Jump to content
IndiaDivine.org

the clarity of unknowing

Rate this topic


Guest guest

Recommended Posts

Guest guest

toombaru:

" All questions evaporated in the clarity of unknowing. "

 

I *love* that!

 

What a wonderfully ironic phrase: the clarity of unknowing.

 

And its counterpart is: the muddle of knowing :)

 

Questions run on tracks: verbal tracks.

And seeing the fundamental emptiness of the question is

to somehow get off the limited " space " of the verbal tracks.

It is like a mini out-of-body experience... but a mini

out-of-question experience... where the question can be

seen as just this " stuff " that has no particular meaning,

and that is seeing the emptiness of it.

 

The point is that one has to get out of the limited " verbal

space " and that is never accomplished by thought, which

only runs on the " tracks " .

 

One way to consider it, perhaps, is that there must be a

shift from the " meaning " of the question to the " beingness "

of the question.

 

Bill

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart

wrote:

>

> toombaru:

> " All questions evaporated in the clarity of unknowing. "

>

> I *love* that!

>

> What a wonderfully ironic phrase: the clarity of unknowing.

 

 

.....yes.....

 

it's clear that there are some dream-bubbles which know.....nothing

realy

 

:)

>

> And its counterpart is: the muddle of knowing :)

>

> Questions run on tracks: verbal tracks.

> And seeing the fundamental emptiness of the question is

> to somehow get off the limited " space " of the verbal tracks.

> It is like a mini out-of-body experience... but a mini

> out-of-question experience... where the question can be

> seen as just this " stuff " that has no particular meaning,

> and that is seeing the emptiness of it.

>

> The point is that one has to get out of the limited " verbal

> space " and that is never accomplished by thought, which

> only runs on the " tracks " .

>

> One way to consider it, perhaps, is that there must be a

> shift from the " meaning " of the question to the " beingness "

> of the question.

>

> Bill

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 "

<dennis_travis33 wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart@>

> wrote:

> >

> > toombaru:

> > " All questions evaporated in the clarity of unknowing. "

> >

> > I *love* that!

> >

> > What a wonderfully ironic phrase: the clarity of unknowing.

>

>

> ....yes.....

>

> it's clear that there are some dream-bubbles which know.....nothing

> realy

>

> :)

 

do such bubbles sometimes post messages to lists like this?

 

 

> >

> > And its counterpart is: the muddle of knowing :)

> >

> > Questions run on tracks: verbal tracks.

> > And seeing the fundamental emptiness of the question is

> > to somehow get off the limited " space " of the verbal tracks.

> > It is like a mini out-of-body experience... but a mini

> > out-of-question experience... where the question can be

> > seen as just this " stuff " that has no particular meaning,

> > and that is seeing the emptiness of it.

> >

> > The point is that one has to get out of the limited " verbal

> > space " and that is never accomplished by thought, which

> > only runs on the " tracks " .

> >

> > One way to consider it, perhaps, is that there must be a

> > shift from the " meaning " of the question to the " beingness "

> > of the question.

> >

> > Bill

> >

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart

wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 "

> <dennis_travis33@> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart@>

> > wrote:

> > >

> > > toombaru:

> > > " All questions evaporated in the clarity of unknowing. "

> > >

> > > I *love* that!

> > >

> > > What a wonderfully ironic phrase: the clarity of unknowing.

> >

> >

> > ....yes.....

> >

> > it's clear that there are some dream-bubbles which

know.....nothing

> > realy

> >

> > :)

>

> do such bubbles sometimes post messages to lists like this?

 

like what/how?....

 

.....doesn't matter...

 

i let you continue....in your great mind-work....:)

>

>

> > >

> > > And its counterpart is: the muddle of knowing :)

> > >

> > > Questions run on tracks: verbal tracks.

> > > And seeing the fundamental emptiness of the question is

> > > to somehow get off the limited " space " of the verbal tracks.

> > > It is like a mini out-of-body experience... but a mini

> > > out-of-question experience... where the question can be

> > > seen as just this " stuff " that has no particular meaning,

> > > and that is seeing the emptiness of it.

> > >

> > > The point is that one has to get out of the limited " verbal

> > > space " and that is never accomplished by thought, which

> > > only runs on the " tracks " .

> > >

> > > One way to consider it, perhaps, is that there must be a

> > > shift from the " meaning " of the question to the " beingness "

> > > of the question.

> > >

> > > Bill

> > >

> >

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart

wrote:

 

>The point is that one has to get out of the limited " verbal

>space " and that is never accomplished by thought, which

>only runs on the " tracks " .

>

>One way to consider it, perhaps, is that there must be a

>shift from the " meaning " of the question to the " beingness "

>of the question.

>

>Bill

 

But there is no point

 

Since there is

Nobody to shift

Nobody to be shifted

Nobody to get anywhere

Because there is no elsewhere

 

The beingness of the questioning

Transforms into meaning

Then becomes another questioning

Bearing more meaning

 

This continuous flow

Called experiencing

Is itself

The point at ease

 

Thanks

Stefan

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

Nisargadatta , " Stefan " <s.petersilge

wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart@>

> wrote:

>

> >The point is that one has to get out of the limited " verbal

> >space " and that is never accomplished by thought, which

> >only runs on the " tracks " .

> >

> >One way to consider it, perhaps, is that there must be a

> >shift from the " meaning " of the question to the " beingness "

> >of the question.

> >

> >Bill

>

> But there is no point

>

> Since there is

> Nobody to shift

> Nobody to be shifted

> Nobody to get anywhere

> Because there is no elsewhere

>

> The beingness of the questioning

> Transforms into meaning

> Then becomes another questioning

> Bearing more meaning

>

> This continuous flow

> Called experiencing

> Is itself

> The point at ease

>

> Thanks

> Stefan

 

 

hey Stefan.....greetings....:)

 

to/from nowhere else....but everywhere

 

Marc

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 "

<dennis_travis33 wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " Stefan " <s.petersilge@>

> wrote:

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart@>

> > wrote:

> >

> > >The point is that one has to get out of the limited " verbal

> > >space " and that is never accomplished by thought, which

> > >only runs on the " tracks " .

> > >

> > >One way to consider it, perhaps, is that there must be a

> > >shift from the " meaning " of the question to the " beingness "

> > >of the question.

> > >

> > >Bill

> >

> > But there is no point

> >

> > Since there is

> > Nobody to shift

> > Nobody to be shifted

> > Nobody to get anywhere

> > Because there is no elsewhere

> >

> > The beingness of the questioning

> > Transforms into meaning

> > Then becomes another questioning

> > Bearing more meaning

> >

> > This continuous flow

> > Called experiencing

> > Is itself

> > The point at ease

> >

> > Thanks

> > Stefan

>

>

> hey Stefan.....greetings....:)

>

> to/from nowhere else....but everywhere

>

> Marc

 

 

Ps:

 

And he sits in the grand stand alone

He's got this big smile on his face

He feels like he's just come home

Feels like he's finally, finally found his place

In the sun, he has won

He's the King of the mountain alone

 

Pigeons fighting over scraps, yeah

Humans they say do not

Hiding from life and little naps

Waking up to find

You have been caught, you have been bought, yeah

You're the King of some mountain alone

 

Mmm ...

Empty wrappers blowin' past him in the breeze

He can still hear last Sunday roar

He sits there and pulls his coat tighter over his knees

And he listens to these people who aren't there anymore

They were only there for

The King of the mountain alone

 

 

CROSBY & NASH

King Of The Mountain

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

Nisargadatta , " Stefan " <s.petersilge

wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart@>

> wrote:

>

> >The point is that one has to get out of the limited " verbal

> >space " and that is never accomplished by thought, which

> >only runs on the " tracks " .

> >

> >One way to consider it, perhaps, is that there must be a

> >shift from the " meaning " of the question to the " beingness "

> >of the question.

> >

> >Bill

>

> But there is no point

>

> Since there is

> Nobody to shift

> Nobody to be shifted

> Nobody to get anywhere

> Because there is no elsewhere

>

> The beingness of the questioning

> Transforms into meaning

> Then becomes another questioning

> Bearing more meaning

>

> This continuous flow

> Called experiencing

> Is itself

> The point at ease

>

> Thanks

> Stefan

 

What you say applies for when there are no

questions. When there *are* burning questions

then funny little ways of " shifting " ways of

looking/considering can induce fundamental

change (sometimes).

 

What you are advocating could be called

neo-Advaita...

 

Take the Ashtavakra Gita... great stuff,

but not much use except for the most advanced,

as for example:

 

If only you will remain resting in consciousness,

seeing yourself as distinct from the body,

then even now you will become happy, peaceful

and free from bonds.

 

Pretty similar to the stanza you have written

above:

 

> This continuous flow

> Called experiencing

> Is itself

> The point at ease

 

So whether there " is a point " depends...

it always depends. There is no absolute

in the ways and means of the turning over

of ignorance into the simplicity of realization.

 

Bill

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

Nisargadatta , " Stefan " <s.petersilge

wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart@>

> wrote:

>

> >The point is that one has to get out of the limited " verbal

> >space " and that is never accomplished by thought, which

> >only runs on the " tracks " .

> >

> >One way to consider it, perhaps, is that there must be a

> >shift from the " meaning " of the question to the " beingness "

> >of the question.

> >

> >Bill

>

> But there is no point

>

> Since there is

> Nobody to shift

> Nobody to be shifted

> Nobody to get anywhere

> Because there is no elsewhere

>

> The beingness of the questioning

> Transforms into meaning

> Then becomes another questioning

> Bearing more meaning

>

> This continuous flow

> Called experiencing

> Is itself

> The point at ease

>

> Thanks

> Stefan

>

 

 

(((((Stefan))))) I was thinking of you and Marios last night.

Again. So nice to see your name, to feel your presence.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart

wrote:

 

>What you say applies for when there are no

>questions. When there *are* burning questions

>then funny little ways of " shifting " ways of

>looking/considering can induce fundamental

>change (sometimes).

 

Who is shifting and who is shifted?

Who is changed by whom?

 

With this burning question watching

The stream of questions and answers

I saw nobody

 

Greetings

Stefan

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

Nisargadatta , " anabebe57 " <kailashana wrote:

 

>(((((Stefan))))) I was thinking of you and Marios last night.

>Again. So nice to see your name, to feel your presence.

 

Hi Anna...

Between two dances it came up:

Why not have a look?

 

And I found

This crazy bunch of people

Their words

Listed in blue letters

Are still there!

 

I thought it has been a long time

And I will leave a mark

Or two.

 

Now you thinking of me

And me thinking of you

Has become another dance

In between two dances

:-)

 

Stefan

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

Nisargadatta , " Stefan " <s.petersilge

wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart@>

> wrote:

>

> >What you say applies for when there are no

> >questions. When there *are* burning questions

> >then funny little ways of " shifting " ways of

> >looking/considering can induce fundamental

> >change (sometimes).

>

> Who is shifting and who is shifted?

> Who is changed by whom?

 

The same " who " that sent the message that

is now being responded to.

 

There's nobody there...

 

So it may be asked why suggest " funny little ways

of 'shifting'... " etc.

 

No different from mnotive for sending the

message that is now being responded to.

 

Nobody there on either end, but the mechanisms do

function. It is all just programming. All these

messages are just programming, not " to anyone " ,

but they will be mulched into the functioning of

the mechanisms... maybe having virtually no effect,

occasionally maybe having some.

 

[note: c.f. McLuhan's the message is the massage....]

 

> With this burning question watching

Ha! hardly burning am sure...

> The stream of questions and answers

> I saw nobody

 

 

Bill

 

> Greetings

> Stefan

>

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest guest

Nisargadatta , " pliantheart " <pliantheart

wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta , " Stefan " <s.petersilge@>

> wrote:

 

>>Who is shifting and who is shifted?

>>Who is changed by whom?

>

>The same " who " that sent the message that

>is now being responded to.

 

Hi Bill!

 

Are you able to catch this " who " which is sending the message? To nail

it down and file it? And are you really sure this is the same " who "

that needs to change something? And moreover the same " who " which

needs to be changed? And even if it was, would not any effort result

in a short circuit?

 

I have tried to find a consistent " who " . The question was burning like

a question of life and death can only burn. It once seemed that my

life was dependent on finding such a solid, reliable identity. But the

moment any " who " was identified it had already passed... and there was

another " who " ... and another. Little concepts of something vast.

Attempts to make flux appear as solid.

 

You are right when you say " it depends " . I do not try to find

arguments for another advaitic " truth " ... I am writing down some

thoughts that come up. And I am still wondering who I am. And my world

is functioning, mysteriously it is.

 

Greetings

Stefan

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
×
×
  • Create New...