Talks with Ramana Maharshi

[Guest guest]

197. Gul and Shirin Byramjee, two Parsi ladies of

Ahmedabad, arrived this day. They spoke at night to Maharshi:

"Bhagavan! We have been spiritually inclined from our childhood. We

have read several books on philosophy and are attracted by Vedanta. So

we read the Upanishads, Yoga Vasishta, Bhagavad Gita etc. We try to

meditate, but there is no progress in our meditation. We do not

understand how to realise. Can you kindly help us towards realisation?''

 

M.: How do you meditate?

 

D.: I begin to ask myself "Who am I?'', eliminate body as not 'I', the

breath as not 'I', the mind as not 'I' and I am not able to proceed

further.

 

M.: Well, that is so far as the intellect goes. Your process is only

intellectual. Indeed, all the scriptures mention the process only to

guide the seeker to know the Truth. The Truth cannot be directly

pointed out. Hence this intellectual process. You see, the one who

eliminates all the not I cannot eliminate the 'I'. To say 'I am not

this' or 'I am that' there must be the 'I'. This 'I' is only the ego or

the 'I'-thought. After the rising up of this 'I'-thought all other

thoughts arise. The 'I'-thought is therefore the root-thought. If the

root is pulled out all others are at the same time uprooted. Therefore

seek the root 'I', question yourself "Who am I?''; find out its source.

Then all these will vanish and the pure Self will remain ever.

 

D.: How to do it?

 

M.: The 'I' is always there - in deep sleep, in dream and in

wakefulness. The one in sleep is the same as that who now speaks. There

is always the feeling of 'I'. Otherwise do you deny your existence? You

do not. You say 'I am'. Find out who is.

 

D.: Even so, I do not understand. 'I', you say, is the wrong 'I' now. How to eliminate this wrong 'I'?

 

M.: You need not eliminate the wrong 'I'. How can 'I' eliminate itself?

- All that you need do is to find out its origin and abide there. Your

efforts can extend only thus far. Then the Beyond will take care of

itself. You are helpless there. No effort can reach it.

 

D.: If 'I' am always-here and now, why do I not feel so?

 

M.: That is it. Why says it is not felt? Does the real 'I' say it or

the false 'I'? Examine it. You will find it as the wrong 'I'. The wrong

'I' is the obstruction. It has to be removed in order that the true 'I'

may not be hidden. The feeling that I have not realised is the

obstruction to realisation.

In fact it is already realised; there is nothing more to be realised.

Otherwise, the realisation will be new; it has not existed so far, it

must take place hereafter. What is born will also die. If realisation

be not eternal it is not worth having. Therefore what we seek is not

that which must happen afresh. It is only that which is eternal but not

now known due to obstructions; it is that we seek. All that we need do

is to remove the obstruction. That which is eternal is not known to be

so because of ignorance. Ignorance is the obstruction. Get over this

ignorance and all will be well.

The ignorance is identical with the 'I'-thought. Find its source and it will vanish.

The 'I'-thought is like a spirit which, although not palpable, rises up

automatically with the body, flourishes and disappears with it. The

body-consciousness is the wrong 'I'. Give up this body-consciousness.

It is done by seeking the source 'I'. The body does not say 'I am'. It

is you who say, 'I am the body!' Find out who this 'I' is. Seeking its

source it will vanish.

 

D.: Then, will there be bliss?

 

M.: Bliss is coeval with Being-Consciousness. All the arguments

relating to the eternal Being of that Bliss apply to Bliss also. Your

nature is Bliss. Ignorance is not hiding that Bliss. Remove the

ignorance for Bliss to be freed.

 

D.: Should we not find out the ultimate reality of the world, individual and God?

 

M.: These are all conceptions of the 'I'. They arise only after the

advent of the 'I'-thought. Did you think of them in your deep sleep?

You existed in deep sleep and the same you are now speaking. If they be

real should they not be in your sleep also? They are only dependent

upon the 'I'-thought. Again does the world tell you 'I am the world'?

Does the body say 'I am body'? You say, "This is the world'', "this is

body'' and so on. So these are only your conceptions. Find out who you

are and there will be an end of all your doubts.

 

D.: What becomes of the body after realisation? Does it exist or not? We see realised beings acting like others.

 

M.: This question need not arise now. Let it be asked after

realisation, if need be. As for the realised beings let them take care

of themselves. Why do you worry about them?

In fact, after realisation the body and all else will not appear different from the Self.

 

D.: Being always Being-Consciousness-Bliss, why does God place us in difficulties? Why did He create us?

 

M.: Does God come and tell you that He has placed you in difficulties?

It is you who say so. It is again the wrong 'I'. If that disappears

there will be no one to say that God created this or that.

That which is does not even say 'I am'. For, does any doubt rise 'I am not'?

Only in such a case should one be reminding oneself 'I am a man'. One

does not. On the other hand, if a doubt arises whether he is a cow or a

buffalo he has to remind himself that he is not a cow, etc., but 'I am

a man'. This would never happen. Similarly with one's own existence and

realisation.

23rd January, 1937

 

http://www.beezone.com/Ramana/ Era