Guest guest Posted August 16, 2006 Report Share Posted August 16, 2006 B; You think *I* am agressive???? > > I'm the one that historically has been considered the wimpy, > > milk-toasty nice guy. Pete should get a real laugh out of this. > > Have I morphed into a fierce Thor-type throwing thunderbolts > > without my realizing it? P: Leaving aside personalities, the broader issue is methodology. Is it confrontation a valid teaching tool? Which teaching style worked best: Ramana's, or Nis'? Was Ramana milk-toasty, and Nis aggressive? Who helped more people? Hard to say. Do we have the right to inflict mental pain by pointing faults, specially, in this kind of forums where no one said to anyone teach me please? Is there a tacit understanding here that if you post, you agreed to teach, and be taught? What level of confrontation is acceptable in these lists? It's curious to note that I have posted every day for 4 years to several lists, and never once, have I been placed in moderation, while many of the people I confronted were either banned, moderated, or left on their own accord. Being nice, or blunt are tools to be used or not. Even Bernardette Roberts ( a popular Christian contemplative) is said to be very confrontational in her Q & A sessions. No tool is universal, the job dictates the tool. Masons use cement, the wrecking crew use jackhammers. To conclude that masons are less aggressive than the wrecking guy is to confuse the tool, the user, and the task. Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 16, 2006 Report Share Posted August 16, 2006 Nisargadatta , Pete S <pedsie5 wrote: > > B; You think *I* am agressive???? > > > I'm the one that historically has been considered the wimpy, > > > milk-toasty nice guy. Pete should get a real laugh out of this. > > > Have I morphed into a fierce Thor-type throwing thunderbolts > > > without my realizing it? > > P: Leaving aside personalities, the broader issue > is methodology. Is it confrontation a valid teaching > tool? Which teaching style worked best: Ramana's, > or Nis'? Was Ramana milk-toasty, and Nis aggressive? > Who helped more people? Hard to say. Do we > have the right to inflict mental pain by pointing faults, > specially, in this kind of forums where no one said to > anyone teach me please? Is there a tacit understanding > here that if you post, you agreed to teach, and be taught? > > What level of confrontation is acceptable in these lists? It's > curious to note that I have posted every day for 4 years > to several lists, and never once, have I been placed in > moderation, while many of the people I confronted were > either banned, moderated, or left on their own accord. > > Being nice, or blunt are tools to be used or not. Even > Bernardette Roberts ( a popular Christian contemplative) > is said to be very confrontational in her Q & A sessions. > No tool is universal, the job dictates the tool. Masons use > cement, the wrecking crew use jackhammers. To conclude > that masons are less aggressive than the wrecking guy is to > confuse the tool, the user, and the task. > > Pete > > What many psychologists find is that we immitate those in power. So, when we hear, " do as I say, not as I do, " it is precisely that hypocricy that is learned. If Nis were to angrily assert, " Don't get angry!, " his followers would angrily assert that they aren't angry and that neither should others so be. In other words, punishment teaches people to be punitive. Aggression teaches Aggression. Is that what you want to teach? .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 16, 2006 Report Share Posted August 16, 2006 Nisargadatta , Pete S <pedsie5 wrote: > > B; You think *I* am agressive???? > > > I'm the one that historically has been considered the wimpy, > > > milk-toasty nice guy. Pete should get a real laugh out of this. > > > Have I morphed into a fierce Thor-type throwing thunderbolts > > > without my realizing it? > > P: Leaving aside personalities, the broader issue > is methodology. Is it confrontation a valid teaching > tool? Which teaching style worked best: Ramana's, > or Nis'? Was Ramana milk-toasty, and Nis aggressive? > Who helped more people? Hard to say. Do we > have the right to inflict mental pain by pointing faults, > specially, in this kind of forums where no one said to > anyone teach me please? Is there a tacit understanding > here that if you post, you agreed to teach, and be taught? > > What level of confrontation is acceptable in these lists? It's > curious to note that I have posted every day for 4 years > to several lists, and never once, have I been placed in > moderation, while many of the people I confronted were > either banned, moderated, or left on their own accord. > > Being nice, or blunt are tools to be used or not. Even > Bernardette Roberts ( a popular Christian contemplative) > is said to be very confrontational in her Q & A sessions. > No tool is universal, the job dictates the tool. Masons use > cement, the wrecking crew use jackhammers. To conclude > that masons are less aggressive than the wrecking guy is to > confuse the tool, the user, and the task. > > Pete Eloquently stated. And I think I pretty much agree as well : ) Ramana and Nisargadatta do make an interesting study in contrasts. Ramana is said to have often completely transformed a person simply by looking at them. I find that pretty impressive. Nisargadatta seemed to work with the mind more than Ramana, to back the person into a corner led by their own assumptions. Much is made of how confrontational Nis was, but I have found in reading the dialogs carefully that so often he would patiently meet the questioner in terms of the questioner's assumptions, and then lead him into the corner those assumptions implied. So I see him as being very sensitive and compassionate in that kind of process. Reading the dialogs, the places where he really gives someone hell is typically re someone who is puffed up about what he knows and is wanting to show that off. Nis had no patience for that kind of thing. My personal feeling about confrontation on these lists is that if a person says no thanks then it is not appropriate to dog them. I rest confident that Pit-Bull Pete will not resonate with that view. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 16, 2006 Report Share Posted August 16, 2006 Nisargadatta , Pete S <pedsie5 wrote: > > B; You think *I* am agressive???? > > > I'm the one that historically has been considered the wimpy, > > > milk-toasty nice guy. Pete should get a real laugh out of this. > > > Have I morphed into a fierce Thor-type throwing thunderbolts > > > without my realizing it? > > P: Leaving aside personalities, the broader issue > is methodology. Is it confrontation a valid teaching > tool? Which teaching style worked best: Ramana's, > or Nis'? Was Ramana milk-toasty, and Nis aggressive? > Who helped more people? Hard to say. Do we > have the right to inflict mental pain by pointing faults, > specially, in this kind of forums where no one said to > anyone teach me please? Is there a tacit understanding > here that if you post, you agreed to teach, and be taught? > > What level of confrontation is acceptable in these lists? It's > curious to note that I have posted every day for 4 years > to several lists, and never once, have I been placed in > moderation, while many of the people I confronted were > either banned, moderated, or left on their own accord. is this a badge of honor thing for you? my, my.. you are of course welcome to blow your own horn....NOT ONCE you say.......goodness gracious sakes alive!...but it is curious. a braggart, or just another great truism that has it's own meaning?........regarding your perfect record and just plain perfection... clap...clap....clap.. clap..clap...good for you! a gold stickum star on top of your post here! > Being nice, or blunt are tools to be used or not. Even > Bernardette Roberts ( a popular Christian contemplative) > is said to be very confrontational in her Q & A sessions. > No tool is universal, the job dictates the tool. Masons use > cement, the wrecking crew use jackhammers. To conclude > that masons are less aggressive than the wrecking guy is to > confuse the tool, the user, and the task. > > Pete now THIS makes sense.......funny how, if we are open and honest with ourselves, what golden opportunities of self discovery we can avail ourselves to with confrontation.......advise is another matter....that just blows away , denegrates, and belittles the other (who's now supposed to 'see the wisdom of said advise and follow through with it's commands of behaviour; and, blows up an ego that is already out of control in it's belief that the one it believes itself to represent can improve or better in any manner, any other living being........that is as delusional and off mark as it gets. .........bob > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 17, 2006 Report Share Posted August 17, 2006 Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 " <Roberibus111 wrote: > > Nisargadatta , Pete S <pedsie5@> wrote: > > > > B; You think *I* am agressive???? > > > > I'm the one that historically has been considered the wimpy, > > > > milk-toasty nice guy. Pete should get a real laugh out of > this. > > > > Have I morphed into a fierce Thor-type throwing thunderbolts > > > > without my realizing it? > > > > P: Leaving aside personalities, the broader issue > > is methodology. Is it confrontation a valid teaching > > tool? Which teaching style worked best: Ramana's, > > or Nis'? Was Ramana milk-toasty, and Nis aggressive? > > Who helped more people? Hard to say. Do we > > have the right to inflict mental pain by pointing faults, > > specially, in this kind of forums where no one said to > > anyone teach me please? Is there a tacit understanding > > here that if you post, you agreed to teach, and be taught? > > > > What level of confrontation is acceptable in these lists? It's > > curious to note that I have posted every day for 4 years > > to several lists, and never once, have I been placed in > > moderation, while many of the people I confronted were > > either banned, moderated, or left on their own accord. > > > is this a badge of honor thing for you? my, my.. you are of course > welcome to blow your own horn....NOT ONCE you say.......goodness > gracious sakes alive!...but it is curious. a braggart, or just > another great truism that has it's own meaning?........regarding your > perfect record and just plain perfection... clap...clap....clap.. > clap..clap...good for you! a gold stickum star on top of your post > here! > > > > > Being nice, or blunt are tools to be used or not. Even > > Bernardette Roberts ( a popular Christian contemplative) > > is said to be very confrontational in her Q & A sessions. > > No tool is universal, the job dictates the tool. Masons use > > cement, the wrecking crew use jackhammers. To conclude > > that masons are less aggressive than the wrecking guy is to > > confuse the tool, the user, and the task. > > > > Pete > > > now THIS makes sense.......funny how, if we are open and honest with > ourselves, what golden opportunities of self discovery we can avail > ourselves to with confrontation.......advise is another > matter....that just blows away , denegrates, and belittles the other > (who's now supposed to 'see the wisdom of said advise and follow > through with it's commands of behaviour; and, blows up an ego that > is already out of control in it's belief that the one it believes > itself to represent can improve or better in any manner, any other > living being........that is as delusional and off mark as it gets. > > .........bob > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 17, 2006 Report Share Posted August 17, 2006 Nisargadatta , " anabebe57 " <kailashana wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 " > <Roberibus111@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , Pete S <pedsie5@> wrote: > > > > > > B; You think *I* am agressive???? > > > > > I'm the one that historically has been considered the > wimpy, > > > > > milk-toasty nice guy. Pete should get a real laugh out of > > this. > > > > > Have I morphed into a fierce Thor-type throwing > thunderbolts > > > > > without my realizing it? > > > > > > P: Leaving aside personalities, the broader issue > > > is methodology. Is it confrontation a valid teaching > > > tool? Which teaching style worked best: Ramana's, > > > or Nis'? Was Ramana milk-toasty, and Nis aggressive? > > > Who helped more people? Hard to say. Do we > > > have the right to inflict mental pain by pointing faults, > > > specially, in this kind of forums where no one said to > > > anyone teach me please? Is there a tacit understanding > > > here that if you post, you agreed to teach, and be taught? > > > > > > What level of confrontation is acceptable in these lists? It's > > > curious to note that I have posted every day for 4 years > > > to several lists, and never once, have I been placed in > > > moderation, while many of the people I confronted were > > > either banned, moderated, or left on their own accord. > > > > > > is this a badge of honor thing for you? my, my.. you are of course > > welcome to blow your own horn....NOT ONCE you say.......goodness > > gracious sakes alive!...but it is curious. a braggart, or just > > another great truism that has it's own meaning?........regarding > your > > perfect record and just plain perfection... > clap...clap....clap.. > > clap..clap...good for you! a gold stickum star on top of your post > > here! > > > > > > > > > Being nice, or blunt are tools to be used or not. Even > > > Bernardette Roberts ( a popular Christian contemplative) > > > is said to be very confrontational in her Q & A sessions. > > > No tool is universal, the job dictates the tool. Masons use > > > cement, the wrecking crew use jackhammers. To conclude > > > that masons are less aggressive than the wrecking guy is to > > > confuse the tool, the user, and the task. > > > > > > Pete > > > > > > now THIS makes sense.......funny how, if we are open and honest > with > > ourselves, what golden opportunities of self discovery we can > avail > > ourselves to with confrontation.......advise is another > > matter....that just blows away , denegrates, and belittles the > other > > (who's now supposed to 'see the wisdom of said advise and follow > > through with it's commands of behaviour; and, blows up an ego > that > > is already out of control in it's belief that the one it believes > > itself to represent can improve or better in any manner, any other > > living being........that is as delusional and off mark as it gets. > > > > .........bob > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 17, 2006 Report Share Posted August 17, 2006 Nisargadatta , " anabebe57 " <kailashana wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 " > <Roberibus111@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , Pete S <pedsie5@> wrote: > > > > > > B; You think *I* am agressive???? > > > > > I'm the one that historically has been considered the > wimpy, > > > > > milk-toasty nice guy. Pete should get a real laugh out of > > this. > > > > > Have I morphed into a fierce Thor-type throwing > thunderbolts > > > > > without my realizing it? > > > > > > P: Leaving aside personalities, the broader issue > > > is methodology. Is it confrontation a valid teaching > > > tool? Which teaching style worked best: Ramana's, > > > or Nis'? Was Ramana milk-toasty, and Nis aggressive? > > > Who helped more people? Hard to say. Do we > > > have the right to inflict mental pain by pointing faults, > > > specially, in this kind of forums where no one said to > > > anyone teach me please? Is there a tacit understanding > > > here that if you post, you agreed to teach, and be taught? > > > > > > What level of confrontation is acceptable in these lists? It's > > > curious to note that I have posted every day for 4 years > > > to several lists, and never once, have I been placed in > > > moderation, while many of the people I confronted were > > > either banned, moderated, or left on their own accord. > > > > > > is this a badge of honor thing for you? my, my.. you are of course > > welcome to blow your own horn....NOT ONCE you say.......goodness > > gracious sakes alive!...but it is curious. a braggart, or just > > another great truism that has it's own meaning?........regarding > your > > perfect record and just plain perfection... > clap...clap....clap.. > > clap..clap...good for you! a gold stickum star on top of your post > > here! > > > > > > > > > Being nice, or blunt are tools to be used or not. Even > > > Bernardette Roberts ( a popular Christian contemplative) > > > is said to be very confrontational in her Q & A sessions. > > > No tool is universal, the job dictates the tool. Masons use > > > cement, the wrecking crew use jackhammers. To conclude > > > that masons are less aggressive than the wrecking guy is to > > > confuse the tool, the user, and the task. > > > > > > Pete > > > > > > now THIS makes sense.......funny how, if we are open and honest > with > > ourselves, what golden opportunities of self discovery we can > avail > > ourselves to with confrontation.......advise is another > > matter....that just blows away , denegrates, and belittles the > other > > (who's now supposed to 'see the wisdom of said advise and follow > > through with it's commands of behaviour; and, blows up an ego > that > > is already out of control in it's belief that the one it believes > > itself to represent can improve or better in any manner, any other > > living being........that is as delusional and off mark as it gets. > > > > .........bob > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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