > a while ago. > > The implications for psychology are enormous, the regular > understanding of bonding, projection, learning, transference, > empathy/apathy/empathy, obsession, compulsion, being 'anal' - all that > and more needs to be reviewed. > This may even form some basis for seriously discussing legislation to > limit access to violent depictions in games, films or plays for young > children now that we may have some physio-biological understanding > behind the process of almost (?) automatic absorption of what children > 'see' and thus can (?) act out. How do we create 'control or error's > or 'checks and balances'? A lot of rethinking is warranted... > > Are we ready for a possible paradigm shift in education... > > Even some popular notions developed by Piaget, some of his conclusions > (that I was almost forced to accept when I was studying psychology and > didactics) need to be thoroughly reviewed. Some of them even became > urban myths..., and urban myths are so resilient... (Maybe there > are specialized mirror neurons that turn modeling based on flawed > thinking when brought forward 'cleverly and craftily' into urban > mythology.:-) > > Can we implant new mirror neurons? Should we? > Can we replace those neurons that replicated/duplicated less savory or > less acceptable impressions and thus produced less beneficial social > behavior? Should we? > Can we fix the broken neurons? Should we? > Can we now also find out what actually causes autism and even > sociopathic or psychopathic behavior? > > There is an issue not touched upon in depth yet: is there not a > certain 'proposal' quality to what mirror neurons replicate/duplicate? > The way I see it, in humans, there seems to be a choice somewhere in > the individual to take the impressions seriously and follow up on them > as though they were one's own OR... to hold them in abeyance for the > time being and not choosing - after certain considerations - to act > them out in perpetuity 'thoughtlessly'? > > Is that where consciousness or conscience comes in? > And if there is an 'observer' to all this, a witness, how is that > witness/observer present, does the possible presence of the witness > fade? > > What is it, if so, what makes that occur? > > If we, instead of using the word, " MIRROR " neuron, would use the word > " ECHO " neuron, is there a 'fade' effect? (As in the theory of sound: > 'attack', 'sustain', 'decay'. Is there volume, loudness or intensity > control?) > > Do initial 'impressions' (when they are verbal, they are called > 'engrams') need to be rekindled once in a while, to stay active? > > How do we forget? > How do (if we believe that they do) because of' therapy, mediation or > whatever we do to become less driven and attached) 'compulsive > actions' stop? > What have we done with those mirror neurons when we deactivated them > (if we did , if they were involved in creating obsessive compulsive > behavior?! > > +Wim > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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