Guest guest Posted May 4, 2006 Report Share Posted May 4, 2006 A computer screen is constantly " refreshing " . Faster than the eye can see (usually) the screen is being repainted from top to bottom. [1] Some use the term " arising " for what is " up " at the moment. What is " up " at the moment is constantly changing. It can safely be said that any sense of continuity in that is an illusion. So if there is any such thing as truth/Truth it surely must be that constant refresh, which is ever and always a disavowal of what went before. And the notion of destruction/creation can be seen in that... destruction in that what just was is already disavowed, creation in that the new is ever arising fresh. But there is no real " force " of creation or destruction. Nothing is being opposed. The constant refresh is just the way it is. Bill [1] - if there is a " flicker " to your computer screen that means the refresh rate is set too low. A similar flicker was seen in early era movies when the frame rate was slower. Hence those old movies where the wheels of a wagon appeared to be turning backwards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 4, 2006 Report Share Posted May 4, 2006 Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn wrote: > > > A computer screen is constantly " refreshing " . > Faster than the eye can see (usually) the screen > is being repainted from top to bottom. [1] > > Some use the term " arising " for what is > " up " at the moment. What is " up " at the moment > is constantly changing. > > It can safely be said that any sense of continuity > in that is an illusion. > > So if there is any such thing as truth/Truth it > surely must be that constant refresh, which is > ever and always a disavowal of what went before. > > And the notion of destruction/creation can be seen > in that... destruction in that what just was is > already disavowed, creation in that the new is ever > arising fresh. > > But there is no real " force " of creation or destruction. > Nothing is being opposed. > > The constant refresh is just the way it is. > > > Bill > > " the constant refresh is just the way it is " .....yes maybe the memory which registrate the nice and fabulous " movements " would need to be refreshed so too..... Marc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 4, 2006 Report Share Posted May 4, 2006 Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " <dennis_travis33 wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn@> wrote: > > > > > > A computer screen is constantly " refreshing " . > > Faster than the eye can see (usually) the screen > > is being repainted from top to bottom. [1] > > > > Some use the term " arising " for what is > > " up " at the moment. What is " up " at the moment > > is constantly changing. > > > > It can safely be said that any sense of continuity > > in that is an illusion. > > > > So if there is any such thing as truth/Truth it > > surely must be that constant refresh, which is > > ever and always a disavowal of what went before. > > > > And the notion of destruction/creation can be seen > > in that... destruction in that what just was is > > already disavowed, creation in that the new is ever > > arising fresh. > > > > But there is no real " force " of creation or destruction. > > Nothing is being opposed. > > > > The constant refresh is just the way it is. > > > > > > Bill > > > > > " the constant refresh is just the way it is " .....yes > > maybe the memory which registrate the nice and fabulous " movements " > would need to be refreshed so too..... > > Marc > what " movements " are you speaking of Marc? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 4, 2006 Report Share Posted May 4, 2006 Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > <dennis_travis33@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > A computer screen is constantly " refreshing " . > > > Faster than the eye can see (usually) the screen > > > is being repainted from top to bottom. [1] > > > > > > Some use the term " arising " for what is > > > " up " at the moment. What is " up " at the moment > > > is constantly changing. > > > > > > It can safely be said that any sense of continuity > > > in that is an illusion. > > > > > > So if there is any such thing as truth/Truth it > > > surely must be that constant refresh, which is > > > ever and always a disavowal of what went before. > > > > > > And the notion of destruction/creation can be seen > > > in that... destruction in that what just was is > > > already disavowed, creation in that the new is ever > > > arising fresh. > > > > > > But there is no real " force " of creation or destruction. > > > Nothing is being opposed. > > > > > > The constant refresh is just the way it is. > > > > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > > > " the constant refresh is just the way it is " .....yes > > > > maybe the memory which registrate the nice and fabulous " movements " > > would need to be refreshed so too..... > > > > Marc > > > > what " movements " are you speaking of Marc? the memory create this " movements " ..... maybe it could be desribed as....the " movements around the now " .... the now ....as being " here and now " .....changless, formless, infinite wish a great " refresh " .... Marc > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 4, 2006 Report Share Posted May 4, 2006 Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " <dennis_travis33 wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > <dennis_travis33@> wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn@> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > A computer screen is constantly " refreshing " . > > > > Faster than the eye can see (usually) the screen > > > > is being repainted from top to bottom. [1] > > > > > > > > Some use the term " arising " for what is > > > > " up " at the moment. What is " up " at the moment > > > > is constantly changing. > > > > > > > > It can safely be said that any sense of continuity > > > > in that is an illusion. > > > > > > > > So if there is any such thing as truth/Truth it > > > > surely must be that constant refresh, which is > > > > ever and always a disavowal of what went before. > > > > > > > > And the notion of destruction/creation can be seen > > > > in that... destruction in that what just was is > > > > already disavowed, creation in that the new is ever > > > > arising fresh. > > > > > > > > But there is no real " force " of creation or destruction. > > > > Nothing is being opposed. > > > > > > > > The constant refresh is just the way it is. > > > > > > > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > > > > > > " the constant refresh is just the way it is " .....yes > > > > > > maybe the memory which registrate the nice and > fabulous " movements " > > > would need to be refreshed so too..... > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > what " movements " are you speaking of Marc? > > the memory create this " movements " ..... > > maybe it could be desribed as....the " movements around the now " .... > > the now ....as being " here and now " .....changless, formless, infinite > > wish a great " refresh " .... > > Marc Ps: and also the movements of the stomach as for example.... digesting lunch.... bon appetit! > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 4, 2006 Report Share Posted May 4, 2006 Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " <dennis_travis33 wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > > <dennis_travis33@> wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn@> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > A computer screen is constantly " refreshing " . > > > > Faster than the eye can see (usually) the screen > > > > is being repainted from top to bottom. [1] > > > > > > > > Some use the term " arising " for what is > > > > " up " at the moment. What is " up " at the moment > > > > is constantly changing. > > > > > > > > It can safely be said that any sense of continuity > > > > in that is an illusion. > > > > > > > > So if there is any such thing as truth/Truth it > > > > surely must be that constant refresh, which is > > > > ever and always a disavowal of what went before. > > > > > > > > And the notion of destruction/creation can be seen > > > > in that... destruction in that what just was is > > > > already disavowed, creation in that the new is ever > > > > arising fresh. > > > > > > > > But there is no real " force " of creation or destruction. > > > > Nothing is being opposed. > > > > > > > > The constant refresh is just the way it is. > > > > > > > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > > > > > > " the constant refresh is just the way it is " .....yes > > > > > > maybe the memory which registrate the nice and > fabulous " movements " > > > would need to be refreshed so too..... > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > > what " movements " are you speaking of Marc? > > the memory create this " movements " ..... > > maybe it could be desribed as....the " movements around the now " .... > > the now ....as being " here and now " .....changless, formless, infinite > > wish a great " refresh " .... > > Marc OK... *those* movements would you say a little different than the " movement of a bird " are those movements, as if they represent a kind of " imprint " in consciousness... ? Or perhaps actually no different from the movement of a bird, the swaying of leaves in the wind etc.... If different, if having the quality of some kind of " imprint " , then they have taken on a " special reality " ... a reality implying someone who is experiencing them, etc. Or maybe not... this is all just supposing isn't it? but perhaps if such " movements " are taken as real, as distinct, as significant, then a snowball of me-ness can build around that... and not taking any of it seriously... is most natural it seems, and where awareness/ consciousness tends to end up... eventually. and that last comment represents a kind of spiritual darwinism... something abhorrent to the fundamentalists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 4, 2006 Report Share Posted May 4, 2006 In a message dated 5/4/2006 5:51:33 AM Pacific Daylight Time, Nisargadatta writes: " billrishel " illusyn Thu May 4, 2006 3:13am(PDT) creation and destruction A computer screen is constantly " refreshing " . Faster than the eye can see (usually) the screen is being repainted from top to bottom. [1] Some use the term " arising " for what is " up " at the moment. What is " up " at the moment is constantly changing. It can safely be said that any sense of continuity in that is an illusion. So if there is any such thing as truth/Truth it surely must be that constant refresh, which is ever and always a disavowal of what went before. And the notion of destruction/creation can be seen in that... destruction in that what just was is already disavowed, creation in that the new is ever arising fresh. But there is no real " force " of creation or destruction. Nothing is being opposed. The constant refresh is just the way it is. Bill In the largest sense, of course, Truth is everything manifest and unmanifest, but the reason I have trouble with Truth being creation/destruction is that, as you imply, nothing is really being created or destroyed; there is no activity going on at all. Truth is not 'doing' anything, rather Truth IS in it's totality, always has been and always will be 'outside' of any temporal framework; any arising and falling. What is seemingly occurring is that various seeming parts of Truth are being experienced in a seeming sequence through the seeming act of perception. There's no more creating or destroying going on than there is when the eye moves from one frame of a motion picture to the next. All frames were present on the film before, during and after the viewing of it, and it hasn't 'done' anything, nor has it been changed by the viewing of it. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 4, 2006 Report Share Posted May 4, 2006 Nisargadatta , ADHHUB wrote: > > > In a message dated 5/4/2006 5:51:33 AM Pacific Daylight Time, > Nisargadatta writes: > > " billrishel " illusyn > Thu May 4, 2006 3:13am(PDT) > creation and destruction > > > A computer screen is constantly " refreshing " . > Faster than the eye can see (usually) the screen > is being repainted from top to bottom. [1] > > Some use the term " arising " for what is > " up " at the moment. What is " up " at the moment > is constantly changing. > > It can safely be said that any sense of continuity > in that is an illusion. > > So if there is any such thing as truth/Truth it > surely must be that constant refresh, which is > ever and always a disavowal of what went before. > > And the notion of destruction/creation can be seen > in that... destruction in that what just was is > already disavowed, creation in that the new is ever > arising fresh. > > But there is no real " force " of creation or destruction. > Nothing is being opposed. > > The constant refresh is just the way it is. > > > Bill > > > > In the largest sense, of course, Truth is everything manifest and > unmanifest, but the reason I have trouble with Truth being creation/destruction is > that, as you imply, nothing is really being created or destroyed; there is no > activity going on at all. Truth is not 'doing' anything, rather Truth IS in it's > totality, always has been and always will be 'outside' of any temporal > framework; any arising and falling. > > What is seemingly occurring is that various seeming parts of Truth are being > experienced in a seeming sequence through the seeming act of perception. > There's no more creating or destroying going on than there is when the eye moves > from one frame of a motion picture to the next. All frames were present on > the film before, during and after the viewing of it, and it hasn't 'done' > anything, nor has it been changed by the viewing of it. > > Phil Think of it in terms of " gestalt " : What " arises " is a gestalt... and that gestalt is superceded by a " new " gestalt. The arising of the new gestlat is creation, repeating over and over again, and with each new creation the prior is -- in effect -- destroyed, cast aside. Now, there is a signficant difference between an openness to each new gestalt and a " clinging to " (metaphoric term) the prior. When there is the " clinging " then a dream of continuity is woven. The new, instead of standing on its own (its nature), is gestalted *as a continuation* of the prior. It is this *forging of continuation*, a " false gestalt process " , that is the distortive process. It is a kind of hypnosis. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 4, 2006 Report Share Posted May 4, 2006 Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn wrote: > > Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@ wrote: > > > > > > In a message dated 5/4/2006 5:51:33 AM Pacific Daylight Time, > > Nisargadatta writes: > > > > " billrishel " illusyn@ > > Thu May 4, 2006 3:13am(PDT) > > creation and destruction > > > > > > A computer screen is constantly " refreshing " . > > Faster than the eye can see (usually) the screen > > is being repainted from top to bottom. [1] > > > > Some use the term " arising " for what is > > " up " at the moment. What is " up " at the moment > > is constantly changing. > > > > It can safely be said that any sense of continuity > > in that is an illusion. > > > > So if there is any such thing as truth/Truth it > > surely must be that constant refresh, which is > > ever and always a disavowal of what went before. > > > > And the notion of destruction/creation can be seen > > in that... destruction in that what just was is > > already disavowed, creation in that the new is ever > > arising fresh. > > > > But there is no real " force " of creation or destruction. > > Nothing is being opposed. > > > > The constant refresh is just the way it is. > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > > > In the largest sense, of course, Truth is everything manifest and > > unmanifest, but the reason I have trouble with Truth being > creation/destruction is > > that, as you imply, nothing is really being created or destroyed; > there is no > > activity going on at all. Truth is not 'doing' anything, rather > Truth IS in it's > > totality, always has been and always will be 'outside' of any temporal > > framework; any arising and falling. > > > > What is seemingly occurring is that various seeming parts of Truth > are being > > experienced in a seeming sequence through the seeming act of > perception. > > There's no more creating or destroying going on than there is when > the eye moves > > from one frame of a motion picture to the next. All frames were > present on > > the film before, during and after the viewing of it, and it hasn't > 'done' > > anything, nor has it been changed by the viewing of it. > > > > Phil > > Think of it in terms of " gestalt " : > > What " arises " is a gestalt... > and that gestalt is superceded by a " new " gestalt. > > The arising of the new gestlat is creation, repeating > over and over again, and with each new creation the > prior is -- in effect -- destroyed, cast aside. > > Now, there is a signficant difference between an openness > to each new gestalt and a " clinging to " (metaphoric term) > the prior. When there is the " clinging " then a dream of > continuity is woven. The new, instead of standing on its > own (its nature), is gestalted *as a continuation* of the > prior. It is this *forging of continuation*, a " false > gestalt process " , that is the distortive process. > > It is a kind of hypnosis. > > > Bill > Beautiful. One can surf a gestalt....very much like a good surfer can ride a huge wave. One can experience the moment to moment naturalness....and easyness ........of what is. Jan Cox talks of this as being in a flowing river and periodically standing up...and looking around. Perhaps this our function......perhaps we are God's sentience. toombaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 4, 2006 Report Share Posted May 4, 2006 Nisargadatta , " toombaru2006 " <lastrain wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 5/4/2006 5:51:33 AM Pacific Daylight Time, > > > Nisargadatta writes: > > > > > > " billrishel " illusyn@ > > > Thu May 4, 2006 3:13am(PDT) > > > creation and destruction > > > > > > > > > A computer screen is constantly " refreshing " . > > > Faster than the eye can see (usually) the screen > > > is being repainted from top to bottom. [1] > > > > > > Some use the term " arising " for what is > > > " up " at the moment. What is " up " at the moment > > > is constantly changing. > > > > > > It can safely be said that any sense of continuity > > > in that is an illusion. > > > > > > So if there is any such thing as truth/Truth it > > > surely must be that constant refresh, which is > > > ever and always a disavowal of what went before. > > > > > > And the notion of destruction/creation can be seen > > > in that... destruction in that what just was is > > > already disavowed, creation in that the new is ever > > > arising fresh. > > > > > > But there is no real " force " of creation or destruction. > > > Nothing is being opposed. > > > > > > The constant refresh is just the way it is. > > > > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > > > > > > > In the largest sense, of course, Truth is everything manifest and > > > unmanifest, but the reason I have trouble with Truth being > > creation/destruction is > > > that, as you imply, nothing is really being created or destroyed; > > there is no > > > activity going on at all. Truth is not 'doing' anything, rather > > Truth IS in it's > > > totality, always has been and always will be 'outside' of any > temporal > > > framework; any arising and falling. > > > > > > What is seemingly occurring is that various seeming parts of Truth > > are being > > > experienced in a seeming sequence through the seeming act of > > perception. > > > There's no more creating or destroying going on than there is when > > the eye moves > > > from one frame of a motion picture to the next. All frames were > > present on > > > the film before, during and after the viewing of it, and it hasn't > > 'done' > > > anything, nor has it been changed by the viewing of it. > > > > > > Phil > > > > Think of it in terms of " gestalt " : > > > > What " arises " is a gestalt... > > and that gestalt is superceded by a " new " gestalt. > > > > The arising of the new gestlat is creation, repeating > > over and over again, and with each new creation the > > prior is -- in effect -- destroyed, cast aside. > > > > Now, there is a signficant difference between an openness > > to each new gestalt and a " clinging to " (metaphoric term) > > the prior. When there is the " clinging " then a dream of > > continuity is woven. The new, instead of standing on its > > own (its nature), is gestalted *as a continuation* of the > > prior. It is this *forging of continuation*, a " false > > gestalt process " , that is the distortive process. > > > > It is a kind of hypnosis. > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > > Beautiful. > > > One can surf a gestalt....very much like a good surfer can ride a huge > wave. > > One can experience the moment to moment naturalness....and easyness > .......of what is. > > Jan Cox talks of this as being in a flowing river and periodically > standing up...and looking around. That periodic standing up ... and looking around... that touches on something that I have yet to find a way to discuss... or even to think about! but with that inspiration... perhaps... > > Perhaps this our function......perhaps we are God's sentience. > or perhaps.... even more likely? His REALLY WIERD sense of humor! > > > > toombaru > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 5, 2006 Report Share Posted May 5, 2006 --- toombaru2006 <lastrain a écrit : Nisargadatta , " billrishel " <illusyn wrote: > > Nisargadatta , ADHHUB@ wrote: > > > > > > In a message dated 5/4/2006 5:51:33 AM Pacific Daylight Time, > > Nisargadatta writes: > > > > " billrishel " illusyn@ > > Thu May 4, 2006 3:13am(PDT) > > creation and destruction > > > > > > A computer screen is constantly " refreshing " . > > Faster than the eye can see (usually) the screen > > is being repainted from top to bottom. [1] > > > > Some use the term " arising " for what is > > " up " at the moment. What is " up " at the moment > > is constantly changing. > > > > It can safely be said that any sense of continuity > > in that is an illusion. > > > > So if there is any such thing as truth/Truth it > > surely must be that constant refresh, which is > > ever and always a disavowal of what went before. > > > > And the notion of destruction/creation can be seen > > in that... destruction in that what just was is > > already disavowed, creation in that the new is ever > > arising fresh. > > > > But there is no real " force " of creation or destruction. > > Nothing is being opposed. > > > > The constant refresh is just the way it is. > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > > > In the largest sense, of course, Truth is everything manifest and > > unmanifest, but the reason I have trouble with Truth being > creation/destruction is > > that, as you imply, nothing is really being created or destroyed; > there is no > > activity going on at all. Truth is not 'doing' anything, rather > Truth IS in it's > > totality, always has been and always will be 'outside' of any temporal > > framework; any arising and falling. > > > > What is seemingly occurring is that various seeming parts of Truth > are being > > experienced in a seeming sequence through the seeming act of > perception. > > There's no more creating or destroying going on than there is when > the eye moves > > from one frame of a motion picture to the next. All frames were > present on > > the film before, during and after the viewing of it, and it hasn't > 'done' > > anything, nor has it been changed by the viewing of it. > > > > Phil > > Think of it in terms of " gestalt " : > > What " arises " is a gestalt... > and that gestalt is superceded by a " new " gestalt. > > The arising of the new gestlat is creation, repeating > over and over again, and with each new creation the > prior is -- in effect -- destroyed, cast aside. > > Now, there is a signficant difference between an openness > to each new gestalt and a " clinging to " (metaphoric term) > the prior. When there is the " clinging " then a dream of > continuity is woven. The new, instead of standing on its > own (its nature), is gestalted *as a continuation* of the > prior. It is this *forging of continuation*, a " false > gestalt process " , that is the distortive process. > > It is a kind of hypnosis. > > > Bill > Beautiful. One can surf a gestalt....very much like a good surfer can ride a huge wave. One can experience the moment to moment naturalness....and easyness ........of what is. Jan Cox talks of this as being in a flowing river and periodically standing up...and looking around. Perhaps this our function......perhaps we are God's sentience. toombaru Wheter or not we are God`s sentience, how can I call that point that you have touched so deeply in me? Patricia ** If you do not wish to receive individual emails, to change your subscription, sign in with your ID and go to Edit My Groups: /mygroups?edit=1 Under the Message Delivery option, choose " No Email " for the Nisargadatta group and click on Save Changes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 5, 2006 Report Share Posted May 5, 2006 > > Wheter or not we are God`s sentience, > how can I call that point that you have touched so > deeply in me? > > Patricia > > > > Lemon......................and blueberry. :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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