Guest guest Posted November 25, 2007 Report Share Posted November 25, 2007 Is there in life an experience that can be pointed at and designated by the words Absolute Consciousness? The mystical legacy and the spiritual heritage say there is. Could it be that all what man calls mystical or spiritual or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline or anything similar producing altered states of consciousness -from the one now. Just asking. v h Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2007 Report Share Posted November 25, 2007 Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred wrote: > > Is there in life an experience that can be > > pointed at and designated by the words > > Absolute Consciousness? > > The mystical legacy > > and the spiritual heritage say there is. > > Could it be that all what man calls mystical or spiritual > > or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline > > or anything similar producing altered states > > of consciousness -from the one now. > > Just asking. > > v h if there is 'experiencing'.. there is an 'experiencer' and some 'other-than-experiencer'... which is the 'experience' being 'experienced' by the 'experiencer' that is making a trinity out of THAT which is ONE. some religions do this too, but this is........ NOT........ ABSOLUTE CONSCIOUSNESS. YOU already and fundamentally ARE THAT. but not when 'you' are there. at the quantum moment of emergent 'me'.. there arises the entire WORLD OF 'me'.. self-creating phantasmagoria will-o'-the wisp whispers.... coming from and going to nowhere. omni spatial. omni temporal. without REALITY. without GROUND or ROOTING. 'THAT' abides without thought, care, correlation, need, 'doing'. when it comes to mescaline, LSD etc. remember this. when those dreams turn to dust.. it's time to vacuum. ..b b.b. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2007 Report Share Posted November 25, 2007 Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred wrote: > > Is there in life an experience that can be > > pointed at and designated by the words > > Absolute Consciousness? No, there isn't ! Consciousness is its content which means there exists no " pure " or " absolute " consciousness separately from its content. Consciousness is memory which is a prouduct of the brain. Consciousnes is the past. What we realize as " Now " already is the past. All your ideas about absolute consciousness etc, are just sitting in your mind and are the ideas of a romantic day-dreamer called Virgil. Werner > > The mystical legacy > > and the spiritual heritage say there is. > > Could it be that all what man calls mystical or spiritual > > or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline > > or anything similar producing altered states > > of consciousness -from the one now. > > Just asking. > > v h > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2007 Report Share Posted November 25, 2007 Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred@> wrote: > > > > Is there in life an experience that can be > > > > pointed at and designated by the words > > > > Absolute Consciousness? > > > No, there isn't ! > > Consciousness is its content which means there exists no " pure " or > " absolute " consciousness separately from its content. > > Consciousness is memory which is a prouduct of the brain. Consciousnes > is the past. What we realize as " Now " already is the past. > > All your ideas about absolute consciousness etc, are just sitting in > your mind and are the ideas of a romantic day-dreamer called Virgil. > > Werner no! you are WRONG! on so many levels and in so many ways.. that it makes no sense at all to discuss it with you. you are so fundamentally screwed up in your understandings.. of science and spirituality! what an embarrassment you must be to your family. but nobody cares anyway. so all is well. you go right ahead with your soap opera mentality. but if you hear snickering...don't be surprised. ..b b.b. *********nnb***************nnb***************nnb****************nnb*** > > The mystical legacy > > > > and the spiritual heritage say there is. > > > > Could it be that all what man calls mystical or spiritual > > > > or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline > > > > or anything similar producing altered states > > > > of consciousness -from the one now. > > > > Just asking. > > > > v h > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2007 Report Share Posted November 25, 2007 Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 " <Roberibus111 wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred@> wrote: > > > > Is there in life an experience that can be > > > > pointed at and designated by the words > > > > Absolute Consciousness? > > > > The mystical legacy > > > > and the spiritual heritage say there is. > > > > Could it be that all what man calls mystical or spiritual > > > > or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline > > > > or anything similar producing altered states > > > > of consciousness -from the one now. > > > > Just asking. > > > > v h > > > if there is 'experiencing'.. > > there is an 'experiencer' and some 'other-than-experiencer'... > > which is the 'experience' being 'experienced' by the 'experiencer' > > that is making a trinity out of THAT which is ONE. > > some religions do this too, > > but this is........ NOT........ ABSOLUTE CONSCIOUSNESS. > > YOU already and fundamentally ARE THAT. > > but not when 'you' are there. > > at the quantum moment of emergent 'me'.. > > there arises the entire WORLD OF 'me'.. > > self-creating phantasmagoria will-o'-the wisp whispers.... > > coming from and going to nowhere. > > omni spatial. > > omni temporal. > > without REALITY. > > without GROUND or ROOTING. > > 'THAT' abides without thought, care, correlation, need, 'doing'. > > when it comes to mescaline, LSD etc. > > remember this. > > when those dreams turn to dust.. > > it's time to vacuum. > > .b b.b. > Could there be an experience in life without this me? If there is no such experience then all metaphysics, mystical and spiritual is nonsense. If there is, then it has to be searched for. v h Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2007 Report Share Posted November 25, 2007 Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred@> wrote: > > > > Is there in life an experience that can be > > > > pointed at and designated by the words > > > > Absolute Consciousness? > > > No, there isn't ! > > Consciousness is its content which means there exists no " pure " or > " absolute " consciousness separately from its content. > > Consciousness is memory which is a prouduct of the brain. Consciousnes > is the past. What we realize as " Now " already is the past. > > All your ideas about absolute consciousness etc, are just sitting in > your mind and are the ideas of a romantic day-dreamer called Virgil. > > Werner > > > > > > The mystical legacy > > > > and the spiritual heritage say there is. > > > > Could it be that all what man calls mystical or spiritual > > > > or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline > > > > or anything similar producing altered states > > > > of consciousness -from the one now. > > > > Just asking. > > > > v h > > > No Consciousness is not memory. Memory is a thought, how can a thought recall a thought? v h Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2007 Report Share Posted November 25, 2007 Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr@> > wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred@> wrote: > > > > > > Is there in life an experience that can be > > > > > > pointed at and designated by the words > > > > > > Absolute Consciousness? > > > > > > No, there isn't ! > > > > Consciousness is its content which means there exists no " pure " or > > " absolute " consciousness separately from its content. > > > > Consciousness is memory which is a prouduct of the brain. > Consciousnes > > is the past. What we realize as " Now " already is the past. > > > > All your ideas about absolute consciousness etc, are just sitting > in > > your mind and are the ideas of a romantic day-dreamer called > Virgil. > > > > Werner > > > > > > > > > > The mystical legacy > > > > > > and the spiritual heritage say there is. > > > > > > Could it be that all what man calls mystical or spiritual > > > > > > or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline > > > > > > or anything similar producing altered states > > > > > > of consciousness -from the one now. > > > > > > Just asking. > > > > > > v h > > > > > > > No Consciousness is not memory. > > > Memory is a thought, how can a thought recall a thought? > > v h > Sorry, Virgil, Ever before have heard of STM, Short Term Memoty ? Here is what neuroscience is telling about it: STM, also known as 'working memory' is memory AND consciousness. Every sensory input is transported after 100 msec into the STM where it stays for for 2 to 5 seconds and then gets shifted into LTM, Long Term Memory. The STM is a memory where the recognition of sensory input is processed and which is firing neurons and creates consciousness. It is both memory and consciousness. Because consciousness is memory you are able watch tv or movvies and not just seeing single frames or you can listen to music and remembering tunes which you heard before at the ame time. I know that it is not very romantic for you and I can imagine that you hate to say good bye to all that spiritual nonsense in your head dealing with consciousness. Just google about neuroscience, consciousness, STM, Working Memory, LTM, Sensory Memory, instead of just saying No and protesting and throwing temper tantrums like some people here on this list do. Good bye Santa Claus and Easter Bunny Werner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2007 Report Share Posted November 25, 2007 Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred wrote: > > Is there in life an experience that can be > > pointed at and designated by the words > > Absolute Consciousness? > > The mystical legacy > > and the spiritual heritage say there is. > > Could it be that all what man calls mystical or spiritual > > or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline > > or anything similar producing altered states > > of consciousness -from the one now. > > Just asking. > > v h > Why are you interested in states other than the state you are in right now?All states are one state in that all states are modes of consciousness whose ground , in turn, is pure being. Z Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2007 Report Share Posted November 25, 2007 Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr@> > > wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Is there in life an experience that can be > > > > > > > > pointed at and designated by the words > > > > > > > > Absolute Consciousness? > > > > > > > > > No, there isn't ! > > > > > > Consciousness is its content which means there exists no " pure " or > > > " absolute " consciousness separately from its content. > > > > > > Consciousness is memory which is a prouduct of the brain. > > Consciousnes > > > is the past. What we realize as " Now " already is the past. > > > > > > All your ideas about absolute consciousness etc, are just sitting > > in > > > your mind and are the ideas of a romantic day-dreamer called > > Virgil. > > > > > > Werner > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The mystical legacy > > > > > > > > and the spiritual heritage say there is. > > > > > > > > Could it be that all what man calls mystical or spiritual > > > > > > > > or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline > > > > > > > > or anything similar producing altered states > > > > > > > > of consciousness -from the one now. > > > > > > > > Just asking. > > > > > > > > v h > > > > > > > > > > > No Consciousness is not memory. > > > > > > Memory is a thought, how can a thought recall a thought? > > > > v h > > > > > Sorry, Virgil, > > Ever before have heard of STM, Short Term Memoty ? > > Here is what neuroscience is telling about it: > > STM, also known as 'working memory' is memory AND consciousness. > Every sensory input is transported after 100 msec into the STM where > it stays for for 2 to 5 seconds and then gets shifted into LTM, Long > Term Memory. > > The STM is a memory where the recognition of sensory input is > processed and which is firing neurons and creates consciousness. It > is both memory and consciousness. > > Because consciousness is memory you are able watch tv or movvies and > not just seeing single frames or you can listen to music and > remembering tunes which you heard before at the ame time. > > I know that it is not very romantic for you and I can imagine that > you hate to say good bye to all that spiritual nonsense in your head > dealing with consciousness. > > Just google about neuroscience, consciousness, STM, Working Memory, > LTM, Sensory Memory, instead of just saying No and protesting and > throwing temper tantrums like some people here on this list do. > > Good bye Santa Claus and Easter Bunny > > Werner you believe all that shit because you think it's 'big stuff'! ha ha haaaaaaaaa! from your writing i can only assume that you get your info.. from the readers digest 'ideas from science'... 'psychology for dummies'.. and..... 'stuff i want to be when i grow up'. it's ludicrous actually. any real scientist would laugh his head off at this childish shit. you should talk about things you have some idea about. how about cartoons? LOL! ..b b.b. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2007 Report Share Posted November 25, 2007 Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 " > <Roberibus111@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred@> wrote: > > > > > > Is there in life an experience that can be > > > > > > pointed at and designated by the words > > > > > > Absolute Consciousness? > > > > > > The mystical legacy > > > > > > and the spiritual heritage say there is. > > > > > > Could it be that all what man calls mystical or spiritual > > > > > > or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline > > > > > > or anything similar producing altered states > > > > > > of consciousness -from the one now. > > > > > > Just asking. > > > > > > v h > > > > > > if there is 'experiencing'.. > > > > there is an 'experiencer' and some 'other-than-experiencer'... > > > > which is the 'experience' being 'experienced' by the 'experiencer' > > > > that is making a trinity out of THAT which is ONE. > > > > some religions do this too, > > > > but this is........ NOT........ ABSOLUTE CONSCIOUSNESS. > > > > YOU already and fundamentally ARE THAT. > > > > but not when 'you' are there. > > > > at the quantum moment of emergent 'me'.. > > > > there arises the entire WORLD OF 'me'.. > > > > self-creating phantasmagoria will-o'-the wisp whispers.... > > > > coming from and going to nowhere. > > > > omni spatial. > > > > omni temporal. > > > > without REALITY. > > > > without GROUND or ROOTING. > > > > 'THAT' abides without thought, care, correlation, need, 'doing'. > > > > when it comes to mescaline, LSD etc. > > > > remember this. > > > > when those dreams turn to dust.. > > > > it's time to vacuum. > > > > .b b.b. > > > > > Could there be an experience in life > > without this me? > > If there is no such experience > > then all metaphysics, mystical and > > spiritual is nonsense. > > If there is, then it has to be searched for. > > v h you're right. everything is nonsense. and talking about nonsense is just bullshit. there is no one to search for an 'experience without me'. from the very first only 'no-self' prevails. it IS VASTNESS. all else is bunkum. ..b b.b. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2007 Report Share Posted November 25, 2007 Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " Werner Woehr " <wwoehr@> > > wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Is there in life an experience that can be > > > > > > > > pointed at and designated by the words > > > > > > > > Absolute Consciousness? > > > > > > > > > No, there isn't ! > > > > > > Consciousness is its content which means there exists no " pure " or > > > " absolute " consciousness separately from its content. > > > > > > Consciousness is memory which is a prouduct of the brain. > > Consciousnes > > > is the past. What we realize as " Now " already is the past. > > > > > > All your ideas about absolute consciousness etc, are just sitting > > in > > > your mind and are the ideas of a romantic day-dreamer called > > Virgil. > > > > > > Werner > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The mystical legacy > > > > > > > > and the spiritual heritage say there is. > > > > > > > > Could it be that all what man calls mystical or spiritual > > > > > > > > or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline > > > > > > > > or anything similar producing altered states > > > > > > > > of consciousness -from the one now. > > > > > > > > Just asking. > > > > > > > > v h > > > > > > > > > > > No Consciousness is not memory. > > > > > > Memory is a thought, how can a thought recall a thought? > > > > v h > > > > > Sorry, Virgil, > > Ever before have heard of STM, Short Term Memoty ? > > Here is what neuroscience is telling about it: > > STM, also known as 'working memory' is memory AND consciousness. > Every sensory input is transported after 100 msec into the STM where > it stays for for 2 to 5 seconds and then gets shifted into LTM, Long > Term Memory. > > The STM is a memory where the recognition of sensory input is > processed and which is firing neurons and creates consciousness. It > is both memory and consciousness. > > Because consciousness is memory you are able watch tv or movvies and > not just seeing single frames or you can listen to music and > remembering tunes which you heard before at the ame time. > > I know that it is not very romantic for you and I can imagine that > you hate to say good bye to all that spiritual nonsense in your head > dealing with consciousness. > > Just google about neuroscience, consciousness, STM, Working Memory, > LTM, Sensory Memory, instead of just saying No and protesting and > throwing temper tantrums like some people here on this list do. > > Good bye Santa Claus and Easter Bunny > > Werner > Do you still believe in science werner at your age? To be glamourized and impressed by science is for the teenagers, who still want to become. An interpretation that we call science! An explanation to life! Who cares, how a frog sees . Do you remember the story of the centipede when asked how you can walk with so many legs? when it looked for an explantion in its head, it could not move an inch. So now, this forum has changed into the Mayo clinic or MIT. v h Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2007 Report Share Posted November 25, 2007 Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 " <Roberibus111 wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " roberibus111 " > > <Roberibus111@> wrote: > > > > > > Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Is there in life an experience that can be > > > > > > > > pointed at and designated by the words > > > > > > > > Absolute Consciousness? > > > > > > > > The mystical legacy > > > > > > > > and the spiritual heritage say there is. > > > > > > > > Could it be that all what man calls mystical or spiritual > > > > > > > > or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline > > > > > > > > or anything similar producing altered states > > > > > > > > of consciousness -from the one now. > > > > > > > > Just asking. > > > > > > > > v h > > > > > > > > > if there is 'experiencing'.. > > > > > > there is an 'experiencer' and some 'other-than-experiencer'... > > > > > > which is the 'experience' being 'experienced' by the 'experiencer' > > > > > > that is making a trinity out of THAT which is ONE. > > > > > > some religions do this too, > > > > > > but this is........ NOT........ ABSOLUTE CONSCIOUSNESS. > > > > > > YOU already and fundamentally ARE THAT. > > > > > > but not when 'you' are there. > > > > > > at the quantum moment of emergent 'me'.. > > > > > > there arises the entire WORLD OF 'me'.. > > > > > > self-creating phantasmagoria will-o'-the wisp whispers.... > > > > > > coming from and going to nowhere. > > > > > > omni spatial. > > > > > > omni temporal. > > > > > > without REALITY. > > > > > > without GROUND or ROOTING. > > > > > > 'THAT' abides without thought, care, correlation, need, 'doing'. > > > > > > when it comes to mescaline, LSD etc. > > > > > > remember this. > > > > > > when those dreams turn to dust.. > > > > > > it's time to vacuum. > > > > > > .b b.b. > > > > > > > > > Could there be an experience in life > > > > without this me? > > > > If there is no such experience > > > > then all metaphysics, mystical and > > > > spiritual is nonsense. > > > > If there is, then it has to be searched for. > > > > v h > > > you're right. > > everything is nonsense. > > and talking about nonsense is just bullshit. > > there is no one to search for an 'experience without me'. > > from the very first only 'no-self' prevails. > > it IS VASTNESS. > > all else is bunkum. > > .b b.b. > Bunkum is a nice word from Buncombe county, N C v h Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2007 Report Share Posted November 25, 2007 Nisargadatta , " tom " <jeusisbuen wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred@> wrote: > > > > Is there in life an experience that can be > > > > pointed at and designated by the words > > > > Absolute Consciousness? > > > > The mystical legacy > > > > and the spiritual heritage say there is. > > > > Could it be that all what man calls mystical or spiritual > > > > or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline > > > > or anything similar producing altered states > > > > of consciousness -from the one now. > > > > Just asking. > > > > v h > > > Why are you interested in states other than the state you are in > right now?All states are one state in that all states are modes of > consciousness whose ground , in turn, is pure being. Z > As I said just asking. v h Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2007 Report Share Posted November 25, 2007 > > > > Sorry, Virgil, > > > > Ever before have heard of STM, Short Term Memoty ? > > > > Here is what neuroscience is telling about it: > > > > STM, also known as 'working memory' is memory AND consciousness. > > Every sensory input is transported after 100 msec into the STM where > > it stays for for 2 to 5 seconds and then gets shifted into LTM, Long > > Term Memory. > > > > The STM is a memory where the recognition of sensory input is > > processed and which is firing neurons and creates consciousness. It > > is both memory and consciousness. > > > > Because consciousness is memory you are able watch tv or movvies and > > not just seeing single frames or you can listen to music and > > remembering tunes which you heard before at the ame time. > > > > I know that it is not very romantic for you and I can imagine that > > you hate to say good bye to all that spiritual nonsense in your head > > dealing with consciousness. > > > > Just google about neuroscience, consciousness, STM, Working Memory, > > LTM, Sensory Memory, instead of just saying No and protesting and > > throwing temper tantrums like some people here on this list do. > > > > Good bye Santa Claus and Easter Bunny > > > > Werner > > > Werner: your description of how " consciousness " : works is just another story floating around in consciousness.In Awareness. Just another bunch of ideas that got to big for its' britches and is now saying to conscousness--in which it is floating like a minnow in the Pacific Ocean-- " Hey, guy!, you're not so friggin big after all! " Z > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 25, 2007 Report Share Posted November 25, 2007 Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred wrote: > > Is there in life an experience that can be > > pointed at and designated by the words > > Absolute Consciousness? > > The mystical legacy > > and the spiritual heritage say there is. > > Could it be that all what man calls mystical or spiritual > > or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline > > or anything similar producing altered states > > of consciousness -from the one now. > > Just asking. > > v h > yes there is. it is this moment. did you happen to notice the word " absolute " in your question? what moment is not absolute. and more to the point why do your waste your time trying to understand? Joe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 26, 2007 Report Share Posted November 26, 2007 Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred wrote: > > Is there in life an experience that can be > > pointed at and designated by the words > > Absolute Consciousness? > > The mystical legacy > > and the spiritual heritage say there is. > > Could it be that all what man calls mystical or spiritual > > or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline > > or anything similar producing altered states > > of consciousness -from the one now. > > Just asking. *************************************** Virgil, Interesting question. First, I suspect there was some misinterpretation of the word " consciousness. " For example, Werner's reply appeared to be eluding to the psychological interpretation as in terms commonly called " conscious " and " subconscious " mind and not from the context of Totality... the realm of the spirit. If that's the case, his explanation was proper within the context of psychological science. On the other hand, because you use terms like " mystical legacy " and " spiritual heritage " ... I logically presume that you are referring to the realm of the Spirit... not the psychological workings of the so-called mind. With that in 'mind', I proceed to address your initial question: Is there in life an experience that can be pointed at and designated by the words Absolute Consciousness? In the context of 'human' life... all experiences are just that... experiences. In the context of Totality... Absolute Consciousness... what you Truly are is the " Experiencing. " However, because of the linear world of duality where we appear to " exist " ... the human so-called mind cannot transcend itself to experience the " Experiencing. " Were it to do so... it would cease to exist... would it not? Then you ask... " Could it be that all what man calls mystical or spiritual or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline or anything similar producing altered states of consciousness - from the one now. " Perhaps if one understands the cognitive psychology of " conditioned minds " (and every human mind is " conditioned " )... it becomes easier to rationalize that so-called mystical experiences or spiritual experiences or all the stuff associated with the metaphysical... are ALL " conceptual " ideations, mentations etc. One does not need to resort to chemical substances in order to create an altered so-called " state of mind " to vividly imagine having a mystical or spiritual experience. If mescaline... or perhaps Vodka... is handy... it might enhance the imagination. Suffice to say... ALL such experiences are ONLY that... human experiences... for which the human is designed. As one named Adyashanti says... God knows Itself through the experience of being human. Maybe so. In any event, a little bit of introspection and/or contemplation reveals the false as false... meaning that ALL so-called experiences... mystical, spiritual or what have you, are without substance... therefore have no basis in TRUTH. There... you see... in one fell swoop... you can render them all totally irrelevant. Yet... if one is awake... and aware... the perception of a mystical or spiritual experience can be a profound event (since nothing is outside the Mind of God) in that it could serve as a brilliant light (Grace) spontaneously revealing the TRUTH!!! And that... is quite a shocking experience! Enjoy yourself as God Does. Nameste Bob C. Fillmore, CA, USA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 26, 2007 Report Share Posted November 26, 2007 Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred wrote: > > Is there in life an experience that can be > > pointed at and designated by the words > > Absolute Consciousness? > > The mystical legacy > > and the spiritual heritage say there is. > > Could it be that all what man calls mystical or spiritual > > or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline > > or anything similar producing altered states > > of consciousness -from the one now. > > Just asking. > > v h whatever " absolut consciousness " you have in mind.... because of some reason..... It is existing often, people who think that It only need little drugs.....are like people who are waiting on the platform for the train......which has already gone....since long time so...the longer they are waiting....the longer the train has already gone.... Marc Ps: they will arrive.....later......that's all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 26, 2007 Report Share Posted November 26, 2007 Nisargadatta , " Bob " <rgcbob wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred@> wrote: > > > > Is there in life an experience that can be > > > > pointed at and designated by the words > > > > Absolute Consciousness? > > > > The mystical legacy > > > > and the spiritual heritage say there is. > > > > Could it be that all what man calls mystical or spiritual > > > > or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline > > > > or anything similar producing altered states > > > > of consciousness -from the one now. > > > > Just asking. > > *************************************** > > Virgil, > Interesting question. > > First, I suspect there was some misinterpretation of the word > " consciousness. " For example, Werner's reply appeared to be eluding to > the psychological interpretation as in terms commonly called > " conscious " and " subconscious " mind and not from the context of > Totality... the realm of the spirit. If that's the case, his > explanation was proper within the context of psychological science. > > On the other hand, because you use terms like " mystical legacy " and > " spiritual heritage " ... I logically presume that you are referring to > the realm of the Spirit... not the psychological workings of the > so-called mind. With that in 'mind', I proceed to address your initial > question: Is there in life an experience that can be pointed at and > designated by the words Absolute Consciousness? > > In the context of 'human' life... all experiences are just that... > experiences. In the context of Totality... Absolute Consciousness... > what you Truly are is the " Experiencing. " However, because of the > linear world of duality where we appear to " exist " ... the human > so-called mind cannot transcend itself to experience the > " Experiencing. " Were it to do so... it would cease to exist... would > it not? > > Then you ask... " Could it be that all what man calls mystical or > spiritual or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline or > anything similar producing altered states of consciousness - from the > one now. " Perhaps if one understands the cognitive psychology of > " conditioned minds " (and every human mind is " conditioned " )... it > becomes easier to rationalize that so-called mystical experiences or > spiritual experiences or all the stuff associated with the > metaphysical... are ALL " conceptual " ideations, mentations etc. One > does not need to resort to chemical substances in order to create an > altered so-called " state of mind " to vividly imagine having a mystical > or spiritual experience. If mescaline... or perhaps Vodka... is > handy... it might enhance the imagination. Suffice to say... ALL such > experiences are ONLY that... human experiences... for which the human > is designed. As one named Adyashanti says... God knows Itself through > the experience of being human. Maybe so. In any event, a little bit of > introspection and/or contemplation reveals the false as false... > meaning that ALL so-called experiences... mystical, spiritual or what > have you, are without substance... therefore have no basis in TRUTH. > There... you see... in one fell swoop... you can render them all > totally irrelevant. > > Yet... if one is awake... and aware... the perception of a mystical or > spiritual experience can be a profound event (since nothing is outside > the Mind of God) in that it could serve as a brilliant light (Grace) > spontaneously revealing the TRUTH!!! And that... is quite a shocking > experience! > > Enjoy yourself as God Does. > > Nameste > Bob C. > Fillmore, CA, USA > There is a book that I had enjoyed reading years ago. The booh was written by the late D.T.Suzuki with the title the " zen doctorine of no mind " No mind, No ego, or No self, this is the Experience mysticism, zen, advita...etc. is all about. When egolessness was mentioned to werner, he answered that an egoless man will be put in a mental institution??? Moreover, the saying about the child being in the Kingdom said by Jesus, was also refused on the basis that Jesus never existed. To go back to the original question; does the Experience of pure consciousness is experienced in man's life? Could you point out an experience that could fit the charecteristics of absolute consciousness in man's life? I remember a book called non-volitional living by wei wu wei speaking about it. Could there exist an ego without volition? or ego is volition? All sages speak of surrender; surrender what? Could it be this volition that has to be surrendered? just thinking! v h Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 26, 2007 Report Share Posted November 26, 2007 Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " Bob " <rgcbob@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " Virgil " <v.halbred@> wrote: > > > > > > Is there in life an experience that can be > > > > > > pointed at and designated by the words > > > > > > Absolute Consciousness? > > > > > > The mystical legacy > > > > > > and the spiritual heritage say there is. > > > > > > Could it be that all what man calls mystical or spiritual > > > > > > or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline > > > > > > or anything similar producing altered states > > > > > > of consciousness -from the one now. > > > > > > Just asking. > > > > *************************************** > > > > Virgil, > > Interesting question. > > > > First, I suspect there was some misinterpretation of the word > > " consciousness. " For example, Werner's reply appeared to be > eluding to > > the psychological interpretation as in terms commonly called > > " conscious " and " subconscious " mind and not from the context of > > Totality... the realm of the spirit. If that's the case, his > > explanation was proper within the context of psychological science. > > > > On the other hand, because you use terms like " mystical legacy " and > > " spiritual heritage " ... I logically presume that you are referring > to > > the realm of the Spirit... not the psychological workings of the > > so-called mind. With that in 'mind', I proceed to address your > initial > > question: Is there in life an experience that can be pointed at and > > designated by the words Absolute Consciousness? > > > > In the context of 'human' life... all experiences are just that... > > experiences. In the context of Totality... Absolute > Consciousness... > > what you Truly are is the " Experiencing. " However, because of the > > linear world of duality where we appear to " exist " ... the human > > so-called mind cannot transcend itself to experience the > > " Experiencing. " Were it to do so... it would cease to exist... > would > > it not? > > > > Then you ask... " Could it be that all what man calls mystical or > > spiritual or metaphysical is simply the effect of mescaline or > > anything similar producing altered states of consciousness - from > the > > one now. " Perhaps if one understands the cognitive psychology of > > " conditioned minds " (and every human mind is " conditioned " )... it > > becomes easier to rationalize that so-called mystical experiences > or > > spiritual experiences or all the stuff associated with the > > metaphysical... are ALL " conceptual " ideations, mentations etc. One > > does not need to resort to chemical substances in order to create > an > > altered so-called " state of mind " to vividly imagine having a > mystical > > or spiritual experience. If mescaline... or perhaps Vodka... is > > handy... it might enhance the imagination. Suffice to say... ALL > such > > experiences are ONLY that... human experiences... for which the > human > > is designed. As one named Adyashanti says... God knows Itself > through > > the experience of being human. Maybe so. In any event, a little > bit of > > introspection and/or contemplation reveals the false as false... > > meaning that ALL so-called experiences... mystical, spiritual or > what > > have you, are without substance... therefore have no basis in > TRUTH. > > There... you see... in one fell swoop... you can render them all > > totally irrelevant. > > > > Yet... if one is awake... and aware... the perception of a > mystical or > > spiritual experience can be a profound event (since nothing is > outside > > the Mind of God) in that it could serve as a brilliant light > (Grace) > > spontaneously revealing the TRUTH!!! And that... is quite a > shocking > > experience! > > > > Enjoy yourself as God Does. > > > > Nameste > > Bob C. > > Fillmore, CA, USA > > > > > There is a book that I had enjoyed reading > > years ago. The booh was written by the late D.T.Suzuki > > with the title the " zen doctorine of no mind " > > No mind, No ego, or No self, this is the > > Experience mysticism, zen, advita...etc. > > is all about. > > When egolessness was mentioned to werner, he answered > > that an egoless man will be put in a mental institution??? > > Moreover, the saying about the child being in the Kingdom > > said by Jesus, was also refused on the basis that Jesus > > never existed. > > To go back to the original question; does the Experience > > of pure consciousness is experienced in man's life? > > Could you point out an experience that could fit > > the charecteristics of absolute consciousness in > > man's life? > > I remember a book called non-volitional living > > by wei wu wei speaking about it. > > Could there exist an ego without volition? or ego is > > volition? > > All sages speak of surrender; surrender what? > > Could it be this volition that has to be surrendered? > > just thinking! > > v h the Experience of pure consciousness is not experienced in man's life..it is the other way around... you experience the life of man, in the Experience of pure consciousness... when you surrender everything that you take yourself to be... including the volition to surrender... then that surrender will show you who you really are... and what you never was... dont hold on to nothing...even the idea of surrender you must surrender so to speak... ....iietsa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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