Methods And Holy Madness

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 4/2/2006 8:10:01 AM Pacific Daylight Time,

pedsie5 writes:

 

> Do all these methods work? Yes and no.

> If they obsess you, if they drive you out your mind,

> if they give you holy madness, they could work.

> It is the compulsion to relentless inquiry, the

> unflinching attention to what you call your self

> and the world that will dispel the mirage of

> separation. It all boils down to this: How bad

> you want to see whatever is there, no matter

> how disappointing it turns out to be.

>

> Pete

>

 

L.E: Very good overview, but your conclusions is rather dismal. You write

these methods " could " work, but do they ever or often work? If someone drives

themselves out of their mind, and they end up in despair rather than

enlightenment, that's just terrible. If the " mirage of separation " is so

difficult to

dispell perhaps it's best left alone. Why dispell it? Only a few will want to

see beyond the everyday, and most of them will probably fail. Is this a

journey worth taking? And why at the end do you mention " disappointing " rather

that exhilerating. I mean if there is a 50-50 chance that after all one's

madness and effort, the result can be disappointing, you would have to be half

mad

to even begin this journey beyond the mirage of separation.

Do you know something about it that you're not telling us? Has your journey

been disappointing? If not, then why do you even mention it? And if it has,

then tell us how and why. And if almost everyone, all humans that have ever

lived and are alive today are under the influence of this " mirage of

separation " perhaps it is an organic and natural outcome of being a

multicellular

organism living in society that is complex and needed for social interaction.

Perhaps more good and pleasure come out of it than bad. I mean, there is

sex/good

and war/bad. Would you have it all go away just to feel unified and

integrated into your life? Or is this a case of having your cake and eating it

too?

That you " preach/teach " the end of separation yetyou want all the good stuff

without the painful and bad?

 

Larry Epston

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

All Religions have a map. They all have

mapped the soul, the mind, and Heaven

itself in great detail. These maps are as

illusory and useless as mapping clouds.

 

Yet, they all offer methods to navigate your

way to their 'Heaven' by the position of

yesterday's clouds.

 

Western Religions maps are rather simple

or even simplistic ( if you want to be negative.)

Their methods are also simple: faith, prayers,

grace, good works, the practice of virtues, and

abstinence from sin.

 

Eastern Religions maps are more detailed,

some might say, exuberantly baroque. One

can spend a lifetime understanding such

maps of mind, self, and mystical stages.

Their methods and techniques seem also

without end. They offer a method for every

taste from standing on your head, to sex.

 

Do all these methods work? Yes and no.

If they obsess you, if they drive you out your mind,

if they give you holy madness, they could work.

It is the compulsion to relentless inquiry, the

unflinching attention to what you call your self

and the world that will dispel the mirage of

separation. It all boils down to this: How bad

you want to see whatever is there, no matter

how disappointing it turns out to be.

 

Pete

[Guest guest]

It is the compulsion to relentless inquiry, the

unflinching attention to what you call your self

and the world that will dispel the mirage of

separation. It all boils down to this: How bad

you want to see whatever is there, no matter

how disappointing it turns out to be.

 

Pete

 

 

Exactamente!

 

 

 

In a message dated 4/2/2006 1:25:53 PM Pacific Daylight Time,

Nisargadatta writes:

 

Sun, 2 Apr 2006 08:05:18 -0700

Pete S <pedsie5

Methods And Holy Madness

 

All Religions have a map. They all have

mapped the soul, the mind, and Heaven

itself in great detail. These maps are as

illusory and useless as mapping clouds.

 

Yet, they all offer methods to navigate your

way to their 'Heaven' by the position of

yesterday's clouds.

 

Western Religions maps are rather simple

or even simplistic ( if you want to be negative.)

Their methods are also simple: faith, prayers,

grace, good works, the practice of virtues, and

abstinence from sin.

 

Eastern Religions maps are more detailed,

some might say, exuberantly baroque. One

can spend a lifetime understanding such

maps of mind, self, and mystical stages.

Their methods and techniques seem also

without end. They offer a method for every

taste from standing on your head, to sex.

 

Do all these methods work? Yes and no.

If they obsess you, if they drive you out your mind,

if they give you holy madness, they could work.

It is the compulsion to relentless inquiry, the

unflinching attention to what you call your self

and the world that will dispel the mirage of

separation. It all boils down to this: How bad

you want to see whatever is there, no matter

how disappointing it turns out to be.

 

Pete