Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 Ramana Maharishi: .Find out where-from thoughts emerge. Then you will abide in the ever-present inner-most Self and be free from the idea of birth and the fear of death. -=-==-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=--=-=-=- Nisargadatta: The final stage of meditation is reached when the sense of identity goes beyond the 'I-am-so-and-so', beyond 'so-I-am', beyond 'I-am-the-witness-only', beyond 'there-is', beyond all ideas into the impersonally personal pure being. Era ps: examples of 'god' in Advaita: Ramana's " Self " Niz's impersonally personal pure being, or Consciousess, Awareess [of Brahman] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 When Ramana Maharshi's mother fell ill, He wrote a 5 stanza bhajan on Lord Arunachala. If He completely confined to self only and said that self is Lord, then He can cure his mother. What is the necessity of praying for Lord arunachala? How do you interpret this? At the lotus feet of Shri Datta Swami surya http://www.universal-spirituality.org Era Molnar <n0ndual wrote: Ramana Maharishi: .Find out where-from thoughts emerge. Then you will abide in the ever-present inner-most Self and be free from the idea of birth and the fear of death. Era ps: examples of 'god' in Advaita: Ramana's " Self " Niz's impersonally personal pure being, or Consciousess, Awareess [of Brahman] . Stay in the know. Pulse on the new .com. Check it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 prakki surya <dattapr2000 > > When Ramana Maharshi's mother fell ill, He wrote a 5 stanza bhajan on Lord Arunachala. What is the necessity of praying for Lord arunachala? How do you interpret this? > Ramana wrote bhajans as he was a poet, he lived inside Arunachala, he is known as the Sage of Arunachala, he experienced Siva there. Surya, you are fascinated by rituals, miracles, symbolic stories, genesis stories, I'm not. I focus on the MESSAGE of saints, not on their stories. Ramana's message is: " Find out where-from thoughts emerge. Then you will abide in the ever-present inner-most Self " Advaitins are looking for God inside, what he called the " Self " thus find a NONDUAL reality, mindset. OTOH you are looking for God on the outside, what is a Davita story Investing too heavily in the concept of Iswara tends to replace the idea of oneself with the idea of another self without realisation. I'm not saying it is wrong to worship Iswara but it is only a step, that can be jumped over by 'Who am I?' [Ramana] Going to the inside instead of the outside > Era Molnar <n0ndual > > Ramana Maharishi: .Find out where-from thoughts emerge. > > Then you will abide in the > ever-present inner-most Self and be free from the idea of birth and the fear of death. > > Era > > ps: examples of 'god' in Advaita: Ramana's " Self " **Niz's impersonally personal pure being, or Consciousess, Awareess [of Brahman] Nisargadatta's message is also referring to the inside: " I Am That " .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 Dearest One, Is it useless to go to the mounain when the mountain is I Am/Us? Ramana's prayer, his mother, her illness, your question, Era's posting, these words I write now, all is/we are the endless delight of the cosmos delighting in our seeking, in our finding, in our aloneness and in our Being One with an infinity ever just beyond our immediate awareness: the cloud of unknowing, our breath high Arunachala, gathering rocks and stones to tie thoughts together that give wings to unseen words written on a cool and placid mountain lake I Am. YIL, Anna Nisargadatta , prakki surya <dattapr2000 wrote: > > When Ramana Maharshi's mother fell ill, He wrote a 5 stanza bhajan on Lord Arunachala. If He completely confined to self only and said that self is Lord, then He can cure his mother. What is the necessity of praying for Lord arunachala? How do you interpret this? > > At the lotus feet of Shri Datta Swami > surya > http://www.universal-spirituality.org > > > Era Molnar <n0ndual wrote: > > Ramana Maharishi: .Find out where-from thoughts emerge. > > Then you will abide in the > ever-present inner-most Self and be free from the idea of birth and the fear of death. > > Era > > ps: examples of 'god' in Advaita: Ramana's " Self " Niz's impersonally personal pure being, or Consciousess, Awareess [of Brahman] > > > . > > > > > > Stay in the know. Pulse on the new .com. Check it out. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 Nisargadatta , " Era Molnar " <n0ndual wrote: > > > prakki surya <dattapr2000@> > > > When Ramana Maharshi's mother fell ill, He wrote a 5 stanza bhajan on Lord Arunachala. What is the necessity of praying for Lord arunachala? How do you interpret this? > > > > Ramana wrote bhajans as he was a poet, he lived inside Arunachala, he is known as the Sage of Arunachala, he experienced Siva there. > > Surya, you are fascinated by rituals, miracles, symbolic stories, genesis stories, I'm not. I focus on the MESSAGE of saints, not on their stories. Ramana's message is: " Find out where-from thoughts emerge. Then you will abide in the ever-present inner-most Self " > > Advaitins are looking for God inside, what he called the " Self " thus find a NONDUAL reality, mindset. OTOH you are looking for God on the outside, what is a Davita story > Inside? Outside?.....of what? what is the demarcation zone? if the Self is One......and 'I' believe 'this'......what can be inside or outside of the Only? is it not 'All' and 'Everything', the One without second?...... do 'inside', 'outside', 'above', 'below', 'along side of', etc have any meaning to the Self? God aka the Void, the Self, Atman/Brahma, whatever..must be niether inside nor outside nor niether nor both.....those are all strictly and only words with relative meaning and actually ALL of them are true with respect to THAT of which, Ramana, Niz, Jesus, Buddha......all the big boys and girls of el Camino Real referred. > Investing too heavily in the concept of Iswara tends to replace the idea of oneself with the idea of another self without realisation. I'm not saying it is wrong to worship Iswara but it is only a step, that can be jumped over by 'Who am I?' [Ramana] Going to the inside instead of the outside there are no steps to where one already and always abides. ........bob ps....there is another fascination called 'captivation of concept'....it's enthralling stuff...but that's all it is.......more 'stuff'. nothing more enlightening about it than pagan ritual. whatever realizes is 'realizing'......whatever conceals.....'conceals'.......period. nobody is 'right', nobody is 'wrong'..... 'nobody' 'is'....... the only true 'fact'. (bn) nnb > > Era Molnar <n0ndual@> > > > > Ramana Maharishi: .Find out where-from thoughts emerge. > > > > Then you will abide in the > > ever-present inner-most Self and be free from the idea of birth and the fear of death. > > > > Era > > > > ps: examples of 'god' in Advaita: Ramana's " Self " **Niz's impersonally personal pure being, or Consciousess, Awareess [of Brahman] > > Nisargadatta's message is also referring to the inside: " I Am That " > > > > . > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 Nisargadatta , " anabebe57 " <kailashana wrote: > > Dearest One, > > Is it useless to go to the mounain when the mountain is I Am/Us? > > Ramana's prayer, his mother, her illness, your question, Era's > posting, these words I write now, all is/we are the endless delight > of the cosmos delighting in our seeking, in our finding, in our > aloneness and in our Being One with an infinity ever just beyond our > immediate awareness: the cloud of unknowing, our breath high > Arunachala, gathering rocks and stones to tie thoughts together that > give wings to unseen words written on a cool and placid mountain > lake I Am. > > YIL, > Anna > > > > > Nisargadatta , prakki surya <dattapr2000@> > wrote: > > > > When Ramana Maharshi's mother fell ill, He wrote a 5 stanza bhajan > on Lord Arunachala. If He completely confined to self only and said > that self is Lord, then He can cure his mother. What is the > necessity of praying for Lord arunachala? How do you interpret this? > > > > At the lotus feet of Shri Datta Swami > > surya > > http://www.universal-spirituality.org > > > > > > Era Molnar <n0ndual@> wrote: > > > > Ramana Maharishi: .Find out where-from thoughts emerge. > > > > Then you will abide in the > > ever-present inner-most Self and be free from the idea of birth > and the fear of death. > > > > Era > > > > ps: examples of 'god' in Advaita: Ramana's " Self " Niz's > impersonally personal pure being, or Consciousess, Awareess [of > Brahman] > > surya is not interested in the song he's only interested in the singer the mother and child reunion which he's trying to establish as disciple and here as teacher p.s.: surya in me, surya in you... .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 " <Roberibus111 wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " Era Molnar " <n0ndual@> wrote: > > > > > > prakki surya <dattapr2000@> > > > > When Ramana Maharshi's mother fell ill, He wrote a 5 stanza > bhajan on Lord Arunachala. What is the necessity of praying for Lord > arunachala? How do you interpret this? > > > > > > > Ramana wrote bhajans as he was a poet, he lived inside Arunachala, > he is known as the Sage of Arunachala, he experienced Siva there. > > > > Surya, you are fascinated by rituals, miracles, symbolic stories, > genesis stories, I'm not. I focus on the MESSAGE of saints, not on > their stories. Ramana's message is: " Find out where-from thoughts > emerge. Then you will abide in the ever-present inner-most Self " > > > > Advaitins are looking for God inside, what he called the " Self " > thus find a NONDUAL reality, mindset. OTOH you are looking for God on > the outside, what is a Davita story > > > > Inside? Outside?.....of what? what is the demarcation zone? if the > Self is One......and 'I' believe 'this'......what can be inside or > outside of the Only? is it not 'All' and 'Everything', the One > without second?...... > do 'inside', 'outside', 'above', 'below', 'along side of', etc have > any meaning to the Self? God aka the Void, the Self, Atman/Brahma, > whatever..must be niether inside nor outside nor niether nor > both.....those are all strictly and only words with relative meaning > and actually ALL of them are true with respect to THAT of which, > Ramana, Niz, Jesus, Buddha......all the big boys and girls of el > Camino Real referred. > > > > Investing too heavily in the concept of Iswara tends to replace the > idea of oneself with the idea of another self without realisation. > I'm not saying it is wrong to worship Iswara but it is only a step, > that can be jumped over by 'Who am I?' [Ramana] Going to the inside > instead of the outside > > > there are no steps to where one already and always abides. > > ........bob > ps....there is another fascination called 'captivation of > concept'....it's enthralling stuff...but that's all it > is.......more 'stuff'. nothing more enlightening about it than pagan > ritual. whatever realizes is 'realizing'......whatever > conceals.....'conceals'.......period. nobody is 'right', nobody > is 'wrong'..... 'nobody' 'is'....... the only true 'fact'. > > (bn) > > > nnb > > > > > Era Molnar <n0ndual@> > > > > > > Ramana Maharishi: .Find out where-from thoughts emerge. > > > > > > Then you will abide in the > > > ever-present inner-most Self and be free from the idea of birth > and the fear of death. > > > > > > Era > > > > > > ps: examples of 'god' in Advaita: Ramana's " Self " **Niz's > impersonally personal pure being, or Consciousess, Awareess [of > Brahman] > > > > Nisargadatta's message is also referring to the inside: " I Am That " > > > > > > > > . > > > it's not just neti neti it's also both and .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 > > Surya, you are fascinated by rituals, miracles, symbolic stories, > genesis stories, I'm not. I focus on the MESSAGE of saints, not on > their stories. Ramana's message is: " Find out where-from thoughts > emerge. Then you will abide in the ever-present inner-most Self " > > > > Advaitins are looking for God inside, what he called the " Self " > thus find a NONDUAL reality, mindset. OTOH you are looking for God on > the outside, what is a Davita story > > > > Inside? Outside?.....of what? what is the demarcation zone? if the > Self is One......and 'I' believe 'this'......what can be inside or > outside of the Only? I was talking to Surya about the Dvaita vs Advaita approach, I wanted to clarify the Advaita teaching and undestanding. IMO there is a duo in the 'me and god' [suriya's approach] and there is none in the 'abiding in Ramana's " Sef " ', as you say, that the " Self is ONE " Nisargadatta leads one to a NONDUAL undestanding, mindset, the Dvaita has the " God is not me " hindrance.. not being ONE with, but ..subserviant.. to a guru to God ect.. Era > is it not 'All' and 'Everything', the One > without second?...... > do 'inside', 'outside', 'above', 'below', 'along side of', etc have > any meaning to the Self? God aka the Void, the Self, Atman/Brahma, > whatever..must be niether inside nor outside nor niether nor > both.....those are all strictly and only words with relative meaning > and actually ALL of them are true with respect to THAT of which, > Ramana, Niz, Jesus, Buddha......all the big boys and girls of el > Camino Real referred. > > > > Investing too heavily in the concept of Iswara tends to replace the > idea of oneself with the idea of another self without realisation. > I'm not saying it is wrong to worship Iswara but it is only a step, > that can be jumped over by 'Who am I?' [Ramana] Going to the inside > instead of the outside > > > there are no steps to where one already and always abides. > > ........bob > ps....there is another fascination called 'captivation of > concept'....it's enthralling stuff...but that's all it > is.......more 'stuff'. nothing more enlightening about it than pagan > ritual. whatever realizes is 'realizing'......whatever > conceals.....'conceals'.......period. nobody is 'right', nobody > is 'wrong'..... 'nobody' 'is'....... the only true 'fact'. > > > > nnb > > > > > Era Molnar <n0ndual@> > > > > > > Ramana Maharishi: .Find out where-from thoughts emerge. > > > > > > Then you will abide in the > > > ever-present inner-most Self and be free from the idea of birth > and the fear of death. > > > > > > Era > > > > > > ps: examples of 'god' in Advaita: Ramana's " Self " **Niz's > impersonally personal pure being, or Consciousess, Awareess [of > Brahman] > > > > Nisargadatta's message is also referring to the inside: " I Am That " > > > > > > > > . - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 I think you have not got my point. I am not talking about dvaita. I needed a clarity that is why i posed that question. See Ramana is an advaitin and I respect him a lot. But I am not able to understand this point, of duality in that specific situation. Instead you have gone ahead and given me a dose of Ramana's teaching. He also preached upon the non-dual self and I have no comments to offer. I am asking a simple question, when he is already Self/Brahman/God then he need not pray to the Lord to save his mother. Does this mean there existed a Lord that is different from what he preached. But look at another situation, he gave complete moksha to his mother when she died later on. Can you explain the two situations separately or you may also corelate them. I have no problem. Surya Nisargadatta , " Era Molnar " <n0ndual wrote: > > > > > > Surya, you are fascinated by rituals, miracles, symbolic stories, > > genesis stories, I'm not. I focus on the MESSAGE of saints, not on > > their stories. Ramana's message is: " Find out where-from thoughts > > emerge. Then you will abide in the ever-present inner-most Self " > > > > > > Advaitins are looking for God inside, what he called the " Self " > > thus find a NONDUAL reality, mindset. OTOH you are looking for God on > > the outside, what is a Davita story > > > > > > > Inside? Outside?.....of what? what is the demarcation zone? if the > > Self is One......and 'I' believe 'this'......what can be inside or > > outside of the Only? > > > > > I was talking to Surya about the Dvaita vs Advaita approach, I wanted to clarify the Advaita teaching and undestanding. > > IMO there is a duo in the 'me and god' [suriya's approach] and there is none in the 'abiding in Ramana's " Sef " ', as you say, that the " Self is ONE " > > Nisargadatta leads one to a NONDUAL undestanding, mindset, the Dvaita has the " God is not me " hindrance.. not being ONE with, but ..subserviant.. to a guru to God ect.. > > Era > > > > > is it not 'All' and 'Everything', the One > > without second?...... > > do 'inside', 'outside', 'above', 'below', 'along side of', etc have > > any meaning to the Self? God aka the Void, the Self, Atman/Brahma, > > whatever..must be niether inside nor outside nor niether nor > > both.....those are all strictly and only words with relative meaning > > and actually ALL of them are true with respect to THAT of which, > > Ramana, Niz, Jesus, Buddha......all the big boys and girls of el > > Camino Real referred. > > > > > > > Investing too heavily in the concept of Iswara tends to replace the > > idea of oneself with the idea of another self without realisation. > > I'm not saying it is wrong to worship Iswara but it is only a step, > > that can be jumped over by 'Who am I?' [Ramana] Going to the inside > > instead of the outside > > > > > > there are no steps to where one already and always abides. > > > > ........bob > > ps....there is another fascination called 'captivation of > > concept'....it's enthralling stuff...but that's all it > > is.......more 'stuff'. nothing more enlightening about it than pagan > > ritual. whatever realizes is 'realizing'......whatever > > conceals.....'conceals'.......period. nobody is 'right', nobody > > is 'wrong'..... 'nobody' 'is'....... the only true 'fact'. > > > > > > > nnb > > > > > > > > Era Molnar <n0ndual@> > > > > > > > > Ramana Maharishi: .Find out where-from thoughts emerge. > > > > > > > > Then you will abide in the > > > > ever-present inner-most Self and be free from the idea of birth > > and the fear of death. > > > > > > > > Era > > > > > > > > ps: examples of 'god' in Advaita: Ramana's " Self " **Niz's > > impersonally personal pure being, or Consciousess, Awareess [of > > Brahman] > > > > > > Nisargadatta's message is also referring to the inside: " I Am That " > > > > > > > > > > > > . > > - > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2006 Report Share Posted August 19, 2006 S: I think you have not got my point. I am not talking about dvaita. I needed a clarity that is why i posed that question. I am asking a simple question, when he is already Self/Brahman/God then he need not pray to the Lord to save his mother. Does this mean there existed a Lord that is different from what he preached. But look at another situation, he gave complete moksha to his mother when she died later on. E: For me these stories do not mean, that there " existed a Lord that is different from what he preached " . You are trying to make a point over and over, that there is Lord seperate from the ALL. IMO THERE IS NONE. Get over it ! No matter how you twist and turn the meaning of Ramana's poems, events of his life and his prayers; there is a Nondual understanding thaught by Ramana and Nisargadatta: namely. that All creation is ONE, god is NOT a seperate entity from this ONE --and your understanding is NOT like that. Era Surya, you are fascinated by rituals, miracles, symbolic stories, genesis stories, I'm not. I focus on the MESSAGE of saints, not on their stories. Ramana's message is: " Find out where-from > thoughts emerge. Then you will abide in the ever-present inner-most Self " Advaitins are looking for God inside, what he called the " Self " thus find a NONDUAL reality, mindset. OTOH you are looking for God on the outside, what is a Davita story Bob: Inside? Outside?.....of what? what is the demarcation zone? if the Self is One......and 'I' believe 'this'......what can be inside or outside of the Only? E: I was talking to Surya about the Dvaita vs Advaita approach, I wanted to clarify the Advaita teaching and undestanding. IMO there is a duo in the 'me and god' [suriya's approach] and there is none in the 'abiding in Ramana's " Sef " ', as you say, that the " Self is ONE " Nisargadatta leads one to a NONDUAL undestanding, mindset, the Dvaita has the " God is not me " hindrance.. not being ONE with, but ..subserviant.. to a guru to God ect.. Nisargadatta's message is also referring to look inside: " I Am That " S: See Ramana is an advaitin and I respect him a lot. But I am not able to understand this point, of duality in that specific situation. Instead you have gone ahead and given me a dose of Ramana's teaching. He also preached upon the non-dual self and I have no comments to offer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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