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Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno " <jasondedonno

wrote:

>

> Hello. I'm new here. I had no idea Nisargadatta is so well known and

> popular.

>

> Cheers

> Jason

 

welcome Jason and...

say more please...

 

what brings your heart here?

 

have you tasted the fire of

knowing within?

 

are you seeking that?

 

what inner journey carries you

in the outer arc of meeting us here?

 

Bill

 

 

 

 

>

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> welcome Jason and...

> say more please...

>

> what brings your heart here?

>

> have you tasted the fire of

> knowing within?

>

> are you seeking that?

>

> what inner journey carries you

> in the outer arc of meeting us here?

>

> Bill

 

Hello Bill

 

Thank you for the warm welcome.

 

I've been reading Nisargadatta for about 10 years on and off. I

found his books by accident - in a second hand book show. Two old

red hardbacks called " I am That " . I was grasped by the dialogues.

 

I both wish for and fear the supreme state. I think my lifestyle -

or rather work, which involves constant problem solving and learning

new stuff - makes it difficult. As Nisargadatta said, all you need

is a quiet mind... but it's not easy when you have to create things

with it all the time.

 

I joined this group to bring up issues like this, and to read what

you're all discussing, and to see how the yoga has gone with others

here. I can't imagine anyone other than Nisargadatta being the

supreme, so it fascinates me to think there may be people here who

are " that " . Another reason I joined is so I am not entirely alone in

this.

 

Inner journey. When I was younger I was very unaware of my own

unconscious, and it's been letting me know this in various ways over

the years, most notably in the form of dream symbolism.

 

I read here about " tension " and relief from tension, and I guess

that's what it's about for me. And overcoming fear.

 

Jason

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> Hello Bill

>

> Thank you for the warm welcome.

>

> I've been reading Nisargadatta for about 10 years on and off. I

> found his books by accident - in a second hand book show. Two old

> red hardbacks called " I am That " . I was grasped by the dialogues.

>

> I both wish for and fear the supreme state. I think my lifestyle -

> or rather work, which involves constant problem solving and

learning

> new stuff - makes it difficult. As Nisargadatta said, all you need

> is a quiet mind... but it's not easy when you have to create

things

> with it all the time.

>

> I joined this group to bring up issues like this, and to read what

> you're all discussing, and to see how the yoga has gone with

others

> here. I can't imagine anyone other than Nisargadatta being the

> supreme, so it fascinates me to think there may be people here who

> are " that " . Another reason I joined is so I am not entirely alone

in

> this.

>

> Inner journey. When I was younger I was very unaware of my own

> unconscious, and it's been letting me know this in various ways

over

> the years, most notably in the form of dream symbolism.

>

> I read here about " tension " and relief from tension, and I guess

> that's what it's about for me. And overcoming fear.

>

> Jason

 

 

Here you have said it, Bill:

 

" and the reason that " mere consciousness " does so trigger

is a realization, effectively, that in that awareness-

presence of I-intent is an inherent incompleteness that

yearns to be transcended, that yearns to be shot-beyond. "

 

Jason

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Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno "

<jasondedonno wrote:

>

> > welcome Jason and...

> > say more please...

> >

> > what brings your heart here?

> >

> > have you tasted the fire of

> > knowing within?

> >

> > are you seeking that?

> >

> > what inner journey carries you

> > in the outer arc of meeting us here?

> >

> > Bill

>

> Hello Bill

>

> Thank you for the warm welcome.

>

> I've been reading Nisargadatta for about 10 years on and off. I

> found his books by accident - in a second hand book show. Two old

> red hardbacks called " I am That " . I was grasped by the dialogues.

>

> I both wish for and fear the supreme state. I think my lifestyle -

> or rather work, which involves constant problem solving and

learning

> new stuff - makes it difficult. As Nisargadatta said, all you need

> is a quiet mind... but it's not easy when you have to create

things

> with it all the time.

>

> I joined this group to bring up issues like this, and to read what

> you're all discussing, and to see how the yoga has gone with

others

> here. I can't imagine anyone other than Nisargadatta being the

> supreme, so it fascinates me to think there may be people here who

> are " that " . Another reason I joined is so I am not entirely alone

in

> this.

>

> Inner journey. When I was younger I was very unaware of my own

> unconscious, and it's been letting me know this in various ways

over

> the years, most notably in the form of dream symbolism.

>

> I read here about " tension " and relief from tension, and I guess

> that's what it's about for me. And overcoming fear.

>

> Jason

>

 

 

Namaste Jason,

 

IMHO, tension is the slender thread between what is and what we

think 'should be', vacillating between a and b. Fear of the unknown

is the other side of the continuum. See, we are already non-dual ;-)

 

 

Yours In Love,

Ana

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> I both wish for and fear the supreme state. I think my lifestyle -

> or rather work, which involves constant problem solving and learning

> new stuff - makes it difficult. As Nisargadatta said, all you need

> is a quiet mind... but it's not easy when you have to create things

> with it all the time.

 

I am both a software engineer and an artist

and quiet mind is hardly a hindrance; quite

the contrary.

 

Quiet mind as I consider that term is not the

absence of thought, really, but the absence of

any " self-consciousness " . Like the Zen saying

about eating when hungry, sleeping when tired,

thought arises when needed, and rests when not.

 

It is only when self-consciousness gets in the

mix that thought gets obsessive in endless loops

of self-reference.

 

Bill

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> I am both a software engineer and an artist

> and quiet mind is hardly a hindrance; quite

> the contrary.

>

> Quiet mind as I consider that term is not the

> absence of thought, really, but the absence of

> any " self-consciousness " . Like the Zen saying

> about eating when hungry, sleeping when tired,

> thought arises when needed, and rests when not.

>

> It is only when self-consciousness gets in the

> mix that thought gets obsessive in endless loops

> of self-reference.

>

> Bill

 

Thanks. And now I also remember Nisargadatta saying that if you use

your spare time to concentrate on the thought-feeling I am, that

should be enough.

 

Interestly, I also work with art and software. I work with and teach

3D graphics, as well as some other IT related things!

 

It's not often I dream about Nisargadatta, but I did last night. This

would make it the second time in 10 years. In this dream I found an

old book about Nisargadatta. It had a framing text written by the

Maharishi or someone, and then there were some prayers, and Indian

ragas, and in the centre of the book was a long dialogue with

Nisargadatta and someone. I noticed that the dialogue text had pencil

notes made to it by Nisargadatta. I read then dialogue and it became

like a trail,. or path, written on the ground in the grass. At the end

of the trail was sitting Nisargadatta behind a desk, in person. We

spoke a little bit, and then we walked back together, talking, to the

beginning of the trail, during which time he said I was doing ok. Now

he wanted me to sit at the opposite end of the trail and meditate.

 

After a while I closed the book.

 

I woke up to do with an alarm with a snooze button. Each time the

alarm went off, I was very aware of the sense " I am " snapping suddenly

into place, like an adams apple shaped bubble appearing forming. I

pressed the snooze button and repeated the experience several times.

The way this " I am " appeared, was like a descent into the conceptual

mind, or like half a tennis ball turning inside out. It was a stable

state, but not the true state.

 

So I think joining this group is significant for me!

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Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno "

<jasondedonno wrote:

>

> > I am both a software engineer and an artist

> > and quiet mind is hardly a hindrance; quite

> > the contrary.

> >

> > Quiet mind as I consider that term is not the

> > absence of thought, really, but the absence of

> > any " self-consciousness " . Like the Zen saying

> > about eating when hungry, sleeping when tired,

> > thought arises when needed, and rests when not.

> >

> > It is only when self-consciousness gets in the

> > mix that thought gets obsessive in endless loops

> > of self-reference.

> >

> > Bill

>

> Thanks. And now I also remember Nisargadatta saying that if you

use

> your spare time to concentrate on the thought-feeling I am, that

> should be enough.

>

> Interestly, I also work with art and software. I work with and

teach

> 3D graphics, as well as some other IT related things!

>

> It's not often I dream about Nisargadatta, but I did last night.

This

> would make it the second time in 10 years. In this dream I found

an

> old book about Nisargadatta. It had a framing text written by the

> Maharishi or someone, and then there were some prayers, and Indian

> ragas, and in the centre of the book was a long dialogue with

> Nisargadatta and someone. I noticed that the dialogue text had

pencil

> notes made to it by Nisargadatta. I read then dialogue and it

became

> like a trail,. or path, written on the ground in the grass. At the

end

> of the trail was sitting Nisargadatta behind a desk, in person. We

> spoke a little bit, and then we walked back together, talking, to

the

> beginning of the trail, during which time he said I was doing ok.

Now

> he wanted me to sit at the opposite end of the trail and meditate.

>

> After a while I closed the book.

>

> I woke up to do with an alarm with a snooze button. Each time the

> alarm went off, I was very aware of the sense " I am " snapping

suddenly

> into place, like an adams apple shaped bubble appearing forming. I

> pressed the snooze button and repeated the experience several

times.

> The way this " I am " appeared, was like a descent into the

conceptual

> mind, or like half a tennis ball turning inside out. It was a

stable

> state, but not the true state.

>

> So I think joining this group is significant for me!

>

enough to be I am.....this so-called group is only thought...

dont give this group-thought a higher value....

couse then you go away from I am...so to speak

anything you give power takes you away from I am

.....iietsa

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Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno "

<jasondedonno wrote:

>

> > I am both a software engineer and an artist

> > and quiet mind is hardly a hindrance; quite

> > the contrary.

> >

> > Quiet mind as I consider that term is not the

> > absence of thought, really, but the absence of

> > any " self-consciousness " . Like the Zen saying

> > about eating when hungry, sleeping when tired,

> > thought arises when needed, and rests when not.

> >

> > It is only when self-consciousness gets in the

> > mix that thought gets obsessive in endless loops

> > of self-reference.

> >

> > Bill

>

> Thanks. And now I also remember Nisargadatta saying that if you use

> your spare time to concentrate on the thought-feeling I am, that

> should be enough.

>

> Interestly, I also work with art and software. I work with and

teach

> 3D graphics, as well as some other IT related things!

>

> It's not often I dream about Nisargadatta, but I did last night.

This

> would make it the second time in 10 years. In this dream I found an

> old book about Nisargadatta. It had a framing text written by the

> Maharishi or someone, and then there were some prayers, and Indian

> ragas, and in the centre of the book was a long dialogue with

> Nisargadatta and someone. I noticed that the dialogue text had

pencil

> notes made to it by Nisargadatta. I read then dialogue and it

became

> like a trail,. or path, written on the ground in the grass. At the

end

> of the trail was sitting Nisargadatta behind a desk, in person. We

> spoke a little bit, and then we walked back together, talking, to

the

> beginning of the trail, during which time he said I was doing ok.

Now

> he wanted me to sit at the opposite end of the trail and meditate.

>

> After a while I closed the book.

>

> I woke up to do with an alarm with a snooze button. Each time the

> alarm went off, I was very aware of the sense " I am " snapping

suddenly

> into place, like an adams apple shaped bubble appearing forming. I

> pressed the snooze button and repeated the experience several

times.

> The way this " I am " appeared, was like a descent into the

conceptual

> mind, or like half a tennis ball turning inside out. It was a

stable

> state, but not the true state.

>

> So I think joining this group is significant for me!

>

 

The most significant part of the dream, it seems to me,

is where he tells you to sit at the opposite end of the

trail and meditate.

 

Do you have a sense of what " opposite end of the trail "

signifies?

 

Bill

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> The most significant part of the dream, it seems to me,

> is where he tells you to sit at the opposite end of the

> trail and meditate.

>

> Do you have a sense of what " opposite end of the trail "

> signifies?

>

> Bill

>

 

Hi again

 

Thanks. Now that I've had some time to reflect, and I think what

it's saying is this:

 

Reading the dialogues is all well and good, but once I have that

knowledge, I have to go and apply it to myself, instead of carrying

on with more and more reading and reflections on the text. Also I

may be attached to Nisargadatta, again, that won't help.

 

I think the Nisargadatta figure in the dream is taking me back to

myself, and telling me to do the " I am " bit and leave the texts

alone.

 

It amazes me that powerful figures like this can appear in a dream,

and behave autonomously, with greater power and knowledge than me.

It's almost as if Nisargadatta is still here, and is still working.

 

Jason

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> Namaste Jason,

>

> IMHO, tension is the slender thread between what is and what we

> think 'should be', vacillating between a and b. Fear of the unknown

> is the other side of the continuum. See, we are already non-dual ;-)

>

>

> Yours In Love,

> Ana

 

Hello

 

I missed your post - thanks for that. Namaste? That sounds like it

could be Nämaste? Swedish?

 

Although I live & work in Sweden, I'm from UK. How did you know about

the Swedish bit?

 

From my experiences this morning, it seems that the " I am " state is

also a kind of tension, but a stable one. We're so used to it.

 

/Jason

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Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno "

<jasondedonno wrote:

>

> > The most significant part of the dream, it seems to me,

> > is where he tells you to sit at the opposite end of the

> > trail and meditate.

> >

> > Do you have a sense of what " opposite end of the trail "

> > signifies?

> >

> > Bill

> >

>

> Hi again

>

> Thanks. Now that I've had some time to reflect, and I think what

> it's saying is this:

>

> Reading the dialogues is all well and good, but once I have that

> knowledge, I have to go and apply it to myself, instead of carrying

> on with more and more reading and reflections on the text. Also I

> may be attached to Nisargadatta, again, that won't help.

>

> I think the Nisargadatta figure in the dream is taking me back to

> myself, and telling me to do the " I am " bit and leave the texts

> alone.

 

That is basically my take on your dream.

Seems he is saying it is time to stop " seeking "

and just be.

 

>

> It amazes me that powerful figures like this can appear in a dream,

> and behave autonomously, with greater power and knowledge than me.

> It's almost as if Nisargadatta is still here, and is still working.

I'm not amazed at all. Seems perfectly natural to me.

 

Bill

 

PS: From your dream account it seems that he especially likes you.

Which would mean you are especially blessed. So leave everything

behind and really go with the new door that is opening. It doesn't

have to be difficult at all when the heart is pure and the intent

is clear.

 

 

> Jason

>

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Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno "

<jasondedonno wrote:

>

> > Namaste Jason,

> >

> > IMHO, tension is the slender thread between what is and what we

> > think 'should be', vacillating between a and b. Fear of the

unknown

> > is the other side of the continuum. See, we are already non-

dual ;-)

> >

> >

> > Yours In Love,

> > Ana

>

> Hello

>

> I missed your post - thanks for that. Namaste? That sounds like it

> could be Nämaste? Swedish?

>

> Although I live & work in Sweden, I'm from UK. How did you know

about

> the Swedish bit?

>

> From my experiences this morning, it seems that the " I am " state is

> also a kind of tension, but a stable one. We're so used to it.

>

> /Jason

>

 

a tension tells you of a resistance.

let the resistance dissolve.

 

don't make it difficult.

let it be easy.

 

the only obstacles are our efforts.

 

Bill

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Nisargadatta , " iietsa " <iietsa wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno "

> <jasondedonno@> wrote:

> >

> > > I am both a software engineer and an artist

> > > and quiet mind is hardly a hindrance; quite

> > > the contrary.

> > >

> > > Quiet mind as I consider that term is not the

> > > absence of thought, really, but the absence of

> > > any " self-consciousness " . Like the Zen saying

> > > about eating when hungry, sleeping when tired,

> > > thought arises when needed, and rests when not.

> > >

> > > It is only when self-consciousness gets in the

> > > mix that thought gets obsessive in endless loops

> > > of self-reference.

> > >

> > > Bill

> >

> > Thanks. And now I also remember Nisargadatta saying that if you

> use

> > your spare time to concentrate on the thought-feeling I am, that

> > should be enough.

> >

> > Interestly, I also work with art and software. I work with and

> teach

> > 3D graphics, as well as some other IT related things!

> >

> > It's not often I dream about Nisargadatta, but I did last night.

> This

> > would make it the second time in 10 years. In this dream I found

> an

> > old book about Nisargadatta. It had a framing text written by

the

> > Maharishi or someone, and then there were some prayers, and

Indian

> > ragas, and in the centre of the book was a long dialogue with

> > Nisargadatta and someone. I noticed that the dialogue text had

> pencil

> > notes made to it by Nisargadatta. I read then dialogue and it

> became

> > like a trail,. or path, written on the ground in the grass. At

the

> end

> > of the trail was sitting Nisargadatta behind a desk, in person.

We

> > spoke a little bit, and then we walked back together, talking,

to

> the

> > beginning of the trail, during which time he said I was doing

ok.

> Now

> > he wanted me to sit at the opposite end of the trail and

meditate.

> >

> > After a while I closed the book.

> >

> > I woke up to do with an alarm with a snooze button. Each time

the

> > alarm went off, I was very aware of the sense " I am " snapping

> suddenly

> > into place, like an adams apple shaped bubble appearing forming.

I

> > pressed the snooze button and repeated the experience several

> times.

> > The way this " I am " appeared, was like a descent into the

> conceptual

> > mind, or like half a tennis ball turning inside out. It was a

> stable

> > state, but not the true state.

> >

> > So I think joining this group is significant for me!

> >

> enough to be I am.....this so-called group is only thought...

> dont give this group-thought a higher value....

> couse then you go away from I am...so to speak

> anything you give power takes you away from I am

> ....iietsa

>

 

 

Dearest iietsa,

 

I Am is the One and only power

We are merely conciously " adding " to it via a " group Soul " , so to

speak, here called Nisargadatta. One ever moves into the unknown.

 

There is and could be nothing that " takes away " from I Am.

 

Everything is ever only " added to " . Albeit often not consciously

and without conscious awareness which is, IMHO, love.

 

Yours In Love,

Ana

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Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno "

<jasondedonno wrote:

>

> > The most significant part of the dream, it seems to me,

> > is where he tells you to sit at the opposite end of the

> > trail and meditate.

> >

> > Do you have a sense of what " opposite end of the trail "

> > signifies?

> >

> > Bill

> >

>

> Hi again

>

> Thanks. Now that I've had some time to reflect, and I think what

> it's saying is this:

>

> Reading the dialogues is all well and good, but once I have that

> knowledge, I have to go and apply it to myself, instead of

carrying

> on with more and more reading and reflections on the text. Also I

> may be attached to Nisargadatta, again, that won't help.

>

> I think the Nisargadatta figure in the dream is taking me back to

> myself, and telling me to do the " I am " bit and leave the texts

> alone.

>

> It amazes me that powerful figures like this can appear in a

dream,

> and behave autonomously, with greater power and knowledge than me.

> It's almost as if Nisargadatta is still here, and is still

working.

>

> Jason

>

 

 

....dreams with dreams Jason,

 

we are no more than the stuff dreams are made of...

Shakespeare paraphrased ;-)

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Nisargadatta , " iietsa " <iietsa wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno "

> <jasondedonno@> wrote:

> >

> > > I am both a software engineer and an artist

> > > and quiet mind is hardly a hindrance; quite

> > > the contrary.

> > >

> > > Quiet mind as I consider that term is not the

> > > absence of thought, really, but the absence of

> > > any " self-consciousness " . Like the Zen saying

> > > about eating when hungry, sleeping when tired,

> > > thought arises when needed, and rests when not.

> > >

> > > It is only when self-consciousness gets in the

> > > mix that thought gets obsessive in endless loops

> > > of self-reference.

> > >

> > > Bill

> >

> > Thanks. And now I also remember Nisargadatta saying that if you

> use

> > your spare time to concentrate on the thought-feeling I am, that

> > should be enough.

> >

> > Interestly, I also work with art and software. I work with and

> teach

> > 3D graphics, as well as some other IT related things!

> >

> > It's not often I dream about Nisargadatta, but I did last night.

> This

> > would make it the second time in 10 years. In this dream I found

> an

> > old book about Nisargadatta. It had a framing text written by the

> > Maharishi or someone, and then there were some prayers, and

Indian

> > ragas, and in the centre of the book was a long dialogue with

> > Nisargadatta and someone. I noticed that the dialogue text had

> pencil

> > notes made to it by Nisargadatta. I read then dialogue and it

> became

> > like a trail,. or path, written on the ground in the grass. At

the

> end

> > of the trail was sitting Nisargadatta behind a desk, in person.

We

> > spoke a little bit, and then we walked back together, talking, to

> the

> > beginning of the trail, during which time he said I was doing ok.

> Now

> > he wanted me to sit at the opposite end of the trail and meditate.

> >

> > After a while I closed the book.

> >

> > I woke up to do with an alarm with a snooze button. Each time the

> > alarm went off, I was very aware of the sense " I am " snapping

> suddenly

> > into place, like an adams apple shaped bubble appearing forming.

I

> > pressed the snooze button and repeated the experience several

> times.

> > The way this " I am " appeared, was like a descent into the

> conceptual

> > mind, or like half a tennis ball turning inside out. It was a

> stable

> > state, but not the true state.

> >

> > So I think joining this group is significant for me!

> >

> enough to be I am.....this so-called group is only thought...

> dont give this group-thought a higher value....

> couse then you go away from I am...so to speak

> anything you give power takes you away from I am

> ....iietsa

>

 

" this so-called group is only thought... "

then you are not paying attention!

 

there is thought, yes, but to say *only* thought?

Oh my!

 

Bill

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> > enough to be I am.....this so-called group is only thought...

> > dont give this group-thought a higher value....

> > couse then you go away from I am...so to speak

> > anything you give power takes you away from I am

> > ....iietsa

> >

>

> " this so-called group is only thought... "

> then you are not paying attention!

>

> there is thought, yes, but to say *only* thought?

> Oh my!

>

> Bill

 

I don't follow - can you explain that please, Bill?

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Nisargadatta , " anabebe57 " <kailashana

wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " iietsa " <iietsa@> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno "

> > <jasondedonno@> wrote:

> > >

> > > > I am both a software engineer and an artist

> > > > and quiet mind is hardly a hindrance; quite

> > > > the contrary.

> > > >

> > > > Quiet mind as I consider that term is not the

> > > > absence of thought, really, but the absence of

> > > > any " self-consciousness " . Like the Zen saying

> > > > about eating when hungry, sleeping when tired,

> > > > thought arises when needed, and rests when not.

> > > >

> > > > It is only when self-consciousness gets in the

> > > > mix that thought gets obsessive in endless loops

> > > > of self-reference.

> > > >

> > > > Bill

> > >

> > > Thanks. And now I also remember Nisargadatta saying that if

you

> > use

> > > your spare time to concentrate on the thought-feeling I am,

that

> > > should be enough.

> > >

> > > Interestly, I also work with art and software. I work with and

> > teach

> > > 3D graphics, as well as some other IT related things!

> > >

> > > It's not often I dream about Nisargadatta, but I did last

night.

> > This

> > > would make it the second time in 10 years. In this dream I

found

> > an

> > > old book about Nisargadatta. It had a framing text written by

> the

> > > Maharishi or someone, and then there were some prayers, and

> Indian

> > > ragas, and in the centre of the book was a long dialogue with

> > > Nisargadatta and someone. I noticed that the dialogue text had

> > pencil

> > > notes made to it by Nisargadatta. I read then dialogue and it

> > became

> > > like a trail,. or path, written on the ground in the grass. At

> the

> > end

> > > of the trail was sitting Nisargadatta behind a desk, in

person.

> We

> > > spoke a little bit, and then we walked back together, talking,

> to

> > the

> > > beginning of the trail, during which time he said I was doing

> ok.

> > Now

> > > he wanted me to sit at the opposite end of the trail and

> meditate.

> > >

> > > After a while I closed the book.

> > >

> > > I woke up to do with an alarm with a snooze button. Each time

> the

> > > alarm went off, I was very aware of the sense " I am " snapping

> > suddenly

> > > into place, like an adams apple shaped bubble appearing

forming.

> I

> > > pressed the snooze button and repeated the experience several

> > times.

> > > The way this " I am " appeared, was like a descent into the

> > conceptual

> > > mind, or like half a tennis ball turning inside out. It was a

> > stable

> > > state, but not the true state.

> > >

> > > So I think joining this group is significant for me!

> > >

> > enough to be I am.....this so-called group is only thought...

> > dont give this group-thought a higher value....

> > couse then you go away from I am...so to speak

> > anything you give power takes you away from I am

> > ....iietsa

> >

>

>

> Dearest iietsa,

>

> I Am is the One and only power

> We are merely conciously " adding " to it via a " group Soul " , so to

> speak, here called Nisargadatta. One ever moves into the unknown.

>

> There is and could be nothing that " takes away " from I Am.

>

> Everything is ever only " added to " . Albeit often not consciously

> and without conscious awareness which is, IMHO, love.

>

> Yours In Love,

> Ana

>

there is nothing wrong....ok

but there is thought thinking there is something wrong...ok

there is nothing wrong with this...ok

......maby you know this for sure, or something like that....

" takes away or goes away " is just a matter of speaking...

there is only one...ok.....

why are you trying so hard to tell this fact...seems like a joke

without a point....like all that is written here....this mail to..

I am not interested in duality....and I see there is only one...

(others might disagree)....it is to this misunderstanding I speak...

if your at home knowing it...those meaningless words are not for

you..but if there is (someone out there)(I still understand there is

only one)listen to this apparent mad-man...hehe

it is only to this mis-taken-entity....made up by identification....

those words are only to (those who have mistaken themselves for a

separate thing...) I am...you ARE...(we) are.....

only shift attantion from I...you...we....they.........

to...... am...are..isness...beingness itself......

.....iietsa

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Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart

wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " iietsa " <iietsa@> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno "

> > <jasondedonno@> wrote:

> > >

> > > > I am both a software engineer and an artist

> > > > and quiet mind is hardly a hindrance; quite

> > > > the contrary.

> > > >

> > > > Quiet mind as I consider that term is not the

> > > > absence of thought, really, but the absence of

> > > > any " self-consciousness " . Like the Zen saying

> > > > about eating when hungry, sleeping when tired,

> > > > thought arises when needed, and rests when not.

> > > >

> > > > It is only when self-consciousness gets in the

> > > > mix that thought gets obsessive in endless loops

> > > > of self-reference.

> > > >

> > > > Bill

> > >

> > > Thanks. And now I also remember Nisargadatta saying that if

you

> > use

> > > your spare time to concentrate on the thought-feeling I am,

that

> > > should be enough.

> > >

> > > Interestly, I also work with art and software. I work with and

> > teach

> > > 3D graphics, as well as some other IT related things!

> > >

> > > It's not often I dream about Nisargadatta, but I did last

night.

> > This

> > > would make it the second time in 10 years. In this dream I

found

> > an

> > > old book about Nisargadatta. It had a framing text written by

the

> > > Maharishi or someone, and then there were some prayers, and

> Indian

> > > ragas, and in the centre of the book was a long dialogue with

> > > Nisargadatta and someone. I noticed that the dialogue text had

> > pencil

> > > notes made to it by Nisargadatta. I read then dialogue and it

> > became

> > > like a trail,. or path, written on the ground in the grass. At

> the

> > end

> > > of the trail was sitting Nisargadatta behind a desk, in

person.

> We

> > > spoke a little bit, and then we walked back together, talking,

to

> > the

> > > beginning of the trail, during which time he said I was doing

ok.

> > Now

> > > he wanted me to sit at the opposite end of the trail and

meditate.

> > >

> > > After a while I closed the book.

> > >

> > > I woke up to do with an alarm with a snooze button. Each time

the

> > > alarm went off, I was very aware of the sense " I am " snapping

> > suddenly

> > > into place, like an adams apple shaped bubble appearing

forming.

> I

> > > pressed the snooze button and repeated the experience several

> > times.

> > > The way this " I am " appeared, was like a descent into the

> > conceptual

> > > mind, or like half a tennis ball turning inside out. It was a

> > stable

> > > state, but not the true state.

> > >

> > > So I think joining this group is significant for me!

> > >

> > enough to be I am.....this so-called group is only thought...

> > dont give this group-thought a higher value....

> > couse then you go away from I am...so to speak

> > anything you give power takes you away from I am

> > ....iietsa

> >

>

> " this so-called group is only thought... "

> then you are not paying attention!

>

> there is thought, yes, but to say *only* thought?

> Oh my!

>

> Bill

>

?

....iietsa

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Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno " <jasondedonno wrote:

>

> > > enough to be I am.....this so-called group is only thought...

> > > dont give this group-thought a higher value....

> > > couse then you go away from I am...so to speak

> > > anything you give power takes you away from I am

> > > ....iietsa

> > >

> >

> > " this so-called group is only thought... "

> > then you are not paying attention!

> >

> > there is thought, yes, but to say *only* thought?

> > Oh my!

> >

> > Bill

>

> I don't follow - can you explain that please, Bill?

>

 

One pitfall with nondualism is that for some it can become

a complete head trip. But certainly not for all, and certainly

not for all on this list. Ana, for example, dooesn't go there.

So to me what iiesta said is not truly representative of this

list. Yes, there are definitely some head trips going on here,

but not only that by any means.

 

Bill

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Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart

wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno "

<jasondedonno@> wrote:

> >

> > > > enough to be I am.....this so-called group is only thought...

> > > > dont give this group-thought a higher value....

> > > > couse then you go away from I am...so to speak

> > > > anything you give power takes you away from I am

> > > > ....iietsa

> > > >

> > >

> > > " this so-called group is only thought... "

> > > then you are not paying attention!

> > >

> > > there is thought, yes, but to say *only* thought?

> > > Oh my!

> > >

> > > Bill

> >

> > I don't follow - can you explain that please, Bill?

> >

>

> One pitfall with nondualism is that for some it can become

> a complete head trip. But certainly not for all, and certainly

> not for all on this list. Ana, for example, dooesn't go there.

> So to me what iiesta said is not truly representative of this

> list. Yes, there are definitely some head trips going on here,

> but not only that by any means.

>

> Bill

>

this might be a simple misunderstanding....

when it is said that you should not emphasize any thoughts

whatsoever...give no power to words....dont hold on to the mind-

buisness.....I surely dont mean to say......join the " head trip "

............where did you slip into the head-trip-thought Bill ?

.....iietsa

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Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart

wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno "

<jasondedonno@> wrote:

> >

> > > > enough to be I am.....this so-called group is only thought...

> > > > dont give this group-thought a higher value....

> > > > couse then you go away from I am...so to speak

> > > > anything you give power takes you away from I am

> > > > ....iietsa

> > > >

> > >

> > > " this so-called group is only thought... "

> > > then you are not paying attention!

> > >

> > > there is thought, yes, but to say *only* thought?

> > > Oh my!

> > >

> > > Bill

> >

> > I don't follow - can you explain that please, Bill?

> >

>

> One pitfall with nondualism is that for some it can become

> a complete head trip. But certainly not for all, and certainly

> not for all on this list. Ana, for example, dooesn't go there.

> So to me what iiesta said is not truly representative of this

> list. Yes, there are definitely some head trips going on here,

> but not only that by any means.

>

> Bill

>

 

you can trow as many " stones " as you like....

but youll never hit anything but your own resisted imagined

selfcreated fantasy-object......

....... good luck with the " stones " Bill.....

please tell me when youre finished with this so-called " love-

spreading " of yours...

.....iietsa

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Nisargadatta , " iietsa " <iietsa wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart@>

> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno "

> <jasondedonno@> wrote:

> > >

> > > > > enough to be I am.....this so-called group is only

thought...

> > > > > dont give this group-thought a higher value....

> > > > > couse then you go away from I am...so to speak

> > > > > anything you give power takes you away from I am

> > > > > ....iietsa

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > " this so-called group is only thought... "

> > > > then you are not paying attention!

> > > >

> > > > there is thought, yes, but to say *only* thought?

> > > > Oh my!

> > > >

> > > > Bill

> > >

> > > I don't follow - can you explain that please, Bill?

> > >

> >

> > One pitfall with nondualism is that for some it can become

> > a complete head trip. But certainly not for all, and certainly

> > not for all on this list. Ana, for example, dooesn't go there.

> > So to me what iiesta said is not truly representative of this

> > list. Yes, there are definitely some head trips going on here,

> > but not only that by any means.

> >

> > Bill

> >

>

> you can trow as many " stones " as you like....

> but youll never hit anything but your own resisted imagined

> selfcreated fantasy-object......

> ...... good luck with the " stones " Bill.....

> please tell me when youre finished with this so-called " love-

> spreading " of yours...

> ....iietsa

>

by the way Bill

are those words of yours designed to jubilate with beauty...

or are they designed for another reason ?

.....iietsa

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Nisargadatta , " iietsa " <iietsa wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart@>

> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno "

> <jasondedonno@> wrote:

> > >

> > > > > enough to be I am.....this so-called group is only thought...

> > > > > dont give this group-thought a higher value....

> > > > > couse then you go away from I am...so to speak

> > > > > anything you give power takes you away from I am

> > > > > ....iietsa

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > " this so-called group is only thought... "

> > > > then you are not paying attention!

> > > >

> > > > there is thought, yes, but to say *only* thought?

> > > > Oh my!

> > > >

> > > > Bill

> > >

> > > I don't follow - can you explain that please, Bill?

> > >

> >

> > One pitfall with nondualism is that for some it can become

> > a complete head trip. But certainly not for all, and certainly

> > not for all on this list. Ana, for example, dooesn't go there.

> > So to me what iiesta said is not truly representative of this

> > list. Yes, there are definitely some head trips going on here,

> > but not only that by any means.

> >

> > Bill

> >

> this might be a simple misunderstanding....

> when it is said that you should not emphasize any thoughts

> whatsoever...give no power to words....dont hold on to the mind-

> buisness.....I surely dont mean to say......join the " head trip "

> ...........where did you slip into the head-trip-thought Bill ?

> ....iietsa

>

 

a. if *it is said* you should not <anything>, THAT is a head trip

in my view.

 

b. have no idea where you get that I said you said " join the head trip " ...

 

c. your last line is an absurd cutism in my view. Another one of

those rhetorical pot-shots...

 

Bill

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Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart

wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " iietsa " <iietsa@> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " pliantheart "

<pliantheart@>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " jasondedonno "

> > <jasondedonno@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > > > enough to be I am.....this so-called group is only

thought...

> > > > > > dont give this group-thought a higher value....

> > > > > > couse then you go away from I am...so to speak

> > > > > > anything you give power takes you away from I am

> > > > > > ....iietsa

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > " this so-called group is only thought... "

> > > > > then you are not paying attention!

> > > > >

> > > > > there is thought, yes, but to say *only* thought?

> > > > > Oh my!

> > > > >

> > > > > Bill

> > > >

> > > > I don't follow - can you explain that please, Bill?

> > > >

> > >

> > > One pitfall with nondualism is that for some it can become

> > > a complete head trip. But certainly not for all, and certainly

> > > not for all on this list. Ana, for example, dooesn't go there.

> > > So to me what iiesta said is not truly representative of this

> > > list. Yes, there are definitely some head trips going on here,

> > > but not only that by any means.

> > >

> > > Bill

> > >

> > this might be a simple misunderstanding....

> > when it is said that you should not emphasize any thoughts

> > whatsoever...give no power to words....dont hold on to the mind-

> > buisness.....I surely dont mean to say......join the " head trip "

> > ...........where did you slip into the head-trip-thought Bill ?

> > ....iietsa

> >

>

> a. if *it is said* you should not <anything>, THAT is a head trip

> in my view.

>

> b. have no idea where you get that I said you said " join the head

trip " ...

>

> c. your last line is an absurd cutism in my view. Another one of

> those rhetorical pot-shots...

>

> Bill

>

you just hang on to " your understanding " as long as you do....

.....iietsa

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