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In a message dated 2/9/2006 3:51:20 PM Pacific Standard Time,

Nisargadatta writes:

 

" Werner Woehr " <wwoehr

Re: [Nisargadatt identifying with Awareness

 

Arvind,

 

A year ago I was in coma for one day and there was no memory left. I

could have died during that time without 'knowing' it.

 

All this chattering and philosophizing about awareness, the knower,

eternity or the Absolute for me no longer makes any sense. Its only

task is to spend time and to get arround boredom.

 

Werner

 

 

 

 

Well, clearly, without human consciousness and memory there is no experience

or the capacity to store and recall it. I guess based on that you conclude

there is no existence beyond human consciousness? I contend that true being is

not an experience anyway. It doesn't involve human consciousness or the

memory that makes the perception of linear time and events possible.

 

I see no real difference in this respect between coma and deep sleep. The

active mind tries to recall what the experience of deep sleep is and finds

nothing stored in memory, but does this mean there was no existence? Do we cease

to exist in deep sleep and then suddenly start existing again when we awaken,

or is the apparent 'absence' just a trick of mind?

 

Phil

 

 

 

 

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Very funny Phil,

 

> True being <

 

Then tell me please, what is 'false being' ?

 

When you identify with God then it is 'true being' and when you

identfy yourself with your bum then it is 'false being' ?

 

This whole spiritual nonsense and confusion has its origin in

dividing oneself in different parts, like:

 

Consciousness, ego, self, soul, matter and spirit, awareness,

thought, higher Self, false self, true Self, intellience, emotions,

body, mind, God, Satan, good and evil, sin, Love, compassion, life

and death etc, etc.

 

Why not forgetting this whole spiritual baloney and spiritual idiocy

and live, just live ?

 

Werner

 

 

Nisargadatta , ADHHUB wrote:

>

>

> In a message dated 2/9/2006 3:51:20 PM Pacific Standard Time,

> Nisargadatta writes:

>

> " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr

> Re: [Nisargadatt identifying with Awareness

>

> Arvind,

>

> A year ago I was in coma for one day and there was no memory left.

I

> could have died during that time without 'knowing' it.

>

> All this chattering and philosophizing about awareness, the

knower,

> eternity or the Absolute for me no longer makes any sense. Its

only

> task is to spend time and to get arround boredom.

>

> Werner

>

>

>

>

> Well, clearly, without human consciousness and memory there is no

experience

> or the capacity to store and recall it. I guess based on that you

conclude

> there is no existence beyond human consciousness? I contend that

true being is

> not an experience anyway. It doesn't involve human consciousness or

the

> memory that makes the perception of linear time and events possible.

>

> I see no real difference in this respect between coma and deep

sleep. The

> active mind tries to recall what the experience of deep sleep is

and finds

> nothing stored in memory, but does this mean there was no

existence? Do we cease

> to exist in deep sleep and then suddenly start existing again when

we awaken,

> or is the apparent 'absence' just a trick of mind?

>

> Phil

>

>

>

>

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Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr

wrote:

>

> Very funny Phil,

>

> > True being <

>

> Then tell me please, what is 'false being' ?

>

> When you identify with God then it is 'true being' and when you

> identfy yourself with your bum then it is 'false being' ?

>

> This whole spiritual nonsense and confusion has its origin in

> dividing oneself in different parts, like:

>

> Consciousness, ego, self, soul, matter and spirit, awareness,

> thought, higher Self, false self, true Self, intellience, emotions,

> body, mind, God, Satan, good and evil, sin, Love, compassion, life

> and death etc, etc.

>

> Why not forgetting this whole spiritual baloney and spiritual

idiocy

> and live, just live ?

>

> Werner

>

>

> Hi Werner,

 

yes Werner....i agree

 

" Werner " is " Werner " ....

 

" God " is " God " ...

 

" Self " is " Self " ...

 

if " Werner " would identify with " God " ....then it would no more

be " Werner " ....

 

 

Marc

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Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr

wrote:

>

> Very funny Phil,

>

> > True being <

>

> Then tell me please, what is 'false being' ?

>

> When you identify with God then it is 'true being' and when you

> identfy yourself with your bum then it is 'false being' ?

>

> This whole spiritual nonsense and confusion has its origin in

> dividing oneself in different parts, like:

>

> Consciousness, ego, self, soul, matter and spirit, awareness,

> thought, higher Self, false self, true Self, intellience, emotions,

> body, mind, God, Satan, good and evil, sin, Love, compassion, life

> and death etc, etc.

>

> Why not forgetting this whole spiritual baloney and spiritual

idiocy

> and live, just live ?

>

> Werner

 

 

 

Yes, absolutely right, Werner.

You didn´t address the second part of the message though:

 

 

 

> > I see no real difference in this respect between coma and deep

> sleep. The

> > active mind tries to recall what the experience of deep sleep is

> and finds

> > nothing stored in memory, but does this mean there was no

> existence? Do we cease

> > to exist in deep sleep and then suddenly start existing again

when

> we awaken,

> > or is the apparent 'absence' just a trick of mind?

> >

> > Phil

 

 

 

He´s got a point.

Inventing the concept of a Knower and identyfying with it is a mind

game, but so is denying the permanence of existence because of coma

or deep sleep. The fact is that we don´t know, so why not just live

without any conclusions?

 

Len

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> Why not forgetting this whole spiritual baloney and spiritual

idiocy

> and live, just live ?

>

> Werner

 

 

L.E: Good idea Werner. Bye bye, see you, be cool, have a good day!

 

Larry

 

 

 

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Language is inherently dualistic. Is it hoped that I could say something

that is not dualistic?

We divide ourselves into parts because that's what mind does. We perceive

dualistically because that's how mind perceives. We can't forget the fulfilment

of our desires because this IS living.

 

What sort of a creature are you hoping to turn yourself into that doesn't

care about either God or man? Do you think the Truth can be known by one who

cares nothing about Truth? Do you think love becomes a reality to one who cares

nothing about love?

 

Phil

 

 

 

 

 

In a message dated 2/10/2006 9:01:58 AM Pacific Standard Time,

Nisargadatta writes:

 

" Werner Woehr " <wwoehr

Re: identifying with Awareness

 

Very funny Phil,

 

> True being <

 

Then tell me please, what is 'false being' ?

 

When you identify with God then it is 'true being' and when you

identfy yourself with your bum then ii is 'fale being' ?

 

This whole spiritual nonsense and confusion has its origin in

dividing oneself in different parts, like:

 

Consciousness, ego, self, soul, matter and spirit, awareness,

thought, higher Self, false self, true Self, intellience, emotions,

body, mind, God, Satan, good and evil, sin, Love, compassion, life

and death etc, etc.

 

Why not just just forgetting that whole spiritual baloney and live?

 

Werner

 

 

 

Nisargadatta , ADHHUB wrote:

>

>

> In a message dated 2/9/2006 3:51:20 PM Pacific Standard Time,

> Nisargadatta writes:

>

> " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr

> Re: [Nisargadatt identifying with Awareness

>

> Arvind,

>

> A year ago I was in coma for one day and there was no memory left.

I

> could have died during that time without 'knowing' it.

>

> All this chattering and philosophizing about awareness, the

knower,

> eternity or the Absolute for me no longer makes any sense. Its

only

> task is to spend time and to get arround boredom.

>

> Werner

>

>

>

>

> Well, clearly, without human consciousness and memory there is no

experience

> or the capacity to store and recall it. I guess based on that you

conclude

> there is no existence beyond human consciousness? I contend that

true being is

> not an experience anyway. It doesn't involve human consciousness or

the

> memory that makes the perception of linear time and events possible.

>

> I see no real difference in this respect between coma and deep

sleep. The

> active mind tries to recall what the experience of deep sleep is

and finds

> nothing stored in memory, but does this mean there was no

existence? Do we cease

> to exist in deep sleep and then suddenly start existing again when

we awaken,

> or is the apparent 'absence' just a trick of mind?

>

> Phil

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Nisargadatta , ADHHUB wrote:

>

>

> Language is inherently dualistic. Is it hoped that I could say

something

> that is not dualistic?

> We divide ourselves into parts because that's what mind does. We

perceive

> dualistically because that's how mind perceives. We can't forget

the fulfilment

> of our desires because this IS living.

>

> What sort of a creature are you hoping to turn yourself into that

doesn't

> care about either God or man? Do you think the Truth can be known

by one who

> cares nothing about Truth? Do you think love becomes a reality to

one who cares

> nothing about love?

>

> Phil

 

 

There are people who care about truth and there are others who care

about the word " truth " .

 

Len

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