Guest guest Posted June 25, 2006 Report Share Posted June 25, 2006 Nisargadatta , OConnor Patricia <gdtige wrote: > > --- pliantheart <pliantheart a écrit : > > > Nisargadatta , OConnor > > Patricia <gdtige@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > --- pliantheart <pliantheart@> a écrit : > > > > > > > > > re: > > > > > > " and words can not be seeds of > > blossoming..... " > > > > > > > > > > > > anything can be a seed of blossoming. > > > > > > > > > > > > you are treating words as a special class of > > > > > > > > phenomena. words and the flight of birds, > > > > > > the sound of thunder... are all just > > phenomena. > > > > > > > > > > > > if there is any problem with words, it is in > > > > > > seeing words as separate from life rather > > than > > > > > > just a part of life. > > > > > > > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ..................................................... > > > > > the world :orange > > > > > > > > > > and then its taste color fragrance texture, > > > > > stickiness, roundness etc... > > > > > you call that the same thing? > > > > > One is a label, the other one is the real > > stuff > > > > that > > > > > you can experience. > > > > > you can press the orange but how can you ever > > > > express > > > > > it.... > > > > > > > > > > > > > from the perspective of a person they do seem > > quite > > > > distinct, don't they? > > > > > > > > but all you mention are vibrations... > > > > > > > > and are manifestations within Silence. > > > > > > > > don't think of words in terms of > > " abstractions " ... > > > > but in terms of instances... > > > > a *particular* experience of some particular > > > > words. > > > > > > > > as an abstraction " orange " is a concept. > > > > but that isn't real. No one ever experiences > > > > the concept orange. But you do experience > > > > the sensations of reading " orange " in a > > > > particular moment. > > > > > > > > if you go into words as something from the > > > > standpoint of thought... *then* words are > > > > distinct from all else... > > > > > > > > but as sensory experience... they are just > > > > phenomena like everything else... hearing > > > > a line of poetry read vs. hearing the same > > > > line of poetry as if " hummed " for example... > > > > both are just sensation. > > > > > > > > I read your words: > > > > > and then its taste color fragrance texture, > > > > > stickiness, roundness etc... > > > > and those words go " through " as sensation, > > > > as vibration, as energy patterns. > > > > > > > > if you hum something to me then I might > > > > hum something back. If you say something > > > > to me I might say something back. If the > > > > response (in words) JUST FLOWS OUT OF ME > > > > (and this is key) then it all is > > > > experienced as just energy going round. > > > > > > > > it is when experience is as a mential operation > > > > that words come to seem very different from > > > > other phenomena. > > > > > > > > in a *particular moment* whatever is experienced > > > > is as vibrations arising within Silence. > > > > The origin of those vibrations does not change > > > > that the experience in the moment is as > > vibration > > > > within Silence. > > > > > > > > so what I am fundamentally saying is that *if* > > > > experience is as vibrations arising in Silence > > > > then " words read " or " words heard " or any other > > > > *particular experience of words* is as > > vibrations > > > > arising and is just phenomena arising in > > Silence. > > > > > > > > that is the whole point of the realization that > > > > all is just phenomena arising in Silence, as > > > > " clouds in the coffee " as it were. > > > > > > > > and see how what I am saying above can only be > > > > understood if experience is immediate, direct, > > > > in the Now... and not a mediated by " mind " ? > > > > > > > > > > > > Bill > > > > > > ok, i see that, i get it, > > > then you are evoquing a very particular language > > that > > > has very little space in this world. > > > > don't know what you mean... very little space... > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > you are evoquing a living state of being in its > natural expression. I observe a lot more mechanical > responses than spontaneous ones in this world. Mind is > the supreme ruler. : therefore I mentionned how little > space this naturalness has. > ~~~ > > what I am saying can apply to *any* experience of > > language... > > > > it is talking by " just being " ... just letting it > > happen > > it is listening by " just being " ... > > > > it is not experiencing as " a person " , and > > a distinct entity " coping with a world " ... > > > > it is dreaming one's life. > > > > it is experience as totally organic, as an > > unfolding whole... > > and what unfolds is always a surprise... > > > > living in such a way is not by a plan according > > to a purpose... > > > > and there is no limitation on language in living > > in such a way. > > > > Bill > > > > > > > Words can be born from thoughts > > > and yes, they can also be an extension of > > silence.. > > > > > > ~~~ > even if you take the most delicate word, it is still just a word... ALL words are thoughts... if you listen in silence, all words are in there right place... if you say some words are an extension of silence, then there is the risk for the ego-person to start looking for th better words.... there is the risk for clinging and sticking with words... do you see the apparent danger ? .....iietsa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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