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Beyond beyond....how lonely we areob

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Bob -

 

There's no supposition.

 

Dying to self and all returns one right back here, as is.

 

Kerplot!

 

You could be posting on a list, picking your nose, walking your dog,

gossiping with your friend, visiting your mom in the hospital --

 

It's all as it is.

 

That there is no one to connect with, and no things to connect with

each other -- that doesn't mean that human life doesn't go on just as

it is.

 

Whatever emotions you feel are felt, whatever you do, you do.

 

It's clear that totality is the only

" mover " or " doer " and that which is being done and the doer aren't

split, the mover, moving, and moved not separated. Anywhere, at any

time, for any one.

 

It's all inclusive - and it has nothing to do with dichotomous

concept like being enlightened or not being enlightened.

 

There isn't anything separable which can locate a quality in itself,

like an enlightened quality.

 

-- D.

 

(nothing new below)

 

Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 "

<Roberibus111 wrote:

>

> Suppose you realized enlightenment. I would say complete

enlightenment

> but that's silly. Of course it would be COMPLETE enlightenment.

Like

> pregnancy, you can't just have a LITTLE bit of it. It's here or

it's

> not. Period. Anyway, suppose this was so. You are THERE. Who could

you

> tell about it? Members on a non-duality list. Ha ha ha ! C'mon.

> Suppose you won the PowerBall!...$500,000,000.!!!!! and that NOW of

all

> times, God/the Universe/ The All/ Self...whatever....played a real

neat

> trick on you and sucked everybody else out of 'your' world and left

you

> alone with absolutely no one to tell the great news to. How happy

would

> you be with your newly aquired half a billion bucks? No one to show

how

> super wealthy and cool you now were, now that " all your troubles'

were

> gone? Ha ha ha! Well even if that dirty trick wasn't in the offing,

> after you told everyone then left them behind or not, my bet is,

within

> a short period of time, the thrill would be gone(Thank you Riley

[better

> known as B.B.]King). Without 'others', at least while stuck here in

> duality, what the hell would anything mean? No matter what you

gained

> or what you lost or how happy you were or how heartbroken you

> felt...and there was NO ONE HERE to tell...would you laugh,

cry..what?

> Whereas it may be that there are no souls and never have been etc.,

> unless and until, you have no need of communicating, if that was

your

> experience for real, and not just something to write and try to

impress

> others with your 'achievement', LONELINESS prevails. Not that that

> would be new. Loneliness IS. IT is the driving force. We desire to

> connect. After all the actualizing, realizing, gaining of degrees

and

> financial success, and achievement and and 'findings of truth and

> meaning'.........We are still lonely. Why? I don't know. But if it

were

> not so, and if any one of us here were to really NOT be

lonely.....why

> are we here posting back and forth? No choice? Observing only?

Thoughts

> come and go but you 'THE GROUND' remain unmoved and ALL THAT CRAP.

As I

> said earlier: C'mon with you! Shallow or deep or wise or stupid,

THIS

> IS FACT.I may be THAT, but THIS is LONELY, and I do not fully feel

that

> I am THAT, if I am writing this.....no matter what I say or how I

try

> to come off, until the time of no more 'me' and no more writing to

> lists to kill time or communicate or explain, or whatever......I am

> feeling alone...unenlightened.....needing....letting the Lord be my

> Shepherd by a thousand different names and myths and metaphors.

Excuse

> the lengthy post, but I was in need of communicating it and

connecting

> with whoever receives the communication. And if any soul says that

this

> is not the case for themselves as well......well delusion is

another

> important aspect of this world we live in and that's OK too.

> Just some 'Sunday Morning Comin Down' thoughts and things.

>

> .........bob

>

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Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033

wrote:

>

> Bob -

>

> There's no supposition.

>

> Dying to self and all returns one right back here, as is.

>

> Kerplot!

>

> You could be posting on a list, picking your nose, walking your

dog,

> gossiping with your friend, visiting your mom in the hospital --

>

> It's all as it is.

>

> That there is no one to connect with, and no things to connect with

> each other -- that doesn't mean that human life doesn't go on just

as

> it is.

>

> Whatever emotions you feel are felt, whatever you do, you do.

>

> It's clear that totality is the only

> " mover " or " doer " and that which is being done and the doer aren't

> split, the mover, moving, and moved not separated. Anywhere, at

any

> time, for any one.

>

> It's all inclusive - and it has nothing to do with dichotomous

> concept like being enlightened or not being enlightened.

>

> There isn't anything separable which can locate a quality in

itself,

> like an enlightened quality.

>

> -- D.

>

> (nothing new below)

>

(nothing new in the above)

 

Thanks Dan. I think I have a handle on what the Buddha searching for

the Buddha is about. Huang-Po et al. But if you nor I weren't looking

for connection of some sort.....we wouldn't be here. Whether real or

unreal, substanced or nonsubstanced, enlightened or not. And your

right....all the dichotomies are just and only concepts as is my

writing and your reply in turn. It all goes on within you and without

you as Mr. G. Harrison sang. And anything I write or you write in

return or on your own, is just as false as it is true. And that's not

just a paradox for me anymore. That's ground zero. It is as it is,

and what it is, and neither you nor I can explain it in it's bare

nakedness sans concept, anymore than we can take these bones and

physically fly to the moon I'm pointing towards. And I'm fortunate I

guess to be able to say that I for one, don't understand what it is

I'm talking about and am therefore not proud nor defensive of it. It

is, as you say, as it is. Whatever is said is just said and has zero

relation to the truth or root of the matter, no matter what either of

us think. And to be as clear as possible, the 'Lonely' I was

referring to, has nothing to do with the maudlin meanings of that

word that are written by and for posies. It's of a different caliber.

And if it's not felt by a being...that being is not of the human

tribe.

 

.....bob

 

 

 

 

> Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 "

> <Roberibus111@> wrote:

> >

> > Suppose you realized enlightenment. I would say complete

> enlightenment

<SNIP>

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Bob -

 

I get what you're saying -- I'd put it a bit differently:

 

It seems to me that it needn't be that we're looking for a

connection -- more that we're expressing what already is the case:

 

a " connection " so seamless that there aren't separated beings

requiring connection or being connected.

 

Words and thinking don't necessarily give the " gestalt " of what's

going on here - " reading between the lines " does. We are free to

exchage words, even while recogizing the seamless totality involved

with all our expressions.

 

my 2c --

 

-- Dan

 

(nnb)

 

> Thanks Dan. I think I have a handle on what the Buddha searching

for

> the Buddha is about. Huang-Po et al. But if you nor I weren't

looking

> for connection of some sort.....we wouldn't be here. Whether real

or

> unreal, substanced or nonsubstanced, enlightened or not. And your

> right....all the dichotomies are just and only concepts as is my

> writing and your reply in turn. It all goes on within you and

without

> you as Mr. G. Harrison sang. And anything I write or you write in

> return or on your own, is just as false as it is true. And that's

not

> just a paradox for me anymore. That's ground zero. It is as it is,

> and what it is, and neither you nor I can explain it in it's bare

> nakedness sans concept, anymore than we can take these bones and

> physically fly to the moon I'm pointing towards. And I'm fortunate

I

> guess to be able to say that I for one, don't understand what it is

> I'm talking about and am therefore not proud nor defensive of it.

It

> is, as you say, as it is. Whatever is said is just said and has

zero

> relation to the truth or root of the matter, no matter what either

of

> us think. And to be as clear as possible, the 'Lonely' I was

> referring to, has nothing to do with the maudlin meanings of that

> word that are written by and for posies. It's of a different

caliber.

> And if it's not felt by a being...that being is not of the human

> tribe.

>

> .....bob

>

>

>

>

> > Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 "

> > <Roberibus111@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Suppose you realized enlightenment. I would say complete

> > enlightenment

> <SNIP>

>

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Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033

wrote:

>

> Bob -

>

> I get what you're saying -- I'd put it a bit differently:

>

> It seems to me that it needn't be that we're looking for a

> connection -- more that we're expressing what already is the case:

>

> a " connection " so seamless that there aren't separated beings

> requiring connection or being connected.

>

> Words and thinking don't necessarily give the " gestalt " of what's

> going on here - " reading between the lines " does. We are free to

> exchage words, even while recogizing the seamless totality involved

> with all our expressions.

>

> my 2c --

>

> -- Dan

>

> (nnb)

 

 

Hi again Dan. Good enough. I think we are using different words and

possibly nuances of meaning, but that at the nitty-gritty, we are in

complete accord. As you have said here, it's between the lines that

we meet(and where we are already in wholeness). Good stuff my friend.

 

..........bob

 

 

> > Thanks Dan. I think I have a handle on what the Buddha searching

> for

> > the Buddha is about. Huang-Po et al. But if you nor I weren't

> looking

> > for connection of some sort.....we wouldn't be here. Whether real

> or

> > unreal, substanced or nonsubstanced, enlightened or not. And your

> > right....all the dichotomies are just and only concepts as is my

> > writing and your reply in turn. It all goes on within you and

> without

> > you as Mr. G. Harrison sang. And anything I write or you write in

> > return or on your own, is just as false as it is true. And that's

> not

> > just a paradox for me anymore. That's ground zero. It is as it

is,

> > and what it is, and neither you nor I can explain it in it's bare

> > nakedness sans concept, anymore than we can take these bones and

> > physically fly to the moon I'm pointing towards. And I'm

fortunate

> I

> > guess to be able to say that I for one, don't understand what it

is

> > I'm talking about and am therefore not proud nor defensive of it.

> It

> > is, as you say, as it is. Whatever is said is just said and has

> zero

> > relation to the truth or root of the matter, no matter what

either

> of

> > us think. And to be as clear as possible, the 'Lonely' I was

> > referring to, has nothing to do with the maudlin meanings of that

> > word that are written by and for posies. It's of a different

> caliber.

> > And if it's not felt by a being...that being is not of the human

> > tribe.

> >

> > .....bob

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > > Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 "

> > > <Roberibus111@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Suppose you realized enlightenment. I would say complete

> > > enlightenment

> > <SNIP>

> >

>

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Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033

wrote:

>

> Bob -

>

> I get what you're saying -- I'd put it a bit differently:

>

> It seems to me that it needn't be that we're looking for a

> connection -- more that we're expressing what already is the case:

 

c.f. Gregory Bateson's " a pattern that connects " ...

 

discovery vs. invention

 

implicit vs. explicit

 

open vs. driven

 

> a " connection " so seamless that there aren't separated beings

> requiring connection or being connected.

>

> Words and thinking don't necessarily give the " gestalt " of what's

> going on here - " reading between the lines " does. We are free to

> exchage words, even while recogizing the seamless totality involved

> with all our expressions.

>

> my 2c --

>

> -- Dan

>

> (nnb)

>

> > Thanks Dan. I think I have a handle on what the Buddha searching

> for

> > the Buddha is about. Huang-Po et al. But if you nor I weren't

> looking

> > for connection of some sort.....we wouldn't be here. Whether real

> or

> > unreal, substanced or nonsubstanced, enlightened or not. And your

> > right....all the dichotomies are just and only concepts as is my

> > writing and your reply in turn. It all goes on within you and

> without

> > you as Mr. G. Harrison sang. And anything I write or you write in

> > return or on your own, is just as false as it is true. And that's

> not

> > just a paradox for me anymore. That's ground zero. It is as it

is,

> > and what it is, and neither you nor I can explain it in it's bare

> > nakedness sans concept, anymore than we can take these bones and

> > physically fly to the moon I'm pointing towards. And I'm

fortunate

> I

> > guess to be able to say that I for one, don't understand what it

is

> > I'm talking about and am therefore not proud nor defensive of it.

> It

> > is, as you say, as it is. Whatever is said is just said and has

> zero

> > relation to the truth or root of the matter, no matter what

either

> of

> > us think. And to be as clear as possible, the 'Lonely' I was

> > referring to, has nothing to do with the maudlin meanings of that

> > word that are written by and for posies. It's of a different

> caliber.

> > And if it's not felt by a being...that being is not of the human

> > tribe.

> >

> > .....bob

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > > Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 "

> > > <Roberibus111@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Suppose you realized enlightenment. I would say complete

> > > enlightenment

> > <SNIP>

> >

>

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Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <illusyn

wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033@>

> wrote:

> >

> > Bob -

> >

> > I get what you're saying -- I'd put it a bit differently:

> >

> > It seems to me that it needn't be that we're looking for a

> > connection -- more that we're expressing what already is the case:

>

> c.f. Gregory Bateson's " a pattern that connects " ...

>

> discovery vs. invention

>

> implicit vs. explicit

>

> open vs. driven

---------------

What seems vs what Is.

 

Neat. I've got your point, and as with Dan's statement below I think

we are all attempting to make statements which are in fact

equivalences in the heart of the matter. And I do like Gregory..a lot.

 

......bob

 

> > a " connection " so seamless that there aren't separated beings

> > requiring connection or being connected.

> >

> > Words and thinking don't necessarily give the " gestalt " of what's

> > going on here - " reading between the lines " does. We are free to

> > exchage words, even while recogizing the seamless totality

involved

> > with all our expressions.

> >

> > my 2c --

> >

> > -- Dan

> >

> > (nnb)

> >

> > > Thanks Dan. I think I have a handle on what the Buddha

searching

> > for

> > > the Buddha is about. Huang-Po et al. But if you nor I weren't

> > looking

> > > for connection of some sort.....we wouldn't be here. Whether

real

> > or

> > > unreal, substanced or nonsubstanced, enlightened or not. And

your

> > > right....all the dichotomies are just and only concepts as is

my

> > > writing and your reply in turn. It all goes on within you and

> > without

> > > you as Mr. G. Harrison sang. And anything I write or you write

in

> > > return or on your own, is just as false as it is true. And

that's

> > not

> > > just a paradox for me anymore. That's ground zero. It is as it

> is,

> > > and what it is, and neither you nor I can explain it in it's

bare

> > > nakedness sans concept, anymore than we can take these bones

and

> > > physically fly to the moon I'm pointing towards. And I'm

> fortunate

> > I

> > > guess to be able to say that I for one, don't understand what

it

> is

> > > I'm talking about and am therefore not proud nor defensive of

it.

> > It

> > > is, as you say, as it is. Whatever is said is just said and has

> > zero

> > > relation to the truth or root of the matter, no matter what

> either

> > of

> > > us think. And to be as clear as possible, the 'Lonely' I was

> > > referring to, has nothing to do with the maudlin meanings of

that

> > > word that are written by and for posies. It's of a different

> > caliber.

> > > And if it's not felt by a being...that being is not of the

human

> > > tribe.

> > >

> > > .....bob

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > > Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 "

> > > > <Roberibus111@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Suppose you realized enlightenment. I would say complete

> > > > enlightenment

> > > <SNIP>

> > >

> >

>

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<<

a " connection " so seamless that there aren't separated

beings requiring connection or being connected.

 

Words and thinking don't necessarily give the " gestalt "

of what's going on here - " reading between the lines "

does. We are free to exchage words, even while

recogizing the seamless totality involved with all our

expressions.

>>

 

you know... I *really like* that...

 

Bill

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Nisargadatta , " Bill Rishel " <illusyn

wrote:

>

> <<

> a " connection " so seamless that there aren't separated

> beings requiring connection or being connected.

>

> Words and thinking don't necessarily give the " gestalt "

> of what's going on here - " reading between the lines "

> does. We are free to exchage words, even while

> recogizing the seamless totality involved with all our

> expressions.

> >>

>

> you know... I *really like* that...

>

> Bill

 

 

Hi Bill.....I 'connected' with that too.

 

bob

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