Creation in the upanishads

[Guest guest]

Dear Dennis-ji,

 

This is in continuation of my prev. post. Gaudapada's statement that brahman

is neither cause nor effect is from the pAramArthica standpoint because then

there is nothing other than brahman. His statement that there is neither

bandha nor moksha is also from the pAramArthika standpoint. From the

vyAvahArika standpoint brahman is the cause of the universe.. Otherwise all

the statements of Sankara about brahman being nimitta kAraNa and upAdAna

kAraNa would have no meaning. This distinction of two standpoints is very

important.

 

Sastri

 

Just one point I would like to make to be pedantic. You say that: " The

description of creation, etc, in the upanishads is only to bring out the

truth that brahman, the cause, alone is real. " Does not Gaudapada in the

kArikA take pains to point out that brahman is kArya kAraNa vilakShaNa (free

from any cause-effect relationship)?

 

Best wishes,

Dennis

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

ether is all-pervading and without it nothing can exist, and as force,

symbolised by air, is also at the root of all movement, and nothing

can exist apart from it, therefore ether and air are to be taken for

granted along with fire, water and earth, and shruti speaks of

trivikaNa only as a more convenient mode of expression. Therefore the

shruti passages about trivikaraNa indirectly refer to panchIkaraNa "

 

praNAms Sri Vinayaka prabhuji

Hare Krishna

 

Interestingly, shankara in sUtra bhAshya categorises even ether as kArya,

hence avidyAkruta...He gives the example of sushupti for the *ether-less*

state. Moreover, in prashna it is said brahman created life, from life

faith, ether, air, light, water etc. have been created. Shankara talks

about trivikaraNa in sUtra bhAshya and says again it is only for the name

sake!! He says, after stating that fire, water and earth are the effect of

brahman, the shruti says that the effects of fire, water and earth donot

exist apart from fire, water and earth in these words. Shankara quotes the

subsequent maNtra from the chAndOgya which says : the fireness of fire has

gone away, for the effect is only a name conjured up by speech..etc.

 

AitarEya has an interesting narrative on the creation, it says Atman alone

in the beginning and nothing else (Atma vA idamEka yEvAgra Asit)sentient or

non-sentient...He thought (sa Ikshata) let me create the worlds!!! Here

shruti giving us the impression that Atman has a personified form & he has

the mind as an upAdhi to think about the creation & then created

accordingly...And if you see muNdaka shruti, it says brahman becomes fat in

the tapas of brooding and from it is born food (avyAkruta)...etc..brahman

becoming fat !! quite funny :-)) . But it is once again clear that it is

not the primary intention of shruti to propagate creation theory either

through trivikaraNa or paNchikaraNa...

 

Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!

bhaskar

[Guest guest]

advaitin , bhaskar.yr wrote:

But it is once again clear that it is

> not the primary intention of shruti to propagate creation theory

either

> through trivikaraNa or paNchikaraNa...

>

> Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!

> bhaskar

 

Dear Bhaskar Prabhuji,

 

praNAms,

 

Thanks for your reply with the relevant info. about the creation

mentioned in the upanishads. I was particulary interested in the

theory of panchikaraNa because when it was propogated in the west by

Swami Vivekananda for the first time, it was very much appreciated

by the leading scients of those days.

 

Here is a related excerpt from his letter:

 

" Mr. Tesla was charmed to hear about the Vedantic Prâna and Âkâsha

and the Kalpas, which according to him are the **only theories

modern science can entertain**. Now both Akasha and Prana again are

produced from the cosmic Mahat, the Universal Mind, the Brahmâ or

Ishvara. Mr. Tesla thinks he can demonstrate mathematically that

force and matter are reducible to potential energy (e=mc2?? which

was formulated later). I am to go and see him next week, to get this

new mathematical demonstration. "

 

It is very intersting to note that scientis have accpeted that space

is not an *empty thing* and they are calling it as *a positive

entity* called 'dark matter' which they are yet to understand fully.

Hope science reaches the coclusions of the vEdAnta one day on the

process of cration at least! :-))

 

Yours in Sri Ramakrishna,

 

Br. Vinayaka.