Fwd: Durga/Joyce Satsang and enlightenment - intersubjective realities

[Guest guest]

NonDualPhil , " Arvind " <adithya_comming

wrote:

 

NonDualPhil , " Durga " <durgaji108@> wrote:

>

> NonDualPhil , " Arvind " <adithya_comming@>

wrote:

> >

> > NonDualPhil , " Durga " <durgaji108@> wrote:

> > >

> > > NonDualPhil , Insight <insight@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >Durga: It is the absolute bottom line teaching of

Advaita/Vedanta

> > > > that once the Self is seen, that is it. Once Self-ignorance

> > > > goes, it is forever gone. There is absolutely no need for

> > > > continual practice after that. An analogy to this is once

> > > > you've seen that what you had mistaken as a snake is a rope,

> > > > you cannot get the snake illusion back, no matter how

> > > > hard you try.

> > > a >

> > > > ========

> > > >

> > > > Joyce: Once the Self is seen that's it?

> > > > No wonder there are so many advaitan teachers

> > > > popping up everywhere.

> > >

> >

> >

> > Question.: Will the knowledge gained by direct

> > experience be lost afterwards?

> >

> > Ramana Maharshi: Kaivalya Navanita says it may be

> > lost. Experience gained without

> > rooting out all the vasanas cannot

> > remain steady. Efforts must be

> > made to eradicate the vasanas.

> >

> > Otherwise rebirth after death takes

> > place. Some say direct experience

> > results from hearing from one's

> > master; others say it is from

> > reflection; yet others say from one-

> > pointedness and also from samadhi.

> > Though they look different on the

> > surface, ultimately they mean the same.

> >

> > KNOWLEDGE CAN REMAIN UNSHAKEN ONLY

> > AFTER ALL THE VASANAS ARE ROOTED

> > OUT.

 

Here is little more of Ramana on this subject

from his " talks... " :

 

Talk 140.

 

D.: What is reality?

 

M: Reality must be always real.

 

It is not with forms and names.

 

That which underlies these is the Reality. It underlies limitations,

being itself limitless. It is not bound. It underlies unrealities,

itself being real.

 

Reality is that which is. It is as it is. It transcends speech,

beyond the expressions, e.g., existence, non-existence, etc.

 

 

Talk 141.

 

The same gentleman later, after quoting a verse from Kaivalya,

asked: " Can jnana be lost after being once attained? "

 

M: Jnana, once revealed, takes time to steady itself.

 

The Self is certainly within the direct experience of everyone, but

not as one imagines it to be. It is only as it is. This Experience

is samadhi.

 

Just as fire remains without scorching against incantations. or

other devices but scorches otherwise, so also the Self remains

veiled by vasanas and reveals itself when there are no vasanas.

Owing to the fluctuation of the vasanas, jnana takes time to steady

itself.Unsteady jnana is not enough to check rebirths.

 

JNANA CANNOT REMAIN UNSHAKEN SIDE BY SIDE WITH VASANAS.

 

True, that in the proximity of a great master, the vasanas will

cease to be active, the mind becomes still and samadhi results,

similar to fire not scorching because of other devices. Thus the

disciple gains true knowledge and right experience in the presence

of the master. To remain unshaken in it further efforts are

necessary.

 

He will know it to be his real Being and thus be liberated even

while alive. Samadhi with closed eyes is certainly good, but one

must go further until it is realized that actionlessness and action

are not hostile to each other. Fear of loss of samadhi while one is

active is the sign of ignorance. Samadhi must be the natural life of

everyone.

 

There is a state beyond our efforts or effortlessness. Until it is

realized effort is necessary.

 

After tasting such Bliss, even once one will repeatedly try to

regain it. " Having once experienced the Bliss of Peace no one would

like to be out of it or engaged himself otherwise.

 

It is as difficult for ajnani to engage in thoughts as it is for an

ajnani to be free from thought. , The common man says that he does

not know himself; he thinks many thoughts and cannot remain without

thinking.

 

Any kind of activity does not affect a jnani; his mind remains ever

in eternal Peace.

 

 

 

 

> >

> >

> > ---

> >

> > PS: I greatly like most of your postings, Durgaji!

> >

> > and, I don't post the above in an effort to counter

> > or argue with you but, to simply point to an alternative

> > view point from someone [Ramana] genuinely Realized,

> > Directly Experienced and Truthful and Honest as well!

> >

> >

> > [...]

>

> Hey Arvind,

>

> I don't know. I guess it just depends on who one

> takes as the authority. If one takes Ramana, then

> accept what he says. If one takes what another

> teacher says, then accept that.

>

> Or there is always the 'wait and see pudding'

> theory. :-)

>

> Durga

>

 

--- End forwarded message ---