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Non-Existing Ego

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In a message dated 4/13/2006 3:29:46 AM Pacific Daylight Time,

lissbon2002 writes:

 

> This conversation is only strange, because you are not aware

> yourself of what the conversation is about.

> You are conditioned to believe that ego is you. This is true, in

> some meaning, because as good as everybody identyfies himself with

> the bunch om memories and reactions called " me " .

> Imagine that you are strongly identyfied with your beautiful house

> with a swimmingpool. You cannot imagine not being identyfied with

> it, you cannot imagine an existance without this beautiful,

> luxurious status symbol.

 

L.E: What you write does not seem accurate or true to me. I suppose the

difference occurrs as we each see the nature of the ego differently and as long

as

that exists, argumentation will exist as each defends his own point of view.

Mind and its individual contents are not the ego. Ego is a pattern or

vibration that comes out of mind, or exists within mind, but is not mind itself.

No

one is " conditioned to believe " that there is an ego separate from the real

you. That's just word stuff. You talk about ego as if it was an appendage,

something separate from yourself, and I see that as impossible. If the ego can

play a game to hide itself from itself, it is exactly doing what you are doing.

I don't do that, but you do. Pretending you are not the ego but can talk

about the ego. By doing that, you are trying to get power and control over

yourself by using yourself which is futile and impossible even though you

persist.

If I am like a person attached to a house, you are a person trying to get

milk from a stone. Impossible. How you got into that situation I have no idea

except it is a defensive tactic as you tried to defend yourself from

ideological attack like from a religious inperative. To survive, you became

split and

exist in an abberant distorted form of self and cannot find a way to become

whole again. See if you can remember how you got that way. Perhaps that will

help. Think of those freaks that grow two heads and have to ask the same

question.

 

Larry Epston

 

 

 

 

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In a message dated 4/13/2006 5:53:00 AM Pacific Daylight Time,

dennis_travis33 writes:

 

> ....as long you " belief " that there are " most people " .....maybe you

> are still lying in this your " grave " .....dreaming.....:)

>

> Marc

>

 

L.E: If you were here, I'd hit you with my long stick and we'd soon enough

see who was dreaming and who has a broken head!

 

Larry Epston

 

 

 

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Nisargadatta , epston wrote:

>

> In a message dated 4/13/2006 3:29:46 AM Pacific Daylight Time,

> lissbon2002 writes:

>

> > This conversation is only strange, because you are not aware

> > yourself of what the conversation is about.

> > You are conditioned to believe that ego is you. This is true, in

> > some meaning, because as good as everybody identyfies himself

with

> > the bunch om memories and reactions called " me " .

> > Imagine that you are strongly identyfied with your beautiful

house

> > with a swimmingpool. You cannot imagine not being identyfied

with

> > it, you cannot imagine an existance without this beautiful,

> > luxurious status symbol.

>

> L.E: What you write does not seem accurate or true to me. I

suppose the

> difference occurrs as we each see the nature of the ego

differently and as long as

> that exists, argumentation will exist as each defends his own

point of view.

> Mind and its individual contents are not the ego. Ego is a

pattern or

> vibration that comes out of mind, or exists within mind, but is

not mind itself. No

> one is " conditioned to believe " that there is an ego separate from

the real

> you. That's just word stuff. You talk about ego as if it was an

appendage,

> something separate from yourself, and I see that as impossible.

If the ego can

> play a game to hide itself from itself, it is exactly doing what

you are doing.

> I don't do that, but you do. Pretending you are not the ego but

can talk

> about the ego. By doing that, you are trying to get power and

control over

> yourself by using yourself which is futile and impossible even

though you persist.

> If I am like a person attached to a house, you are a person

trying to get

> milk from a stone. Impossible. How you got into that situation I

have no idea

> except it is a defensive tactic as you tried to defend yourself

from

> ideological attack like from a religious inperative. To survive,

you became split and

> exist in an abberant distorted form of self and cannot find a way

to become

> whole again. See if you can remember how you got that way.

Perhaps that will

> help. Think of those freaks that grow two heads and have to ask

the same

> question.

>

> Larry Epston

 

 

 

You will keep believing this untill you notice the difference

between what you believe to be there and what is.

Which for most people means - to their grave.

 

Len

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Nisargadatta , " lissbon2002 " <lissbon2002

wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , epston@ wrote:

> >

> > In a message dated 4/13/2006 3:29:46 AM Pacific Daylight Time,

> > lissbon2002@ writes:

> >

> > > This conversation is only strange, because you are not aware

> > > yourself of what the conversation is about.

> > > You are conditioned to believe that ego is you. This is true,

in

> > > some meaning, because as good as everybody identyfies himself

> with

> > > the bunch om memories and reactions called " me " .

> > > Imagine that you are strongly identyfied with your beautiful

> house

> > > with a swimmingpool. You cannot imagine not being identyfied

> with

> > > it, you cannot imagine an existance without this beautiful,

> > > luxurious status symbol.

> >

> > L.E: What you write does not seem accurate or true to me. I

> suppose the

> > difference occurrs as we each see the nature of the ego

> differently and as long as

> > that exists, argumentation will exist as each defends his own

> point of view.

> > Mind and its individual contents are not the ego. Ego is a

> pattern or

> > vibration that comes out of mind, or exists within mind, but is

> not mind itself. No

> > one is " conditioned to believe " that there is an ego separate

from

> the real

> > you. That's just word stuff. You talk about ego as if it was an

> appendage,

> > something separate from yourself, and I see that as impossible.

> If the ego can

> > play a game to hide itself from itself, it is exactly doing what

> you are doing.

> > I don't do that, but you do. Pretending you are not the ego but

> can talk

> > about the ego. By doing that, you are trying to get power and

> control over

> > yourself by using yourself which is futile and impossible even

> though you persist.

> > If I am like a person attached to a house, you are a person

> trying to get

> > milk from a stone. Impossible. How you got into that situation I

> have no idea

> > except it is a defensive tactic as you tried to defend yourself

> from

> > ideological attack like from a religious inperative. To survive,

> you became split and

> > exist in an abberant distorted form of self and cannot find a

way

> to become

> > whole again. See if you can remember how you got that way.

> Perhaps that will

> > help. Think of those freaks that grow two heads and have to ask

> the same

> > question.

> >

> > Larry Epston

>

>

>

> You will keep believing this untill you notice the difference

> between what you believe to be there and what is.

> Which for most people means - to their grave.

>

> Len

>

.....as long you " belief " that there are " most people " .....maybe you

are still lying in this your " grave " .....dreaming.....:)

 

Marc

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Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 "

<dennis_travis33 wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " lissbon2002 " <lissbon2002@>

> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , epston@ wrote:

> > >

> > > In a message dated 4/13/2006 3:29:46 AM Pacific Daylight Time,

> > > lissbon2002@ writes:

> > >

> > > > This conversation is only strange, because you are not aware

> > > > yourself of what the conversation is about.

> > > > You are conditioned to believe that ego is you. This is

true,

> in

> > > > some meaning, because as good as everybody identyfies

himself

> > with

> > > > the bunch om memories and reactions called " me " .

> > > > Imagine that you are strongly identyfied with your beautiful

> > house

> > > > with a swimmingpool. You cannot imagine not being identyfied

> > with

> > > > it, you cannot imagine an existance without this beautiful,

> > > > luxurious status symbol.

> > >

> > > L.E: What you write does not seem accurate or true to me. I

> > suppose the

> > > difference occurrs as we each see the nature of the ego

> > differently and as long as

> > > that exists, argumentation will exist as each defends his own

> > point of view.

> > > Mind and its individual contents are not the ego. Ego is a

> > pattern or

> > > vibration that comes out of mind, or exists within mind, but

is

> > not mind itself. No

> > > one is " conditioned to believe " that there is an ego separate

> from

> > the real

> > > you. That's just word stuff. You talk about ego as if it was

an

> > appendage,

> > > something separate from yourself, and I see that as

impossible.

> > If the ego can

> > > play a game to hide itself from itself, it is exactly doing

what

> > you are doing.

> > > I don't do that, but you do. Pretending you are not the ego

but

> > can talk

> > > about the ego. By doing that, you are trying to get power and

> > control over

> > > yourself by using yourself which is futile and impossible even

> > though you persist.

> > > If I am like a person attached to a house, you are a person

> > trying to get

> > > milk from a stone. Impossible. How you got into that

situation I

> > have no idea

> > > except it is a defensive tactic as you tried to defend

yourself

> > from

> > > ideological attack like from a religious inperative. To

survive,

> > you became split and

> > > exist in an abberant distorted form of self and cannot find a

> way

> > to become

> > > whole again. See if you can remember how you got that way.

> > Perhaps that will

> > > help. Think of those freaks that grow two heads and have to

ask

> > the same

> > > question.

> > >

> > > Larry Epston

> >

> >

> >

> > You will keep believing this untill you notice the difference

> > between what you believe to be there and what is.

> > Which for most people means - to their grave.

> >

> > Len

> >

> ....as long you " belief " that there are " most people " .....maybe

you

> are still lying in this your " grave " .....dreaming.....:)

>

> Marc

 

 

 

And what kind of crap have you been reading?

 

Len

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Nisargadatta , " lissbon2002 " <lissbon2002

wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 "

> <dennis_travis33@> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " lissbon2002 " <lissbon2002@>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , epston@ wrote:

> > > >

> > > > In a message dated 4/13/2006 3:29:46 AM Pacific Daylight

Time,

> > > > lissbon2002@ writes:

> > > >

> > > > > This conversation is only strange, because you are not

aware

> > > > > yourself of what the conversation is about.

> > > > > You are conditioned to believe that ego is you. This is

> true,

> > in

> > > > > some meaning, because as good as everybody identyfies

> himself

> > > with

> > > > > the bunch om memories and reactions called " me " .

> > > > > Imagine that you are strongly identyfied with your

beautiful

> > > house

> > > > > with a swimmingpool. You cannot imagine not being

identyfied

> > > with

> > > > > it, you cannot imagine an existance without this beautiful,

> > > > > luxurious status symbol.

> > > >

> > > > L.E: What you write does not seem accurate or true to me. I

> > > suppose the

> > > > difference occurrs as we each see the nature of the ego

> > > differently and as long as

> > > > that exists, argumentation will exist as each defends his own

> > > point of view.

> > > > Mind and its individual contents are not the ego. Ego is a

> > > pattern or

> > > > vibration that comes out of mind, or exists within mind, but

> is

> > > not mind itself. No

> > > > one is " conditioned to believe " that there is an ego separate

> > from

> > > the real

> > > > you. That's just word stuff. You talk about ego as if it

was

> an

> > > appendage,

> > > > something separate from yourself, and I see that as

> impossible.

> > > If the ego can

> > > > play a game to hide itself from itself, it is exactly doing

> what

> > > you are doing.

> > > > I don't do that, but you do. Pretending you are not the ego

> but

> > > can talk

> > > > about the ego. By doing that, you are trying to get power

and

> > > control over

> > > > yourself by using yourself which is futile and impossible

even

> > > though you persist.

> > > > If I am like a person attached to a house, you are a person

> > > trying to get

> > > > milk from a stone. Impossible. How you got into that

> situation I

> > > have no idea

> > > > except it is a defensive tactic as you tried to defend

> yourself

> > > from

> > > > ideological attack like from a religious inperative. To

> survive,

> > > you became split and

> > > > exist in an abberant distorted form of self and cannot find

a

> > way

> > > to become

> > > > whole again. See if you can remember how you got that way.

> > > Perhaps that will

> > > > help. Think of those freaks that grow two heads and have to

> ask

> > > the same

> > > > question.

> > > >

> > > > Larry Epston

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > You will keep believing this untill you notice the difference

> > > between what you believe to be there and what is.

> > > Which for most people means - to their grave.

> > >

> > > Len

> > >

> > ....as long you " belief " that there are " most people " .....maybe

> you

> > are still lying in this your " grave " .....dreaming.....:)

> >

> > Marc

>

>

>

> And what kind of crap have you been reading?

>

> Len

 

i read your crap.....

 

always funny to read such ego-minded crap.....:)

 

Marc

>

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Nisargadatta , epston wrote:

>

> In a message dated 4/13/2006 5:53:00 AM Pacific Daylight Time,

> dennis_travis33 writes:

>

> > ....as long you " belief " that there are " most people " .....maybe you

> > are still lying in this your " grave " .....dreaming.....:)

> >

> > Marc

> >

>

> L.E: If you were here, I'd hit you with my long stick and we'd soon

enough

> see who was dreaming and who has a broken head!

>

> Larry Epston

>

>

LOL

 

is this a nice and new concept of communication?....

 

or did you have a nightmare....again?....

 

Marc

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In a message dated 4/12/2006 7:40:56 AM Pacific Daylight Time,

lissbon2002 writes:

 

>>Yes. The idea of non existing ego is meant to keep the ego intact

>>(no need to pay attention to something which doesn´t exist) and at

>>the same time reach the state which can be only there when the ego

>>is not ;-)

>>

>>Len

>

L.E: This conversation is so strange as you all try to talk about the ego

but

cannot recognize that you are the ego that is talking. You talk about the

ego as if it was something other than what you are. As if by splitting

yourself

as ego into an observer and the observed ego you can analyze and understand

 

yourself as ego. lCan't be done. And there's a big lesson there. The ego,

you,

cannot divide into two and understand your own nature. But you can relax

and

let the ego subside, and let is dissolve for a moment in the reservoir of

mind from which it arises. Then the you who talks to yourself disappears

and the

experience of healing and peace can occurr.

 

Larry Epston

 

 

 

And so you demonstrate Len's point perfectly. :)

 

 

L.E; That's absurd. The ego doesn't invent the idea of the non-existing ego

as a defense. It has no independent volition at all. You are your ego. If

anyone is running from anything, it is you pretending to be not you. Is that

what you are doing to keep your ego intact? Are you the demonstration of Len's

point perfectly?

 

Larry Epston

''

 

 

 

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In a message dated 4/13/2006 6:11:18 AM Pacific Daylight Time,

Nisargadatta writes:

 

Thu, 13 Apr 2006 08:16:10 EDT

epston

Non-Existing Ego

 

In a message dated 4/13/2006 3:29:46 AM Pacific Daylight Time,

lissbon2002 writes:

 

> This conversation is only strange, because you are not aware

> yourself of what the conversation is about.

> You are conditioned to believe that ego is you. This is true, in

> some meaning, because as good as everybody identyfies himself with

> the bunch om memories and reactions called " me " .

> Imagine that you are strongly identyfied with your beautiful house

> with a swimmingpool. You cannot imagine not being identyfied with

> it, you cannot imagine an existance without this beautiful,

> luxurious status symbol.

 

L.E: What you write does not seem accurate or true to me. I suppose the

difference occurrs as we each see the nature of the ego differently and as

long as

that exists, argumentation will exist as each defends his own point of view.

Mind and its individual contents are not the ego. Ego is a pattern or

vibration that comes out of mind, or exists within mind, but is not mind

itself. No

one is " conditioned to believe " that there is an ego separate from the real

you. That's just word stuff. You talk about ego as if it was an appendage,

something separate from yourself, and I see that as impossible. If the ego

can

play a game to hide itself from itself, it is exactly doing what you are

doing.

I don't do that, but you do. Pretending you are not the ego but can talk

about the ego. By doing that, you are trying to get power and control over

yourself by using yourself which is futile and impossible even though you

persist.

If I am like a person attached to a house, you are a person trying to get

milk from a stone. Impossible. How you got into that situation I have no

idea

except it is a defensive tactic as you tried to defend yourself from

ideological attack like from a religious inperative. To survive, you became

split and

exist in an abberant distorted form of self and cannot find a way to become

whole again. See if you can remember how you got that way. Perhaps that

will

help. Think of those freaks that grow two heads and have to ask the same

question.

 

Larry Epston

 

 

 

 

L: Mind and its individual contents are not the ego.

 

 

P: Ego is a concept that refers to a collection of self referential

thoughts. It's not a thing or a pattern or something that exists separately from

mind.

 

 

 

L: If the ego can

play a game to hide itself from itself, it is exactly doing what you are

doing.

I don't do that,

 

 

P: You do that more effectively than anyone else here, Larry, which is why

you don't know you're doing it.

 

 

 

 

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Nisargadatta , epston wrote:

>

>

>

> In a message dated 4/12/2006 7:40:56 AM Pacific Daylight Time,

> lissbon2002 writes:

>

> >>Yes. The idea of non existing ego is meant to keep the ego

intact

> >>(no need to pay attention to something which doesn´t exist) and

at

> >>the same time reach the state which can be only there when the

ego

> >>is not ;-)

> >>

> >>Len

> >

> L.E: This conversation is so strange as you all try to talk about

the ego

> but

> cannot recognize that you are the ego that is talking. You talk

about the

> ego as if it was something other than what you are. As if by

splitting

> yourself

> as ego into an observer and the observed ego you can analyze and

understand

>

> yourself as ego. lCan't be done. And there's a big lesson there.

The ego,

> you,

> cannot divide into two and understand your own nature. But you

can relax

> and

> let the ego subside, and let is dissolve for a moment in the

reservoir of

> mind from which it arises. Then the you who talks to yourself

disappears

> and the

> experience of healing and peace can occurr.

>

> Larry Epston

>

>

>

> And so you demonstrate Len's point perfectly. :)

>

>

> L.E; That's absurd. The ego doesn't invent the idea of the non-

existing ego

> as a defense. It has no independent volition at all. You are your

ego. If

> anyone is running from anything, it is you pretending to be not

you. Is that

> what you are doing to keep your ego intact? Are you the

demonstration of Len's

> point perfectly?

>

> Larry Epston

> ''

>

OK you(who are not your ego) are pretending to not be you(also not

the ego), and the ego(not you) doesn't invent the idea of it's(ego's)

non-existence, which by the way it is i.e.:not existing. I'm not

having an easy time with this , but let us proceed. Near the end of

line two above we reverse ourselves and you are your ego now. And

furthermore, now that you is the ego again, you is running pretending

to be the you that you are not; which is the ego that you is/is not.

And the purpose of this running, which by the way is non-volitional

(BIG WORD..a little drama here), is all about keeping this ego/no-

ego/you/not you/ Self(methiks) INTACT! OK now damn't all Len..are you

demonstrating Len's point here? Someone thinks so.

I NEED guys like Larry to get me back on track with his humour

as/like this terrific fun demonstration of his. Thanks L.E., you're a

lot of fun and a big blessing too.

.........bob

>

>

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