How can I recognise a Sadguru or true Mukta Guru?Share

[Guest guest]

How can I recognise a Sadguru or true Mukta Guru?

 

First of all a True Guru will call you and you will know from inside...the

heart..However they usually share some common signals.

 

1. Teach vegetarianism .....for Daya, Ahimsa and self purification.

 

2. Teach recognisable Teachings from Vedanta and other Muktas. All is One and

the small 'I' is false.

 

3. Usually they are not over active and don't travel a lot if

possible....Nowhere to go!!!

 

4. They teach a lot by silence like Dakshinamurthi.....and are not given to long

road show discourses...

 

5. They do not write copiously..but may answer questions.....but not usually

from dilletantes..

 

6. Have the ability to answer obtuse questions without being tertiary

educated...

 

7. You can usually feel their energy and they can give Diksha or initiation and

Saktipat....

 

8. They are usually not making, generating and selling Books, DVDs, and asking

for donations.

 

9. They are not given to siddhis and miracles although things may happen around

them.

 

10. Regard all beings as being equal including animals.

 

11. Sometimes grant Moksha to animals......and advanced humans...

 

12. They usually prefer to more reclusive than expansive....

 

13. Demonstrate or advise some kind of sadhana...and meditation.

 

Those road show gurus are not usually Muktas and although do good work for

everybody and themselves cannot impart initiation as only a Mukta with power of

the Self can do that...

 

The best way is to become a mukta oneself.....Tony.

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " aoclery " <aoclery wrote:

>

> How can I recognise a Sadguru or true Mukta Guru?

>

> First of all a True Guru will call you and you will know from inside...the

heart..However they usually share some common signals.

>

> 1. Teach vegetarianism .....for Daya, Ahimsa and self purification.

>

> 2. Teach recognisable Teachings from Vedanta and other Muktas. All is One and

the small 'I' is false.

>

> 3. Usually they are not over active and don't travel a lot if

possible....Nowhere to go!!!

>

> 4. They teach a lot by silence like Dakshinamurthi.....and are not given to

long road show discourses...

>

> 5. They do not write copiously..but may answer questions.....but not usually

from dilletantes..

>

> 6. Have the ability to answer obtuse questions without being tertiary

educated...

>

> 7. You can usually feel their energy and they can give Diksha or initiation

and Saktipat....

>

> 8. They are usually not making, generating and selling Books, DVDs, and asking

for donations.

>

> 9. They are not given to siddhis and miracles although things may happen

around them.

>

> 10. Regard all beings as being equal including animals.

>

> 11. Sometimes grant Moksha to animals......and advanced humans...

>

> 12. They usually prefer to more reclusive than expansive....

>

> 13. Demonstrate or advise some kind of sadhana...and meditation.

>

> Those road show gurus are not usually Muktas and although do good work for

everybody and themselves cannot impart initiation as only a Mukta with power of

the Self can do that...

>

> The best way is to become a mukta oneself.....Tony.

 

P: The above can be translated as:

 

A mukta is what Tony believes a mukta should be. Someone

who believes what Tony believes, and makes him feel real

good, is a mukta to Tony.

>

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " cerosoul " <pedsie6 wrote:

>

>

>

> Nisargadatta , " aoclery " <aoclery@> wrote:

> >

> > How can I recognise a Sadguru or true Mukta Guru?

> >

> > First of all a True Guru will call you and you will know from inside...the

heart..However they usually share some common signals.

> >

> > 1. Teach vegetarianism .....for Daya, Ahimsa and self purification.

> >

> > 2. Teach recognisable Teachings from Vedanta and other Muktas. All is One

and the small 'I' is false.

> >

> > 3. Usually they are not over active and don't travel a lot if

possible....Nowhere to go!!!

> >

> > 4. They teach a lot by silence like Dakshinamurthi.....and are not given to

long road show discourses...

> >

> > 5. They do not write copiously..but may answer questions.....but not usually

from dilletantes..

> >

> > 6. Have the ability to answer obtuse questions without being tertiary

educated...

> >

> > 7. You can usually feel their energy and they can give Diksha or initiation

and Saktipat....

> >

> > 8. They are usually not making, generating and selling Books, DVDs, and

asking for donations.

> >

> > 9. They are not given to siddhis and miracles although things may happen

around them.

> >

> > 10. Regard all beings as being equal including animals.

> >

> > 11. Sometimes grant Moksha to animals......and advanced humans...

> >

> > 12. They usually prefer to more reclusive than expansive....

> >

> > 13. Demonstrate or advise some kind of sadhana...and meditation.

> >

> > Those road show gurus are not usually Muktas and although do good work for

everybody and themselves cannot impart initiation as only a Mukta with power of

the Self can do that...

> >

> > The best way is to become a mukta oneself.....Tony.

>

> P: The above can be translated as:

>

> A mukta is what Tony believes a mukta should be. Someone

> who believes what Tony believes, and makes him feel real

> good, is a mukta to Tony.

> >

>

Namaste,

 

I see you haven't recovered yet.....I must admit it took some research over time

to come to the above opinion plus programming in statements by other muktas, and

sanskrit slokas over time....Yes it is still an opinion as I am not a

mukta.....But you are right about one thing you get a good feeling off a real

mukta.........hope you get better soon..........Tony.

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " aoclery " <aoclery wrote:

>

>

>

> Nisargadatta , " cerosoul " <pedsie6@> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " aoclery " <aoclery@> wrote:

> > >

> > > How can I recognise a Sadguru or true Mukta Guru?

> > >

> > > First of all a True Guru will call you and you will know from inside...the

heart..However they usually share some common signals.

> > >

> > > 1. Teach vegetarianism .....for Daya, Ahimsa and self purification.

> > >

> > > 2. Teach recognisable Teachings from Vedanta and other Muktas. All is One

and the small 'I' is false.

> > >

> > > 3. Usually they are not over active and don't travel a lot if

possible....Nowhere to go!!!

> > >

> > > 4. They teach a lot by silence like Dakshinamurthi.....and are not given

to long road show discourses...

> > >

> > > 5. They do not write copiously..but may answer questions.....but not

usually from dilletantes..

> > >

> > > 6. Have the ability to answer obtuse questions without being tertiary

educated...

> > >

> > > 7. You can usually feel their energy and they can give Diksha or

initiation and Saktipat....

> > >

> > > 8. They are usually not making, generating and selling Books, DVDs, and

asking for donations.

> > >

> > > 9. They are not given to siddhis and miracles although things may happen

around them.

> > >

> > > 10. Regard all beings as being equal including animals.

> > >

> > > 11. Sometimes grant Moksha to animals......and advanced humans...

> > >

> > > 12. They usually prefer to more reclusive than expansive....

> > >

> > > 13. Demonstrate or advise some kind of sadhana...and meditation.

> > >

> > > Those road show gurus are not usually Muktas and although do good work for

everybody and themselves cannot impart initiation as only a Mukta with power of

the Self can do that...

> > >

> > > The best way is to become a mukta oneself.....Tony.

> >

> > P: The above can be translated as:

> >

> > A mukta is what Tony believes a mukta should be. Someone

> > who believes what Tony believes, and makes him feel real

> > good, is a mukta to Tony.

> > >

> >

> Namaste,

>

> I see you haven't recovered yet.....I must admit it took some research over

time to come to the above opinion plus programming in statements by other

muktas, and sanskrit slokas over time....Yes it is still an opinion as I am not

a mukta.....But you are right about one thing you get a good feeling off a real

mukta.........hope you get better soon..........Tony.

 

P; Hmm! Better is another opinion. " What is " is what is, it never

gets better nor worse, it just seem to do.

>

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " cerosoul " <pedsie6 wrote:

>

>

>

> Nisargadatta , " aoclery " <aoclery@> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " cerosoul " <pedsie6@> wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " aoclery " <aoclery@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > How can I recognise a Sadguru or true Mukta Guru?

> > > >

> > > > First of all a True Guru will call you and you will know from

inside...the heart..However they usually share some common signals.

> > > >

> > > > 1. Teach vegetarianism .....for Daya, Ahimsa and self purification.

> > > >

> > > > 2. Teach recognisable Teachings from Vedanta and other Muktas. All is

One and the small 'I' is false.

> > > >

> > > > 3. Usually they are not over active and don't travel a lot if

possible....Nowhere to go!!!

> > > >

> > > > 4. They teach a lot by silence like Dakshinamurthi.....and are not given

to long road show discourses...

> > > >

> > > > 5. They do not write copiously..but may answer questions.....but not

usually from dilletantes..

> > > >

> > > > 6. Have the ability to answer obtuse questions without being tertiary

educated...

> > > >

> > > > 7. You can usually feel their energy and they can give Diksha or

initiation and Saktipat....

> > > >

> > > > 8. They are usually not making, generating and selling Books, DVDs, and

asking for donations.

> > > >

> > > > 9. They are not given to siddhis and miracles although things may happen

around them.

> > > >

> > > > 10. Regard all beings as being equal including animals.

> > > >

> > > > 11. Sometimes grant Moksha to animals......and advanced humans...

> > > >

> > > > 12. They usually prefer to more reclusive than expansive....

> > > >

> > > > 13. Demonstrate or advise some kind of sadhana...and meditation.

> > > >

> > > > Those road show gurus are not usually Muktas and although do good work

for everybody and themselves cannot impart initiation as only a Mukta with power

of the Self can do that...

> > > >

> > > > The best way is to become a mukta oneself.....Tony.

> > >

> > > P: The above can be translated as:

> > >

> > > A mukta is what Tony believes a mukta should be. Someone

> > > who believes what Tony believes, and makes him feel real

> > > good, is a mukta to Tony.

> > > >

> > >

> > Namaste,

> >

> > I see you haven't recovered yet.....I must admit it took some research over

time to come to the above opinion plus programming in statements by other

muktas, and sanskrit slokas over time....Yes it is still an opinion as I am not

a mukta.....But you are right about one thing you get a good feeling off a real

mukta.........hope you get better soon..........Tony.

>

> P; Hmm! Better is another opinion. " What is " is what is, it never

> gets better nor worse, it just seem to do.

 

And here is Pete with an absolutist slogan.

 

Pete likes to do what he accuses others of doing.

 

It's called projection.

 

Next, he will count the posts compulsively, so he can tell who is being

compulsive about their posting. And he will use a rude put-down to let everyone

know he is beyond being reactive.

 

Keep on truckin', Pete.

 

Just remind yourself, all of this is being produced by your brain.

 

And remind Werner that he is only dealing with the contents of his own

consciousness.

 

And we'll all rock on, on this list.

 

Except Anna, who is missing Bob.

 

- D -

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033 wrote:

>

>

>

> Nisargadatta , " cerosoul " <pedsie6@> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " aoclery " <aoclery@> wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " cerosoul " <pedsie6@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Nisargadatta , " aoclery " <aoclery@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > How can I recognise a Sadguru or true Mukta Guru?

> > > > >

> > > > > First of all a True Guru will call you and you will know from

inside...the heart..However they usually share some common signals.

> > > > >

> > > > > 1. Teach vegetarianism .....for Daya, Ahimsa and self purification.

> > > > >

> > > > > 2. Teach recognisable Teachings from Vedanta and other Muktas. All is

One and the small 'I' is false.

> > > > >

> > > > > 3. Usually they are not over active and don't travel a lot if

possible....Nowhere to go!!!

> > > > >

> > > > > 4. They teach a lot by silence like Dakshinamurthi.....and are not

given to long road show discourses...

> > > > >

> > > > > 5. They do not write copiously..but may answer questions.....but not

usually from dilletantes..

> > > > >

> > > > > 6. Have the ability to answer obtuse questions without being tertiary

educated...

> > > > >

> > > > > 7. You can usually feel their energy and they can give Diksha or

initiation and Saktipat....

> > > > >

> > > > > 8. They are usually not making, generating and selling Books, DVDs,

and asking for donations.

> > > > >

> > > > > 9. They are not given to siddhis and miracles although things may

happen around them.

> > > > >

> > > > > 10. Regard all beings as being equal including animals.

> > > > >

> > > > > 11. Sometimes grant Moksha to animals......and advanced humans...

> > > > >

> > > > > 12. They usually prefer to more reclusive than expansive....

> > > > >

> > > > > 13. Demonstrate or advise some kind of sadhana...and meditation.

> > > > >

> > > > > Those road show gurus are not usually Muktas and although do good work

for everybody and themselves cannot impart initiation as only a Mukta with power

of the Self can do that...

> > > > >

> > > > > The best way is to become a mukta oneself.....Tony.

> > > >

> > > > P: The above can be translated as:

> > > >

> > > > A mukta is what Tony believes a mukta should be. Someone

> > > > who believes what Tony believes, and makes him feel real

> > > > good, is a mukta to Tony.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > Namaste,

> > >

> > > I see you haven't recovered yet.....I must admit it took some research

over time to come to the above opinion plus programming in statements by other

muktas, and sanskrit slokas over time....Yes it is still an opinion as I am not

a mukta.....But you are right about one thing you get a good feeling off a real

mukta.........hope you get better soon..........Tony.

> >

> > P; Hmm! Better is another opinion. " What is " is what is, it never

> > gets better nor worse, it just seem to do.

>

> And here is Pete with an absolutist slogan.

>

> Pete likes to do what he accuses others of doing.

>

> It's called projection.

>

> Next, he will count the posts compulsively, so he can tell who is being

compulsive about their posting. And he will use a rude put-down to let everyone

know he is beyond being reactive.

>

> Keep on truckin', Pete.

>

> Just remind yourself, all of this is being produced by your brain.

>

> And remind Werner that he is only dealing with the contents of his own

consciousness.

>

> And we'll all rock on, on this list.

>

> Except Anna, who is missing Bob.

>

> - D -

>

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-BeVGCINic

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033 wrote:

>

>

>

> And remind Werner that he is only dealing with the contents of his own

consciousness.

 

 

Wrong, Dan !

 

The world of consciousness is the world we are communicating and sharing. It is

this sharing which builds up and constitutes society.

 

You are the world and the world is you.

 

You must know this expression of K, Dan, because already since 10 years you are

a member of the Krishnamurti list.

 

Werner

 

 

>

> And we'll all rock on, on this list.

>

> - D -

>

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta, " cerosoul " <pedsie6 > wrote:

>

>

>

> Nisargadatta, " aoclery " <aoclery@> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > Nisargadatta, " cerosoul " <pedsie6@> wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta, " aoclery " <aoclery@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > How can I recognise a Sadguru or true Mukta Guru?

> > > >

> > > > First of all a True Guru will call you and you will know from

inside...the heart..However they usually share some common signals.

> > > >

> > > > 1. Teach vegetarianism .....for Daya, Ahimsa and self purification.

> > > >

> > > > 2. Teach recognisable Teachings from Vedanta and other Muktas. All is

One and the small 'I' is false.

> > > >

> > > > 3. Usually they are not over active and don't travel a lot if

possible.... Nowhere to go!!!

> > > >

> > > > 4. They teach a lot by silence like Dakshinamurthi. ....and are not

given to long road show discourses.. .

> > > >

> > > > 5. They do not write copiously..but may answer questions... ..but not

usually from dilletantes. .

> > > >

> > > > 6. Have the ability to answer obtuse questions without being tertiary

educated...

> > > >

> > > > 7. You can usually feel their energy and they can give Diksha or

initiation and Saktipat....

> > > >

> > > > 8. They are usually not making, generating and selling Books, DVDs, and

asking for donations.

> > > >

> > > > 9. They are not given to siddhis and miracles although things may happen

around them.

> > > >

> > > > 10. Regard all beings as being equal including animals.

> > > >

> > > > 11. Sometimes grant Moksha to animals..... .and advanced humans...

> > > >

> > > > 12. They usually prefer to more reclusive than expansive... .

> > > >

> > > > 13. Demonstrate or advise some kind of sadhana...and meditation.

> > > >

> > > > Those road show gurus are not usually Muktas and although do good work

for everybody and themselves cannot impart initiation as only a Mukta with power

of the Self can do that...

> > > >

> > > > The best way is to become a mukta oneself..... Tony.

> > >

> > > P: The above can be translated as:

> > >

> > > A mukta is what Tony believes a mukta should be. Someone

> > > who believes what Tony believes, and makes him feel real

> > > good, is a mukta to Tony.

> > > >

> > >

> > Namaste,

> >

> > I see you haven't recovered yet.....I must admit it took some research over

time to come to the above opinion plus programming in statements by other

muktas, and sanskrit slokas over time....Yes it is still an opinion as I am not

a mukta.....But you are right about one thing you get a good feeling off a real

mukta....... ..hope you get better soon........ ..Tony.

>

> P; Hmm! Better is another opinion. " What is " is what is, it never

> gets better nor worse, it just seem to do.

 

And here is Pete with an absolutist slogan.

 

Pete likes to do what he accuses others of doing.

 

It's called projection.

 

Next, he will count the posts compulsively, so he can tell who is being

compulsive about their posting. And he will use a rude put-down to let everyone

know he is beyond being reactive.

 

Keep on truckin', Pete.

 

Just remind yourself, all of this is being produced by your brain.

 

And remind Werner that he is only dealing with the contents of his own

consciousness.

 

And we'll all rock on, on this list.

 

Except Anna, who is missing Bob.

 

- D -

 

 

 

and here are now nearly all the kids back....

 

bubbling out this their arrogance....

 

which isn't of anybodies interests....

 

and therefore the meaningless words and little fights...

 

among this spiritual kids....

 

dreaming to just Be....

 

this their ignorance....

 

and/or to be the peace...

 

they are dreaming about

 

without knowing anything...

 

about this their dreams...

 

....

 

 

oooommmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

 

.....

 

 

Marc

[Guest guest]

Visitor: Is the relationship between the Guru and the disciple similar to

telepathy?

 

Maharaj: Yes, telepathy can function if the receptivity is good. Some have a

buffalo like skull; no amount of thrashing affects that dull animal.

 

V: Would Maharaj speak about the Guru and disciple relationship?

 

M: The Guru links the relationship of the disciple with Self-knowledge and the

disciple nourishes it. The Guru links you to Self-knowledge, that is you Guru,

nourish it. The knowledge ‘you are’ is the Guru, once linked don’t disturb

the relationship by identifying with the body. Once a woman is married to a man,

it’s done, each must behave accordingly. Once linked with the Guru, you must

not identify, with the body. The knowledge ‘you are’, be there with full

devotion, the knowledge ‘I am’ is not the body.

 

Jai Guru Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj

 

I am Unborn (41)

 

--- On Fri, 3/12/10, Marc <dennis_travis33 wrote:

 

 

Marc <dennis_travis33

Re: How can I recognise a Sadguru or true Mukta

Guru?Share

Nisargadatta

Friday, March 12, 2010, 9:38 AM

 

 

 

 

 

 

Nisargadatta, " cerosoul " <pedsie6 > wrote:

>

>

>

> Nisargadatta, " aoclery " <aoclery@> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > Nisargadatta, " cerosoul " <pedsie6@> wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta, " aoclery " <aoclery@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > How can I recognise a Sadguru or true Mukta Guru?

> > > >

> > > > First of all a True Guru will call you and you will know from

inside...the heart..However they usually share some common signals.

> > > >

> > > > 1. Teach vegetarianism .....for Daya, Ahimsa and self purification.

> > > >

> > > > 2. Teach recognisable Teachings from Vedanta and other Muktas. All

is One and the small 'I' is false.

> > > >

> > > > 3. Usually they are not over active and don't travel a lot if

possible.... Nowhere to go!!!

> > > >

> > > > 4. They teach a lot by silence like Dakshinamurthi. ....and are not

given to long road show discourses.. .

> > > >

> > > > 5. They do not write copiously..but may answer questions... ..but not

usually from dilletantes. .

> > > >

> > > > 6. Have the ability to answer obtuse questions without being tertiary

educated...

> > > >

> > > > 7. You can usually feel their energy and they can give Diksha or

initiation and Saktipat....

> > > >

> > > > 8. They are usually not making, generating and selling Books, DVDs, and

asking for donations.

> > > >

> > > > 9. They are not given to siddhis and

miracles although things may happen around them.

> > > >

> > > > 10. Regard all beings as being equal including animals.

> > > >

> > > > 11. Sometimes grant Moksha to animals..... .and advanced humans...

> > > >

> > > > 12. They usually prefer to more reclusive than expansive... .

> > > >

> > > > 13. Demonstrate or advise some kind of sadhana...and meditation.

> > > >

> > > > Those road show gurus are not usually Muktas and although do good work

for everybody and themselves cannot impart initiation as only a Mukta with power

of the Self can do that...

> > > >

> > > > The best way is to become a mukta oneself..... Tony.

> > >

> > > P: The above can be translated as:

> > >

> > > A mukta is what Tony believes a mukta should

be. Someone

> > > who believes what Tony believes, and makes him feel real

> > > good, is a mukta to Tony.

> > > >

> > >

> > Namaste,

> >

> > I see you haven't recovered yet.....I must admit it took some research over

time to come to the above opinion plus programming in statements by other

muktas, and sanskrit slokas over time....Yes it is still an opinion as I am not

a mukta.....But you are right about one thing you get a good feeling off a real

mukta....... ..hope you get better soon........ ..Tony.

>

> P; Hmm! Better is another opinion. " What is " is what is, it never

> gets better nor worse, it just seem to do.

 

And here is Pete with an absolutist slogan.

 

Pete likes to do what he accuses others of doing.

 

It's called projection.

 

Next, he will count the posts compulsively, so he can tell who is being

compulsive about their

posting. And he will use a rude put-down to let everyone know he is beyond

being reactive.

 

Keep on truckin', Pete.

 

Just remind yourself, all of this is being produced by your brain.

 

And remind Werner that he is only dealing with the contents of his own

consciousness.

 

And we'll all rock on, on this list.

 

Except Anna, who is missing Bob.

 

- D -

 

and here are now nearly all the kids back....

 

bubbling out this their arrogance... .

 

which isn't of anybodies interests... .

 

and therefore the meaningless words and little fights...

 

among this spiritual kids....

 

dreaming to just Be....

 

this their ignorance... .

 

and/or to be the peace...

 

they are dreaming about

 

without knowing anything...

 

about this their dreams...

 

....

 

oooommmmmmmmmmmmmmm mmmmmmmmmmmmm

 

.....

 

Marc

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " wwoehr " <wwoehr wrote:

>

>

>

> Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033@> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > And remind Werner that he is only dealing with the contents of his own

consciousness.

>

>

> Wrong, Dan !

>

> The world of consciousness is the world we are communicating and sharing. It

is this sharing which builds up and constitutes society.

>

> You are the world and the world is you.

>

> You must know this expression of K, Dan, because already since 10 years you

are a member of the Krishnamurti list.

>

> Werner

 

Werner, I'm quoting you. You who said everything is consciousness, and

consciousness is its contents.

 

You've never followed through on what you yourself said.

 

If you followed through on it, you'd realize that all your comments about what

others are doing, are comments about the contents of your own consciousness.

 

And the comments also are contents of your consciousness.

 

But although you can say the words, you can't actually see this.

 

Because you are invested in having a complaint about what others are doing.

 

Never realizing that the complaint is about you, and the complainer and that

which is complained about are not apart from each other - as they are equally

contents of Werner's consciousness.

 

- D -

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , Marc <dennis_travis33 wrote:

>

> Nisargadatta, " cerosoul " <pedsie6@ > wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > Nisargadatta, " aoclery " <aoclery@> wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta, " cerosoul " <pedsie6@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Nisargadatta, " aoclery " <aoclery@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > How can I recognise a Sadguru or true Mukta Guru?

> > > > >

> > > > > First of all a True Guru will call you and you will know from

inside...the heart..However they usually share some common signals.

> > > > >

> > > > > 1. Teach vegetarianism .....for Daya, Ahimsa and self purification.

> > > > >

> > > > > 2. Teach recognisable Teachings from Vedanta and other Muktas. All is

One and the small 'I' is false.

> > > > >

> > > > > 3. Usually they are not over active and don't travel a lot if

possible.... Nowhere to go!!!

> > > > >

> > > > > 4. They teach a lot by silence like Dakshinamurthi. ....and are not

given to long road show discourses.. .

> > > > >

> > > > > 5. They do not write copiously..but may answer questions... ..but not

usually from dilletantes. .

> > > > >

> > > > > 6. Have the ability to answer obtuse questions without being tertiary

educated...

> > > > >

> > > > > 7. You can usually feel their energy and they can give Diksha or

initiation and Saktipat....

> > > > >

> > > > > 8. They are usually not making, generating and selling Books, DVDs,

and asking for donations.

> > > > >

> > > > > 9. They are not given to siddhis and miracles although things may

happen around them.

> > > > >

> > > > > 10. Regard all beings as being equal including animals.

> > > > >

> > > > > 11. Sometimes grant Moksha to animals..... .and advanced humans...

> > > > >

> > > > > 12. They usually prefer to more reclusive than expansive... .

> > > > >

> > > > > 13. Demonstrate or advise some kind of sadhana...and meditation.

> > > > >

> > > > > Those road show gurus are not usually Muktas and although do good work

for everybody and themselves cannot impart initiation as only a Mukta with power

of the Self can do that...

> > > > >

> > > > > The best way is to become a mukta oneself..... Tony.

> > > >

> > > > P: The above can be translated as:

> > > >

> > > > A mukta is what Tony believes a mukta should be. Someone

> > > > who believes what Tony believes, and makes him feel real

> > > > good, is a mukta to Tony.

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > Namaste,

> > >

> > > I see you haven't recovered yet.....I must admit it took some research

over time to come to the above opinion plus programming in statements by other

muktas, and sanskrit slokas over time....Yes it is still an opinion as I am not

a mukta.....But you are right about one thing you get a good feeling off a real

mukta....... ..hope you get better soon........ ..Tony.

> >

> > P; Hmm! Better is another opinion. " What is " is what is, it never

> > gets better nor worse, it just seem to do.

>

> And here is Pete with an absolutist slogan.

>

> Pete likes to do what he accuses others of doing.

>

> It's called projection.

>

> Next, he will count the posts compulsively, so he can tell who is being

compulsive about their posting. And he will use a rude put-down to let everyone

know he is beyond being reactive.

>

> Keep on truckin', Pete.

>

> Just remind yourself, all of this is being produced by your brain.

>

> And remind Werner that he is only dealing with the contents of his own

consciousness.

>

> And we'll all rock on, on this list.

>

> Except Anna, who is missing Bob.

>

> - D -

>

>

>

> and here are now nearly all the kids back....

>

> bubbling out this their arrogance....

>

> which isn't of anybodies interests....

>

> and therefore the meaningless words and little fights...

>

> among this spiritual kids....

>

> dreaming to just Be....

>

> this their ignorance....

>

> and/or to be the peace...

>

> they are dreaming about

>

> without knowing anything...

>

> about this their dreams...

>

> ...

>

>

> oooommmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

>

> ....

>

>

> Marc

 

Yes.

 

The babbling ceases, as never having been.

 

As the dream of last night is where?

 

upon being awake from the dream.

 

 

- D -

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta, " wwoehr " <wwoehr wrote:

>

>

>

> Nisargadatta, " dan330033 " <dan330033@> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > And remind Werner that he is only dealing with the contents of his own

consciousness.

>

>

> Wrong, Dan !

>

> The world of consciousness is the world we are communicating and sharing. It

is this sharing which builds up and constitutes society.

>

> You are the world and the world is you.

>

> You must know this expression of K, Dan, because already since 10 years you

are a member of the Krishnamurti list.

>

> Werner

 

Werner, I'm quoting you. You who said everything is consciousness, and

consciousness is its contents.

 

You've never followed through on what you yourself said.

 

If you followed through on it, you'd realize that all your comments about what

others are doing, are comments about the contents of your own consciousness.

 

And the comments also are contents of your consciousness.

 

But although you can say the words, you can't actually see this.

 

Because you are invested in having a complaint about what others are doing.

 

Never realizing that the complaint is about you, and the complainer and that

which is complained about are not apart from each other - as they are equally

contents of Werner's consciousness.

 

- D -

 

 

true, D

 

but don't forget that " Werner " is also only of the content " D " during the time

" D " is involved into an appearent " Werner "

 

etc

 

....

 

in fact....there is Nobody you could ever explain this your

consciousness/content issue.

 

....

 

except it's part of this your worldly business....means, of worldly

existence.....in selling such spiritual ideas and concepts...

 

....

 

just like the one who is selling some fresh salads on the market...

 

....

 

 

Marc

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033 wrote:

>

>

>

> Nisargadatta , " wwoehr " <wwoehr@> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033@> wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > And remind Werner that he is only dealing with the contents of his own

consciousness.

> >

> >

> > Wrong, Dan !

> >

> > The world of consciousness is the world we are communicating and sharing. It

is this sharing which builds up and constitutes society.

> >

> > You are the world and the world is you.

> >

> > You must know this expression of K, Dan, because already since 10 years you

are a member of the Krishnamurti list.

> >

> > Werner

>

> Werner, I'm quoting you. You who said everything is consciousness, and

consciousness is its contents.

 

 

Hey Dan,

 

Repeating a lie again and again won't change it into truth.

 

We had that already but because your mind seems reluctant and stubborn to

remember what I really said here it is again:

 

I never said 'everything is conscsiousness' but I repeatedly said 'consciousness

is all there is' and with a bit good will and pondering you will reaslize that

there is a vast difference between both statements.

 

 

>

> You've never followed through on what you yourself said.

>

> If you followed through on it, you'd realize that all your comments about what

others are doing, are comments about the contents of your own consciousness.

>

> And the comments also are contents of your consciousness.

>

> But although you can say the words, you can't actually see this.

>

> Because you are invested in having a complaint about what others are doing.

>

> Never realizing that the complaint is about you, and the complainer and that

which is complained about are not apart from each other - as they are equally

contents of Werner's consciousness.

 

 

Dan, surely there is just my own consciousness, we don't have to discuss that.

But for a nondual guy without any blood in his veins it is very difficult to

allow a bit commonsense:

 

I myself now open the door very wide and say hello world, hello trees and

meadows and clouds, hello wind touching my skin, hello friends and neigbours,

hello, hello, hello - I embrace you all.

 

And you poor philosopher, Dan, selfrighteous and totally stuck in nondual

phrases, you never will understand what commonsese is.

 

 

Werner

 

 

>

> - D -

>

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033 wrote:

>

>

>

> Nisargadatta , " wwoehr " <wwoehr@> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033@> wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > And remind Werner that he is only dealing with the contents of his own

consciousness.

> >

> >

> > Wrong, Dan !

> >

> > The world of consciousness is the world we are communicating and sharing. It

is this sharing which builds up and constitutes society.

> >

> > You are the world and the world is you.

> >

> > You must know this expression of K, Dan, because already since 10 years you

are a member of the Krishnamurti list.

> >

> > Werner

>

> Werner, I'm quoting you. You who said everything is consciousness, and

consciousness is its contents.

>

> You've never followed through on what you yourself said.

>

> If you followed through on it, you'd realize that all your comments > about

what others are doing, are comments about the contents of

> your own consciousness.

>

> And the comments also are contents of your consciousness.

>

> But although you can say the words, you can't actually see this.

 

It's amazing he can't see this simple fact.

 

It's right out in the open, in plain view.

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch wrote:

>

>

>

> Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033@> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " wwoehr " <wwoehr@> wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > And remind Werner that he is only dealing with the contents of his own

consciousness.

> > >

> > >

> > > Wrong, Dan !

> > >

> > > The world of consciousness is the world we are communicating and sharing.

It is this sharing which builds up and constitutes society.

> > >

> > > You are the world and the world is you.

> > >

> > > You must know this expression of K, Dan, because already since 10 years

you are a member of the Krishnamurti list.

> > >

> > > Werner

> >

> > Werner, I'm quoting you. You who said everything is consciousness, and

consciousness is its contents.

> >

> > You've never followed through on what you yourself said.

> >

> > If you followed through on it, you'd realize that all your comments > about

what others are doing, are comments about the contents of

> > your own consciousness.

> >

> > And the comments also are contents of your consciousness.

> >

> > But although you can say the words, you can't actually see this.

>

> It's amazing he can't see this simple fact.

 

 

He ? Who is he ?

 

Gossiper-Tim again is sticking his nose together with Dan. You still can't stand

on your own feet, Timmy boy.

 

Werner

 

 

 

>

> It's right out in the open, in plain view.

>

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " wwoehr " <wwoehr wrote:

>

>

>

> Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033@> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " wwoehr " <wwoehr@> wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > And remind Werner that he is only dealing with the contents of his own

consciousness.

> > >

> > >

> > > Wrong, Dan !

> > >

> > > The world of consciousness is the world we are communicating and sharing.

It is this sharing which builds up and constitutes society.

> > >

> > > You are the world and the world is you.

> > >

> > > You must know this expression of K, Dan, because already since 10 years

you are a member of the Krishnamurti list.

> > >

> > > Werner

> >

> > Werner, I'm quoting you. You who said everything is consciousness, and

consciousness is its contents.

>

>

> Hey Dan,

>

> Repeating a lie again and again won't change it into truth.

>

> We had that already but because your mind seems reluctant and stubborn to

remember what I really said here it is again:

>

> I never said 'everything is conscsiousness' but I repeatedly said

'consciousness is all there is' and with a bit good will and pondering you will

reaslize that there is a vast difference between both statements.

 

D: Werner, saying all is consciousness doesn't change the point I'm making about

your mode of response.

 

You respond as if you are addressing someone existing outside of your

consciousness who is being arrogant, as if this weren't a content of your

consciousness.

 

As all is consciousness, when you complain (for example you repeatedly complain

about others' arrogance) - your complaint is about the arrogance arising in your

own consciousness, which " being all " as you say, is the arrogance. The

arrogance is a content of your consciousness, and you object to it as if it is

coming from outside of you and is not you.

 

> > You've never followed through on what you yourself said.

> >

> > If you followed through on it, you'd realize that all your comments about

what others are doing, are comments about the contents of your own

consciousness.

> >

> > And the comments also are contents of your consciousness.

> >

> > But although you can say the words, you can't actually see this.

> >

> > Because you are invested in having a complaint about what others are doing.

> >

> > Never realizing that the complaint is about you, and the complainer and that

which is complained about are not apart from each other - as they are equally

contents of Werner's consciousness.

>

>

> Dan, surely there is just my own consciousness, we don't have to discuss that.

 

D: You say it, but you don't " own " it as the immediate fact.

 

> But for a nondual guy without any blood in his veins it is very difficult to

allow a bit commonsense:

>

> I myself now open the door very wide and say hello world, hello trees and

meadows and clouds, hello wind touching my skin, hello friends and neigbours,

hello, hello, hello - I embrace you all.

 

D: Embrace the arrogance you attribute to beings outside of you.

 

> And you poor philosopher, Dan, selfrighteous and totally stuck in nondual

phrases, you never will understand what commonsese is.

>

>

 

D: The self-righteousness you object to is a content of your consciousness,

Werner. You repeatedly locate it outside of you, as if you could address it as

the property of another being existing separately from you.

 

Your friend Krishnamurti repeatedly suggested that you are the greed, you are

the arrogance, you are the fear -- so stop avoiding.

 

Yet, although you claim to respect the teachings of Krishnamurti, you repeatedly

place the locus of arrogance and conceit (which are fear) outside of yourself.

With lots of condenscending personalized remarks - which you clearly enjoy.

 

What you enjoy is having a defense against the fear (and conceit and arrogance)

that you are.

 

Consider that the deflection and pretense can stop. You can now understand that

it's not a matter of parroting words and concepts from others, like

Krishnamurti. As he said, this is urgent, the world is burning - the time is

now.

 

Clearly you enjoy using online forums to find ways to put down others. There are

many who go no further than to relieve their frustration at the expense of

imagined others, who they make a point to demonstrate their superiority to.

 

Your remarks repeat a theme of how you're superior, how others are arrogant, how

others aren't as smart as you. Of course, this is as far as many can go with

the teachings they have read. They use whatever they know as a way to make a

demonstration of their superiority, in one way or another. So, I don't think

you are unique in resorting to this kind of defensiveness.

 

And maybe this is as far as you can take it.

 

Maybe here you are satisfied and will rest in complacency.

 

Of course, I realize that you don't listen. Your mode of response is basically

saying over and over " I'm not listening. This is about me, and you're not worth

listening to. You are full of nondual nonsense, etc., etc. "

 

I'm not kidding myself that you hear what is being said. And I know you will

deflect what has been said here, and treat it as if you are dealing with someone

else existing apart from you.

 

So you won't know first-hand what it is to be " consciousness that is all " or to

understand that there is nothing you are dealing with that isn't the contents of

your own consciousness, including the " one called Werner " who is " speaking out "

about others.

 

As for me, I'm fully aware that the " Werner " I'm addressing is my own

construction. And whatever I say to you about this is for the fun of voicing

the fact that the " you " I'm addressing is nothing other than a configuration of

" my own awareness " or " consciousness " as you like to call it.

 

- D -

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch wrote:

>

>

>

> Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033@> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " wwoehr " <wwoehr@> wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > And remind Werner that he is only dealing with the contents of his own

consciousness.

> > >

> > >

> > > Wrong, Dan !

> > >

> > > The world of consciousness is the world we are communicating and sharing.

It is this sharing which builds up and constitutes society.

> > >

> > > You are the world and the world is you.

> > >

> > > You must know this expression of K, Dan, because already since 10 years

you are a member of the Krishnamurti list.

> > >

> > > Werner

> >

> > Werner, I'm quoting you. You who said everything is consciousness, and

consciousness is its contents.

> >

> > You've never followed through on what you yourself said.

> >

> > If you followed through on it, you'd realize that all your comments > about

what others are doing, are comments about the contents of

> > your own consciousness.

> >

> > And the comments also are contents of your consciousness.

> >

> > But although you can say the words, you can't actually see this.

>

> It's amazing he can't see this simple fact.

>

> It's right out in the open, in plain view.

 

Yes, it is.

 

And although its obvious, it's defended against nonstop.

 

Why?

 

To keep a personal sense of existence going.

 

To keep a stance vis a vis the imagined other.

 

To keep " me " as " mine " and " not yours. "

 

My words keep you away from me, and me away from you.

 

And that is the payoff.

 

With all the frustration involved in me vs you being misunderstood, and

projected outward as " something that is wrong with you. "

 

- D -

[Guest guest]

Returning to the original question posed by Tony,

 

A mukta/sadguru, will take the carpet out from under one's feet,

and that is not a good feeling even if s/he pulls you into her

sphere of influence with the promise of feeling good.

 

 

~A

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033 wrote:

>

>

>

> Nisargadatta , " wwoehr " <wwoehr@> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033@> wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " wwoehr " <wwoehr@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > And remind Werner that he is only dealing with the contents of his own

consciousness.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Wrong, Dan !

> > > >

> > > > The world of consciousness is the world we are communicating and

sharing. It is this sharing which builds up and constitutes society.

> > > >

> > > > You are the world and the world is you.

> > > >

> > > > You must know this expression of K, Dan, because already since 10 years

you are a member of the Krishnamurti list.

> > > >

> > > > Werner

> > >

> > > Werner, I'm quoting you. You who said everything is consciousness, and

consciousness is its contents.

> >

> >

> > Hey Dan,

> >

> > Repeating a lie again and again won't change it into truth.

> >

> > We had that already but because your mind seems reluctant and stubborn to

remember what I really said here it is again:

> >

> > I never said 'everything is conscsiousness' but I repeatedly said

'consciousness is all there is' and with a bit good will and pondering you will

reaslize that there is a vast difference between both statements.

>

> D: Werner, saying all is consciousness doesn't change the point I'm making

about your mode of response.

>

> You respond as if you are addressing someone existing outside of your

consciousness who is being arrogant, as if this weren't a content of your

consciousness.

>

> As all is consciousness, when you complain (for example you repeatedly

complain about others' arrogance) - your complaint is about the arrogance

arising in your own consciousness, which " being all " as you say, is the

arrogance. The arrogance is a content of your consciousness, and you object to

it as if it is coming from outside of you and is not you.

>

> > > You've never followed through on what you yourself said.

> > >

> > > If you followed through on it, you'd realize that all your comments about

what others are doing, are comments about the contents of your own

consciousness.

> > >

> > > And the comments also are contents of your consciousness.

> > >

> > > But although you can say the words, you can't actually see this.

> > >

> > > Because you are invested in having a complaint about what others are

doing.

> > >

> > > Never realizing that the complaint is about you, and the complainer and

that which is complained about are not apart from each other - as they are

equally contents of Werner's consciousness.

> >

> >

> > Dan, surely there is just my own consciousness, we don't have to discuss

that.

>

> D: You say it, but you don't " own " it as the immediate fact.

>

> > But for a nondual guy without any blood in his veins it is very difficult to

allow a bit commonsense:

> >

> > I myself now open the door very wide and say hello world, hello trees and

meadows and clouds, hello wind touching my skin, hello friends and neigbours,

hello, hello, hello - I embrace you all.

>

> D: Embrace the arrogance you attribute to beings outside of you.

>

> > And you poor philosopher, Dan, selfrighteous and totally stuck in nondual

phrases, you never will understand what commonsese is.

> >

> >

>

> D: The self-righteousness you object to is a content of your consciousness,

Werner. You repeatedly locate it outside of you, as if you could address it as

the property of another being existing separately from you.

>

> Your friend Krishnamurti repeatedly suggested that you are the greed, you are

the arrogance, you are the fear -- so stop avoiding.

>

> Yet, although you claim to respect the teachings of Krishnamurti, you

repeatedly place the locus of arrogance and conceit (which are fear) outside of

yourself. With lots of condenscending personalized remarks - which you clearly

enjoy.

>

> What you enjoy is having a defense against the fear (and conceit and

arrogance) that you are.

>

> Consider that the deflection and pretense can stop. You can now understand

that it's not a matter of parroting words and concepts from others, like

Krishnamurti. As he said, this is urgent, the world is burning - the time is

now.

>

> Clearly you enjoy using online forums to find ways to put down others. There

are many who go no further than to relieve their frustration at the expense of

imagined others, who they make a point to demonstrate their superiority to.

>

> Your remarks repeat a theme of how you're superior, how others are arrogant,

how others aren't as smart as you. Of course, this is as far as many can go

with the teachings they have read. They use whatever they know as a way to make

a demonstration of their superiority, in one way or another. So, I don't think

you are unique in resorting to this kind of defensiveness.

>

> And maybe this is as far as you can take it.

>

> Maybe here you are satisfied and will rest in complacency.

>

> Of course, I realize that you don't listen. Your mode of response is

basically saying over and over " I'm not listening. This is about me, and you're

not worth listening to. You are full of nondual nonsense, etc., etc. "

>

> I'm not kidding myself that you hear what is being said. And I know you will

deflect what has been said here, and treat it as if you are dealing with someone

else existing apart from you.

>

> So you won't know first-hand what it is to be " consciousness that is all " or

to understand that there is nothing you are dealing with that isn't the contents

of your own consciousness, including the " one called Werner " who is " speaking

out " about others.

>

> As for me, I'm fully aware that the " Werner " I'm addressing is my own

construction. And whatever I say to you about this is for the fun of voicing

the fact that the " you " I'm addressing is nothing other than a configuration of

" my own awareness " or " consciousness " as you like to call it.

>

> - D -

>

 

 

And when you see a blossoming flower and you smell it's fragrance you instantly

will say to yourself it doesn't exist, right ?

 

And when you are falling in love with a sexy woman and during you have sex with

her you constantly repeat " she is not real, she is not real, she is just a

content of consciousnss " , won't you ?

 

And that is what I meant with that in your veins there is no blood but just

nondual phrases.

 

Why not calling it a nondual neurosis ?

 

Werner

[Guest guest]

[...]

 

>

> And when you see a blossoming flower and you smell it's fragrance you

instantly will say to yourself it doesn't exist, right ?

>

> And when you are falling in love with a sexy woman and during you have sex

with her you constantly repeat " she is not real, she is not real, she is just a

content of consciousnss " , won't you ?

>

> And that is what I meant with that in your veins there is no blood but just

nondual phrases.

>

> Why not calling it a nondual neurosis ?

>

> Werner

>

 

 

Dear Werner ji:

 

Without agreeing or disagreeing with you or Danji, I note that what you wrote

above is very entertaining, humorous, witty and funny! It brought smile to my

mind.

 

Best wishes,

ac

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " ac " <adithya_comming wrote:

>

> [...]

>

> >

> > And when you see a blossoming flower and you smell it's fragrance you

instantly will say to yourself it doesn't exist, right ?

> >

> > And when you are falling in love with a sexy woman and during you have sex

with her you constantly repeat " she is not real, she is not real, she is just a

content of consciousnss " , won't you ?

> >

> > And that is what I meant with that in your veins there is no blood but just

nondual phrases.

> >

> > Why not calling it a nondual neurosis ?

> >

> > Werner

> >

>

>

> Dear Werner ji:

>

> Without agreeing or disagreeing with you or Danji, I note that what you wrote

above is very entertaining, humorous, witty and funny! It brought smile to my

mind.

>

> Best wishes,

> ac

>

 

 

Thanks ac. I am pleased you enjoyed it.

 

But it must tell you when wrting that post I was clenching my fists and with a

grimly face I was praying " Oh Lord, please help Dan to wake up and to recover

from his nondual neurosis and let him realize he is a human being of flesh and

blood and not just a nondual phrasing machine " .

 

 

Werner

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " wwoehr " <wwoehr wrote:

>

>

>

> Nisargadatta , " ac " <adithya_comming@> wrote:

> >

> > [...]

> >

> > >

> > > And when you see a blossoming flower and you smell it's fragrance you

instantly will say to yourself it doesn't exist, right ?

> > >

> > > And when you are falling in love with a sexy woman and during you have sex

with her you constantly repeat " she is not real, she is not real, she is just a

content of consciousnss " , won't you ?

> > >

> > > And that is what I meant with that in your veins there is no blood but

just nondual phrases.

> > >

> > > Why not calling it a nondual neurosis ?

> > >

> > > Werner

> > >

> >

> >

> > Dear Werner ji:

> >

> > Without agreeing or disagreeing with you or Danji, I note that what you

wrote above is very entertaining, humorous, witty and funny! It brought smile to

my mind.

> >

> > Best wishes,

> > ac

> >

>

>

> Thanks ac. I am pleased you enjoyed it.

>

> But it must tell you when wrting that post I was clenching my fists and with a

grimly face I was praying " Oh Lord, please help Dan to wake up and to recover

from his nondual neurosis and let him realize he is a human being of flesh and

blood and not just a nondual phrasing machine " .

>

>

>

> Werner

>

 

 

It's relative Werner, I was praying just that for you a couple of days ago.

 

;-)

 

~A

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033 wrote:

>

>

>

> Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch@> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033@> wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " wwoehr " <wwoehr@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > And remind Werner that he is only dealing with the contents of his own

consciousness.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Wrong, Dan !

> > > >

> > > > The world of consciousness is the world we are communicating and

sharing. It is this sharing which builds up and constitutes society.

> > > >

> > > > You are the world and the world is you.

> > > >

> > > > You must know this expression of K, Dan, because already since 10 years

you are a member of the Krishnamurti list.

> > > >

> > > > Werner

> > >

> > > Werner, I'm quoting you. You who said everything is consciousness, and

consciousness is its contents.

> > >

> > > You've never followed through on what you yourself said.

> > >

> > > If you followed through on it, you'd realize that all your comments >

about what others are doing, are comments about the contents of

> > > your own consciousness.

> > >

> > > And the comments also are contents of your consciousness.

> > >

> > > But although you can say the words, you can't actually see this.

> >

> > It's amazing he can't see this simple fact.

> >

> > It's right out in the open, in plain view.

>

> Yes, it is.

>

> And although its obvious, it's defended against nonstop.

>

> Why?

>

> To keep a personal sense of existence going.

>

> To keep a stance vis a vis the imagined other.

>

> To keep " me " as " mine " and " not yours. "

>

> My words keep you away from me, and me away from you.

>

> And that is the payoff.

>

> With all the frustration involved in me vs you being misunderstood, and

projected outward as " something that is wrong with you. "

>

> - D -

>

 

He sees it, and he doesn't see it.

 

Hangs out on list(s) devoted to 'nonduality' and complains about 'nondualists',

like someone hanging out at a car dealership and complaining about automobiles.

 

Somehow, the contradiction in that isn't clear to him.

 

It's interesting.

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " wwoehr " <wwoehr wrote:

>

>

>

> Nisargadatta , " ac " <adithya_comming@> wrote:

> >

> > [...]

> >

> > >

> > > And when you see a blossoming flower and you smell it's fragrance you

instantly will say to yourself it doesn't exist, right ?

> > >

> > > And when you are falling in love with a sexy woman and during you have sex

with her you constantly repeat " she is not real, she is not real, she is just a

content of consciousnss " , won't you ?

> > >

> > > And that is what I meant with that in your veins there is no blood but

just nondual phrases.

> > >

> > > Why not calling it a nondual neurosis ?

> > >

> > > Werner

> > >

> >

> >

> > Dear Werner ji:

> >

> > Without agreeing or disagreeing with you or Danji, I note that what you

wrote above is very entertaining, humorous, witty and funny! It brought smile to

my mind.

> >

> > Best wishes,

> > ac

> >

>

>

> Thanks ac. I am pleased you enjoyed it.

>

> But it must tell you when wrting that post I was clenching my fists and with a

grimly face I was praying " Oh Lord, please help Dan to wake up and to recover

from his nondual neurosis and let him realize he is a human being of flesh and

blood and not just a nondual phrasing machine " .

>

>

>

> Werner

>

 

It's funny that with " Dan and the other nondualists " having a neurosis, Werner's

the one clenching his teeth grimly, hanging on, and praying to God.

 

[Guest guest]

Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033 wrote:

>

>

>

> Nisargadatta , " Tim G. " <fewtch@> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033@> wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Nisargadatta , " wwoehr " <wwoehr@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Nisargadatta , " dan330033 " <dan330033@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > And remind Werner that he is only dealing with the contents of his own

consciousness.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Wrong, Dan !

> > > >

> > > > The world of consciousness is the world we are communicating and

sharing. It is this sharing which builds up and constitutes society.

> > > >

> > > > You are the world and the world is you.

> > > >

> > > > You must know this expression of K, Dan, because already since 10 years

you are a member of the Krishnamurti list.

> > > >

> > > > Werner

> > >

> > > Werner, I'm quoting you. You who said everything is consciousness, and

consciousness is its contents.

> > >

> > > You've never followed through on what you yourself said.

> > >

> > > If you followed through on it, you'd realize that all your comments >

about what others are doing, are comments about the contents of

> > > your own consciousness.

> > >

> > > And the comments also are contents of your consciousness.

> > >

> > > But although you can say the words, you can't actually see this.

> >

> > It's amazing he can't see this simple fact.

> >

> > It's right out in the open, in plain view.

>

> Yes, it is.

>

> And although its obvious, it's defended against nonstop.

>

> Why?

>

> To keep a personal sense of existence going.

>

> To keep a stance vis a vis the imagined other.

>

> To keep " me " as " mine " and " not yours. "

>

> My words keep you away from me, and me away from you.

>

> And that is the payoff.

>

> With all the frustration involved in me vs you being misunderstood, and

projected outward as " something that is wrong with you. "

>

> - D -

>

 

It's funny how thought can " be out there " , imagine to " be out there with the

other " , and yet not be anywhere, not go anywhere. Nisargadatta put it this way:

 

" As the sun knows not darkness, so does the self know not the non-self. It is

the mind, which by knowing the other, becomes the other. Yet the mind is nothing

else but the self. It is the self that becomes the other, the not-self, and yet

remains the self. All else is an assumption. Just as a cloud obscures the sun

without in any way affecting it, so does assumption obscure reality without

destroying it. " -- from " I Am That "