Guest guest Posted April 28, 2006 Report Share Posted April 28, 2006 Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn wrote: > > <snip> > > > > > > it makes sense to me anyway. the courage to sail an > > > > > uncharted sea, destination unknown, and even the notion > > > > > of " oneself " empty, pointing nowhere. > > > > > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > > > this courage is same.....every evening....before sleep..... > > > > > > > > ...entering an " uncharted sea, destination unknown, and even > the > > > > notion of " oneself " empty, pointing nowhere " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > a ship that is emptiness > > > on a sea that is emptiness > > > > > > emptiness in emptiness > > > > > > and then > > > > > > just emptiness > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > so emptyness should have courage to enter in....emptyness?.... > > > > > > Marc > > by that point it is all dissolving into the mist anyhow... > for the emptiness you are speaking of is the notion of > oneself as empty, pointing nowhere. > > so at that point it is a Ghost Vessel, as it were, > a fata morgana on a ghostly sea of endless Silence > > where does the ship end and the sea begin? > > all boundaries blurred, it is just > Emptiness dwelling in Itself. > > an interesting metaphor for Emptiness > dwelling in Itself is a " klein bottle " : > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klein_bottle > > and a more general notion is Douglas > Hoffstaeder's notion of " strange loop " : > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strange_loop > > Bill your Self isn't emptyness?.... Marc > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 28, 2006 Report Share Posted April 28, 2006 Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " <dennis_travis33 wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn@> wrote: > > > > <snip> > > > > > > > > it makes sense to me anyway. the courage to sail an > > > > > > uncharted sea, destination unknown, and even the notion > > > > > > of " oneself " empty, pointing nowhere. > > > > > > > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > > > > > this courage is same.....every evening....before sleep..... > > > > > > > > > > ...entering an " uncharted sea, destination unknown, and even > > the > > > > > notion of " oneself " empty, pointing nowhere " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > a ship that is emptiness > > > > on a sea that is emptiness > > > > > > > > emptiness in emptiness > > > > > > > > and then > > > > > > > > just emptiness > > > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > > > > so emptyness should have courage to enter in....emptyness?.... > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > by that point it is all dissolving into the mist anyhow... > > for the emptiness you are speaking of is the notion of > > oneself as empty, pointing nowhere. > > > > so at that point it is a Ghost Vessel, as it were, > > a fata morgana on a ghostly sea of endless Silence > > > > where does the ship end and the sea begin? > > > > all boundaries blurred, it is just > > Emptiness dwelling in Itself. > > > > an interesting metaphor for Emptiness > > dwelling in Itself is a " klein bottle " : > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klein_bottle > > > > and a more general notion is Douglas > > Hoffstaeder's notion of " strange loop " : > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strange_loop > > > > Bill > > your Self isn't emptyness?.... > > Marc Ps: to get out of the " desert " ....you should be aware of the dream to be aware of the dream....you need to identify with Self....and not with the " ghost " ...named " Bill " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 28, 2006 Report Share Posted April 28, 2006 <snip> > > > > so emptyness should have courage to enter in....emptyness?.... > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > by that point it is all dissolving into the mist anyhow... > > > for the emptiness you are speaking of is the notion of > > > oneself as empty, pointing nowhere. > > > > > > so at that point it is a Ghost Vessel, as it were, > > > a fata morgana on a ghostly sea of endless Silence > > > > > > where does the ship end and the sea begin? > > > > > > all boundaries blurred, it is just > > > Emptiness dwelling in Itself. > > > > > > an interesting metaphor for Emptiness > > > dwelling in Itself is a " klein bottle " : > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klein_bottle > > > > > > and a more general notion is Douglas > > > Hoffstaeder's notion of " strange loop " : > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strange_loop > > > > > > Bill > > > > your Self isn't emptyness?.... > > > > Marc > > Ps: to get out of the " desert " ....you should be aware of the dream > to be aware of the dream....you need to identify with Self....and not > with the " ghost " ...named " Bill " > what " ghost " named Bill? in this moment no room for anything though at times there is a fragile vessel seeking its way through a storm but when that vessel is accepted as simply what is now... is not resisted its distinctness fades and then again just vastness perhaps what you call Self is something else yet... of that I do not know but a glimpse perhaps as a curl of mystery from the navel of now which shimmers for a moment as it turns this now is myriad boundless in depth and full of surprise as the breaking of a whale and the spray of its spume wet upon the eyes then it is gone any knowledge is clutter in this brightness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 28, 2006 Report Share Posted April 28, 2006 Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn wrote: > > <snip> > > > > > > so emptyness should have courage to enter in....emptyness?.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > by that point it is all dissolving into the mist anyhow... > > > > for the emptiness you are speaking of is the notion of > > > > oneself as empty, pointing nowhere. > > > > > > > > so at that point it is a Ghost Vessel, as it were, > > > > a fata morgana on a ghostly sea of endless Silence > > > > > > > > where does the ship end and the sea begin? > > > > > > > > all boundaries blurred, it is just > > > > Emptiness dwelling in Itself. > > > > > > > > an interesting metaphor for Emptiness > > > > dwelling in Itself is a " klein bottle " : > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klein_bottle > > > > > > > > and a more general notion is Douglas > > > > Hoffstaeder's notion of " strange loop " : > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strange_loop > > > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > your Self isn't emptyness?.... > > > > > > Marc > > > > Ps: to get out of the " desert " ....you should be aware of the dream > > to be aware of the dream....you need to identify with Self....and > not > > with the " ghost " ...named " Bill " > > > > what " ghost " named Bill? > > in this moment > no room for anything > > though at times there is a fragile vessel > seeking its way through a storm > > but when that vessel is accepted as > simply what is now... > is not resisted > its distinctness fades > > and then again > > just vastness > > perhaps what you call Self > is something else yet... > > of that I do not know > but a glimpse perhaps > > as a curl of mystery > from the navel of now > which shimmers for a moment > as it turns > > this now is myriad > boundless in depth > > and full of surprise > > as the breaking of a whale > and the spray of its spume > wet upon the eyes > > then it is gone > > any knowledge is clutter > in this brightness sure....in brightness there is no " knowledge " .... i agree with your view concerning " acceptance " also... ok...we can't realy " share " the " Self " .... the Self is like the source of all imaginary ... " dynamics " and movements and forms and names.... it's the source.....it's Home.....it's infinite....it's formless..... it's the real " soulmate " ... Marc > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 28, 2006 Report Share Posted April 28, 2006 Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " <dennis_travis33 wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn@> wrote: > > > > <snip> > > > > > > > > so emptyness should have courage to enter > in....emptyness?.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > by that point it is all dissolving into the mist anyhow... > > > > > for the emptiness you are speaking of is the notion of > > > > > oneself as empty, pointing nowhere. > > > > > > > > > > so at that point it is a Ghost Vessel, as it were, > > > > > a fata morgana on a ghostly sea of endless Silence > > > > > > > > > > where does the ship end and the sea begin? > > > > > > > > > > all boundaries blurred, it is just > > > > > Emptiness dwelling in Itself. > > > > > > > > > > an interesting metaphor for Emptiness > > > > > dwelling in Itself is a " klein bottle " : > > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klein_bottle > > > > > > > > > > and a more general notion is Douglas > > > > > Hoffstaeder's notion of " strange loop " : > > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strange_loop > > > > > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > > > your Self isn't emptyness?.... > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > Ps: to get out of the " desert " ....you should be aware of the dream > > > to be aware of the dream....you need to identify with Self....and > > not > > > with the " ghost " ...named " Bill " > > > > > > > what " ghost " named Bill? > > > > in this moment > > no room for anything > > > > though at times there is a fragile vessel > > seeking its way through a storm > > > > but when that vessel is accepted as > > simply what is now... > > is not resisted > > its distinctness fades > > > > and then again > > > > just vastness > > > > perhaps what you call Self > > is something else yet... > > > > of that I do not know > > but a glimpse perhaps > > > > as a curl of mystery > > from the navel of now > > which shimmers for a moment > > as it turns > > > > this now is myriad > > boundless in depth > > > > and full of surprise > > > > as the breaking of a whale > > and the spray of its spume > > wet upon the eyes > > > > then it is gone > > > > any knowledge is clutter > > in this brightness > > > > sure....in brightness there is no " knowledge " .... > > i agree with your view concerning " acceptance " also... > > ok...we can't realy " share " the " Self " .... > the Self is like the source of all imaginary ... " dynamics " and > movements and forms and names.... > it's the source.....it's Home.....it's infinite....it's formless..... > it's the real " soulmate " ... > > > Marc wooops! you just went over the top for me. will digest. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 28, 2006 Report Share Posted April 28, 2006 Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > <dennis_travis33@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn@> wrote: > > > > > > <snip> > > > > > > > > > > so emptyness should have courage to enter > > in....emptyness?.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > by that point it is all dissolving into the mist anyhow... > > > > > > for the emptiness you are speaking of is the notion of > > > > > > oneself as empty, pointing nowhere. > > > > > > > > > > > > so at that point it is a Ghost Vessel, as it were, > > > > > > a fata morgana on a ghostly sea of endless Silence > > > > > > > > > > > > where does the ship end and the sea begin? > > > > > > > > > > > > all boundaries blurred, it is just > > > > > > Emptiness dwelling in Itself. > > > > > > > > > > > > an interesting metaphor for Emptiness > > > > > > dwelling in Itself is a " klein bottle " : > > > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klein_bottle > > > > > > > > > > > > and a more general notion is Douglas > > > > > > Hoffstaeder's notion of " strange loop " : > > > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strange_loop > > > > > > > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > > > > > your Self isn't emptyness?.... > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > Ps: to get out of the " desert " ....you should be aware of the > dream > > > > to be aware of the dream....you need to identify with > Self....and > > > not > > > > with the " ghost " ...named " Bill " > > > > > > > > > > what " ghost " named Bill? > > > > > > in this moment > > > no room for anything > > > > > > though at times there is a fragile vessel > > > seeking its way through a storm > > > > > > but when that vessel is accepted as > > > simply what is now... > > > is not resisted > > > its distinctness fades > > > > > > and then again > > > > > > just vastness > > > > > > perhaps what you call Self > > > is something else yet... > > > > > > of that I do not know > > > but a glimpse perhaps > > > > > > as a curl of mystery > > > from the navel of now > > > which shimmers for a moment > > > as it turns > > > > > > this now is myriad > > > boundless in depth > > > > > > and full of surprise > > > > > > as the breaking of a whale > > > and the spray of its spume > > > wet upon the eyes > > > > > > then it is gone > > > > > > any knowledge is clutter > > > in this brightness > > > > > > > > sure....in brightness there is no " knowledge " .... > > > > i agree with your view concerning " acceptance " also... > > > > ok...we can't realy " share " the " Self " .... > > the Self is like the source of all imaginary ... " dynamics " and > > movements and forms and names.... > > it's the source.....it's Home.....it's infinite....it's > formless..... > > it's the real " soulmate " ... > > > > > > Marc > > wooops! > you just went over the top for me. > > will digest. > > Bill ....yes ...continue to get empty... Marc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 28, 2006 Report Share Posted April 28, 2006 > > ok...we can't realy " share " the " Self " .... > > the Self is like the source of all imaginary ... " dynamics " and > > movements and forms and names.... > > it's the source.....it's Home.....it's infinite....it's > formless..... > > it's the real " soulmate " ... > > > > > > Marc > Nope.........Sorry.........It is merely another concept that emerges within the dream.....just an imaginary completeness within the fragmentation that never was. toombaru > wooops! > you just went over the top for me. > > will digest. > > Bill > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 28, 2006 Report Share Posted April 28, 2006 Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " <dennis_travis33 wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > <dennis_travis33@> wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn@> > wrote: > > > > > > > > <snip> > > > > > > > > > > > > so emptyness should have courage to enter > > > in....emptyness?.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > by that point it is all dissolving into the mist anyhow... > > > > > > > for the emptiness you are speaking of is the notion of > > > > > > > oneself as empty, pointing nowhere. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so at that point it is a Ghost Vessel, as it were, > > > > > > > a fata morgana on a ghostly sea of endless Silence > > > > > > > > > > > > > > where does the ship end and the sea begin? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > all boundaries blurred, it is just > > > > > > > Emptiness dwelling in Itself. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > an interesting metaphor for Emptiness > > > > > > > dwelling in Itself is a " klein bottle " : > > > > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klein_bottle > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and a more general notion is Douglas > > > > > > > Hoffstaeder's notion of " strange loop " : > > > > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strange_loop > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > > > > > > > your Self isn't emptyness?.... > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > Ps: to get out of the " desert " ....you should be aware of the > > dream > > > > > to be aware of the dream....you need to identify with > > Self....and > > > > not > > > > > with the " ghost " ...named " Bill " > > > > > > > > > > > > > what " ghost " named Bill? > > > > > > > > in this moment > > > > no room for anything > > > > > > > > though at times there is a fragile vessel > > > > seeking its way through a storm > > > > > > > > but when that vessel is accepted as > > > > simply what is now... > > > > is not resisted > > > > its distinctness fades > > > > > > > > and then again > > > > > > > > just vastness > > > > > > > > perhaps what you call Self > > > > is something else yet... > > > > > > > > of that I do not know > > > > but a glimpse perhaps > > > > > > > > as a curl of mystery > > > > from the navel of now > > > > which shimmers for a moment > > > > as it turns > > > > > > > > this now is myriad > > > > boundless in depth > > > > > > > > and full of surprise > > > > > > > > as the breaking of a whale > > > > and the spray of its spume > > > > wet upon the eyes > > > > > > > > then it is gone > > > > > > > > any knowledge is clutter > > > > in this brightness > > > > > > > > > > > > sure....in brightness there is no " knowledge " .... > > > > > > i agree with your view concerning " acceptance " also... > > > > > > ok...we can't realy " share " the " Self " .... > > > the Self is like the source of all imaginary ... " dynamics " and > > > movements and forms and names.... > > > it's the source.....it's Home.....it's infinite....it's > > formless..... > > > it's the real " soulmate " ... > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > wooops! > > you just went over the top for me. > > > > will digest. > > > > Bill > > > ...yes ...continue to get empty... > > Marc > The attempt to 'get empty' fills you up fast. toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 2, 2006 Report Share Posted May 2, 2006 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain wrote: > > > > > ok...we can't realy " share " the " Self " .... > > > the Self is like the source of all imaginary ... " dynamics " and > > > movements and forms and names.... > > > it's the source.....it's Home.....it's infinite....it's > > formless..... > > > it's the real " soulmate " ... > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > Nope.........Sorry.........It is merely another concept that emerges > within the dream.....just an imaginary completeness within the > fragmentation that never was. > > > > toombaru do you know the Self....or not? the Self is no " concept " ....sorry Marc > > > > > > wooops! > > you just went over the top for me. > > > > will digest. > > > > Bill > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 2, 2006 Report Share Posted May 2, 2006 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > <dennis_travis33@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn@> wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > > <dennis_travis33@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn@> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > <snip> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so emptyness should have courage to enter > > > > in....emptyness?.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > by that point it is all dissolving into the mist anyhow... > > > > > > > > for the emptiness you are speaking of is the notion of > > > > > > > > oneself as empty, pointing nowhere. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > so at that point it is a Ghost Vessel, as it were, > > > > > > > > a fata morgana on a ghostly sea of endless Silence > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > where does the ship end and the sea begin? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > all boundaries blurred, it is just > > > > > > > > Emptiness dwelling in Itself. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > an interesting metaphor for Emptiness > > > > > > > > dwelling in Itself is a " klein bottle " : > > > > > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klein_bottle > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and a more general notion is Douglas > > > > > > > > Hoffstaeder's notion of " strange loop " : > > > > > > > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strange_loop > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > > > > > > > > > your Self isn't emptyness?.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > > > > > > Ps: to get out of the " desert " ....you should be aware of the > > > dream > > > > > > to be aware of the dream....you need to identify with > > > Self....and > > > > > not > > > > > > with the " ghost " ...named " Bill " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > what " ghost " named Bill? > > > > > > > > > > in this moment > > > > > no room for anything > > > > > > > > > > though at times there is a fragile vessel > > > > > seeking its way through a storm > > > > > > > > > > but when that vessel is accepted as > > > > > simply what is now... > > > > > is not resisted > > > > > its distinctness fades > > > > > > > > > > and then again > > > > > > > > > > just vastness > > > > > > > > > > perhaps what you call Self > > > > > is something else yet... > > > > > > > > > > of that I do not know > > > > > but a glimpse perhaps > > > > > > > > > > as a curl of mystery > > > > > from the navel of now > > > > > which shimmers for a moment > > > > > as it turns > > > > > > > > > > this now is myriad > > > > > boundless in depth > > > > > > > > > > and full of surprise > > > > > > > > > > as the breaking of a whale > > > > > and the spray of its spume > > > > > wet upon the eyes > > > > > > > > > > then it is gone > > > > > > > > > > any knowledge is clutter > > > > > in this brightness > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sure....in brightness there is no " knowledge " .... > > > > > > > > i agree with your view concerning " acceptance " also... > > > > > > > > ok...we can't realy " share " the " Self " .... > > > > the Self is like the source of all imaginary ... " dynamics " and > > > > movements and forms and names.... > > > > it's the source.....it's Home.....it's infinite....it's > > > formless..... > > > > it's the real " soulmate " ... > > > > > > > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > wooops! > > > you just went over the top for me. > > > > > > will digest. > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > ...yes ...continue to get empty... > > > > Marc > > > > > The attempt to 'get empty' fills you up fast. > > > toombaru there is no choice.... nobody ever lived for infinite times with a fullness of ignorance (ego-mind) Marc > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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