Basic questions from a beginner...

[Guest guest]

Hari Om!

 

Thank you for arranging this possibility to be able to learn

and share thoughts about Advaita. I ‘m a beginner starting to discover Advaita

and the Vedantic traditions. I have some questions that I would like to share

and hope for your patience and help in correcting my limited understanding.

 

A)

The four stages of consciousness, I ve understood to be

1) Awake

2) Asleep

3) Deep sleep (beyond vasanas)

4) Turiya (the existence we are in all the time without

realizing it- sheer being- experience of Nirvikalpa Samadhi)

 

What are the Sanskrit words for the states of being awake,

asleep and deep sleep? And: could anyone describe the state of being awake and

asleep- what are the differences, since I experience these in maya? In the state

of deep sleep I ve understood that my consciousness is freed from vasanas

achieved by this and all previous existences. Is this correct? In that case, am

I still in maya, or do I experience existence beyond maya? If anyone assist me

in explaining these four states of consciousness I would be deeply grateful.

 

B)

Savikalpa = what does the words in Sanskrit mean?

 

C)

I ve read a very good basic book about Advaita called “Vedanta-heart of

Hinduism” by Torwesten. When I read that, I understand it as if Torwesten

describes the four yogas to be:

1) Karma Yoga, 2) Bhakti Yoga, 3) Jnana Yoga and 4) Raja

Yoga. Is this a correct understanding of the Yogas in

Hinduism? He describes Raja Yoga as

systematic exercises to attain realization. I get confused as new in this

field: where does Hatha Yoga belong? I ve understood Raja

Yoga to be a specific Hindu devotional group (Brahmakumaris)?

 

 

D)

Sadhana, I ve understood to be specific spiritual disciplines. Is Sadhana a

part of Brahmacharya or a part of Raja Yoga?

 

 

E)

Regarding Jnana Yoga- I ve read about the Four means to salvation as:

Viveka, Vairagya, Shad-sampat (the six virtues, of which I wonder about the

Sanskrit name for Tranquility, that I ve understood to be ‘control of the mind’)

and Mumukshutva.

Since I m also interested in Christian spiritual discipline, I wonder if there

in Advaita and Vedantic literature are any more specific virtues to live with

as Advaitin. In that case, could you help me explain them, also with their

Sanskrit names?

 

 

Thank you again for your patience....

 

Blessings,

 

Anasuya

[Guest guest]

Anasuya Jonsson - PraNAms

 

You have raised lot of questions that cover the whole of Vedanta. My suggestion

to you is look into the web site www.advaita.org.uk - Shree Dennis Waite has

many topics discussed in that - There is an introduction to Vedanta consisting

of 20+ posts that I posted to this list - he has edited and is available for

study and down load. Many of the questions you raise are answered there. In

brief:

 

 

 

--- On Sat, 6/21/08, Anasuya Jonsson <anasuyamaria wrote:

 

- answers are provided next to the questions:

A)

The four stages of consciousness, I ve understood to be

1) Awake - Jaagrat avastha - waking state

2) Asleep - svapana avastha - dream state

3) Deep sleep (beyond vasanas)- suShupti avastha - deep sleep state - it is not

beyond vasanas - It is where one identifies with pure vaasanas or ignorance -

since I have no knowledge of anything in deep sleep state.

4) Turiya (the existence we are in all the time without realizing it- sheer

being- experience of Nirvikalpa Samadhi)- Turiya is called fourth state but it

is not really fourth since it pervades all the three states - it is stateless

state that pervades all the three states and is called as fourth only to

differentiate from the other three where there is identification as I am a

waker, dreamer or deep sleeper. In turiiya I am just shifting my attention to

myself which is pure existence-consciousness. It is not experience of any since

it is beyond experience-experiencer-experiencing triality. It is nirvikalapa in

spite of vikalpa or in spite of any thoughts. It is not therefore absence of

thoughts but recognition or understanding that thoughts rise in me, sustained by

me and go back into me - and I am beyond the thoughts that come and go - I AM -

is the way.

------------------

 

What are the Sanskrit words for the states of being awake, asleep and deep

sleep?

 

 

And: could anyone describe the state of being awake and asleep- what are the

differences, since I experience these in maya? In the state of deep sleep I ve

understood that my consciousness is freed from vasanas achieved by this and all

previous existences. Is this correct?

 

---------

There is plurality in both waking and dream states - seer-seen distinctions

exist - I take these distinctions as real due to ignorance. Ignorance includes -

non-apprehension of myself and then mis-apprehension of myself to be this or

that. - both aspects are maaya as discussed in other post yesterday.

 

--------

In that case, am I still in maya, or do I experience existence beyond maya? If

anyone assist me in explaining these four states of consciousness I would be

deeply grateful.

-----------

Any experience is maaya - that I am experiencer beyond experiences is the

knowledge. In the waking state - identifying myself with this limited

body-mind-intellect - I see the world separate from me and I transact with the

world with that notion - I take myself to be a doer - enjoyer and therefore

sufferer etc - although doing-enjoying and suffering belong to prakriti - the

nature which is maaya. In deep sleep state - I project the world of plurality

and again forget that I am the one who created the dream world and take myself

to be a tiny subject and deal with the world gathering or exhausting the

vaasanas (suppressions and oppressions gathered in the waking state - it is an

exhaustive mechanism).

In deep sleep state I identify only with the vaasanas or causal state - where

there is no projection but pure ignorance- I do not know - is the running theme.

I am existent-consciousness - or witnessing agent in all the three states

-witnessing the waking state - witnessing dream state and witnessing deep sleep

state - but I am beyond the three state - I am neither sleeper nor a waker - I

am ever present conscious entity - I say I slept very well - I was there to

sleep very well. But since mind is not there in deep sleep state that sleep

experience is recorded only as absence of mind. Absence of mind means absence of

objective knowledge - hence I say I did not know anything in deep sleep state -

no space no time - but I am there to know that there is no space and no time.

 

B)

Savikalpa = what does the words in Sanskrit mean?

 

vikalpa involves projection of the mind - thinker- thought duality. sa means

together - hence I AM together with thoughts of duality - is savikalpa

 

C)

I ve read a very good basic book about Advaita called “Vedanta-heart of

Hinduism†by Torwesten. When I read that, I understand it as if Torwesten

describes the four yogas to be:

1) Karma Yoga, 2) Bhakti Yoga, 3) Jnana Yoga and 4) Raja Yoga .

------------

Raja yoga term became popular after Vivekananda. Actually the first three are

three yogas that are described in Gita. If I understand correctly patanjali yoga

is brought in as part of raja yoga.

 

---------------------

Is this a correct understanding of the Yogas in Hinduism? He describes Raja

Yoga as systematic exercises to attain realization. I get confused as new in

this field: where does Hatha Yoga belong? I ve understood Raja Yoga to be a

specific Hindu devotional group (Brahmakumaris) ?

 

----------

Yoga involves sadhana or spiritual practice. Actually Krishna talks about two

yogas only in Giita - karma and jnaana - Bhakti is devotion and it is underlying

theme for both yogas. Bhakti is needed for the fulfillment of karma and jnaana.

There is no separate raja yoga. There is upaasana that includes meditation as

part of both yogas. Upaasana can be separated as part of bhakti yoga as part of

ritual but that is involves karma at body level and meditation at the mind

level.

 

HaTha yoga - as physical exercise is only to inculcate the physical discipline

needed to keep the body and mind in shape to make it ready for karma and jnaana

yoga - One can include pranaayaama and pratyaahaara - breathing exercises etc as

part of preparatory for keeping the mind study so that it can do jnaana yoga - a

disturbed mind cannot learn anything, much less Vedanta.

 

 

D)

Sadhana, I ve understood to be specific spiritual disciplines. Is Sadhana a part

of Brahmacharya or a part of Raja Yoga ?

 

Sadhana is preparing the mind or purifying the mind - it is part of any yoga -

karma yoga - upaasna yoga and jnaana yoga - Disciplining the body-mind-intellect

is saadhana - the essential goal is purification of the mind. yoginaH karma

kurvanti sangham tyaktvaa aatma suddhaye - yogies perform action to purify the

mind, by renouncing the attachments.

------------------

E)

Regarding Jnana Yoga- I ve read about the Four means to salvation as:

Viveka, Vairagya, Shad-sampat (the six virtues, of which I wonder about the

Sanskrit name for Tranquility, that I ve understood to be ‘control of the

mind’) and Mumukshutva.

 

- these four not means not for realization but requisites in preparing the mind

for contemplation on the nature of reality.

Realization is self-evident fact. Three is nothing to realize since I am

existent-consciousness - but right now due to misunderstanding I take myself as

I am existence as this and I am conscious of this etc -not pure

existence-consciousness which is unlimited while this or that is limited. The

above four prepare the mind to make it free from wrong notions about myself and

Vedanta teaches that you are that what you are seeking - that knowledge sinks

in.

-------------------------

 

Since I m also interested in Christian spiritual discipline, I wonder if there

in Advaita and Vedantic literature are any more specific virtues to live with as

Advaitin. In that case, could you help me explain them, also with their Sanskrit

names?

 

 

There is no problem - There are books available in explaining - say Sermon on

the Mount - in terms of advaitic understanding - I think Ramakrishna mission

has published one or two.

 

All religions teach the same values - be good to others - others include all

beings. What you expect others not to do to you, you should not do to others -

like you expect others not to tell you lies, not to steal your property - not to

hurt you physically, mentally etc.

What you expect others do to you, you should do to others - you expect others to

be kind to you, forgive your mistakes, be helpful, etc, etc.

 

All these help in the purification of the mind - blessed are those whose minds

are pure - the pure mind alone can see the kingdom of heaven in ones heart. He

resides in the heart - and heart of the individual is I Am - which is the very

essence of all biodata - I am this I am that etc - Hence Jesus statement - I AM

- is the way. Hence if you understand the teaching in proper perspective all

teaching culminate to the same truth.

 

I urge you to study " I am That " but Nisargadatta majaraj - this is not a book to

read but to contemplate and meditate on.

 

 

Hope this helps.

 

Hari Om!

Sadananda

[Guest guest]

advaitin , Anasuya Jonsson <anasuyamaria wrote:

 

> Since I m also interested in Christian spiritual discipline, I

wonder if there

> in Advaita and Vedantic literature are any more specific virtues to

live with

> as Advaitin. In that case, could you help me explain them, also with

their

> Sanskrit names?

 

> Blessings,

>

> Anasuya

 

Namaste Anasuya,

 

In my opinion, Sri Sadanandaji, as always, has

answered your questions very well.

 

There is also a book called 'Value of Values,'

by Swami Dayananda. You can order it here.

 

http://books.arshavidya.org/

(Search by the title of the book)

 

In the book Swamiji carefully outlines 20 values

which are useful for the mind to acquire in order

that self-knowledge takes place.

 

Swamiji gives the Sanskrit name for each

of the 20 values,

 

For example:

Adambhitvam (absence of pretence)

Ksantih (accommodation)

Sthairyam (steadiness)

 

And then a very good and thorough explanation of why

having a value for each particular value is important.

 

This is a lovely book, very clear, and

really wonderful to ponder, and I would

highly recommend it for anyone who wishes

to know more on the subject.

 

Pranams,

Durga

[Guest guest]

kuntimaddi sadananda <kuntimaddisada wrote:

 

> ...the nature which is maaya. In deep sleep state - I project the

world of plurality and again forget that I am the one who created the

dream world and take myself to be a tiny subject and deal with the

world gathering or exhausting the vaasanas (suppressions and

oppressions gathered in the waking state - it is an exhaustive

mechanism)....

 

Revered Sadaji, pranams!

Thank you for your in-a-nutshell presentation.

I have a small doubt related to what you described in your last posting.

In the paragraph quoted above, assuming you meant " dream state " (and

your fingers wrote " deep sleep state " ) would that mean that in the

dream state we also gather vasanas and exhaust them, as in the waking

state?.

 

Could you please clarify?.

 

Thank you in advance,

Mouna

[Guest guest]

--- On Sat, 6/21/08, Mouna <carlos wrote:

 

kuntimaddi sadananda <kuntimaddisada@ ...> wrote:

 

> ...the nature which is maaya. In deep sleep state - I project the

world of plurality and again forget that I am the one who created the

dream world and take myself to be a tiny subject and deal with the

world gathering or exhausting the vaasanas (suppressions and

oppressions gathered in the waking state - it is an exhaustive

mechanism).. ..

 

Revered Sadaji, pranams!

Thank you for your in-a-nutshell presentation.

I have a small doubt related to what you described in your last posting.

In the paragraph quoted above, assuming you meant " dream state " (and

your fingers wrote " deep sleep state " ) would that mean that in the

dream state we also gather vasanas and exhaust them, as in the waking

state?.

 

Could you please clarify?.

 

Shree Mouna - PraNAms.

 

Yes, it is the dream state that I was referring to. One only exhausts the

vaasanas, not accumulate new ones. It is clearning house mechanism for the mind

to become fresh for the next day. Since 'will' to do intellect is not there

that much it is only exhausting the suppressions and oppressions of the waking

mind. In the deep sleep state the mind is at rest- no vasanas are exhausted in

that state.

 

Hari Om!

Sadananda