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Attention is noumenon.

Noumenon is attention.

 

Attention is movement that writes

And its ink is the light of experience.

 

Attention writes in dazzling color

Vivid fluence

Bright wonder

Feeding on its own rapturous display.

 

Attention is not the display

but rather the " hidden hand "

that moves the puppet show.

 

Attenion is noumenon.

Noumenon is attention.

 

 

 

Bill

(3-05)

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Bill,

 

Attention is noumenon ?

 

Wow ! You seem to know the noumenon to make such statemet.

 

Werner

 

 

Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart

wrote:

>

>

>

> Attention is noumenon.

> Noumenon is attention.

>

> Attention is movement that writes

> And its ink is the light of experience.

>

> Attention writes in dazzling color

> Vivid fluence

> Bright wonder

> Feeding on its own rapturous display.

>

> Attention is not the display

> but rather the " hidden hand "

> that moves the puppet show.

>

> Attenion is noumenon.

> Noumenon is attention.

>

>

>

> Bill

> (3-05)

>

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Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr

wrote:

>

> Bill,

>

> Attention is noumenon ?

>

> Wow ! You seem to know the noumenon to make such statemet.

>

> Werner

 

Call it a conjecture, Werner.

But if attention is truly what shapes

experience, if it is the " carving knife "

in the " fluid ice of consciousness "

(I'm being metaphorical, hope you get

what I mean), then attention is

effectively noumenon, is it not?

 

Bill

 

 

 

> Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart@>

> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > Attention is noumenon.

> > Noumenon is attention.

> >

> > Attention is movement that writes

> > And its ink is the light of experience.

> >

> > Attention writes in dazzling color

> > Vivid fluence

> > Bright wonder

> > Feeding on its own rapturous display.

> >

> > Attention is not the display

> > but rather the " hidden hand "

> > that moves the puppet show.

> >

> > Attenion is noumenon.

> > Noumenon is attention.

> >

> >

> >

> > Bill

> > (3-05)

> >

>

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Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart

wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr@>

> wrote:

> >

> > Bill,

> >

> > Attention is noumenon ?

> >

> > Wow ! You seem to know the noumenon to make such statemet.

> >

> > Werner

>

> Call it a conjecture, Werner.

> But if attention is truly what shapes

> experience, if it is the " carving knife "

> in the " fluid ice of consciousness "

> (I'm being metaphorical, hope you get

> what I mean), then attention is

> effectively noumenon, is it not?

>

> Bill

>

 

Oops, metaphorical ? What is that ? Is it using an example to explain

what cannot get explained ?

 

Ok, I have no need for metaphors, I cannot follow you in either case.

Why don't you just forget noumenon and leave it alone ?

 

Don't misunderstand me Bil. I like all you posts, but most of them I

don't understand :)

 

Werner

 

>

>

> > Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart@>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Attention is noumenon.

> > > Noumenon is attention.

> > >

> > > Attention is movement that writes

> > > And its ink is the light of experience.

> > >

> > > Attention writes in dazzling color

> > > Vivid fluence

> > > Bright wonder

> > > Feeding on its own rapturous display.

> > >

> > > Attention is not the display

> > > but rather the " hidden hand "

> > > that moves the puppet show.

> > >

> > > Attenion is noumenon.

> > > Noumenon is attention.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Bill

> > > (3-05)

> > >

> >

>

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Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr

wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart@>

> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr@>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Bill,

> > >

> > > Attention is noumenon ?

> > >

> > > Wow ! You seem to know the noumenon to make such statemet.

> > >

> > > Werner

> >

> > Call it a conjecture, Werner.

> > But if attention is truly what shapes

> > experience, if it is the " carving knife "

> > in the " fluid ice of consciousness "

> > (I'm being metaphorical, hope you get

> > what I mean), then attention is

> > effectively noumenon, is it not?

> >

> > Bill

> >

>

> Oops, metaphorical ? What is that ? Is it using an example to

explain

> what cannot get explained ?

>

> Ok, I have no need for metaphors, I cannot follow you in either

case.

> Why don't you just forget noumenon and leave it alone ?

>

> Don't misunderstand me Bil. I like all you posts, but most of them

I

> don't understand :)

>

> Werner

>

 

 

it happen that the One writer....and the One reader....

don't understand each....

 

maybe therefore they are reading and writing and misunderstanding and

trying to explain....and....

 

until peace let them ....be One....

 

without words

 

:)

 

Marc

 

 

 

 

> >

> >

> > > Nisargadatta , " pliantheart "

<pliantheart@>

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Attention is noumenon.

> > > > Noumenon is attention.

> > > >

> > > > Attention is movement that writes

> > > > And its ink is the light of experience.

> > > >

> > > > Attention writes in dazzling color

> > > > Vivid fluence

> > > > Bright wonder

> > > > Feeding on its own rapturous display.

> > > >

> > > > Attention is not the display

> > > > but rather the " hidden hand "

> > > > that moves the puppet show.

> > > >

> > > > Attenion is noumenon.

> > > > Noumenon is attention.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Bill

> > > > (3-05)

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

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Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 "

<dennis_travis33 wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr@>

> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart@>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr@>

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Bill,

> > > >

> > > > Attention is noumenon ?

> > > >

> > > > Wow ! You seem to know the noumenon to make such statemet.

> > > >

> > > > Werner

> > >

> > > Call it a conjecture, Werner.

> > > But if attention is truly what shapes

> > > experience, if it is the " carving knife "

> > > in the " fluid ice of consciousness "

> > > (I'm being metaphorical, hope you get

> > > what I mean), then attention is

> > > effectively noumenon, is it not?

> > >

> > > Bill

> > >

> >

> > Oops, metaphorical ? What is that ? Is it using an example to

> explain

> > what cannot get explained ?

> >

> > Ok, I have no need for metaphors, I cannot follow you in either

> case.

> > Why don't you just forget noumenon and leave it alone ?

> >

> > Don't misunderstand me Bil. I like all you posts, but most of

them

> I

> > don't understand :)

> >

> > Werner

> >

>

>

> it happen that the One writer....and the One reader....

> don't understand each....

>

> maybe therefore they are reading and writing and misunderstanding

and

> trying to explain....and....

>

> until peace let them ....be One....

>

> without words

>

> :)

>

> Marc

 

the true One can do its thing

with or without words, Marc.

 

and don't assume that because

communication has not been completely

successful that there is:

a) misunderstanding

b) lack of peace

 

true peace can move through the

most complex quandaries and quagmires

of circumstance unscathed.

 

confusion is always on the surface.

 

but peace goes below that... all the way down :) [hi toomb!]

 

Bill

 

 

Bill

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Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart

wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 "

> <dennis_travis33@> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr@>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " pliantheart "

<pliantheart@>

> > > wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr@>

> > > > wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Bill,

> > > > >

> > > > > Attention is noumenon ?

> > > > >

> > > > > Wow ! You seem to know the noumenon to make such statemet.

> > > > >

> > > > > Werner

> > > >

> > > > Call it a conjecture, Werner.

> > > > But if attention is truly what shapes

> > > > experience, if it is the " carving knife "

> > > > in the " fluid ice of consciousness "

> > > > (I'm being metaphorical, hope you get

> > > > what I mean), then attention is

> > > > effectively noumenon, is it not?

> > > >

> > > > Bill

> > > >

> > >

> > > Oops, metaphorical ? What is that ? Is it using an example to

> > explain

> > > what cannot get explained ?

> > >

> > > Ok, I have no need for metaphors, I cannot follow you in either

> > case.

> > > Why don't you just forget noumenon and leave it alone ?

> > >

> > > Don't misunderstand me Bil. I like all you posts, but most of

> them

> > I

> > > don't understand :)

> > >

> > > Werner

> > >

> >

> >

> > it happen that the One writer....and the One reader....

> > don't understand each....

> >

> > maybe therefore they are reading and writing and misunderstanding

> and

> > trying to explain....and....

> >

> > until peace let them ....be One....

> >

> > without words

> >

> > :)

> >

> > Marc

>

> the true One can do its thing

> with or without words, Marc.

 

 

the true One....is behind understanding of mind and intellect....

so it make not much sense to speculate what the true One can do....

>

> and don't assume that because

> communication has not been completely

> successful that there is:

> a) misunderstanding

> b) lack of peace

 

i don't assume anything here in this discussion between Werner and you

>

> true peace can move through the

> most complex quandaries and quagmires

> of circumstance unscathed.

 

true peace has absolutly nothing in common with complexity....yes

>

> confusion is always on the surface.

 

confusion is of mind/complex

>

> but peace goes below that... all the way down :) [hi toomb!]

>

 

yes....

 

(hi nobody)

 

:)

 

Marc

 

 

 

 

>

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" pliantheart " <pliantheart wrote:

>

>

>

> Attention is noumenon.

> Noumenon is attention.

>

> Attention is movement that writes

> And its ink is the light of experience.

>

> Attention writes in dazzling color

> Vivid fluence

> Bright wonder

> Feeding on its own rapturous display.

>

> Attention is not the display

> but rather the " hidden hand "

> that moves the puppet show.

>

> Attenion is noumenon.

> Noumenon is attention.

>

>

>

> Bill

> (3-05)

>

 

I wonder if this story is saying something similar to what you wrote

above?

Stuart

------

Cherokee Wisdom

 

An old Cherokee is teaching his grandson about life.

 

" A fight is going on inside me, " he said to the boy.

 

" It is a terrible fight and it is between two wolves.

 

One is evil. He is anger, envy, sorrow, regret, greed,

 

arrogance, self-pity, guilt, resentment, inferiority,

 

lies, false pride, superiority, and ego.

 

The other is good. He is joy, peace, love, hope, serenity,

 

humility, kindness, benevolence, empathy, generosity,

 

truth, compassion, and faith.

 

This same fight is going on inside you,

 

and inside every other person, too. "

 

The grandson thought about it for a minute

 

and then asked his grandfather,

 

" Which wolf will win? "

 

The old Cherokee replied simply,

 

" The one you feed. "

 

 

-----------------

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Nisargadatta , " stuartkfmn " <stuartkfmn

wrote:

>

> " pliantheart " <pliantheart@> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > Attention is noumenon.

> > Noumenon is attention.

> >

> > Attention is movement that writes

> > And its ink is the light of experience.

> >

> > Attention writes in dazzling color

> > Vivid fluence

> > Bright wonder

> > Feeding on its own rapturous display.

> >

> > Attention is not the display

> > but rather the " hidden hand "

> > that moves the puppet show.

> >

> > Attenion is noumenon.

> > Noumenon is attention.

> >

> >

> >

> > Bill

> > (3-05)

> >

>

> I wonder if this story is saying something similar to what you wrote

> above?

> Stuart

> ------

> Cherokee Wisdom

>

> An old Cherokee is teaching his grandson about life.

>

> " A fight is going on inside me, " he said to the boy.

>

> " It is a terrible fight and it is between two wolves.

>

> One is evil. He is anger, envy, sorrow, regret, greed,

>

> arrogance, self-pity, guilt, resentment, inferiority,

>

> lies, false pride, superiority, and ego.

>

> The other is good. He is joy, peace, love, hope, serenity,

>

> humility, kindness, benevolence, empathy, generosity,

>

> truth, compassion, and faith.

>

> This same fight is going on inside you,

>

> and inside every other person, too. "

>

> The grandson thought about it for a minute

>

> and then asked his grandfather,

>

> " Which wolf will win? "

>

> The old Cherokee replied simply,

>

> " The one you feed. "

>

>

> -----------------

>

 

And that implies a feeding entity endnowed with insight,

responsibility and free will. But it doesn't exist. The entity is

both wolves.

 

J.W.v. Goethe wrote when he was about 80:

 

" That I didn't become a criminal wasn't because of my character but

just because of a benevolent fate " .

 

Werner

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Nisargadatta , " stuartkfmn " <stuartkfmn wrote:

>

> " pliantheart " <pliantheart@> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > Attention is noumenon.

> > Noumenon is attention.

> >

> > Attention is movement that writes

> > And its ink is the light of experience.

> >

> > Attention writes in dazzling color

> > Vivid fluence

> > Bright wonder

> > Feeding on its own rapturous display.

> >

> > Attention is not the display

> > but rather the " hidden hand "

> > that moves the puppet show.

> >

> > Attenion is noumenon.

> > Noumenon is attention.

> >

> >

> >

> > Bill

> > (3-05)

> >

>

> I wonder if this story is saying something similar to what you wrote

> above?

> Stuart

> ------

> Cherokee Wisdom

>

> An old Cherokee is teaching his grandson about life.

>

> " A fight is going on inside me, " he said to the boy.

>

> " It is a terrible fight and it is between two wolves.

>

> One is evil. He is anger, envy, sorrow, regret, greed,

>

> arrogance, self-pity, guilt, resentment, inferiority,

>

> lies, false pride, superiority, and ego.

>

> The other is good. He is joy, peace, love, hope, serenity,

>

> humility, kindness, benevolence, empathy, generosity,

>

> truth, compassion, and faith.

>

> This same fight is going on inside you,

>

> and inside every other person, too. "

>

> The grandson thought about it for a minute

>

> and then asked his grandfather,

>

> " Which wolf will win? "

>

> The old Cherokee replied simply,

>

> " The one you feed. "

>

>

> -----------------

>

 

The phrase that comes to mind:

" What you are is what you get! "

 

The Cherokee story emphasizes choice

in a way that my poem does not.

 

But very curious comparison you make Stu!

 

They are not the same, but there is a

common element is how I would put it.

 

Bill

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" Werner Woehr " <wwoehr wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " stuartkfmn " <stuartkfmn@>

> wrote:

> >

> > " pliantheart " <pliantheart@> wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Attention is noumenon.

> > > Noumenon is attention.

> > >

> > > Attention is movement that writes

> > > And its ink is the light of experience.

> > >

> > > Attention writes in dazzling color

> > > Vivid fluence

> > > Bright wonder

> > > Feeding on its own rapturous display.

> > >

> > > Attention is not the display

> > > but rather the " hidden hand "

> > > that moves the puppet show.

> > >

> > > Attenion is noumenon.

> > > Noumenon is attention.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Bill

> > > (3-05)

> > >

> >

> > I wonder if this story is saying something similar to what you wrote

> > above?

> > Stuart

> > ------

> > Cherokee Wisdom

> >

> > An old Cherokee is teaching his grandson about life.

> >

> > " A fight is going on inside me, " he said to the boy.

> >

> > " It is a terrible fight and it is between two wolves.

> >

> > One is evil. He is anger, envy, sorrow, regret, greed,

> >

> > arrogance, self-pity, guilt, resentment, inferiority,

> >

> > lies, false pride, superiority, and ego.

> >

> > The other is good. He is joy, peace, love, hope, serenity,

> >

> > humility, kindness, benevolence, empathy, generosity,

> >

> > truth, compassion, and faith.

> >

> > This same fight is going on inside you,

> >

> > and inside every other person, too. "

> >

> > The grandson thought about it for a minute

> >

> > and then asked his grandfather,

> >

> > " Which wolf will win? "

> >

> > The old Cherokee replied simply,

> >

> > " The one you feed. "

> >

> >

> > -----------------

> >

>

> And that implies a feeding entity endnowed with insight,

> responsibility and free will. But it doesn't exist. The entity is

> both wolves.

>

> J.W.v. Goethe wrote when he was about 80:

>

> " That I didn't become a criminal wasn't because of my character but

> just because of a benevolent fate " .

>

> Werner

>

 

 

To me I see only the old man as the feeding entity, he is, in a polar

way, both wolves . He is what he has his attention fixated on.

 

What do you think Goethe meant by " fate " ?

 

Stu

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