World is neither real nor unreal - it is called mithyaa

[Guest guest]

--- hsin_shang <hsin_shang wrote:

> hsin: World is unreal in the sense that man's as ego lives his

> ambitions, hopes, pleasures and pain.

 

Hsin - PraNAms

 

Here is Shankara's description of advaitic concept - Brahma satyam - jagat

mithyaa -

jivaH brahman eva na aparH.

Brahman is real, the world is mithyaa - and mithyaa is defined as sat asat

vilakshaNam -

neither real nor unreal.

Individual soul is none other than Brahman.

 

Real is defined as that which remains the same all the time - that which does

not undergo

any change - that alone is real.

 

Unreal is that which has no locus for existence at any time - the classical

example is

son of a barren woman. Unreal therefore has no existence and therefore can never

be

experienced.

 

World does not come under the category of real since it is changing continuously

- the

Sanskrit word is jagat - meaning jaayate gacchate iti - that which comes and

goes - day

in and day out.

 

World does not come under the category of unreal either since it is all the time

experienced.

 

When an actor playig a role of a begger in a drama - is the role real or unreal.

He is

not really a begger and the same time is dressed like a begger and being kicked

left and

right by the other characters and every body watching the scene are crying too.

Hence

begger is not unreal since he is experienced. But the real truth is he is actor

and who

is millioner and making more millions because of all that kicking but playing

the role of

begger for fun - everybody's fun. He is enjoying too.

Of course, he forgets that he is really actor playing the role of a begger and

behaves

like one even outside the scene, we have a REAL problem. He has to be taken to

mental

hospital

 

That is also our problem - not with the world nor with Brahman -not with Vedanta

either

-All Vedanta is telling us is look more carefully what you are- all your

problmes are

centered on not seeing properly what is our real nature.

 

Upanishad define creation is transformationless transformation like gold

becoming a ring,

bangle, etc. Gold remains gold in this transformation yet we have varieties of

ornaments

- ring, bangle, necklace, bracelet, etc. Each one is different yet the

substantive of all

is nothing but Gold - From gold point there is no transformation since it was

gold, it is

gold and it remains gold even if ring transforms in to a bangle.

 

Mithyaa is that which appears to be there but it is not really as it appears. If

we take

the appearance as real and forget the real all the problems in the world becomes

our

problems. In the analysis of the ego, I am this is what exactly pointed when I

take

myself as 'this' which is a changing entity while I am is the changeless

substratum.

 

All the problems in the world become only apparent problems not real problems to

deal

with if we shift our attention to the substantive rather than worry about

superficial

problems.

 

I did not participate in the discussion on what does Vedanta speak - because the

emphasis

is wrongly placed. All Vedanta says is look at the world correctly not with

delusory

eyes. Then you see the vibhuuti of the Lord in all its glory. All problems in

the world

become real problem to deal with if we forget the substantive and worry about

the

superficialities - that is what Vedanta wants us too see the problem in correct

perspective.

 

Just my 2C

 

Hari Om!

Sadananda

[Guest guest]

Greeting Sadananda Sir

 

Thank you for replying.

 

Any explanation is as good as the other.

 

" Therefore the highest teachings are wordless. My own words are not

the medicine, but a prescription; not the destination, but a map to

help you reach it. " Lao Tzu -Hua Hu Ching:31

 

hsin

 

In advaitin , kuntimaddi sadananda

<kuntimaddisada wrote:

>

> Hsin - PraNAms

>

> Here is Shankara's description of advaitic concept - Brahma

satyam - jagat mithyaa -

> jivaH brahman eva na aparH.

> Brahman is real, the world is mithyaa - and mithyaa is defined as

sat asat vilakshaNam -

> neither real nor unreal.

> Individual soul is none other than Brahman.

>

> Real is defined as that which remains the same all the time - that

which does not undergo

> any change - that alone is real.

>

> Unreal is that which has no locus for existence at any time - the

classical example is

> son of a barren woman. Unreal therefore has no existence and

therefore can never be

> experienced.

>

> World does not come under the category of real since it is

changing continuously - the

> Sanskrit word is jagat - meaning jaayate gacchate iti - that which

comes and goes - day

> in and day out.

>

> World does not come under the category of unreal either since it

is all the time

> experienced.

>

> When an actor playig a role of a begger in a drama - is the role

real or unreal. He is

> not really a begger and the same time is dressed like a begger and

being kicked left and

> right by the other characters and every body watching the scene

are crying too. Hence

> begger is not unreal since he is experienced. But the real truth

is he is actor and who

> is millioner and making more millions because of all that kicking

but playing the role of

> begger for fun - everybody's fun. He is enjoying too.

> Of course, he forgets that he is really actor playing the role of

a begger and behaves

> like one even outside the scene, we have a REAL problem. He has to

be taken to mental

> hospital

>

> That is also our problem - not with the world nor with Brahman -

not with Vedanta either

> -All Vedanta is telling us is look more carefully what you are-

all your problmes are

> centered on not seeing properly what is our real nature.

>

> Upanishad define creation is transformationless transformation

like gold becoming a ring,

> bangle, etc. Gold remains gold in this transformation yet we have

varieties of ornaments

> - ring, bangle, necklace, bracelet, etc. Each one is different yet

the substantive of all

> is nothing but Gold - From gold point there is no transformation

since it was gold, it is

> gold and it remains gold even if ring transforms in to a bangle.

>

> Mithyaa is that which appears to be there but it is not really as

it appears. If we take

> the appearance as real and forget the real all the problems in the

world becomes our

> problems. In the analysis of the ego, I am this is what exactly

pointed when I take

> myself as 'this' which is a changing entity while I am is the

changeless substratum.

>

> All the problems in the world become only apparent problems not

real problems to deal

> with if we shift our attention to the substantive rather than

worry about superficial

> problems.

>

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PranAms,

 

" When an actor playig a role of a begger in a drama - is the role real or

unreal. He is not really a begger ... " In a way, we all are actors of a drama

and this drama is directed by the Almighty. Whatever we do on this earth is

prompted by Him. The 'sufferings' that Mr. Ramesam mentioned is nothing, but

His Lila from which we cannot have escape. Even His ardent devotees and with

whom He had very close relations had to undergo the so-called 'sufferings'.

Lord Krishna's close friend Sudama too had to undergo the 'sufferings' even

though his faith in Lord was rock solid.

 

This whole world, its living and non-living bearings are all His charactors.

If we submit to Him completely, I think we have no reason to complain about

anything that is happening around us, which all infact is Maya. When the whole

unverse is a Maya, why should we get unduly worried about the happenings?

Since, all Hindus believe in the 'karma phala' if somebody is suffering, we must

understand that it is his Karma phala. It is not only human beings are

sufferings, but also other flora and fauna. You cannot expect everthing to be

perfect all time. If that happens, I think that is the end of the universe.

Everything in this world have to be imperfect or else we will lose our urge to

live, we will lose our fighting spirit, and lastly but not leastly we will start

questionintg the very existence of God. If everyting goes on smoothly, who need

God? Even the aeithists call Him when they are in trouble.

 

So, let the universe be so what it is meant to be. We cannot interfere in his

Lilas. Those who knows the truth will have no qualm over anything. Those whom

have evern the slightest of doubt will have more questions to ask and they try

to seek answers for the same. Everyone cannot reach the same level of

spirituality. Although I have not read anyting and my knowledge is very

limited, these are my views. My only knowledge is that there is nothing in this

world except Brahman and it is with His command and knowledge that everything is

happening in this world.

 

Babu

 

 

 

kuntimaddi sadananda <kuntimaddisada wrote:

 

--- hsin_shang <hsin_shang wrote:

> hsin: World is unreal in the sense that man's as ego lives his

> ambitions, hopes, pleasures and pain.