Gurdijieff

[Guest guest]

> > Lene: why are we on this planet earth anyway?

> >

> > geo: When I read Gurdjieff a long time ago it became obvious to me - I

> > bought the fish.

> > Mankind is on earth for two absolutely different reasons.

> >

> > 1- To fulfill the needs - on a cosmic level - of the absolute in order

> > to

> > sustain the creation and maintainence of the universe.

> > In this sense man, or organic life on earth as a whole, are needed in

> > order to keep the ray of creation working. But for this

> > what is needed is a mankind just like it is: mechanical, conditioned,

> > with

> > a sense of herd consciousness. It is as if the earth

> > needed the wars and collective conflicts to fulfill some of its needs.

> > To

> > this there is nothing " we " must do - just remain ignorant

> > and sleeping as we are. that is what is needed in a cosmic scale.

> >

> > 2- For a few there is the opportunity to change. That is what we are

> > discussing in these forums (not entering in that now).

> > This change is a turn inward. A " new " movement in its nature. This new

> > movement is only attainable through the realization of

> > non-separation, of " existing " . It is not meant to the majority for that

> > would disturb the other needs of the universe (#1) - but for some

> > it is possible and necessary for the universe.... in this case not the

> > same reasons as in #1.

> >

> >

> Interesting. It sounds like a version of the Matrix the movie plot. I

> always

> wondered where Gurdjieff got these prescriptive ideas from. It's not like

> Russians were known for this sort of thing other than writing very good

> psychological novels which were mostly descriptive, not prescriptive.

>

> geo: He is not Russian but from turkey. It is very interesting indeed. The

> trouble

> is that people sort of confuse Gurdjieff " schools " and other fourth way BS

> with

> what G had to say. He said he got it from other(s). The real source is

> unknown.

> All this doesn't matter. What matters is assimilating the stuff to the

> point

> I can say it is mine. I robed it and now it is mine!! ...It is not for

> anyone on the street

> because it may seem to theoretical if viewed only from an analytical

> perspective -

> specially at first sight. The fact is that the man - as anyone who

> " knows " -

> is trying

> to describe, to draw a map, of something that is right here present in

> front

> of me (him).

> But not all languages are suited for all people. Viva a diferença!!

>

 

I'm from Turkey and although Gurdijieff is from that area (more like the

" Kafkas " region, the area between Turkey and Ukraine), his last name

indicates he has links to Georgia since we call Georgians " Gurju " (Gurdji).

Culturally he can be considered Russian since many of the multi ethnic

groups under the Russian empire were assimilated to a certain degree even

though they spoke Russian with an accent. I read his biography at Wikipedia

and what suprised me was that he lived in Istanbul in 1920 and that was one

of the most turbulent times to be there.

 

Regardless of his complex background, I found this article on the net and

Gurdjieff seems to be combining the Western method of " effort " with the

Eastern paths especially for the Householders (the working class).

 

http://www.tayu.org/~tayu/wayfourth/sgood27.html

 

I was intrigued by the notion of " Avoiding the Expression of Negative

Emotions " ...It's really a type of " how to " method ...not just " you are

that...now you're liberated. "

-hur-

 

Yes you are right about his origins. As for " Avoiding the Expression of

Negative Emotions " , must be said that it is part of a wider frame.

Man must provoke in an ongoing manner two " shocks " in his being in order to

create the appropriate substances. It is related to the second shock.

Now....this will sound sacrilegious to most in this list because it is a

totally different approach to the matter. You are right. It is a " teaching " ,

a method.

It must be contacted, studied, perhaps analyzed.... but at one point - and

this is important IMHO - all that is dropped and one is being it.

 

If you are interested I strongly suggest you start with Ouspensky's " In

Search Of The Miraculous " . It is not difficult to find it online. I have it

in my PC

somewhere and I can send it to you - if you have the patience to wait till I

find it because I amnot sure the name of the book is exactly that.

 

There are chapters in there that deal with school settings and teachers.

That should not be taken seriously, no need to read it at all. That was

valid for them because G and Ouspensky where alive. The former died in 1949

and the later in 1947. I don't believe in the so called schools that

followed - pure guruhood BS!!

 

PS - I would gladly discuss any issues related to the stuff... in case you

get somehow started.

 

-geo-