Guest guest Posted June 22, 2006 Report Share Posted June 22, 2006 To cease fabricating objects in the mind is to stop perceiving what we are not and to apperceive what we ARE. - Ramesh Balsekar can we ever know " what we ARE " ? seems dubious more important, it seems, is freedom from wondering in the first place it is only what-we-are-not that wonders " what we ARE " . Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 23, 2006 Report Share Posted June 23, 2006 Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart wrote: > > To cease fabricating objects in the mind is > to stop perceiving what we are not and to > apperceive what we ARE. > > - Ramesh Balsekar > > can we ever know " what we ARE " ? > > seems dubious > > more important, it seems, is freedom > from wondering in the first place > > it is only what-we-are-not that wonders > " what we ARE " . > > > Bill > hi bill: what happens is if u focus on the " i am " phenomenon which is produced by the body-mind, 1 eventually sees that this body-mind is a creation other than 1self & a shift in consciousness transpires from the body-mind to 1's true position which is analogous to infinite space. it cannot be ascertained intellectually as it is beyond the body-mind. simply focus on the " i am " effect of the body-mind & the shift will happen by itself irresistably automatically. it's a trip. dannyc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 23, 2006 Report Share Posted June 23, 2006 Nisargadatta , " dannyc_1eyeluv " <dannyc_1eyeluv wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart@> > wrote: > > > > To cease fabricating objects in the mind is > > to stop perceiving what we are not and to > > apperceive what we ARE. > > > > - Ramesh Balsekar > > > > can we ever know " what we ARE " ? > > > > seems dubious > > > > more important, it seems, is freedom > > from wondering in the first place > > > > it is only what-we-are-not that wonders > > " what we ARE " . > > > > > > Bill > > > > > hi bill: > > what happens is if u focus on the " i am " phenomenon which is produced > by the body-mind, 1 eventually sees that this body-mind is a creation > other than 1self & a shift in consciousness transpires from the > body-mind to 1's true position which is analogous to infinite space. > it cannot be ascertained intellectually as it is beyond the body-mind. > simply focus on the " i am " effect of the body-mind & the shift will > happen by itself irresistably automatically. > > it's a trip. > > dannyc > there are different little " programs " that can run that bring about a " shift " ... and they can vary immensely from person to person. What you describe is something that evidently spins experience out of a body-mind mode into something else, *for you*. focusing on " I am " , going into " I am " , whatever with " I am " ... seems to be an axis of transformation for a lot of people in a lot of different ways. There are no fixed rules. It is just something to experiment with... as you seem to have been doing. Krishnamurti will frequently recommend " experimenting " ... and it is a reminder that there are no fixed way " things work " ... the key is always to *go into it* with real earnestness, as Nisargadatta recommends time and again. I find it interesting that you say the " I am phenomenon " is *produced by* the body-mind. I like that because I do not consider the " I am phenomenon " be in any sense fundamentally real... it is just an " effect " . I emphasize that is *my view*... I know there are others on this list that view " I am " quite differently. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 24, 2006 Report Share Posted June 24, 2006 Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " dannyc_1eyeluv " > <dannyc_1eyeluv@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart@> > > wrote: > > > > > > To cease fabricating objects in the mind is > > > to stop perceiving what we are not and to > > > apperceive what we ARE. > > > > > > - Ramesh Balsekar > > > > > > can we ever know " what we ARE " ? > > > > > > seems dubious > > > > > > more important, it seems, is freedom > > > from wondering in the first place > > > > > > it is only what-we-are-not that wonders > > > " what we ARE " . > > > > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > > > > hi bill: > > > > what happens is if u focus on the " i am " phenomenon which is produced > > by the body-mind, 1 eventually sees that this body-mind is a creation > > other than 1self & a shift in consciousness transpires from the > > body-mind to 1's true position which is analogous to infinite space. > > it cannot be ascertained intellectually as it is beyond the body-mind. > > simply focus on the " i am " effect of the body-mind & the shift will > > happen by itself irresistably automatically. > > > > it's a trip. > > > > dannyc > > > > there are different little " programs " that can run > that bring about a " shift " ... and they can vary immensely > from person to person. What you describe is something that > evidently spins experience out of a body-mind mode into > something else, *for you*. > > focusing on " I am " , going into " I am " , whatever with " I am " ... > seems to be an axis of transformation for a lot of people > in a lot of different ways. There are no fixed rules. It is > just something to experiment with... as you seem to have > been doing. > > Krishnamurti will frequently recommend " experimenting " ... > and it is a reminder that there are no fixed way " things > work " ... the key is always to *go into it* with real > earnestness, as Nisargadatta recommends time and again. > > I find it interesting that you say the " I am phenomenon " > is *produced by* the body-mind. I like that because I do > not consider the " I am phenomenon " be in any sense > fundamentally real... it is just an " effect " . I emphasize > that is *my view*... I know there are others on this list > that view " I am " quite differently. > > > Bill > that's exactly what i said in my last post verbatim: " the 'i am' effect of the body-mind " . an effect is a phenomenon. i mention the sense of " i am " as this was nisargadatta's focal point of reference ( & his teacher's before him) & as this is a nisargadatta forum i thought it would be OK to refer to it. ;-) dc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 24, 2006 Report Share Posted June 24, 2006 Nisargadatta , " dannyc_1eyeluv " <dannyc_1eyeluv wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart@> > wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " dannyc_1eyeluv " > > <dannyc_1eyeluv@> wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart@> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > To cease fabricating objects in the mind is > > > > to stop perceiving what we are not and to > > > > apperceive what we ARE. > > > > > > > > - Ramesh Balsekar > > > > > > > > can we ever know " what we ARE " ? > > > > > > > > seems dubious > > > > > > > > more important, it seems, is freedom > > > > from wondering in the first place > > > > > > > > it is only what-we-are-not that wonders > > > > " what we ARE " . > > > > > > > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > > > > > > > > hi bill: > > > > > > what happens is if u focus on the " i am " phenomenon which is produced > > > by the body-mind, 1 eventually sees that this body-mind is a creation > > > other than 1self & a shift in consciousness transpires from the > > > body-mind to 1's true position which is analogous to infinite space. > > > it cannot be ascertained intellectually as it is beyond the body-mind. > > > simply focus on the " i am " effect of the body-mind & the shift will > > > happen by itself irresistably automatically. > > > > > > it's a trip. > > > > > > dannyc > > > > > > > there are different little " programs " that can run > > that bring about a " shift " ... and they can vary immensely > > from person to person. What you describe is something that > > evidently spins experience out of a body-mind mode into > > something else, *for you*. > > > > focusing on " I am " , going into " I am " , whatever with " I am " ... > > seems to be an axis of transformation for a lot of people > > in a lot of different ways. There are no fixed rules. It is > > just something to experiment with... as you seem to have > > been doing. > > > > Krishnamurti will frequently recommend " experimenting " ... > > and it is a reminder that there are no fixed way " things > > work " ... the key is always to *go into it* with real > > earnestness, as Nisargadatta recommends time and again. > > > > I find it interesting that you say the " I am phenomenon " > > is *produced by* the body-mind. I like that because I do > > not consider the " I am phenomenon " be in any sense > > fundamentally real... it is just an " effect " . I emphasize > > that is *my view*... I know there are others on this list > > that view " I am " quite differently. > > > > > > Bill > > > > > that's exactly what i said in my last post verbatim: " the 'i am' > effect of the body-mind " . an effect is a phenomenon. > > i mention the sense of " i am " as this was nisargadatta's focal point > of reference ( & his teacher's before him) & as this is a nisargadatta > forum i thought it would be OK to refer to it. ;-) > > dc > It is amusing, is it not that for most of our lives we buy into the definition provided by family, society, culture, sex religion and finally a 'spirituality' at 'someone else's' feet. When we truly know who we are, or who we are not;-) we are exactly who we always have been, just a bit more free, a bit more compassionate, a bit more loving. IMHO. Yours In Love, Ana p.s. does anyone sleep here? I remember those days. sigh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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