Guest guest Posted July 20, 2008 Report Share Posted July 20, 2008 End of suffering is possible! ....yes, it is called *death*! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 21, 2008 Report Share Posted July 21, 2008 Nisargadatta , " adithya_comming " <adithya_comming wrote: > > > > End of suffering is possible! > > > > ...yes, it is called *death*! P: What do we really mean by suffering? Most people here would agree, I think, that pain is not the same as suffering. That suffering means a mind tormented by its thoughts, fears, and moods. A mind trapped in conditions that it want to escape. Suffering requires being caught, trapped and tormented by our own mind for some time. A second, or a minute of torment couldn't be considered suffering. It's possible to acquire a mind that is never trapped, that easily flows? Surely, only death can put and end to physical and mental pain, but the mind need not dwell, and be trapped by that. Is it possible to be dead, yet alive? It is possible. Matter of fact, we all partake of both, all the time, without realizing it. The atoms, which gives us form, are non-living things, yet our bodies are alive. Most of our brain's functions are unconscious, yet what we consider our life is only our moments of consciousness. What we consider life and consciousness is a mere passing surface reflection in a deep unconscious ocean. Once we realize that unknowing, unconcious ocean as the absolute we seek, we are dead, and alive, but most important, we're Free. Pete > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 22, 2008 Report Share Posted July 22, 2008 Nisargadatta , " cerosoul " <pedsie6 wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " adithya_comming " > <adithya_comming@> wrote: > > > > > > > > End of suffering is possible! > > > > > > > > ...yes, it is called *death*! > > P: What do we really mean by suffering? > > Most people here would agree, I think, > that pain is not the same as suffering. > That suffering means a mind tormented > by its thoughts, fears, and moods. A > mind trapped in conditions that it > want to escape. Suffering requires being > caught, trapped and tormented by our own > mind for some time. A second, or a minute > of torment couldn't be considered suffering. > > It's possible to acquire a mind that is > never trapped, that easily flows? Surely, > only death can put and end to physical > and mental pain, but the mind need not > dwell, and be trapped by that. > > Is it possible to be dead, yet alive? > > It is possible. Matter of fact, we all > partake of both, all the time, without > realizing it. The atoms, which gives us > form, are non-living things, yet our > bodies are alive. Most of our brain's > functions are unconscious, yet what > we consider our life is only our moments > of consciousness. What we consider life > and consciousness is a mere passing surface > reflection in a deep unconscious ocean. > > Once we realize that unknowing, unconcious > ocean as the absolute we seek, we are > dead, and alive, but most important, we're > Free. > > Pete I like what you wrote above, Pete! This is what I will say: - Body has the potential for pain. - Mind has the potential for suffering. - Body and mind is ultimately one. i.e. brain becomes body, body becomes brain. Ingest alcohol or drugs, first the body changes, hormone changes and then change the mind, feeling and thoughts. Watch a scary movie or have a nightmare, first the thinking changes and then the feeling and mind and pretty soon the bdoy changes as the heart starts racing. Watch a exotic lady, a porno movie or read a erotic fiction... first the thinking changes, then the feeling, then the mind and pretty soon the body too changes as the flow of blood changes, shape, size and strength of some organs changes, speed of heart-beat changes. and, perhaps, most importantly: Change breathing [which is a body activity], start breathing deeper, slowly... and, the mind becomes calm. Calm the mind and breathing starts to slow down. Mind always has the potential of suffering, but, if you define suffering by duration, then, yes, with understanding a large part of it becomes unnecessary. Nothing really changes, but, the mind learns a better way to deal with the situations that without understanding cause suffering. Thanks for this dialogue, Pete! regards, ac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 22, 2008 Report Share Posted July 22, 2008 Nisargadatta , " adithya_comming " <adithya_comming wrote: > > Nisargadatta , " cerosoul " <pedsie6@> wrote: > > > > Nisargadatta , " adithya_comming " > > <adithya_comming@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Pete > > > I like what you wrote above, Pete! > > This is what I will say: > > - Body has the potential for pain. > > - Mind has the potential for suffering. > > - Body and mind is ultimately one. > i.e. brain becomes body, body becomes > brain. > > > Ingest alcohol or drugs, first the body > changes, hormone changes and then change > the mind, feeling and thoughts. > > Watch a scary movie or have a nightmare, > first the thinking changes and then the > feeling and mind and pretty soon the bdoy > changes as the heart starts racing. > > Watch a exotic lady, a porno movie or read > a erotic fiction... > > first the thinking changes, then the feeling, > then the mind and pretty soon the body too > changes as the flow of blood changes, shape, > size and strength of some organs changes, > speed of heart-beat changes. > > > and, perhaps, most importantly: > > Change breathing [which is a body activity], > start breathing deeper, slowly... and, the > mind becomes calm. Calm the mind and breathing > starts to slow down. > > > Mind always has the potential of suffering, > but, if you define suffering by duration, > then, yes, with understanding a large part of > it becomes unnecessary. Nothing really changes, > but, the mind learns a better way to deal > with the situations that without understanding > cause suffering. > > Thanks for this dialogue, Pete! > > > regards, > ac : You're welcome, Arvind. It always makes me feel glad to hear that you're doing so well. Buddha said: " Suffering exists, but there is no sufferer thereof. " Most people don't take the time to meditate on this. To see, that the mind has to allocate great energy, from moment to moment to recreate the sufferer. The sufferer comes to life when the mind is intent in remember a history of suffering, which it links to this instant of suffering, and it projects into the future. In reality, only this moment of pain exists, and as this instant only, it's quite bearable. It only becomes unbearable if we give it continuity in our imagination. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 23, 2008 Report Share Posted July 23, 2008 > GuruRatings , " cerosoul " <pedsie6@> wrote: > > > > > > Buddha said: " Suffering exists, but there > > is no sufferer thereof. " Most people don't > > take the time to meditate on this. To see, > > that the mind has to allocate great energy, > > from moment to moment to recreate the sufferer. Why does it invest energy to recreate the sufferer, Pete? Is mind stupid? I don't think so. Mind recreates sufferer, because, it wants to avoid suffering in the future and to do that it wants to undersatnd the suffering, its causes, its source, its mechanics. In the root of this effort to 'avoid suffering' is the real physical 'pain reaction' that the body produces in response to this mental suffering and,the memory of the 'body pain' which is associated with this 'mental suffering. For example, the memory of intense hunger or extreme cold or severe pain caused by a a pussing wound and not having access to food, water or medicine might be associated with the 'mental fear' of poverty. Mind 'recreates' and 'projects' suffering because the mind is interested in 'survival' and it is interested in its 'freedom'. Mind knows that it can't really remain 'free' when neurons are rapidly firing 'hunger', 'thirst' or 'pain' signals. > > > > The sufferer comes to life when the mind is > > intent in remember a history of suffering, which > > it links to this instant of suffering, and it > > projects into the future. In reality, only > > this moment of pain exists, and as this instant > > only, it's quite bearable. It is thru the memory, projection and extrapolation that the humans and society [read mind] have made so much progress in the word of medicine, food, drugs to help certain pains from occuring. The mind knows that. The mind knows that thru memory, projection, extrapolation it might be able to solve the recurrence of this pain. Mind knows that without this 'memory' and analysis... it has no hope. > It only becomes > > unbearable if we give it continuity in our > > imagination. > > > > > > > > > > > regards, ac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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