Guest guest Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 Nisargadatta , " Stefan " <s.petersilge@o...> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@A... wrote: > > > >Yes. I'm not struggling with the illusion. It's fine just as it is. > > Thats great, Phil! > > But I went one step further and said: there is no illusion. To call > the mirage an illusion means creating another concept, another belief. > It means exchanging one belief for another. But everything is as it > is. The mirage simply is a mirage. > > If everything is embraced equally then there is no need for concepts > like illusion and liberation. Then there is just the natural state. > Ordinary. It is not a higher state, it does not avard one with > privileges like a university degree. We all are already in that state. > It is the only state that exists. It simply has to be accepted. W: hi Stefan, " it simply has to be accepted " ? what...that you are longing for peace, bliss and love? or that bliss is your reality? .... bliss breathing through this... ......ordinary divine flowing energy... > > But as long as one expects peace, bliss, love... and all that has to > be lasting of course... he is hunting his own tail and may do so > forever. What is peace? Everybody experiences his little peace from > time to time, but he might find himself in the midst of war the next > moment. But what has all this to do with truth? What do we want: truth > or wonderful higher states? If we really want truth then we have to be > ready to accept whatever we find. > > We can stop to ponder and fathom at any moment and instead look for > what is. (But it might be different from what we expect :-))) > > LiLaLo > Stefan > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 - bigwaaba Nisargadatta Saturday, January 14, 2006 8:09 AM bliss Nisargadatta , " Stefan " <s.petersilge@o...> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@A... wrote: > > > >Yes. I'm not struggling with the illusion. It's fine just as it is. > > Thats great, Phil! > > But I went one step further and said: there is no illusion. To call > the mirage an illusion means creating another concept, another belief. > It means exchanging one belief for another. But everything is as it > is. The mirage simply is a mirage. > > If everything is embraced equally then there is no need for concepts > like illusion and liberation. Then there is just the natural state. > Ordinary. It is not a higher state, it does not avard one with > privileges like a university degree. We all are already in that state. > It is the only state that exists. It simply has to be accepted. W: hi Stefan, " it simply has to be accepted " ? what...that you are longing for peace, bliss and love? or that bliss is your reality? ... bliss breathing through this... .....ordinary divine flowing energy... If I am not bliss, who am I if not This Is? Love.... Ana > > But as long as one expects peace, bliss, love... and all that has to > be lasting of course... he is hunting his own tail and may do so > forever. What is peace? Everybody experiences his little peace from > time to time, but he might find himself in the midst of war the next > moment. But what has all this to do with truth? What do we want: truth > or wonderful higher states? If we really want truth then we have to be > ready to accept whatever we find. > > We can stop to ponder and fathom at any moment and instead look for > what is. (But it might be different from what we expect :-))) > > LiLaLo > Stefan > ** If you do not wish to receive individual emails, to change your subscription, sign in with your ID and go to Edit My Groups: /mygroups?edit=1 Under the Message Delivery option, choose " No Email " for the Nisargadatta group and click on Save Changes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 Nisargadatta , " Anna Ruiz " <nli10u@c...> wrote: > > > - > bigwaaba > Nisargadatta > Saturday, January 14, 2006 8:09 AM > bliss > > > Nisargadatta , " Stefan " <s.petersilge@o...> > wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@A... wrote: > > > > > >Yes. I'm not struggling with the illusion. It's fine just as it is. > > > > Thats great, Phil! > > > > But I went one step further and said: there is no illusion. To call > > the mirage an illusion means creating another concept, another > belief. > > It means exchanging one belief for another. But everything is as it > > is. The mirage simply is a mirage. > > > > If everything is embraced equally then there is no need for concepts > > like illusion and liberation. Then there is just the natural state. > > Ordinary. It is not a higher state, it does not avard one with > > privileges like a university degree. We all are already in that > state. > > It is the only state that exists. It simply has to be accepted. > > W: hi Stefan, " it simply has to be accepted " ? what...that you are > longing for peace, bliss and love? or that bliss is your reality? > ... bliss breathing through this... > .....ordinary divine flowing energy... > > > If I am not bliss, who am I if not This Is? > > Love.... > > > Ana AHHHH... answer doesn't appear in this mind... > > > > > > But as long as one expects peace, bliss, love... and all that has to > > be lasting of course... he is hunting his own tail and may do so > > forever. What is peace? Everybody experiences his little peace from > > time to time, but he might find himself in the midst of war the next > > moment. But what has all this to do with truth? What do we want: > truth > > or wonderful higher states? If we really want truth then we have to > be > > ready to accept whatever we find. > > > > We can stop to ponder and fathom at any moment and instead look for > > what is. (But it might be different from what we expect :-))) > > > > LiLaLo > > Stefan > > > ** > > If you do not wish to receive individual emails, to change your subscription, sign in with your ID and go to Edit My Groups: > > /mygroups?edit=1 > > Under the Message Delivery option, choose " No Email " for the Nisargadatta group and click on Save Changes. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " <bigwaaba> wrote: >W: hi Stefan, " it simply has to be accepted " ? what...that you are >longing for peace, bliss and love? or that bliss is your reality? >... bliss breathing through this... >.....ordinary divine flowing energy... Hi, thanks for asking! I meant: everything that arises has to be accepted. You can chose a part of it (like a concept of truth, love and peace and a supposedly longing for it) and accept that. Great. But this is not the total acceptance I am talking about. Embrace everything. Existence is every moment new. Full of surprises. We like to live in a predictable world, though. This is the reason why people go on and on discussing how things are going to be. But if one is longing for truth... To be with what is... How could truth be found anywhere else? Stefan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 14, 2006 Report Share Posted January 14, 2006 thank you! personally...(ah! maybe not an advaita-correct word!)...however, personally i do not like to live in a predictable world. Embracing the unkwown is the action of love...embracing it not to make it known, just pulsating with it...and truth is never found, is lived, is living...yes, around there is the scent of it, the vibrations,the thrill...all pervading... :) ! Nisargadatta , " Stefan " <s.petersilge@o...> wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " bigwaaba " <bigwaaba> wrote: > > >W: hi Stefan, " it simply has to be accepted " ? what...that you are > >longing for peace, bliss and love? or that bliss is your reality? > >... bliss breathing through this... > >.....ordinary divine flowing energy... > > Hi, thanks for asking! > > I meant: everything that arises has to be accepted. You can chose a > part of it (like a concept of truth, love and peace and a supposedly > longing for it) and accept that. Great. But this is not the total > acceptance I am talking about. Embrace everything. Existence is every > moment new. Full of surprises. We like to live in a predictable world, > though. This is the reason why people go on and on discussing how > things are going to be. > > But if one is longing for truth... > To be with what is... > How could truth be found anywhere else? > > Stefan > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 23, 2009 Report Share Posted January 23, 2009 , " Tony OClery " <aoclery wrote: , " Peter " <not_2@> wrote: > > > > > , " Tony OClery " wrote: > > >> Ramana talked mainly of Iswara/Saguna/Sakti etc, as that was the > mentality of many of his audience. Bliss is the last impediment as it is of > the mind/iswara/sakti/saguna. Ramana also said that Iswara was as real as > you are.........Tony<< > > Dear Tony, > > Both Ramana and Sankaracharya stated that our true nature, Atman, is none > other than the unborn Brahman (nirguna Brahman). This is the essence of > ajatavada, is it not? This is the natural state (sahaj stithi) unrealised > by us and realised and 'abided in' by the jnani. > > Jiva (the individual) and Ishwara (the personal god, saguna brahman) are > appearances in the field of empirical existence, i.e., duality. Both jiva > and Ishwara as appearances are relative realities, relative truths. It would > be quite absurd for either Ramana or Sankaracharya to assert that our true > nature, our " real self " , is but an appearance, a relative reality, nor did > either of them assert this. It is the same unborn Brahman that appears as > the individual jiva, the world, and as Ishwara (saguna brahman). This is > the heart of Ramana's teaching. > > With regards to Bliss, Ramana distinguishes between the Bliss which is our > true nature (Atman, Brahman) and temporary blissful states of consciousness > experienced by the jiva due to the anandamaya kosa. It is the latter that > are usually referred to as an impediment when the individual jiva becomes > attached to such transient states of mind. In Talks, Ramana explains: > > M.: The common man is aware of himself only when > modifications arise in the intellect (vijnanamaya kosa); these > modifications are transient; they arise and set. Hence the vijnanamaya > (intellect) is called a kosa or sheath. When pure awareness is left > over it is itself the Chit (Self) or the Supreme. To be in one's natural > state on the subsidence of thoughts is bliss; if that bliss be transient > - arising and setting - then it is only the sheath of bliss (Anandamaya > kosa), not the pure Self. What is needed is to fix the attention on > the pure 'I' after the subsidence of all thoughts and not to lose hold > of it. This has to be described as an extremely subtle thought; else > it cannot be spoken of at all, since it is no other than the Real Self. > Who is to speak of it, to whom and how? > (Talks: 624) > > Best wishes, > Peter Namaste, Peter, You are still talking of Saguna concept.. ...Sankara never taught beyond the Self...the unborn etc is Saguna the God within but at the same time separate........I am talking of Nir Guna Brahman or Para Advaita. Ultimately there is no Saguna but many followers totally confuse Saguna with Nir Guna and assume that somebody made a mistake when they wrote NirGuna as it cannot be positively described.. Ramana and Sankara only talk about what can be talked about Saguna. Saguna of the projected Bliss, Sakti Iswara etc etc........Sakti or even prakriti are Bliss the supreme bliss of illusion and delusion. That is what I am saying even the appearance, projection and projector didn't happen..........That is Ajativada even ParaAdvaita a phrase I coined myself to explain my ramblings....... That is the fatal mistake of most sadhakas to continually identify the unborn Saguna as NirGuna, hence my treatment on the Advaitin site for daring to say that the Brahman of Pralaya is Saguna because of the potentialiy.............Wake up and smell the Gunas that is the delusion...........Cheers Tony. --- End forwarded message --- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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