Guest guest Posted July 24, 2007 Report Share Posted July 24, 2007 How to Stabilize in the Self.... Who will stabilize where? Since you don't exist and only the Self exists, it is the identification with the body as Self that precludes remaining in The Self. So then practice deliberate identification with the Self " AS " Self. After a while this practice will become sublimated and the mind will automatically identify only with the Self " AS " Self. Since it is not the Jiva who wields the Will in the Mind (due to the Ichha-Sakti) then to let go of the Will means to deliberately identify with the Self " AS " Self. This does not mean to say that the Jiva is identifying with The Self " AS " itself, (assuming ownership of this act) because the Human Will is empowered by the Ichha-Sakti. The mistake is that the reflection of the creative act (The Will-in-action) in the conscious (or psychic) space of The Self, is taken to be the real reality. The understanding that the Jiva is NOT the doer is indispensible here. i.e. in this case the Jiva is not the thinker, nor is the Jiva the one who visualizes any action or proposed action. i.e all volitional action manifests in the mind as a visualized event previous to action being taken, by the Jiva, mind or body. The question is Who is visualizing what in where? Who is thinking in ALL minds? Who is cognizing, experiencing or knowing what where? IN short what is known by Whom? Nothing is known by Jiva about the Self. Nothing can be reported by the mind about the Self. because the mind becomes whatever thought arises (i.e mind appears " AS " that arisen thought; hence the mind's transcendence lies in recognizing the MIND IS Thought itself; i.e. it is the consciousness. While the conscious Self. is beyond the Mind, it is beyond its attribute yet is the Only knower of its OWN content. The content of the Conscious-Self is the consciousness, it is existence itself. The Self Shines " AS " existence. Thus it is experiencing itself thru " ALL minds no matter how advanced, primitive or god-like. There is thus no final Self at all He " The Self " is as the Vaisnava's say self-transcendant, and is said to abide is his transcendental abode. That transcendental abode has been imagined by countless people over countless centuries to resembel such and such and contain such and such etc.. but these are merely imaginary. However He (The Self) enjoys all moodes of His own consciousness and is free in all modes (just as is said in Siva Sutra) and is not bound by any mode hence once established in the Self by constant contemplation upon the Self " AS " Self the indwelling Will (the presence of God\Siva\Self) in us re-cognizes who HE IS! He is Self-realized the JIva does not and cannot realize Him, but after realization the mind is used for practical purposes but it can no longer bind that free one as HE has found himself ! Om Tat Sat! With love and respect binduji Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 25, 2007 Report Share Posted July 25, 2007 Nisargadatta , " bindu " <binduau wrote: > > How to Stabilize in the Self.... > > Who will stabilize where? Since you don't exist > and only the Self exists, it is the identification with the body as > Self that precludes remaining in The Self. So then practice > deliberate identification with the Self " AS " Self. After a while this > practice will become sublimated and the mind will automatically > identify only with the Self " AS " Self. > > Since it is not the Jiva who wields the Will in the Mind (due to the > Ichha-Sakti) > then to let go of the Will means to deliberately identify with the > Self " AS " Self. > > This does not mean to say that the Jiva is identifying with The > Self " AS " itself, (assuming ownership of this act) because the Human > Will is empowered by the Ichha-Sakti. The mistake is that the > reflection of the creative act (The Will-in-action) in the conscious > (or psychic) space of The Self, is taken to be the real reality. > > The understanding that the Jiva is NOT the doer is indispensible > here. i.e. in this case the Jiva is not the thinker, nor is the Jiva > the one who visualizes any action or proposed action. i.e all > volitional action manifests in the mind as a visualized event > previous to action being taken, by the Jiva, mind or body. > > The question is Who is visualizing what in where? Who is thinking in > ALL minds? Who is cognizing, experiencing or knowing what where? IN > short what is known by Whom? > > Nothing is known by Jiva about the Self. Nothing can be reported by > the mind about the Self. because the mind becomes whatever thought > arises (i.e mind appears " AS " that arisen thought; hence the mind's > transcendence lies in recognizing the MIND IS Thought itself; i.e. it > is the consciousness. While the conscious Self. is beyond the Mind, > it is beyond its attribute yet is the Only knower of its OWN content. > > The content of the Conscious-Self is the consciousness, it is > existence itself. > The Self Shines " AS " existence. Thus it is experiencing itself > thru " ALL minds no matter how advanced, primitive or god-like. There > is thus no final Self at all He " The Self " is as the Vaisnava's say > self-transcendant, and is said to abide is his transcendental abode. > That transcendental abode has been imagined by countless people over > countless centuries to resembel such and such and contain such and > such etc.. but these are merely imaginary. > > However He (The Self) enjoys all moodes of His own consciousness and > is free in all modes (just as is said in Siva Sutra) and is not bound > by any mode hence once established in the Self by constant > contemplation upon the Self " AS " Self the indwelling Will (the > presence of God\Siva\Self) in us re-cognizes who HE IS! > > > He is Self-realized the JIva does not and cannot realize Him, but > after realization the mind is used for practical purposes but it can > no longer bind that free one as HE has found himself ! > > Om Tat Sat! > > With love and respect > > binduji > Can it be said that there is no need to stabilize what is already stable?I take it you are saying something like that.Thinking that one needs to stabilize something is a great source of misery. No? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 25, 2007 Report Share Posted July 25, 2007 Nisargadatta , " tom " <jeusisbuen wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " bindu " <binduau@> wrote: > > > > How to Stabilize in the Self.... > > > > Who will stabilize where? Since you don't exist > > and only the Self exists, it is the identification with the body > as > > Self that precludes remaining in The Self. So then practice > > deliberate identification with the Self " AS " Self. After a while > this > > practice will become sublimated and the mind will automatically > > identify only with the Self " AS " Self. > > > > Since it is not the Jiva who wields the Will in the Mind (due to > the > > Ichha-Sakti) > > then to let go of the Will means to deliberately identify with the > > Self " AS " Self. > > > > This does not mean to say that the Jiva is identifying with The > > Self " AS " itself, (assuming ownership of this act) because the > Human > > Will is empowered by the Ichha-Sakti. The mistake is that the > > reflection of the creative act (The Will-in-action) in the > conscious > > (or psychic) space of The Self, is taken to be the real reality. > > > > The understanding that the Jiva is NOT the doer is indispensible > > here. i.e. in this case the Jiva is not the thinker, nor is the > Jiva > > the one who visualizes any action or proposed action. i.e all > > volitional action manifests in the mind as a visualized event > > previous to action being taken, by the Jiva, mind or body. > > > > The question is Who is visualizing what in where? Who is thinking > in > > ALL minds? Who is cognizing, experiencing or knowing what where? > IN > > short what is known by Whom? > > > > Nothing is known by Jiva about the Self. Nothing can be reported > by > > the mind about the Self. because the mind becomes whatever thought > > arises (i.e mind appears " AS " that arisen thought; hence the > mind's > > transcendence lies in recognizing the MIND IS Thought itself; i.e. > it > > is the consciousness. While the conscious Self. is beyond the > Mind, > > it is beyond its attribute yet is the Only knower of its OWN > content. > > > > The content of the Conscious-Self is the consciousness, it is > > existence itself. > > The Self Shines " AS " existence. Thus it is experiencing itself > > thru " ALL minds no matter how advanced, primitive or god-like. > There > > is thus no final Self at all He " The Self " is as the Vaisnava's > say > > self-transcendant, and is said to abide is his transcendental > abode. > > That transcendental abode has been imagined by countless people > over > > countless centuries to resembel such and such and contain such and > > such etc.. but these are merely imaginary. > > > > However He (The Self) enjoys all moodes of His own consciousness > and > > is free in all modes (just as is said in Siva Sutra) and is not > bound > > by any mode hence once established in the Self by constant > > contemplation upon the Self " AS " Self the indwelling Will (the > > presence of God\Siva\Self) in us re-cognizes who HE IS! > > > > > > He is Self-realized the JIva does not and cannot realize Him, but > > after realization the mind is used for practical purposes but it > can > > no longer bind that free one as HE has found himself ! > > > > Om Tat Sat! > > > > With love and respect > > > > binduji > > > Can it be said that there is no need to stabilize what is already > stable?I take it you are saying something like that.Thinking that > one needs to stabilize something is a great source of misery. No? many things to stabilize.... every moment of life.... just like " you " need to stabilize " your " imaginary being.... every night.... during nice dreams....and deep sleep.... Marc ps: often it's better to stabilize the mind.....with simply sleeping.....enough sleep... instead to keep the mind busy busy busy.... with endless (spiritual) talk and talk....and talk.... of no meaning at all > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 25, 2007 Report Share Posted July 25, 2007 Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " <dennis_travis33 wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " tom " <jeusisbuen@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " bindu " <binduau@> wrote: > > > > > > How to Stabilize in the Self.... > > > > > > Who will stabilize where? Since you don't exist > > > and only the Self exists, it is the identification with the body > > as > > > Self that precludes remaining in The Self. So then practice > > > deliberate identification with the Self " AS " Self. After a while > > this > > > practice will become sublimated and the mind will automatically > > > identify only with the Self " AS " Self. > > > > > > Since it is not the Jiva who wields the Will in the Mind (due to > > the > > > Ichha-Sakti) > > > then to let go of the Will means to deliberately identify with > the > > > Self " AS " Self. > > > > > > This does not mean to say that the Jiva is identifying with The > > > Self " AS " itself, (assuming ownership of this act) because the > > Human > > > Will is empowered by the Ichha-Sakti. The mistake is that the > > > reflection of the creative act (The Will-in-action) in the > > conscious > > > (or psychic) space of The Self, is taken to be the real reality. > > > > > > The understanding that the Jiva is NOT the doer is indispensible > > > here. i.e. in this case the Jiva is not the thinker, nor is the > > Jiva > > > the one who visualizes any action or proposed action. i.e all > > > volitional action manifests in the mind as a visualized event > > > previous to action being taken, by the Jiva, mind or body. > > > > > > The question is Who is visualizing what in where? Who is thinking > > in > > > ALL minds? Who is cognizing, experiencing or knowing what where? > > IN > > > short what is known by Whom? > > > > > > Nothing is known by Jiva about the Self. Nothing can be reported > > by > > > the mind about the Self. because the mind becomes whatever > thought > > > arises (i.e mind appears " AS " that arisen thought; hence the > > mind's > > > transcendence lies in recognizing the MIND IS Thought itself; > i.e. > > it > > > is the consciousness. While the conscious Self. is beyond the > > Mind, > > > it is beyond its attribute yet is the Only knower of its OWN > > content. > > > > > > The content of the Conscious-Self is the consciousness, it is > > > existence itself. > > > The Self Shines " AS " existence. Thus it is experiencing itself > > > thru " ALL minds no matter how advanced, primitive or god-like. > > There > > > is thus no final Self at all He " The Self " is as the Vaisnava's > > say > > > self-transcendant, and is said to abide is his transcendental > > abode. > > > That transcendental abode has been imagined by countless people > > over > > > countless centuries to resembel such and such and contain such > and > > > such etc.. but these are merely imaginary. > > > > > > However He (The Self) enjoys all moodes of His own consciousness > > and > > > is free in all modes (just as is said in Siva Sutra) and is not > > bound > > > by any mode hence once established in the Self by constant > > > contemplation upon the Self " AS " Self the indwelling Will (the > > > presence of God\Siva\Self) in us re-cognizes who HE IS! > > > > > > > > > He is Self-realized the JIva does not and cannot realize Him, > but > > > after realization the mind is used for practical purposes but it > > can > > > no longer bind that free one as HE has found himself ! > > > > > > Om Tat Sat! > > > > > > With love and respect > > > > > > binduji > > > > > Can it be said that there is no need to stabilize what is already > > stable?I take it you are saying something like that.Thinking that > > one needs to stabilize something is a great source of misery. No? > > > > many things to stabilize.... > every moment of life.... > > just like " you " need to stabilize " your " imaginary being.... > > every night.... > > during nice dreams....and > > deep sleep.... > > > Marc > > > ps: often it's better to stabilize the mind.....with simply > sleeping.....enough sleep... > > instead to keep the mind busy busy busy.... > > with endless (spiritual) talk and talk....and talk.... > > of > > no meaning > > at all > > > >If something needs to be stabilized, I hope it doesn't hold its' breath until " I " stabilize it. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 26, 2007 Report Share Posted July 26, 2007 Nisargadatta , " tom " <jeusisbuen wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " dennis_travis33 " > <dennis_travis33@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " tom " <jeusisbuen@> wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " bindu " <binduau@> wrote: > > > > > > > > How to Stabilize in the Self.... > > > > > > > > Who will stabilize where? Since you don't exist > > > > and only the Self exists, it is the identification with the > body > > > as > > > > Self that precludes remaining in The Self. So then practice > > > > deliberate identification with the Self " AS " Self. After a > while > > > this > > > > practice will become sublimated and the mind will > automatically > > > > identify only with the Self " AS " Self. > > > > > > > > Since it is not the Jiva who wields the Will in the Mind (due > to > > > the > > > > Ichha-Sakti) > > > > then to let go of the Will means to deliberately identify with > > the > > > > Self " AS " Self. > > > > > > > > This does not mean to say that the Jiva is identifying with > The > > > > Self " AS " itself, (assuming ownership of this act) because the > > > Human > > > > Will is empowered by the Ichha-Sakti. The mistake is that the > > > > reflection of the creative act (The Will-in-action) in the > > > conscious > > > > (or psychic) space of The Self, is taken to be the real > reality. > > > > > > > > The understanding that the Jiva is NOT the doer is > indispensible > > > > here. i.e. in this case the Jiva is not the thinker, nor is > the > > > Jiva > > > > the one who visualizes any action or proposed action. i.e all > > > > volitional action manifests in the mind as a visualized event > > > > previous to action being taken, by the Jiva, mind or body. > > > > > > > > The question is Who is visualizing what in where? Who is > thinking > > > in > > > > ALL minds? Who is cognizing, experiencing or knowing what > where? > > > IN > > > > short what is known by Whom? > > > > > > > > Nothing is known by Jiva about the Self. Nothing can be > reported > > > by > > > > the mind about the Self. because the mind becomes whatever > > thought > > > > arises (i.e mind appears " AS " that arisen thought; hence the > > > mind's > > > > transcendence lies in recognizing the MIND IS Thought itself; > > i.e. > > > it > > > > is the consciousness. While the conscious Self. is beyond the > > > Mind, > > > > it is beyond its attribute yet is the Only knower of its OWN > > > content. > > > > > > > > The content of the Conscious-Self is the consciousness, it is > > > > existence itself. > > > > The Self Shines " AS " existence. Thus it is experiencing itself > > > > thru " ALL minds no matter how advanced, primitive or god- like. > > > There > > > > is thus no final Self at all He " The Self " is as the > Vaisnava's > > > say > > > > self-transcendant, and is said to abide is his transcendental > > > abode. > > > > That transcendental abode has been imagined by countless > people > > > over > > > > countless centuries to resembel such and such and contain such > > and > > > > such etc.. but these are merely imaginary. > > > > > > > > However He (The Self) enjoys all moodes of His own > consciousness > > > and > > > > is free in all modes (just as is said in Siva Sutra) and is > not > > > bound > > > > by any mode hence once established in the Self by constant > > > > contemplation upon the Self " AS " Self the indwelling Will (the > > > > presence of God\Siva\Self) in us re-cognizes who HE IS! > > > > > > > > > > > > He is Self-realized the JIva does not and cannot realize Him, > > but > > > > after realization the mind is used for practical purposes but > it > > > can > > > > no longer bind that free one as HE has found himself ! > > > > > > > > Om Tat Sat! > > > > > > > > With love and respect > > > > > > > > binduji > > > > > > > Can it be said that there is no need to stabilize what is > already > > > stable?I take it you are saying something like that.Thinking > that > > > one needs to stabilize something is a great source of misery. No? > > > > > > > > many things to stabilize.... > > every moment of life.... > > > > just like " you " need to stabilize " your " imaginary being.... > > > > every night.... > > > > during nice dreams....and > > > > deep sleep.... > > > > > > Marc > > > > > > ps: often it's better to stabilize the mind.....with simply > > sleeping.....enough sleep... > > > > instead to keep the mind busy busy busy.... > > > > with endless (spiritual) talk and talk....and talk.... > > > > of > > > > no meaning > > > > at all > > > > > > >If something needs to be stabilized, I hope it doesn't hold its' > breath until " I " stabilize it. the cat catched the mouse.... in an extremely fast reaction.... ....yeah.... the cat had no time to stabilize " something " ....before..... .... Marc > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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