Guest guest Posted April 8, 2008 Report Share Posted April 8, 2008 Yes indeedy. A bit of garbage collection is always in order. Phil "Pain and suffering are only the body and mind screaming forattention. To go beyond the body you must be healthy; to go beyondthe mind, you must have your mind in perfect order. You cannot leavea mess behind and go beyond. The mess will bog you up. 'Pick up yourrubbish' seems the universal law. And a just law, too." NizPlanning your summer road trip? Check out AOL Travel Guides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 8, 2008 Report Share Posted April 8, 2008 Nisargadatta , souldreamone wrote: > > > Yes indeedy. A bit of garbage collection is always in order. > Phil > > > " Pain and suffering are only the body and mind screaming for > attention. To go beyond the body you must be healthy; to go beyond > the mind, you must have your mind in perfect order. You cannot leave > a mess behind and go beyond. The mess will bog you up. 'Pick up your > rubbish' seems the universal law. And a just law, too. " > > > > Niz first you quote wayne liqerman with...humans that exist...go away come back and get over... then you quote niz with...beyond it all together... it seems that your understanding is colored... ....iietsa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 8, 2008 Report Share Posted April 8, 2008 In a message dated 4/8/2008 12:09:13 AM Pacific Daylight Time, iietsa writes: Nisargadatta , souldreamone wrote:>> > Yes indeedy. A bit of garbage collection is always in order.> Phil> > > "Pain and suffering are only the body and mind screaming for> attention. To go beyond the body you must be healthy; to go beyond> the mind, you must have your mind in perfect order. You cannot leave> a mess behind and go beyond. The mess will bog you up. 'Pick up your> rubbish' seems the universal law. And a just law, too."> > > > Nizfirst you quote wayne liqerman with...humans that exist...go away come back and get over...then you quote niz with...beyond it all together...it seems that your understanding is colored......iietsa I'm sure that it is, but Wayne never said the human exists as an independent being, and it wasn't my intention to say that either. What he was trying to say is, begin where you are. You believe yourself to be a human or you would not be here, so what sense does it make to quote nondual concepts that you don't exist? This obstructs the seeing of what is so on a deeper level. From a little larger perspective, it's silly for folks to run around saying 'I don't exist'. The concepts change nothing at all. You DO exist, it's just that you're not what You think You are. What's wrong with getting real and saying 'As delusional as it may be, this is how I see myself right now, as a separate human being, and I want to see the Truth of the matter even if it kills me, which apparently it will.' That's honest, it's an integrous approach to seeing the Truth by humbly beginning with the truth. Adding delusion to delusion is not a movement toward Truth. Phil Planning your summer road trip? Check out AOL Travel Guides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Nisargadatta , souldreamone wrote: > > > In a message dated 4/8/2008 12:09:13 AM Pacific Daylight Time, > iietsa writes: > > Nisargadatta , souldreamone@ wrote: > > > > > > Yes indeedy. A bit of garbage collection is always in order. > > Phil > > > > > > " Pain and suffering are only the body and mind screaming for > > attention. To go beyond the body you must be healthy; to go beyond > > the mind, you must have your mind in perfect order. You cannot leave > > a mess behind and go beyond. The mess will bog you up. 'Pick up > your > > rubbish' seems the universal law. And a just law, too. " > > > > > > > > Niz > > first you quote wayne liqerman with...humans that exist...go away come > back and get over... > then you quote niz with...beyond it all together... > it seems that your understanding is colored... > ...iietsa > > > > I'm sure that it is, but Wayne never said the human exists as an independent > being, and it wasn't my intention to say that either. What he was trying to > say is, begin where you are. You believe yourself to be a human or you would > not be here, so what sense does it make to quote nondual concepts that you > don't exist? This obstructs the seeing of what is so on a deeper level. From a > little larger perspective, it's silly for folks to run around saying 'I don't > exist'. The concepts change nothing at all. You DO exist, it's just that > you're not what You think You are. What's wrong with getting real and saying 'As > delusional as it may be, this is how I see myself right now, as a separate > human being, and I want to see the Truth of the matter even if it kills me, > which apparently it will.' That's honest, it's an integrous approach to seeing > the Truth by humbly beginning with the truth. Adding delusion to delusion is > not a movement toward Truth. > > Phil > be honest the honest way... and see that what you identify as youself is extra luggage... carry it as you like...or just leave it to itself...and see what happens... ....where is the honesty in identifying oneself with an object ? ....iietsa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 10, 2008 Report Share Posted April 10, 2008 In a message dated 4/9/2008 10:23:40 AM Pacific Daylight Time, iietsa writes: > I'm sure that it is, but Wayne never said the human exists as an independent > being, and it wasn't my intention to say that either. What he was trying to > say is, begin where you are. You believe yourself to be a human or you would > not be here, so what sense does it make to quote nondual concepts that you > don't exist? This obstructs the seeing of what is so on a deeper level. From a > little larger perspective, it's silly for folks to run around saying 'I don't > exist'. The concepts change nothing at all. You DO exist, it's just that > you're not what You think You are. What's wrong with getting real and saying 'As > delusional as it may be, this is how I see myself right now, as a separate > human being, and I want to see the Truth of the matter even if it kills me, > which apparently it will.' That's honest, it's an integrous approach to seeing > the Truth by humbly beginning with the truth. Adding delusion to delusion is > not a movement toward Truth.> > Phil> be honest the honest way...and see that what you identify as youself is extra luggage...carry it as you like...or just leave it to itself...and see what happens......where is the honesty in identifying oneself with an object ?...iietsa Neither of us is identifying ourself with an object. That's a ruse to distract from the point that you identify yourself as an individual. Beyond the concepts of Oneness and Isness and Beingness and Nothingness, that's the truth of the matter; you somehow still seem to be an individual. It's understandable you don't want that to be so, but not wanting it to be doesn't make it go away. What do you KNOW yourself to be? Be honest. Phil Planning your summer road trip? Check out AOL Travel Guides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 10, 2008 Report Share Posted April 10, 2008 In a message dated 4/10/2008 12:40:15 AM Pacific Daylight Time, iietsa writes: > Neither of us is identifying ourself with an object. That's a ruse to > distract from the point that you identify yourself as an individual. Beyond the > concepts of Oneness and Isness and Beingness and Nothingness, that's the truth > of the matter; you somehow still seem to be an individual. It's understandable > you don't want that to be so, but not wanting it to be doesn't make it go > away. What do you KNOW yourself to be? Be honest.> > Phil> it is not that I want to be something, or want to not be something...the personality (iietsa) is there...but I dont give a monkeys ass about that...its not my business...I dont identify with it...it is more like a tool...sometimes its like the hammer...sometimes its like the nail...I am not in the game trying to improve or fix something even if it appears that way...its all taking care of itself...I am what I am prior to all words......iietsa Yes, I think if we poked Marc a little we would find an enlightened person there too. Somehow I always end up the only unenlightened one on these forums. PhilPlanning your summer road trip? Check out AOL Travel Guides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 10, 2008 Report Share Posted April 10, 2008 Nisargadatta , souldreamone wrote: > > > In a message dated 4/9/2008 10:23:40 AM Pacific Daylight Time, > iietsa writes: > > > I'm sure that it is, but Wayne never said the human exists as an > independent > > being, and it wasn't my intention to say that either. What he was > trying to > > say is, begin where you are. You believe yourself to be a human or > you would > > not be here, so what sense does it make to quote nondual concepts > that you > > don't exist? This obstructs the seeing of what is so on a deeper > level. From a > > little larger perspective, it's silly for folks to run around > saying 'I don't > > exist'. The concepts change nothing at all. You DO exist, it's just > that > > you're not what You think You are. What's wrong with getting real > and saying 'As > > delusional as it may be, this is how I see myself right now, as a > separate > > human being, and I want to see the Truth of the matter even if it > kills me, > > which apparently it will.' That's honest, it's an integrous > approach to seeing > > the Truth by humbly beginning with the truth. Adding delusion to > delusion is > > not a movement toward Truth. > > > > Phil > > > > be honest the honest way... > and see that what you identify as youself is extra luggage... > carry it as you like...or just leave it to itself...and see what > happens... > ...where is the honesty in identifying oneself with an object ? > ...iietsa > > > > Neither of us is identifying ourself with an object. That's a ruse to > distract from the point that you identify yourself as an individual. Beyond the > concepts of Oneness and Isness and Beingness and Nothingness, that's the truth > of the matter; you somehow still seem to be an individual. It's understandable > you don't want that to be so, but not wanting it to be doesn't make it go > away. What do you KNOW yourself to be? Be honest. > > Phil > it is not that I want to be something, or want to not be something... the personality (iietsa) is there...but I dont give a monkeys ass about that...its not my business...I dont identify with it...it is more like a tool...sometimes its like the hammer...sometimes its like the nail...I am not in the game trying to improve or fix something even if it appears that way...its all taking care of itself... I am what I am prior to all words... ....iietsa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.