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Discarding The Ego Self /Len ...

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In a message dated 4/1/2006 9:23:45 AM Pacific Standard Time,

lissbon2002 writes:

 

> In Nisargadatta , epston wrote:

> >

> >

> >>The idea of " me " is a thought mistaken for a psychological entity

> >>which can be harmed and therefore must be protected. As if it was

> >>the body. But it is not a body, but a thought, connected to other

> >>thoughts, a thought-system, not necessary for the body/mind´s

> >>functioning.

> >

> >L.E: The problems is, that this thought-system IS necessary for the

> >body/mind's functioning until it possibly reaches a stage of

> development where it is

> >no longer needed like the shell of a lobster. Before that stage is

> reached

> >where it can be discarded, it is an essential and organic part of

> the organism,

> >body-brain-mind-self system.

> >

> >Larry Epston

>

>

> This is exactly what I wonder about.

> I wonder whether it is necessary at all.

> Or is it only necessary as the suffering seems necessary to be free

> from suffering? ;-)

>

> Len

>

>

L.E: My assumption is that the ego self is a natural outcome of brain, mind

environment relationships. As the baby human organism interacts with its

environment, the ego self develops and naturally grows. Then there are endless

variations. Sometimes the function get diseased, or distorted. In others it

acts harmoniously with the organism. As it grows through experience, a few may

develop a new interior as does the lobster, and it becomes possible to discard

or dissolve it.

Much of so-called spiritual life consists of various methods to get free of

the overdeveloped ego self even as a lobster discards and eats its shell or a

snake wriggles out of its skin after great effort.

What do you think?

 

Larry Epston

 

 

 

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Nisargadatta , epston wrote:

>

> In a message dated 4/1/2006 9:23:45 AM Pacific Standard Time,

> lissbon2002 writes:

>

> > In Nisargadatta , epston@ wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > >>The idea of " me " is a thought mistaken for a psychological

entity

> > >>which can be harmed and therefore must be protected. As if it

was

> > >>the body. But it is not a body, but a thought, connected to

other

> > >>thoughts, a thought-system, not necessary for the body/mind´s

> > >>functioning.

> > >

> > >L.E: The problems is, that this thought-system IS necessary for

the

> > >body/mind's functioning until it possibly reaches a stage of

> > development where it is

> > >no longer needed like the shell of a lobster. Before that stage

is

> > reached

> > >where it can be discarded, it is an essential and organic part

of

> > the organism,

> > >body-brain-mind-self system.

> > >

> > >Larry Epston

> >

> >

> > This is exactly what I wonder about.

> > I wonder whether it is necessary at all.

> > Or is it only necessary as the suffering seems necessary to be

free

> > from suffering? ;-)

> >

> > Len

> >

> >

> L.E: My assumption is that the ego self is a natural outcome of

brain, mind

> environment relationships. As the baby human organism interacts

with its

> environment, the ego self develops and naturally grows. Then there

are endless

> variations. Sometimes the function get diseased, or distorted.

> In others it

> acts harmoniously with the organism.

 

 

 

 

This would mean that the ego can be conflict-free, which I doubt.

There is a part of ego: personal data with a practical function,

which we need for communication, making appointments, finding back

our house etc. But the ego as a psychological centre, as a self-image

IS conflict.

 

 

 

 

 

> As it grows through experience, a few may

> develop a new interior as does the lobster, and it becomes possible

to discard

> or dissolve it.

> Much of so-called spiritual life consists of various methods to get

free of

> the overdeveloped ego

 

 

 

 

The effort to get free IS of the ego, so it won't help us to get rid

of it.

 

 

 

 

 

> self even as a lobster discards and eats its shell or a

> snake wriggles out of its skin after great effort.

> What do you think?

>

> Larry Epston

 

 

 

 

I wonder whether we need that thing at all.

We are conditioned to perpetuate it, to believe in it.

Thought, which can be used for many meaningful purposes, constructed

the self-image together with its defence system. What for?

Ego might have been developed as a tool to dominate, as a kind of

defence/attack system which can provide a good position in the

hierarchy. Think of animals trying to make themselves look bigger. Or

animals making terrible noise to impress and scare their enemies. So

we could say that the ego does indeed have a protective function, the

more I can impress you with my image, the more you will be scared of

me, the more " safe " I will feel. The strange thing is though that

when you don't use this defence system based on images – nothing bad

happens. The opposite is even true, everything seems to go smoother,

there is no fear, no conflict.

It seems to me that we don't need ego anymore then we " need "

psychological suffering.

 

Len

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