Ignorant Mind Asks ...

[Guest guest]

--- Gopinath Panduranga <brahmaprajna

wrote:

 

> Namaste Advaitins,

>

> Sloka:

> patram puspam phalam toyam yo me bhaktya prayacchati

> tad aham bhakty-upahrtam asnami prayatatmanah

.......

> above question more directly - " What would Lord

> Krishna/Bhagawan Ramana do,

> if he is offered with any non-sattvic food (ex.

> non-vegetarian food) as

> naivedya by a devotee? Will he eat? or will he not

> eat? "

 

 

Shree Gopinath,

 

Here is my understanding.

 

We need to look at the sloka very carefully - and

examine your question in the light of the sloka.

 

First and foremost thing is emphasis on Bhakti or

devotion. Yo me bhktyaa - with complete devotion.

 

I do not know if you have seen Ramayana Series where

Bharata goes to forest to request Rama to return back

- There Bharata's bhakti on one side and Rama's duty

on the other - Janaka was asked to judge. Please see

that (Ramananda series) again. It is an eye-opener.

Whenever I watch that scene I cannot contain myself -

I cry - Janaka declares Bhakti is superior to duty -

and that Bharata won - But there is fine print, as

Janaka points out. Bhakti involves complete

surrenderance. There are no more devotees’ wishes

here. What a devotee has to do in his complete

surrenderance is to do what Lord wants not what

devotee wants. Bharata learns what true bhakti means

- it is not demand by bhakta but surrender to the

wishes or desires of the Lord, whatever that may be.

That is true bhakti.

 

Hence Krishna, knowing very well these types of

questions, emphasized the fact that who ever offers

with Bhakti. As for as Lord is concerned, he cannot

eat since everything is Him only - Hence we chant

Brahmaarpanam BrahmahaviH.... Whatever we offer comes

back to us, he takes only the devotion. When

everything is His, what can we offer to him -

'tvadiiyam vastu Govindaa tubhyam eva samarpaye' - Oh

Lord everything is yours, but I am offering it to you

and what I am offering is my notion that this is

mine.- that is true offering to the Lord. our

ownership of things that we never really own.

 

For jnaani - we are offering to the local equipments

or upaadhiis. Then what we need to offer is what He

likes not what we like since He will be using the

local BMI (body, mind and intellect)to eat. Hence one

has to be careful what one offers to the Jnaani.

Otherwise there is no bhakti towards Jnaani and he

does not have to accept it when you are offering

something he does not like it - the like and dislikes

do not belong to Him but belongs to the prarabda

generated BMI. The food becomes satvic also by

devotion and prayer. It is not veg or non-veg etc but

it is absolute devotion at the alter that makes it

satvic. But if you hurt an animal and offer it to the

Lord, Lord who is there in the animal also, would he

appreciate it? Same goes to plants too. Please read an

article I wrote on Vegetarianism (may be Ram or sunder

give the ref to that post). Hence Lord demands 'sarva

bhuuta hite rataaH' - Treat all beings with kind and

Love since devotion to the Lord should manifest as

devotion to the whole universe of things and beings.

Is there a place where there is no Lord? That

understanding becomes true devotion.

 

With that devotion what else you can offer to the Lord

other than what He likes.

 

Hence Ramana Says - jagata iishadhiihi yukta sevanam -

the whole universe is the Lord and serve Him with full

devotion.

 

In the Bible if I remember - Lord blesses a devotee

since devotee helped the Lord when he needed it - The

devotee asked when I did I help you Lord? - The Lord

responds - when you have helped lowest of the lowest,

you are helping me. Whe are feeding the poorest of the

poorest, you are feeding me - What a beautiful

teaching.

 

The best offer one can give is ones Ego - even the

notion that I am offering has to be surrendered with

devotion.

 

Hari Om!

Sadananda

[Guest guest]

Dear Shri Gopinathji:

In addition to the post# 38349 of Sadanandaji, I request you to refer

to the following posts from Profvkji and 34184 and 34208 from

Dhyanasaraswathiji. Regards. Jan Nagraj

 

" Namaste

 

Regarding Shankara's concept of Bhakti and the story of

Kannappar illustrating it, one may see also the following three

postings of mine on 'Bhakti according to Shankara?:

Advaita-bhakti'.

advaitin/message/5298

advaitin/message/5300

advaitin/message/5307

dated 17, 18, 19, June 2000.

 

PraNAms to all advaitins

profvk "

 

 

 

 

advaitin , " Gopinath Panduranga "

<brahmaprajna wrote:

>

> Namaste Advaitins,

>

> Sloka:

> patram puspam phalam toyam yo me bhaktya prayacchati

> tad aham bhakty-upahrtam asnami prayatatmanah

> So here is the question ..

- " What would Lord Krishna/Bhagawan Ramana do,

> if he is offered with any non-sattvic food (ex. non-vegetarian

food) as

> naivedya by a devotee? Will he eat? or will he not eat? "

[Guest guest]

Namaste Sadanandaji,

 

You quoted as:

 

> For jnaani - we are offering to the local equipments

> or upaadhiis. Then what we need to offer is what He

> likes not what we like since He will be using the

> local BMI (body, mind and intellect)to eat. Hence one

> has to be careful what one offers to the Jnaani.

> Otherwise there is no bhakti towards Jnaani and he

> does not have to accept it when you are offering

> something he does not like it - the like and dislikes

> do not belong to Him but belongs to the prarabda

> generated BMI. The food becomes satvic also by

> devotion and prayer. It is not veg or non-veg etc but

> it is absolute devotion at the alter that makes it

> satvic.

 

Sadaji, I am a pure vegetarian and I offer my beloved Guru Saibaba of

Shirdi with the same during my daily prayers.

 

The question rosed in my mind, when I see people who sacrifice animals

and offer them as naivedya to various Gods represented as idols. Since

the idols do not show any sense of rejection or acception at that

time, the devotion towards the God will make us consider the food as

sanctified and is accepted by him. Considering this scenario, If Jnani

is offered the same food, you said that the chances of

rejection/acception is due to the prarabhda generated by his BMI. Does

this not show that Jnani also has food preferences, while he is beyond

duality?

 

Please clarify..

 

saipadaarpanamastu,

gopinath

[Guest guest]

--- Gopinath Panduranga <brahmaprajna >

>Considering this

> scenario, If Jnani

> is offered the same food, you said that the chances

> of

> rejection/acception is due to the prarabhda

> generated by his BMI. Does

> this not show that Jnani also has food preferences,

> while he is beyond

> duality?

>

> Please clarify..

>

> saipadaarpanamastu,

> gopinath

 

Shree gopinath - PraNAms

 

1. First question about God. I do not think God wants

people to sacrifice innocent animals to please them.

He prefers the people who are sacrificing to sacrifice

themselves to him not somebody (some body) else.

That is the real sacrifice with which the Gods are

pleased not innocent animals who cannot express their

voice of displeasure in the language that the

sacrificer can understand. People sacrifice others

instead of themselves. People do it does not justify

the so-called sacrifice. Anyway that is my opinion.

 

2. About the second question, the jnaani is the one

who has realized that the world is mithyaa. That does

not mean there is no value to the world. He does

discriminate the food vs garbage, poison vs

non-poison. Thus jnaanam does not negate the

transactional value of the world - He plays with the

world. If he was brought up with hot spicy Andhra food

from his childhood and after he has realized that does

not mean he will like any food, including all the time

sweet Gujarati food. He may enjoy the Andhra food

better than the Gujarati food. Jnaani enjoys the

world as much as the ajnaani does. The difference is

he does not give more importance than what it is

needed. He does not get burned by the world.

 

There is famous statement:

 

An ignorant fellow does not take life seriously.

An intelligent fellow seriously takes life seriously.

A wise man seriously does not take life seriously. He

plays the game of life as the scene demands.

 

If he is offered Gujarati sweet food he will take it

if it is eatable. If He is offered good hot Andhra

food he may relish it. If he does not have any food

for that day, he takes that the Lord wants him to do

upavaasam that day.

 

'duHkeshu anudvigna manaaH, sukhesu vagata spruhaH'

If unpleasant things come, he does not cry over and if

exciting things come he is not going to be jumping up

and down. He takes what it comes and act

appropriately giving whatever imporatance that is due.

 

 

Please read the book " Iswara Darshan " by Swami

Tapovanam. His autobiography.

 

If garbage is offered instead of food, jnaani is not

going to accept it. He disposes it off appropriately.

The same thing if you offer something he does not

like. Likes and dislikes now become his vibhuuti -

like snake as an ornament on Lord Shiva to decorate or

like water bed to sleep on. Snakes stand for vaasanas

or like and dislikes - they become glory of the Lord.

Same with jnaani.

 

 

Hari Om!

Sadananda

[Guest guest]

advaitin , " Gopinath Panduranga "

<brahmaprajna wrote:

>

> The question rose in my mind, when I see people who sacrifice

animals

> and offer them as naivedya to various Gods represented as idols.

Since

> the idols do not show any sense of rejection or acception at that

> time, the devotion towards the God will make us consider the food as

> sanctified and is accepted by him. Considering this scenario, If

Jnani

> is offered the same food, you said that the chances of

> rejection/acception is due to the prarabhda generated by his BMI.

Does

> this not show that Jnani also has food preferences, while he is

beyond

> duality?

 

Namaste,

 

The following words of a j~nAnI are worth bearing in mind:

 

http://kamakoti.org/newlayout/template/hindudharma.html/5/1/hindu/The+

Vedas

Ch 23,24,25)

The Purpose of Sacrifices

 

Is Sacrificial Killing Justified?

 

Animal Sacrifice in the Age of Kali

 

 

Ramana Maharshi would not eat anyrhing without sharing it

EQUALLY with everyone else present.

 

Ramakrishna Paramahamsa would only touch the sacrificial

naivedya with his finger and touch his tongue with it, so as not to

displease Kali (by refusing the prasada), his Ishta Devata.

 

Every Guru and every Shishya-sadhaka is unique in some ways, and

the latter's doubt can only be cleared by the former.

 

 

Regards,

 

Sunder

[Guest guest]

Namaste Sadanandaji,

 

You quoted as:

> 2. About the second question, the jnaani is the one

> who has realized that the world is mithyaa. That does

> not mean there is no value to the world. He does

> discriminate the food vs garbage, poison vs

> non-poison. Thus jnaanam does not negate the

> transactional value of the world - He plays with the

> world. If he was brought up with hot spicy Andhra food

> from his childhood and after he has realized that does

> not mean he will like any food, including all the time

> sweet Gujarati food. He may enjoy the Andhra food

> better than the Gujarati food. Jnaani enjoys the

> world as much as the ajnaani does. The difference is

> he does not give more importance than what it is

> needed. He does not get burned by the world.

> .....

 

> 'duHkeshu anudvigna manaaH, sukhesu vagata spruhaH'

> If unpleasant things come, he does not cry over and if

> exciting things come he is not going to be jumping up

> and down. He takes what it comes and act

> appropriately giving whatever imporatance that is due.

>

 

These statements really clarified my doubts I had in me for years.

Thanks for the answer which cut through my ignorance.

 

Dhanyavadam.

 

saipadaarpanamastu,

gopinath

[Guest guest]

Is it correct or not?

 

Kindly explain

 

Muveen

-

kuntimaddi sadananda

advaitin

Monday, December 03, 2007 6:39 AM

Re: Ignorant Mind Asks ...

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-

Muveen

advaitin

Monday, December 03, 2007 10:57 AM

Re: Re: Ignorant Mind Asks ...

 

 

Is it correct or not?

 

Kindly explain

 

Muveen

-

kuntimaddi sadananda

advaitin

Monday, December 03, 2007 6:39 AM

Re: Ignorant Mind Asks ...

[Guest guest]

AN OFFERING UNTO HIM!

 

You are offering to *a* jnAni!

Where do you get more than one

Other than in your phenomenal?

 

Isn't that ignorance?

Get rid of its awful burden.

Aloneness alone then shines.

Aloneness that is Wholeness.

 

Know that to be the true knowing One.

No one there now to offer or take,

Where offering and acceptance are not twine.

 

Bhakti is a boat.

It helps you traverse the phenomenal

On to the land of Knowledge,

Where there is no more any hither or thither,

And no traversing any further.

You don't yet give up the boat.

For it is now one with you.

Devotion is not other than you.

 

Offer anything unto Him fit,

You, the lover, have nothing unfit,

To the jnAni beyond opposites.

Likes and dislikes, cold and heat.

He has no choice but to accept it.

Yet, don't worry what he does with it.

 

And, if perchance he ignores your bit.

The blame rests squarely on you fit.

Offering is our worldly wont.

Ignorance our unwanted woe.

 

We look through coloured eyes

Cry for answers for the shades.

In the dual is give and take

The sad game separation plays

To keep us in thralldom

Away from our Kingdom.

Where offering and acceptance are never two

But the Timeless in eternal fusion.

 

OM PARASHAKTYAI NAMAHA

 

_________

 

PraNAms.

 

Madathil Nair

[Guest guest]

advaitin , " Gopinath Panduranga "

<brahmaprajna wrote:

 

Gopiniathji,

You asked:

" " What would Lord Krishna/Bhagawan Ramana do,

if he is offered with any non-sattvic food (ex. non-vegetarian food) as

naivedya by a devotee? Will he eat? or will he not eat? "

 

 

 

I do not know how a non-sattvic food is defined. Swami Vivekananda

once said that only a jnAni can determine the true quality of food,

noone else can.

But, the story of Shabri from Ramayana comes to mind, where Shri Rama

accepts the fruits which she offered even when they had been tasted

before.

 

Mirabai sums this up really beautifully in one of her bhajans. (IF

anyone has the original bhajan, please link it to me, I am providing a

translation here.)

----

The plums tasted

sweet to the unlettered desert-tribe girl-

but what manners! To chew into each!

 

She was ungainly, low-caste, ill mannered and dirty,

but the god took the fruit she'd been sucking.

 

 

Why? She knew how to love.

She might not distinquish

splendor from filth

but she'd tasted the nectar of passion.

 

 

Might not know any Veda,

but a chariot swept her away-

now she frolics in heaven, esctatically bound

to her god.

 

 

The Lord of Fallen Fools, says Mira,

will save anyone who can practice rapture like that-

I myself in a previous birth

was a cowherding girl

at Gokul.

 

- Mirabai

 

 

http://www.poetseers.org/the_poetseers/mirabai/poems/the_plums_tasted

 

Hari Om.

~Vaibhav.

[Guest guest]

Namaste,

It all depends on the attitude of the offerer. Remember, Shabari, who offered

tasted fruits one by one to Lord Rama Who accepted them.

Warm regards

Mani

 

 

 

 

 

 

R. S. Mani

 

 

 

Be a better pen pal. Text or chat with friends inside Mail. See how.

 

 

[Guest guest]

Namaste Vaibhav-ji.

 

Your message 38360.

 

Beautiful! Whose translation is it?

____

 

Namaste all.

 

In my post 38359, please replace the typo " twine " with " twain " .

 

_____

 

PraNAms.

 

Madthil Nair

____________

 

advaitin , " vskhire " <vskhire wrote:

>

> Mirabai sums this up really beautifully in one of her bhajans. (IF

> anyone has the original bhajan, please link it to me, I am providing a

> translation here.)

>

[Guest guest]

hare krishna,namaskarams

 

<Gopinath Panduranga <brahmaprajna wrote:

 

" What would Lord Krishna/Bhagawan Ramana do,if he is offered with any

non-sattvic food (ex. non-vegetarian food) asnaivedya by a devotee? Will he eat?

or will he not eat? " Please pardon me for asking such a crazy question

saipadaarpanamastu,gopinath>

 

in the sloka you referred lord krishna says that whatever is offered to him with

love and devotion is accepted by him and he blesses such a devotee.you must be

aware of the story of Kannappa nayanar of Sri Kalahasthi who as a hunter offered

meat tasted by him and did the abishekam with water he brought in his mouth and

was blessed by Lord Shiva and attained moksha.

 

it is not what you offer but how it is offered,wiht what intention ,to what you

seek through it.for a true devotee everything goes beyond any of the rules and

regulations.

 

may lord krishna bles us all.

 

baskaran

 

 

 

 

 

 

BASKARAN.C.S

 

 

 

Forgot the famous last words? Access your message archive online.

 

 

[Guest guest]

Nairji,

I do not know whose translation it is, I found it only on the website I linked.

If I find it, I will let you know.

Pranam,

~Vaibhav.

 

 

 

Madathil Rajendran Nair <madathilnair wrote:

Namaste Vaibhav-ji.

 

Your message 38360.

 

Beautiful! Whose translation is it?

____

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Save all your chat conversations. Find them online.

 

 

[Guest guest]

Note from List Moderators: We request you and other new members

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Sadananda ji,

 

Subh Prabhat,

 

I Have received below mentioned scripture by a brother,

 

and i just want to clear that it is correct or not..kindly clear the

confustion.

 

BEEF EATING IN HINDU SCRIPTURES

 

Lord Indra used to eat beef

 

" Men with the stone press out for thee, O Indra, strong, gladdening Soma,

and thereof thou drinkest. Bulls they dress for thee, and of these thou

eatest when, Maghavan, with food thou art invited. " [Rig-Veda 10:28:3]

 

" [indra:] Fifteen in number, then, for me a score of bullocks they prepare,

And I devour the fat thereof: they fill my belly full with food. Supreme is

Indra over all. " [Rig-Veda 10:86:14]

 

Lord Rama used to eat meat

 

Lord Rama laments to his mom (Kausalya) that he is going to be exiled from

the palace at Ayodhya into the forest for fourteen years, and he explains

how he will be missing eating meat as he is so accustomed to at the palace:

 

" [Rama:] I must to lonely wilds repair, abstain from flesh, and living there

on roots, fruit, honey, hermit's food, pass twice seven years (14 yrs.) in

solitude. To Bharat's hand the king will yield the regent power I thought to

wield, and me, a hermit, will he send my days in Dandak wood to spend. "

[Ramayana 2:20]

 

" Meat is indeed the best kind of food. " [satapatha Brahmana 11:7:1:3; cf.

12:8:3:12]

 

 

 

Muveen

 

 

 

-

" kuntimaddi sadananda " <kuntimaddisada

[Guest guest]

advaitin , " Muveen " <muveen wrote:

>

> Sadananda ji,

>

> Subh Prabhat,

>

> I Have received below mentioned scripture by a brother,

>

> and i just want to clear that it is correct or not..kindly clear the

> confustion.

>

> BEEF EATING IN HINDU SCRIPTURES

>

> Lord Indra used to eat beef

>

> " Men with the stone press out for thee, O Indra, strong, gladdening

Soma,

> " Meat is indeed the best kind of food. " [satapatha Brahmana

11:7:1:3; cf.

> 12:8:3:12]

>

>

>

> Muveen

>

 

 

Sri Muveenji, Namaskarams,

 

Probably it depends on the particular standpoint from which you

address the question. Anyone in favour of eating meat or killing

animals can argue along the lines of Bhagavad Gita Chp 2. The Self

does not die, cannot be slain, etc. Here you have the power of the

entire philosophy at your disposal; the other quotes you give are

begging of the surrender of rationality and blind worship of

smrithi/mythology-oriented scripture.

 

You can also argue that plants feel, rocks feel, bacterias are

everywhere, etc. So killing everyone does anyway, therefore killing

cows, goats, pigs, mice, etc is justified. That is fine, but then

don't preach of the speciality of humans either, and on love,

compassion, brotherhood and all that play on human-weakness.

 

For me, I can rationally feel a sense of oneness with animals like

cow, etc. They have senses, eat, drink, sleep, feel pain, desire to

live, etc. That is sufficient; I don't want to brainwash myself with

high-sounding philosophy and lose this little grasp of unity that I

have at present. If not killing them is possible, I should abide by

that.

 

thollmelukaalkizhu

[Guest guest]

--- putranm <putranm wrote:

 

 

> For me, I can rationally feel a sense of oneness

> with animals like

> cow, etc. They have senses, eat, drink, sleep, feel

> pain, desire to

> live, etc. That is sufficient; I don't want to

> brainwash myself with

> high-sounding philosophy and lose this little grasp

> of unity that I

> have at present. If not killing them is possible, I

> should abide by

> that.

 

Shree Putranmji - PraNAms

You have answered the question beautifully and I have

nothing more to add. I wrote an article on Hinduism

and vegitarianism many years ago which was republished

in different formats - recent one by Harshaji and

posted in this list.

 

Hari Om!

Sadananda

[Guest guest]

Namaste Putranji,

 

Muveenji sought clarification objectively. In fact he didn't express

what he feels about meat eating in the post and in fact he mentioned

he was confused. To convert the discussion into a subjective one would

betray the evidence that Muveenji has provided. Discussing repulsive

topics (not to all though) like this one could help a mumuksu remove

sobhana adhyasa (superimposing goodness or beauty). Just my 2cents

worth.

 

On Dec 5, 2007 2:10 PM, putranm <putranm wrote:

 

> Sri Muveenji, Namaskarams,

>

> Probably it depends on the particular standpoint from which you

> address the question. Anyone in favour of eating meat or killing

> animals can argue along the lines of Bhagavad Gita Chp 2. The Self

> does not die, cannot be slain, etc. Here you have the power of the

> entire philosophy at your disposal; the other quotes you give are

> begging of the surrender of rationality and blind worship of

> smrithi/mythology-oriented scripture.

>

> You can also argue that plants feel, rocks feel, bacterias are

> everywhere, etc. So killing everyone does anyway, therefore killing

> cows, goats, pigs, mice, etc is justified. That is fine, but then

> don't preach of the speciality of humans either, and on love,

> compassion, brotherhood and all that play on human-weakness.

>

> For me, I can rationally feel a sense of oneness with animals like

> cow, etc. They have senses, eat, drink, sleep, feel pain, desire to

> live, etc. That is sufficient; I don't want to brainwash myself with

> high-sounding philosophy and lose this little grasp of unity that I

> have at present. If not killing them is possible, I should abide by

> that.

>

> thollmelukaalkizhu

>

>

[Guest guest]

advaitin , " Muveen " <muveen wrote:

>

> I Have received below mentioned scripture by a brother,

>

> and i just want to clear that it is correct or not..kindly clear the

> confustion.

 

Sri Muveenji, in the light of Sri Karthirasanji's post to me, you are

quite possibly right regarding the particular quotations. One

particular point to note here: your quotes regarding Indra and Rama

can be taken as statements particular to Kshatriyas (the warriors)

who on account of their work took meat. In fact, there may also be

quotes of Brahmanas (the priests) taking meat and animal sacrifices

were part of the rituals (I have not read the earlier discussions on

this). I have read of famous Hindus to have quoted such things, and

the arguments (in favour of killing/eating animals) I have given are

used by Hindus themselves: and my slight repartees were directed to

them as well.

 

However do not be surprised to find a list of alternate quotations

coming out of Hindu scriptures denouncing the killing of animals for

eating meat. Here is an example Hindu site giving bunches of such

quotes.

 

http://www.himalayanacademy.com/resources/pamphlets/WinMeatEaterArgume

nt.html

 

Then we get into arguing over our favoured scriptures and

personalities.

 

The fact is not that the Hindu sages required all to be vegetarians

or not; rather they recognized variety in human nature/tendencies and

gave room for those who (need to) eat meat and those who can forgo

it. In such SECONDARY topics, our society is not fixed on a

particular scripture; it grows and evolves as guided by the saints of

each era who exemplify the ideals, and the present sages' (not all)

examples of non-meat eating is as relevant to the Hindus of today as

contrary examples were in the past. And we are free to discuss

rationally any and every such topic; quoting scriptures has only

partial use then (see for instance, how I dismissed your quotes in my

previous post).

 

thollmelukaalkizhu

 

 

>

> BEEF EATING IN HINDU SCRIPTURES

>

> Lord Indra used to eat beef

>

> " Men with the stone press out for thee, O Indra, strong, gladdening

Soma,

> and thereof thou drinkest. Bulls they dress for thee, and of these

thou

> eatest when, Maghavan, with food thou art invited. " [Rig-Veda

10:28:3]

>

> " [indra:] Fifteen in number, then, for me a score of bullocks they

prepare,

> And I devour the fat thereof: they fill my belly full with food.

Supreme is

> Indra over all. " [Rig-Veda 10:86:14]

>

> Lord Rama used to eat meat

>

> Lord Rama laments to his mom (Kausalya) that he is going to be

exiled from

> the palace at Ayodhya into the forest for fourteen years, and he

explains

> how he will be missing eating meat as he is so accustomed to at the

palace:

>

> " [Rama:] I must to lonely wilds repair, abstain from flesh, and

living there

> on roots, fruit, honey, hermit's food, pass twice seven years (14

yrs.) in

> solitude. To Bharat's hand the king will yield the regent power I

thought to

> wield, and me, a hermit, will he send my days in Dandak wood to

spend. "

> [Ramayana 2:20]

>

> " Meat is indeed the best kind of food. " [satapatha Brahmana

11:7:1:3; cf.

> 12:8:3:12]

>

>

>

> Muveen

>

>

>

> -

> " kuntimaddi sadananda " <kuntimaddisada

>

[Guest guest]

Namaste Kathirasanji:

 

You have raised an interesting point that why we are obligated to

treat messages sent by members such as Muveenji seriously and clear

those doubts. Your point is well taken and what you have said is

certainly worth more than two cents. I do agree that at the

paramarthika level(ultimate reality) there are no distinctions

between right and wrong, good and bad, joy and pain, etc. However we

do need to sharpen our discriminating mind while answering messages

such as from Muveenji with subjective objectivity.

 

Honestly speaking, he is not confused but he wants to use his

scholarship to raise questions to embarass the believers of Hinduism.

As a moderator of this list, I have seen many avatars of Muveens who

appear to inject messages with the primary purpsoe to divert the list

focus from philosophical discussions. The tone of his message

(posting just one side of the coin and by hiding the other side) do

not indicate that he is confused. (Previous avatars also just post

irrelevent questions and disappear without participating in the

discussions)

 

Bhagavad Gita contains detailed discussions on the potential

association between food habits and Gunas (human tendencies or

qualities) in the later chapters. Unlike other religions, Hinduism is

an evolving religion and is always willing to accept changes that are

appropriate to time and environment. I suggest the article by Sadaji

for an objective view of Vegetarinism:

 

2007/06/06/hinduism-and-vegetarianism-by-dr-k-

sadananda/.

 

With my warmest regards,

 

Ram Chandran

 

 

advaitin , " K Kathirasan " <brahmasatyam

wrote:

>

> Namaste Putranji,

>

> Muveenji sought clarification objectively. In fact he didn't express

> what he feels about meat eating in the post and in fact he mentioned

> he was confused. To convert the discussion into a subjective one

would

> betray the evidence that Muveenji has provided.

 

> Namaste Putranji,

>

> Muveenji sought clarification objectively. In fact he didn't express

> what he feels about meat eating in the post and in fact he mentioned

> he was confused. To convert the discussion into a subjective one

would

> betray the evidence that Muveenji has provided. Discussing repulsive

> topics (not to all though) like this one could help a mumuksu remove

> sobhana adhyasa (superimposing goodness or beauty). Just my 2cents

> worth.

>

> On Dec 5, 2007 2:10 PM, putranm <putranm wrote:

>

> > Sri Muveenji, Namaskarams,

> >

> > Probably it depends on the particular standpoint from which you

> > address the question. Anyone in favour of eating meat or killing

> > animals can argue along the lines of Bhagavad Gita Chp 2. The

Self

> > does not die, cannot be slain, etc. Here you have the power of

the

> > entire philosophy at your disposal; the other quotes you give are

> > begging of the surrender of rationality and blind worship of

> > smrithi/mythology-oriented scripture.

> >

> > You can also argue that plants feel, rocks feel, bacterias are

> > everywhere, etc. So killing everyone does anyway, therefore

killing

> > cows, goats, pigs, mice, etc is justified. That is fine, but then

> > don't preach of the speciality of humans either, and on love,

> > compassion, brotherhood and all that play on human-weakness.

> >

> > For me, I can rationally feel a sense of oneness with animals

like

> > cow, etc. They have senses, eat, drink, sleep, feel pain, desire

to

> > live, etc. That is sufficient; I don't want to brainwash myself

with

> > high-sounding philosophy and lose this little grasp of unity

that I

> > have at present. If not killing them is possible, I should abide

by

> > that.

> >

> > thollmelukaalkizhu

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

advaitin , " Muveen " <muveen wrote:

> BEEF EATING IN HINDU SCRIPTURES

>

> Lord Indra used to eat beef

 

 

Namashkaar,

 

I donot have much to add after more knowledgeable people have

replied than quoting the following verse from from the famous

Asya Vamiya Sukta of the Rig Veda Samhita.

 

1.164.39 Upon what syllable of holy praise-song, as twere their

highest heaven, the Gods repose them, Who knows not this, what

will he do with praise-song? But they who know it well sit here

assembled. [And this I am not giving the translation of Griffith

himself!!!]

 

Some out of context verses, wherever they are from, are

meaningless. The Hindu scriptures are not for everyone, and

certainly not for light reading. The meaning has to be

searched deep within.

 

If you want further modern day research, please read the

excellent books by Shri Aurobindo.

 

In this same advaitin list, Shri Dave had posted a series of

articles on Rig Veda. The files are available from the files

section.

advaitinRig-Veda/

 

Namashkaar,

Ramakrishna

[Guest guest]

Note from the List Moderators: Members are once again reminded to keep their

message compact by removing unnecessary portions of the previous poster's

message. Members should also note that in order to access the files at the List

archives:

advaitinRig-Veda/

you do need to get an ID - required by the .

 

-

Muveen

advaitin

Friday, December 07, 2007 10:46 AM

Re: Re: Ignorant Mind Asks ...

 

 

Some out of context verses, wherever they are from, are

meaningless. The Hindu scriptures are not for everyone, and

certainly not for light reading. The meaning has to be

searched deep within.

 

Religion Scriptures has nothing meaningless, just you are unable to understand

so why you told that verses are meaningless and Religion Scriptures should be

for everyone.. Bodh Scriptures for everyone Jain Scriptures for everyone. If

you have not any knowledge regarding this then don't to try to prove it

meaningless..

 

If you want further modern day research, please read the

excellent books by Shri Aurobindo.

 

Yes, I want to read that book which u have mentioned here.

 

In this same advaitin list, Shri Dave had posted a series of

articles on Rig Veda. The files are available from the files

section.

advaitinRig-Veda/

 

This is my humble request to you kindly send me the these files as attachment

due to I am unable to open this link at my office and i have not any computer at

my home again my humble request.

 

Muveen

 

 

-

Ramakrishna Upadrasta

advaitin